Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

Faceless Clock posted:

The argument is that he can afford a $180 lease payment. If he wants to lease a new car, it is a financially sound decision for him to do so, even if buying a used car would cost less overall.

Besides $180 looking small in comparison to $4000/month after tax income, there's really no basis to call leasing a financially sound decision. When you're making that kind of income you're in a place to save up and pay cash for a car. Then if you want the excitement of a monthly payment, put that $180/month into a high-yield savings or money market or something that builds interest so you can start paying for your next car.

I dunno what the rest of the budget looks like, but on $4k a month it should be feasible to save up and buy a $10-$15k car in cash within a year or so. There's really no reason to complicate the process and get into a lease just because you can't wait a year to have a nice shiny toy to tool around town in.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

Faceless Clock posted:

Come on. I don't want to have to repeat myself. I already listed why it is better to lease even if you can pay cash for a new car. So have other posters.

Besides, have you actually looked at car prices? You're not going to get much of a new car for $15k.

Ok, then lets save real hard for a year and a half and buy a ~$20k car. Isn't the idea that leasing is the better decision assuming that the actual depreciation of the car is more than expected, and that your use of the vehicle with conform to all the bureaucracy of the lease terms, and that there's not much opportunity cost of losing $monthlyLeaseAmount from your cashflow, and neglecting the risk of signing yourself up for a $180/month contract? If you pay for your car outright and lose your job at least there's no guy ready to come kick you in the balls because you couldn't give him his money this month.

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

Throatwarbler posted:

I don't understand what you are saying here. Yeah, the guy coming to kick you in the balls is doing so because you got the car but didn't pay for (all of)it. Yes if you pay for all of it up front, he won't kick you. On the other hand if you don't give him all your money up front, you have more of it left in your pocket. Do you like having money in your pocket?

I'm saying that...

artard posted:

I live well under my means but don't have much savings at the moment because I recently finished paying off my credit card and student loan debt.

...in reality land the type of people that get into car leases do so because they don't have a lot of cash in their pocket. Signing up for a monthly payment represents risk. Signing up for a monthly payment when you don't have lots of money in savings represents more risk.

If you've got enough money to buy yourself out of the lease whenever you feel like then it's just a theorycrafting debate on whether it's better to have a little risk with the lease and invest a lump sum now while paying a monthly payment, or if it's better to have less risk and pay for the car with a lump sum and invest those monthly payment. Since either scenario is marginally close anyway, it's probably a moot point.

But are we really going to sit here and tell someone without a proper EFund to go lease a brand new car just because $180/month is small compared to $4000/month? I thought BFC was all about huge cash reserves to protect your rear end.

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

Lyesh posted:

You're assuming that the dealer's depreciation follows market depreciation. A 2007 Honda Civic DX runs around $10,300 from a dealer (according to edmunds). A 2010 Civic DX runs $17,200 MSRP. That means that depreciation on a Civic DX across 3 years is around $6900 at most (since your price for a new one is going to be below MSRP). They list the lease at $347.44 for 36 months, which is $12,400 total. 3 years interest on the loan (assuming 5% across 60 months) is around $1,900. $1,900 plus $6900 is NOT greater than $12,400. Guess what the extra's for.

Hint: it's the risk premium for the dealer. Which yes, they do gently caress up. But not every single time.

Edit: then again this does depend on the buyout price. Anyone actually have data on that?

Can we assume we don't take out a loan to buy the car so we can ignore that $1900 as well?

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

artard posted:

....buy a $2000 car and hope it doesn't break down?

Just an anecdote, but three years ago my wife paid $2500 for a '95 impreza. We put ~$125 into a new timing belt (yay ebay), $300 into tires, and that's about it. Hasn't broken down once, so no problem there.

Most of my friends bought ~$3k cars many years ago and are still driving them, with no major issues. Of course, the plural of anecdote is not fact. Just sayin'...

The other fun thing about beaters like this is that you don't give a crap when people door ding you at the mall, run into your rear end when the light turns green and you weren't on the gas yet, or whatever. It's so fun to not give a drat about your daily driver.

artard posted:

my loan amount would be about $10,500 and my monthly payments on a 36 month loan would be about $315. I would plan on basically driving this car into the ground and hopefully keeping it for a decade or longer.

If you decide to go this route, I'd just personally push for you to plan on paying it off much sooner than the 3 years and maybe put that $315 away for car maintenance/replacement. But that's just me.

artard posted:

Looking at craigslist right now I see 3 Imprezas exactly like this one for 13-15k and they have 30-50k miles on them. Tell me why I'm retarded for wanting to buy this car.

It's definitely a good deal, you just gotta make sure it fits into your financial goals.

Only other thing is to see what else you can find for the money you plan on spending, and make sure you get the best deal and a car you like (especially if you're planning on living with it for a decade). I've kicked myself more than once when I found out some dude was selling a really awesome car for less than I just bought a really mediocre car for - not that a 2007 is "really mediocre".


one last thing...

artard posted:

If I came to a worst case scenario where I couldn't afford the car I would just sell it.

This always sounds easier than it is. Last year it took me a little over 4 months to sell a 2002 WRX for $2k under KBB "good" condition. A lot of people on the car forums in the state are complaining about the same thing.

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

bewbies posted:

I have plenty of credit left on my card...would my loan company go for that? I guess they probably wouldn't care one way or another.

Any other unforseen issues in using a credit card to get the lien released?

The other option is you pay it down just below payoff, and sell the car. Depending on what state you're in, and whether the bank that holds your loan has a physical location to fill paperwork out in, this ranges from easy to complicated-as-crap.

In my state, you basically sell the car with a bill of sale stating you'll pay off the car and have the bank send the dude the title (don't let the bank send it to you, and then from you to him... also, good luck getting a craigslister to not think you're trying to scam him). Or if the guy who's buying it is taking out a loan (not likely on a $3k car) his loan company will do all the paperwork for you. I'd just call your lienholder and ask them what the process is - they'll know what's up for whatever state you're in.

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

I'd tend to stray away from salvage cars because the paperwork of getting it registered can be a pain, depending on whether or not the person you're buying it from has put in the effort to jump through all the bureaucracy for you.

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

gotly posted:

CarFax will have no idea if you do anything to your car if you don't submit it under warranty, insurance or file some sort of police record. I could go buy some doors or poo poo for my car right now, install it by myself and nobody would be the wiser. CarFax doesn't tell the whole story.

If you have a dealer do the work (outside of warranty) don't they normally submit all their work to carfax? I just bought a 2000 Jetta (daily beater), the dude printed of the carfax for me and it was like 4 pages of "VW dealer - scheduled maintenace."

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

Leperflesh posted:

Obviously people buy them, and do so even after cross-shopping with other sedans. Have you driven one? Sometimes there are features people like about a car that don't just narrow down to horsepower or reliability ratings or whatever. VW sold a lot of Jettas; they do so with differentiating factors and a price point that attracts customers. Gotta be a reason.

Just bought a 2000 Jetta VR6 to replace a 1995 Impreza 1.8l 2door. It's comfortable, has a bunch of luxury-esque items (power everyfreakingthing, great sound system, blah blah blah). Ir'a easy and really fun to drive around town, rides smooth on the highway... after test driving about a million different sedans I can say this was the best one I could find for the $3k-beater range. Of course, I do a lot of my own mechanic work so failed parts doesn't intimidate me too bad.

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

destructo posted:

Better prepare for the eventuality that your windows will fall into the doors.

*Exact thing happened to my '92 Talon TSi driver side, '99 Camaro z28 passenger side, and '02 WRX driver side. It seems all my power window motors have cranked themselves right off the door panels... this is less of a worry for me and more of an expectation at this point. Definitely nothing to slam VW about, in any case.

*not sure if the jetta's problem is the motor falling off mounts or what, just sayin...

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

shredswithpiks posted:

Just bought a 2000 Jetta VR6 to replace a 1995 Impreza 1.8l 2door. It's comfortable, has a bunch of luxury-esque items (power everyfreakingthing, great sound system, blah blah blah). It's easy and really fun to drive around town, rides smooth on the highway... after test driving about a million different sedans I can say this was the best one I could find for the $3k-beater range. Of course, I do a lot of my own mechanic work so failed parts doesn't intimidate me too bad.

Welp, so much for that. Wife ran over a rock that punctured the oil pan, drove 100+ miles home, then 20 mile round trip to work two days later (without noticing the car-sized oil spill). Lets see how long the motor lasts after replacing the pan and filling it back up :v:

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

Either she didn't notice it or it didn't come on. Probably didn't come on though, since she does call me every time her ABS light starts blinking.

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

The "I got this car from my divorce and am selling it super cheap cuz I don't have a license" is a common CL scam. Don't bother.

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

BotchedLobotomy posted:

Thanks for the tips. The USAA is only available if you're part of the military right?
How does the car work with the lien setup being registered? Once its paid off do I need to re-register it under my name with the lien holder removed or anything like that?

USAA insurance is only for military / kids of military / spouses of kids of military. Their bank system is available to everyone.

After you pay it off they'll send you a lien release that you will take to the DMV to get a clean title with no lien hold listed.

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

BotchedLobotomy posted:

I applied earlier and was rejected, while their banking system is available for everyone, their financial services (loans) are not. Any other good options for a 10K or less loan?

Weird. Guess I made an assumption there...

Do you have some local credit unions around that you would qualify for membership of? In my experience, my credit union has had ~1 or 2% lower rates than other banks for auto loans.

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

^^

I just sold that exact car, same color and milleage, on craigslist for a close friend. Got $1500 for it (had a crap ton of body damage, doors didn't open right, but ran ok). Really kind of sad I couldn't have bought it for myself just for the gas mileage - if you baby the throttle and neutral down hills you can get into the 50s :P

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

the more you know :)

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

Leperflesh posted:

It's been said before, but I'll say it again:

Always negotiate price on a new or used car at the dealership first. Only after you are satisfied with the final price, do you broach the subjects of trade-ins and financing.

If a salesman is unwilling to negotiate price without getting you to say whether you'll finance or not, and/or if you have a trade-in, then you should be willing to walk away. There are other dealerships and other cars out there that will meet your needs.

Has anyone mentioned truecar.com yet? It's basically an instant "lets start negotiations at invoice pricing" button for new-car shopping.

Went to look at a new 370z base this past weekend. Got the price where I wanted it, but as soon as I mentioned I had a possible trade in the sales dude immediately started trying to sell me a NISMO for an extra 10k to make up the cost. Ended up walking away...

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

Omne posted:

Just on a whim, I put in my car on Craigslist to see what people were selling similar cars for. 2005 Jeep Liberty, 104k miles. Dealers on CL were selling for $9000 and up. I had no idea it'd go for something that much, I expected like $5000 max.

I live in Colorado. If I saw a Liberty with 104k miles in anything resembling decent shape for $5k I'd buy it without hesitation and immediately re-list it on craigslist or wherever. Those things sell drat fast out here, too.

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

Omne posted:

This is very interesting...I had no idea there was such a big secondary market for Liberty's.

That being said, what's the process for selling a car on Craigslist? I know I'd get more from a person than I would at a dealer, so that sounds like the more attractive route. Is it worth it to take care of minor repairs and stuff, or let the buyer take care of that?


I have sold a bunch of cars on craigslist, and haven't really worried about minor repairs. I'll fix things up enough to get it to pass emissions... last car I sold via craigslist had a clicking CV axle so I replaced that (myself, car guy here) before selling it because I consider that to be a cheap major fix.

It's pretty easy. Just post it for sale with pictures and be straight forward. Only meet during the day in public places. If you still owe money on the car, check with your bank for what their process is to release the title is when selling it off to someone who isn't a dealer.

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

MN-Ghost posted:

I've read a lot about having a mechanic doing an inspection when buying a used car. That sounds like a good idea, but I'm completely clueless about how this works. What, do you just take the car over to your mechanic while test driving? Wouldn't it take a while potentially? Wouldn't I need to make an appointment first? What if my mechanic is on the other side of town?

Conversely, if I'm selling the car, do I just let the prospective buyer drive off in my car? How do I ensure they are coming back?

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but I just don't get it. Only bought a used car once from a dealer, and didn't get it inspected first (probably should have). I am thinking about selling a couple cars in the future and am still trying to figure out what to expect.

What I do (have bought and sold a whole lot of cars on craigslist) is first meet with the seller for a test-drive and look-over. If you like the car, explain that you would like to have a mechanic look it over. Call and make an appointment with your mechanic, and try to fit that around the seller's schedule. There are then three options - convince the seller to let you borrow the car, have the seller meet you there, or have the seller take it in on his own. You can normally pre-pay the mechanic since inspections are normally a flat fee, and then you just have the mechanic give you a printout of all the stuff he finds. That last option normally works out the best.

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

Ed Mungo posted:

something with 4WD/AWD

12k could get you a really decent used Subaru Forester.

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

Ed Mungo posted:

I ran a quick search within 75 miles of my zip code and 2009 models started at $18,900 and went up from there, and I'd really like to stick to the newer end of used. I'm using http://usnews.rankingsandreviews.com should I be looking somewhere else? Craigslist isn't terribly useful because I'm not close to a major city, but I sometimes browse around on Local Sales Network and prices are pretty comparable to what the US News site is telling me.

edit: When I say I'm expecting to spend $20k, really I'd like to spend less than that and hopefully my car will contribute a little toward that amount. I guess what I'm looking for is also what everyone else is looking for though, so they're kinda ridiculous right now. :(

Argh. Yeah, if you're looking in the 2-4yo range you're probably not going to find a bargain Subaru. I'm a big fan of Subaru 2005/2006 MY, and if you're willing to travel a ways to pick one up you can find a really good deal. If you're set on sticking with something 09+, then I might still stick with the Forester as a recommendation (although you're gonna be towards the top of your 20k range), and possibly the Subaru Outback (not legacy or impreza outback... just outback so you get the extra clearance) for something a little smaller.

If it were me, I would go out of my way to not finance any of it and stick with an 05/06.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

shredswithpiks
Jul 5, 2006
Blast! I need a goon account!

Don Lapre posted:

Until MY2010 legacy outback and outback are the same vehicle. If you look at legacy outbacks just make sure its the wagon and not the sedan, unless you want the sedan that is.

oh, duh. Brain thought they split in MY09 for some reason.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply