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IOwnCalculus
Apr 2, 2003





KillHour posted:

My mom has an escape. It's a lifted focus with plastic cladding. Literally.

I don't know if that is a good or a bad thing.

I have to wonder at what point the Escape stops being a lifted Focus, and the Focus becomes a lowered Escape.

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Queen Victorian
Feb 21, 2018



skipdogg posted:

I donít want to break your heart or anything, but that 2nd gen Escape was basically a Mazda 626 sedan with some body panels and a lift

The new Escape is on the Ford C2 platform which is shared by the Bronco Sport and Maverick, and of course the Focus. Iím not a fan of the new escape design either though.

I had a 2008 and a 2009 or 2010 Escape and they were decent little cars back in the day. Looked good, I never had any problems with them, but I also didnít keep them long.

Oh don't worry, my heart broke over the Escape years ago and I ultimately bought an F-150 because unlike back then, I now own a huge fixer upper and wanted the utility of a truck on hand (I grew up with a truck always around and got spoiled to it). It also handles all our SUV use cases which is great.

If I ever want a compact SUV in the future, there's now the Bronco Sport, which has filled the void created by everything getting turned into a crossover. I'm not a hardliner about BoF vs unibody or anything, so as long as it's off-road capable and sufficiently truck-like and boxy in appearance, it's good enough for me. With crossovers I just don't like the general aesthetic or the rounded edges taking away from interior volume/useable cargo space and reducing visibility. But that's apparently a minority opinion, given the insane popularity of crossovers and the decimation of the small and mid-sized truck-like SUV classes.

Corla Plankun
May 8, 2007

improve the lives of everyone


KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:

consider going Full :911: and getting the Maverick.

This is the first I've heard of it but this looks good as hell. Is it worth it to buy 3rd-party stuff (e.g. canoe racks and dashcams, etc) at time-of-purchase? It seems like they could either be subsidized or marked-up-extra-high depending on how mean Ford is to its customers and I don't know enough about how much this stuff usually costs to make a call about it.

KYOON GRIFFEY JR
Apr 12, 2010



Runner-up, TRP Sack Race 2021/22

Corla Plankun posted:

This is the first I've heard of it but this looks good as hell. Is it worth it to buy 3rd-party stuff (e.g. canoe racks and dashcams, etc) at time-of-purchase? It seems like they could either be subsidized or marked-up-extra-high depending on how mean Ford is to its customers and I don't know enough about how much this stuff usually costs to make a call about it.

which do you think it is, i bet you know the answer

Anyway I was correctly reminded by skipdogg to not recommend Year One Ford product so you may want to avoid. It's Escape based so a bunch of stuff should be fine but inevitably Ford will completely screw up product launch and anything new on it will be hosed.

Queen Victorian
Feb 21, 2018



Corla Plankun posted:

This is the first I've heard of it but this looks good as hell. Is it worth it to buy 3rd-party stuff (e.g. canoe racks and dashcams, etc) at time-of-purchase? It seems like they could either be subsidized or marked-up-extra-high depending on how mean Ford is to its customers and I don't know enough about how much this stuff usually costs to make a call about it.

When I bought my truck and signed up with FordPass, I got a buttload of reward points that I could put towards the purchase of accessories. They took a few days after purchase to propagate, so once they did, I called the dealership, ordered a drop-in bed liner and tonneau cover, they arrived the next day, so I returned to the dealership and applied the reward points and saved a couple hundred bucks on the accessories purchase. And the parts guy helped install the bed liner. I thiiink the bed liner was under $300 and the tonneau cover (folding aluminum panel type) was $1,100. I had never purchased truck accessories before so I didn't have a sense of whether prices were normal or whacked. Seemed reasonable, I guess? Tonneau cover was pricey, but it's secure and well made so :shrug:

Overall pretty smooth and easy experience. It did help that the truck I found online that I wanted happened to be at a chill and decidedly not slimy dealership that was easy to work with. Also helps that Ford has this super handy website to help you find all the poo poo that's compatible with your vehicle: https://accessories.ford.com

NinjaPete
Nov 14, 2004

Hail to the speaker,
Hail to the knower,
Joy to him who has understood,
Delight to those who have listened.

- Hávamál


Thanks for the feedback. I'm seeing the Escape is going to be fine for what we'd use it for so that helps with some fears. Thank you!

And yes it was very unnerving to suddenly find myself staring down a gun in the dark and have no idea what is really happening. Incredibly surreal.

clockworkjoe
May 31, 2000

Rolled a 1 on the random encounter table, didn't you?

I finally got a car - wound up with a rav4 hybrid 2021 - put a deposit on it in late august and it was delivered yesterday to the dealership. (It was built in Georgia).

I said no to the extended warranty thing at the dealership but given that the normal warranty only covers manufacturer defects, is it worth getting?

Also, is the Toyota app worth messing with?

Mustache Ride
Sep 11, 2001







Don't install the Toyota app, I worked with the developers of it and uhhhhh... Yeah don't install it

Also, with a Toyota I wouldn't worry about the dealer extended warranty. Factory warranty will cover any issues.

Deteriorata
Feb 6, 2005



clockworkjoe posted:

I finally got a car - wound up with a rav4 hybrid 2021 - put a deposit on it in late august and it was delivered yesterday to the dealership. (It was built in Georgia).

I said no to the extended warranty thing at the dealership but given that the normal warranty only covers manufacturer defects, is it worth getting?

Also, is the Toyota app worth messing with?

No, extended warranties are never worth getting. You're prepaying for repairs you'll likely never have to make.

IOwnCalculus
Apr 2, 2003





clockworkjoe posted:

I said no to the extended warranty thing at the dealership but given that the normal warranty only covers manufacturer defects, is it worth getting?

If the person selling you the warranty implied that anything other than a "manufacturing defect" would be covered by an extended warranty, they were lying or it's more than a warranty (and priced accordingly).

You've just bought what is likely to be one of the most reliable cars you can get today. Any warranty beyond what comes with the car is money wasted.

clockworkjoe
May 31, 2000

Rolled a 1 on the random encounter table, didn't you?

Mustache Ride posted:

Don't install the Toyota app, I worked with the developers of it and uhhhhh... Yeah don't install it

Also, with a Toyota I wouldn't worry about the dealer extended warranty. Factory warranty will cover any issues.

well i uninstalled the app and I won't get the warranty. Thanks!

edit: They called it a vehicle service contract and said it would cover wear and tear.

clockworkjoe fucked around with this message at 00:41 on Oct 21, 2021

KillHour
Oct 28, 2007






By that, they usually mean "brake pads and rotors" which a normal person on a normal car will replace like once a decade.

Queen Victorian
Feb 21, 2018



clockworkjoe posted:

well i uninstalled the app and I won't get the warranty. Thanks!

edit: They called it a vehicle service contract and said it would cover wear and tear.

Yeah a "service contract" that handles routine maintenance for regular wear and tear seems like something not worth bothering with because I figured that was the sort of stuff that you just did on your own as part of being a car owner and also if you do it on your own you're not locked into using the dealership's services.

Probably dumb/BWM of me in the long run, but I ended up taking the extended warranty for a few reasons:
- First model year of the new generation
- All these high tech computer/sensor parts are loving expensive, with some being as or more expensive than the entire cost of the warranty
- Extended warranty is through manufacturer (if it was some third party dealer poo poo I would have declined)
- I come from a family car culture of keeping cars around for a decade or two and driving them into the ground so chances are I'll be keeping it for a while
- My dad had a Mercedes GLS that ended up having five figures worth of out-of-warranty problems and that was kind of a nightmare (and one of very few cars my dad traded in before driving it into the ground)
- My first ever vehicle purchase so I wanted the peace of mind

The extended manufacturer warranty was the only add-on our finance guy even suggested after literally crossing out all the other options (GAP insurance, service plans, etc) as unnecessary bullshit. Didn't push for it very hard, just recommended it due to the first model year of new gen and new tech making making repairs super expensive and I thought it was a good idea/took the bait.

KillHour
Oct 28, 2007






I do gap insurance but that's because my credit union offers it for $20.

You can also get the BMW extended warranty at any time before your regular warranty expires but you can't finance it then so whatever.

IOwnCalculus
Apr 2, 2003





Even if it includes wear and tear, service requirements / wear items on modern cars are increasingly long lived. You aren't getting oil changes every 3k and spark plugs every 30k.

As far as routine maintenance on most new vehicles, over the course of the first 200k miles I'd expect to go through something in the ballpark of:
*25 oil changes
*Three ATF changes assuming you actually care about the car surviving past 200k, none if you don't
*Two sets of spark plugs, maybe
*Two antifreeze changes
*One or two sets of shocks (assuming no luxury cars with air-ride here)
*Two sets of brake pads and at least three sets of tires, though this will vary wildly on driving style
*Probably at least one service to get the intake valves decarboned, assuming it's purely direct injected as many (most?) new cars are now. Bonus for the RAV4 buyer, Toyota does a combination of port and direct injection so you won't need this!

Outside of paying full dealer markup for literally all of the above, this isn't that much work, especially spread across the timeframe of 5-10 years or more.

Mustache Ride
Sep 11, 2001







And all of that stuff is probably done better and cheaper by a prominent local shop that specializes in your car rather than the kids they have getting apprenticed at a dealer.

Takkaryx
Oct 17, 2007

Bunnies (very useful) Scientific Facts: Bunnies never close doors

Hello thread. My wife's car recently got into the middle of a 4 car bender. Although it's technically maybe still drivable, it's a 2006 corolla north of 200k miles that's lived a good long life so we're in the market for new car.

Proposed Budget 30-40k
New or Used New
Body Style 4 door, same rough size as her corolla.
How will you be using the car? CA Bay Area commuter with enough cargo for Costco runs.
Do you prefer a luxury vehicle with all the gizmos? I like gizmos, but luxury isn't super important.
What aspects are most important to you? Automation and safety. We're planning on having a kid in the next few years, and every fender bender and ding we've ever had could have been avoided with autobraking and collision avoidance.

We've been thinking of getting an EV circuit installed in the garage where it would be parked, and there's EV hookups at her work parking.

Looking over the thread I see that Priuses are a top choice, and Toyotas have been good to us. What model?

KYOON GRIFFEY JR
Apr 12, 2010



Runner-up, TRP Sack Race 2021/22

IOwnCalculus posted:

Even if it includes wear and tear, service requirements / wear items on modern cars are increasingly long lived. You aren't getting oil changes every 3k and spark plugs every 30k.

As far as routine maintenance on most new vehicles, over the course of the first 200k miles I'd expect to go through something in the ballpark of:
*25 oil changes
*Three ATF changes assuming you actually care about the car surviving past 200k, none if you don't
*Two sets of spark plugs, maybe
*Two antifreeze changes
*One or two sets of shocks (assuming no luxury cars with air-ride here)
*Two sets of brake pads and at least three sets of tires, though this will vary wildly on driving style
*Probably at least one service to get the intake valves decarboned, assuming it's purely direct injected as many (most?) new cars are now. Bonus for the RAV4 buyer, Toyota does a combination of port and direct injection so you won't need this!

Outside of paying full dealer markup for literally all of the above, this isn't that much work, especially spread across the timeframe of 5-10 years or more.

I'd expect rotors by 200k as well, plus a few sets of wipers and a couple cabin air filters. as well as a battery, but you're right that you won't need that much stuff.

Takkaryx posted:

Hello thread. My wife's car recently got into the middle of a 4 car bender. Although it's technically maybe still drivable, it's a 2006 corolla north of 200k miles that's lived a good long life so we're in the market for new car.

Proposed Budget 30-40k
New or Used New
Body Style 4 door, same rough size as her corolla.
How will you be using the car? CA Bay Area commuter with enough cargo for Costco runs.
Do you prefer a luxury vehicle with all the gizmos? I like gizmos, but luxury isn't super important.
What aspects are most important to you? Automation and safety. We're planning on having a kid in the next few years, and every fender bender and ding we've ever had could have been avoided with autobraking and collision avoidance.

We've been thinking of getting an EV circuit installed in the garage where it would be parked, and there's EV hookups at her work parking.

Looking over the thread I see that Priuses are a top choice, and Toyotas have been good to us. What model?

good news: the corolla hybrid exists. set it and forget it mon frere

IOwnCalculus
Apr 2, 2003





KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:

I'd expect rotors by 200k as well, plus a few sets of wipers and a couple cabin air filters. as well as a battery, but you're right that you won't need that much stuff.

Don't know why I forgot wipers and air filters, but those are also all so cheap that they'd be rounding errors across the total cost of ownership for 200k miles.

All this isn't to say that other poo poo can't go wrong, and some new cars can certainly still rack up big repair bills... but if you buy "mass-market economy vehicle" from "trusted automaker" you really aren't likely to run into much.

Verman
Jul 4, 2005
Third time is a charm right?


Man, just picked up the $6k little old lady Prius. 06 with 80k miles. It's mint. All the dealer hang tags and sales brochures are in the glove box. Tires are brand new. It's spotless. Seats don't even look sat in. Silver thankfully, I don't think I could live with the green one.

Driving it back from Utah, doing 85 mph with ease and surprisingly stable ... I was getting 50+ mpg. Lol. I had about an eighth of a tank when I refueled and it only cost $24 to fill it up. It's funny to hear the little 75hp engine rev up on the highway. After driving a 4runner for so long, I felt like I was driving a Mario kart with my rear end on the pavement. I really can't complain at all though. It drives super smooth. It feels planted and more solid than I thought it would.

I think I need decals that say "THIS IS NOT AN UBER" so I don't get any hop-ons.

KillHour
Oct 28, 2007






You still will. I've had so many drunk people try to get in my loving focus at lights.

mobby_6kl
Aug 9, 2009

"You are the best poster... do not let anyone say otherwise."


Verman posted:

Man, just picked up the $6k little old lady Prius. 06 with 80k miles. It's mint. All the dealer hang tags and sales brochures are in the glove box. Tires are brand new. It's spotless. Seats don't even look sat in. Silver thankfully, I don't think I could live with the green one.

Driving it back from Utah, doing 85 mph with ease and surprisingly stable ... I was getting 50+ mpg. Lol. I had about an eighth of a tank when I refueled and it only cost $24 to fill it up. It's funny to hear the little 75hp engine rev up on the highway. After driving a 4runner for so long, I felt like I was driving a Mario kart with my rear end on the pavement. I really can't complain at all though. It drives super smooth. It feels planted and more solid than I thought it would.

I think I need decals that say "THIS IS NOT AN UBER" so I don't get any hop-ons.

I wish people wanted to get into the car with me.

Are you getting 50 mpg WHILE doing 85 mph? My 2003 Fit can only do like 36-40 at highway speed which was a bit disappointing considering it alos has a like 70hp 1.3l engine. I would've thought the hybrid stuff wouldn't do much at this speed, but maybe it's the aerodynamics.

Verman
Jul 4, 2005
Third time is a charm right?


I'm not sure how accurate the computer is but yeah, i84 from Utah to Seattle, super flat and smooth highway near Boise, I was going 80-90mph and shocked to see it maintaining 40-50mpg during that time. When I would step on the gas to pass people it would drop to 25-30. With cruise control on doing 80-85, ~50mpg.

My dad was probably the most astonished. He keeps asking me how much gas I have and he's surprised every time when it's still the same answer.

I kept thinking it would feel like a Chevy spark or something incredibly light and twitchy but no, feels a little closer to a normal car, maybe like a matrix but a little smoother even.

IOwnCalculus
Apr 2, 2003





There's a long list of reasons the Prius (especially the second gen, though less so now that minty examples like that are hard to find) is The Recommendation, and you've discovered a lot of them already.

Shine
Feb 26, 2007

No Muscles For The Majority


My ancient Matrix finally had a "not gonna spend this much money repairing a car this loving old" issue, so I actually spent money on a car for once and now have a 2016 CX-5 Grand Touring with 30K miles. God drat, I've never felt so fancy in my own car. I really should do nice things for myself more often.

CarMax gave me $1500 for my old-enough-to-vote Matrix with 230K miles and unrepaired cosmetic accident damage. Their website ballparked a $300 trade value, but their on-site appraiser somehow saw 5X that value. The market is loving stupid right now :psyduck:.

Inner Light
Jan 2, 2020





https://www.carvana.com/vehicle/2058641

The market is still dumb god drat. Am I to believe an S4 loses only roughly 10% of its value vs. MSRP in 3 years? The average new car loses almost 40% value in 3 years.

Mr Interweb
Aug 25, 2004

I posted my food for USPOL Thanksgiving!


guys! need advice

my friend has a 2012 prius II hybrid (almost 150k miles) that she's willing to sell for between $4k-5k. said she never had a single issue with it (and i trust this person).

yay or nay?

Mr Interweb fucked around with this message at 05:47 on Oct 24, 2021

Mustache Ride
Sep 11, 2001







Based on prices in my area (Texas) on Facebook marketplace, which are between 6500-8500 for similar miles for a 2012, seems like a good deal. If you're prepared to lose a friend if she screws you.

I don't buy cars from friends, no matter how much I trust them, but that's just me. Makes financial sense if you need a car and she's willing to sell it to you that cheap.

Ask for maintenance records and any and all docs before committing.

MeruFM
Jul 27, 2010


I bought a car 5 months ago from a dealership and they convinced me to tack on 10k+ worth of extended warranty and maint plans (dumb i know). I asked them to cancel the day after purchase and the finance manager at the time agreed, saying it will take more than a month to reflect on my balance.

I asked again a month later if it has been cancelled, as my loan balance has not changed. Turns out that finance manager already left.

I asked their new finance manager to cancel for me, and he said he did, and gave me a couple papers to sign. A couple months after that, I followed up again and they said they don't know what happened.

Some back and forth until today and 2 more financer manager later, it still hasn't been cancelled.

Other than some bad reviews, is there anything I can do at this point? Would a lawyer be worth it? I have a good paper/email trail, but some of it was in-person conversations.

MeruFM fucked around with this message at 06:20 on Oct 24, 2021

Mustache Ride
Sep 11, 2001







Go to a local credit union and refinance the car.

Nitrox
Jul 5, 2002

Slur, your fighting style is extremely problematic!

Mustache Ride posted:

Go to a local credit union and refinance the car.
While a good idea, the amount needs to be corrected beforehand

Mustache Ride
Sep 11, 2001







Yeah I guess you're right. Probably get more action out of the finance dipshit if you go in and say something like "Hey I'm trying to refinance my car and this stupid extended warranty your predecessors told me they removed from my loan in still on here, can you remove it and give me a loan payoff letter with it removed please?"

That might get more movement than just asking them to remove it. Dealers make the majority of their money off of these extended warranties so they're not incentiviesed to remove it unless you give them a reason.

bird with big dick
Oct 21, 2015




Why are you trying to take food out of the mouths of that poor finance manís childrens

KYOON GRIFFEY JR
Apr 12, 2010



Runner-up, TRP Sack Race 2021/22

Inner Light posted:

https://www.carvana.com/vehicle/2058641

The market is still dumb god drat. Am I to believe an S4 loses only roughly 10% of its value vs. MSRP in 3 years? The average new car loses almost 40% value in 3 years.

right now nothing loses value, my Alltrack has gained 15% since i bought it in 2019 so

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007

"I think he's watching us..."

"No, it's just the Mountain Peeks."
(Source)



Sounds like I need to buy a car before the 8th of November when Americans can come up here and rob us blind of all our cars.

the tingler
Jul 15, 2009


Mr Interweb posted:

guys! need advice

my friend has a 2012 prius II hybrid (almost 150k miles) that she's willing to sell for between $4k-5k. said she never had a single issue with it (and i trust this person).

yay or nay?

let me talk to her

Verman
Jul 4, 2005
Third time is a charm right?


As I just learned with my new to me prius, if the 2012's use the same kind of fuel bladder, it might not hold as much as its supposed to. I think the tank is supposed to hold 11-12 gallons but mine only holds about 8.

Other than that I would listen over bumps to see if the front sway bar bushings need replacing (hopefully they've been replaced at that mileage). I've heard it on nearly every prius I've ever ridden in, and 100% of clapped out ubers. On my drive back this past week when picking up mine, I heard a muffled knocking sound, like a tennis ball in a dryer, and it was mostly coming form my front driver side which I suspect to be either the strut, sway bushing or end link. I'll take a look eventually when it stops raining here.

Fun story about the false fuel cell capacity:

My dad was in town visiting so we flew to Utah last week to pick up the prius and drive it back to Seattle which was a great way of getting familiar with the car. I had filled up when we got to Idaho, maybe around the twin falls area and we stayed in Boise overnight. In my head, I knew the tank capacity was 11+ gallons and we had a full tank so I thought I could easily get into Washington before needing to fill up again. Well ... we got to the Umatilla National forest which is a ~50 mile stretch of highway through the forest/mountains with no services and little to no cell reception. As we're going up, the prius is really losing fuel. I had driven through here before but didn't remember the length of the area and how far it was until the next gas station. We were maybe 10 miles in and heard a beep. I had no idea what that noise was, I assumed I still had 2 little bars of fuel. I look up and the last bar is now blinking and we're ... 38 miles from Pendleton which is still up and over and down the other side of the pass. At one point I started thinking about how to get gas if we ran out and I didn't have any reception. Its not like we could walk to a nearby station. I babied it going up trying to keep the mpg high as possible. We get to the top of the pass and I coast as much as possible. Thankfully its mostly down the whole way. We rolled into the fuel station on what I assumed were fumes and a stiff tailwind. I filled the tank and it was 8.5 gallons to full. This is when I googled to see if there were issues with it not filling all the way and read about the fuel cell getting less elastic over time and being affected by pressure and heat/cold. My dad, who is not the go-with-the-flow type, was quietly nervous the whole time. He was making GBS threads his dad pants thinking about running out of gas in the mountains. In my head I knew it was going to be close. The worst part is I'm usually the person with the whole kit in my vehicle and since I just bought it, it was empty.

Verman fucked around with this message at 23:46 on Oct 25, 2021

SouthShoreSamurai
Apr 28, 2009

It is a tale,
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.




Fun Shoe

I think it may finally be time to move on from the RAV4 I've loved for the last 8 years. I've wanted a truck for a while now, but I really know absolutely nothing about them. I need would like one for hauling wood/lumber/construction material, and eventually it would be nice to have a plow (I have two large driveways and live in the snowy NE)

Proposed Budget: Ideally Sub-$20k, but could go to $25k
New or Used: Used
Body Style: Truck. No need for an extended cab.
How will you be using the car?: Hauling construction material, and commuting roughly 60 miles 3x a week. I have a Telluride that is the family car for hauling children.
Do you prefer a luxury vehicle with all the gizmos? No. Some comfort would be nice for the 3x weekly commute
What aspects are most important to you? reliability, cost of ownership/maintenance, MPG, size, style - in that order

I have absolutely nothing bad to say about the RAV4, other than it can't fit sheet goods or longer pieces of lumber (12' is about the max I've gotten)

So really what I'm looking to find out here is what makes for a good value in a truck.

Motronic
Nov 6, 2009





Grimey Drawer

Have you considered a trailer for moving construction material?

And some other solution for plowing?.....because it really destroys pickups. I have friends who plow with ATVs. I plow with a tractor.
Depending on your lawn/landsacpe situation something like that could be a multi-use item.

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KYOON GRIFFEY JR
Apr 12, 2010



Runner-up, TRP Sack Race 2021/22

yeah the best plow truck costs five hundred bucks and the second best plow truck costs a grand because they're already hosed up and disposable

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