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NOTE: NOTHING IN MY POSTS SHOULD BE CONSIDERED LEGAL ADVICE. I AM NOT A LAWYER, NOT AN ATTORNEY, JUST A GUY WHO USED A LOT OF INTERNET TO FIGHT AND WIN LAWSUITS. IF YOU ARE IN A SIMILAR SITUATION TAKE MY ADVICE TO A LAWYER FOR A PROFESSIONAL OPINION. Also, this advice is for lawsuits/settlements with debt collectors, original creditors, and so on in regards to unsecured credit card debt. I cannot help you with foreclosures, car repos, or anything of that nature as I have no experience with those things. Because of a lot of stupid college kid mistakes, I found myself deep in debt to multiple credit card companies without the means or ability to pay them back. Calling and talking to their customer service reps did little to nothing, and trying to use a debt consolidation service was out of the question, since they'd only lower my payments by about 10% and speed up the time I'd need to pay. I was left with 3 choices: 1) Ask family for a bailout 2) Quit school and work 2+ full-time jobs to hope to have enough to pay the debt back 3) Stop payments, walk away from the debt, and attempt to reconcile it once my money situation was resolved. So I chose 3, and after about 3 months the phone calls and letters started rolling in about making payments, getting sent to the legal department, all that kind of stuff. When I did answer, I simply told them I couldn't pay right now, and that was that. A month later, they mostly stopped, and for a while I didn't really worry about it. 2 months after that, new companies began sending me letters and being more threatening, telling me about how my paycheck would be garnished, my bank accounts taken, and so on if I didn't pay NOW. Again, I mostly ignored these calls until I got a knock on my door from a process server. One of the debt collectors was suing me in small claims court for one of my college cards - something like $800, I forget. I had a month before court and I was mortified. Despite that I did a little research on the web and figured out essentially what I needed to do to try and defend myself. I went to court that day to appear for the summons date - and when the lawyer saw me come up to the bench he told the judge they were dismissing the case. I didn't understand what exactly was going on, but while I was waiting to get my copies of the dismissal papers, it became more clear. I was probably one of the nine or ten out of 200 cases heard that morning that actually showed up. Of those, I was only one of two that showed up to defend instead of admit to the debt asked for. Some of the lawyers were representing six or seven different plaintiffs and were just walking up, showing paperwork, noting the lack of a defendant and getting a default judgment for the amount asked. $1000, $7500, $13400, you name it. Each lawyer was probably walking away with six figures in judgments from their cases without a fight from the defendants. When I asked the lawyer why he dropped the case, he said "I don't have time to fight you over this, I have 60 more cases today and then I need to go to the next county over to appear for 150 more by 1:30." Holy poo poo. Since then, I have been sued eleven times by original creditors and the junk debt buyers who purchase these accounts from the original creditors. I have lost none of these cases, and have even been able to collect money from some of these plaintiffs and law firms because those companies generally do not follow the law in trying to collect debt from you. (Note: Due to most of these settlements being contingent on a non-disclosure agreement, I cannot get into specifics as to those I have sued/been sued by, nor the amounts I have collected. I will, however, say that these settlements have done nicely to help fund my pharmacy schooling.) My credit score has also gone up over 200 points as a result of my credit repair, at minimal cost. I can help anyone who needs general advice on how to deal with creditors/owners of your unpaid debt, and what to do both before they begin legal action and after the lawsuit has begun. Questions I get from people I've helped before are below: This is your debt, right? You loving scumbag. Pay what you owe and you don't have to go through this poo poo! This is true! Generally, the debt/account in question was owed by me, and I do not have a problem paying what I'm owed to the person I owe. Debt collection, however, clouds those waters. - The debt may be time-barred, also known as outside the Statute of Limitations (SOL.) This varies from state to state and contract to contract, but is generally 2-7 years after you stop paying the account. Once that time expires, any attempts to collect on that debt (especially legal action) is a violation of the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act (FDCPA.) One of my biggest settlements came from a creditor trying to sue me on a time-barred debt - under $100. I made nearly 100 times that in my settlement. - The debt collector may have unfairly added fees and penalties to what you really owe. I've had cards with $300 limits show up as $2000+ balances due, $1000 limits be nearly $7000, and so on. Most of those added fees are arbitrarily added by the buyer of your debt without rhyme or reason. On that point: - Most debt buyers buy debt in a package from the original creditor, usually at a rate of 3 to 10 cents on the dollar. If they cannot collect, it is usually sold to a secondary debt buyer for less than a penny on the dollar. Regardless of who buys your debt, they will try to get you to pay as much as they can. You'll get letters like "You owe us $5000, but as a special offer, we'll take a one-time payment of $3200 today to settle your account in full!" A nice 'discount' for you, but consider they likely paid between $40-500 for your papers. - If you 'settle' with a debt buyer, you're usually not much better off in terms of your credit report. A 'settled in full' tradeline is barely better (sometimes not at all) than a non-paid tradeline, and usually such tradelines will stay on your report for a full seven years. On top of that, the scummier debt buyers will get you to agree on a settlement, take the money, update your account as settled for that amount in the credit reports - then sell the remainder of your debt to another junk debt buyer, who will hound you for that. - Some collectors will talk to you about your moral obligation to pay the debt. You can judge your own morals, but I prefer not to consider the opinions of someone that gets a bonus check if I show them 'good morals.' Ok, so I shouldn't just send them a check. How do I make sure they don't sue me? Once you start getting the letters in the mail, you need to be proactive. Usually, if you don't respond to a collector within 30 days, they can assume the debt is valid and you lose a bunch of your rights. The first paperwork they send you a what's called a dunning letter. It basically states that they own your debt, this is what you owe, if you dispute the debt contact them within 30 days - pretty standard. Save all the paperwork you get - you may need it later, especially if they've made mistakes on them. What you want to do first is send a debt verification (DV) letter. There are plenty you can copy and paste all around the internet and you can make it all fancy and legalese-ridden but it can be as simple as: quote:Dear rear end in a top hat Collection Agency: Send any correspondence to an agency or law firm Certified Mail, preferably with a return receipt attached. This lets you confirm, if necessary, that the letters were received. They won't do the same for you, but the extra dollar or 2 is worth it. Once this is done, wait. Generally the collector won't verify, and then you win. If they don't verify but keep trying to collect, you win even more, because doing so violates the FDCPA and you can start collecting evidence for a lawsuit against them. If they do verify (and some do,) you may want to consider settling with them if you're not aggressively litigous. Settle? But you said not to pay them! And generally you shouldn't. But if they have all their ducks in a row and they've done things properly, you do owe the debt and you should settle. But do it in an advantageous way. - No matter what, negotiate what's called a 'pay for delete.' What this means is you pay X amount of the debt, and the agency deletes the tradeline off all your credit reports. This will usually mean a 30-80 point jump on your credit report almost immediately. Some agencies will say pay for delete is illegal. It isn't. Generally they don't even delete it themselves, they will just not answer your request for the credit bureau to verify your debt with them, then off your report it goes. Usually you can get an agency to do a pay for delete if you pay about 40-60% of the balance due. Start at 10% and work your way up - I've had a $1500 card deleted for paying $200. If they won't delete, you don't pay. Again, getting a 'settled' tradeline is not worth paying for. - Get the terms in writing, signed by someone with power at their agency, before you send them any money. They will go back on their word if you don't. - Pay with a money order. Paying by check (or worse, over the phone by credit card) lets them know where you bank. Call me paranoid, but I'd rather not let them have that information. How can they violate the FDCPA, and why do they do it if it's so bad for them? Because most people don't know the law, and getting a few lawsuits they have to settle is small potatoes compared to the people who will pay in full if pushed enough. There are a ton of ways they violate, including calling too early/too late, calling when you've sent them a cease and desist order, using threatening language on the phone, claiming they can take your wages/bank account/etc, misrepresenting your rights, continuing to try to collect without verifying the debt... plenty of ways. If your state allows you to record calls without the other party's consent, you may wish to tape your conversations with the phone reps. One call I had the rep did 15 violations in a 20 minute call. In my state that call alone allows me to sue for $1000 per violation x treble damages + damages for pain and suffering/lost wages the violations cost me. I'm barred from talking further about it due to my NDA, but let me say they were happy to settle for far less than what I was threatening to sue for.  They're suing me! What should I do? This post is long enough and I can go into that later, but the main thing you need to do is show up to every court date. If you don't show, the lawyer will enter a default judgment against you, and you lose. There's next to no downside to trying to defend yourself in court - the worst that can happen is you pay what you would have if you didn't show up at all. (I don't know if any states allow the winner to collect attorney's fees - check your state to see if they do! Mine doesn't, and neither do most states.) Anyway, I think that's enough for now. If anyone is currently trying to get out of debt or repair their credit score, I can try to help. If you're in the middle of a lawsuit, I can try to help, so long as you understand that I'm not giving out legal advice. I can just tell stories, too, as long as they don't get too detailed in cases where I've got an NDA. EDIT: I'm not sure if this should go in Biz/Fin instead, or just be kept in the Legal Megathread. If that's the case, I'll close the thread and move it to the proper place. CubsWoo fucked around with this message at 09:13 on Nov 30, 2009 |
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Nov 30, 2009 09:08
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Kaal posted:Having good credit and generally being a Scrooge when it comes right down to it, I'm always a little disappointed when these threads come around because it sounds so easy to make money off these debt collectors. I'm pretty sure there's another guy on the forums who similarly decided to start fighting off debt collectors and realized that they are completely retarded and make themselves open for all sorts of misconduct lawsuits if you know what to pay attention to. I'll be honest with you, if I could go back and not make the mistakes I did (WOW A FREE PIZZA AND SWEATSHIRT FOR APPLYING? WOW A $5000 LIMIT? SURELY I WILL BE FINANCIALLY RESPONSIBLE AT AGE 18!) I would have. I buried myself in a shitload of problems and I consider myself fortunate that there's no debtor's prisons and I'm able to use legal avenues to rebuild my credit rating and get something back from the collectors who would call me between midnight-5AM to try and coax payments out of me. You can also insert the 'well if the collectors weren't scumbags they'd have nothing to worry about' line here but I don't really see it that way.
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Nov 30, 2009 09:35
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Kaal posted:How do you see it then? You seem strangely sympathetic with the collectors for someone who seems to have been quite successful at fighting them in court after being hounded by them for years. I suppose I can understand that sentiment in regards to the individual workers (who are just doing their jobs in order to avoid going into debt themselves), but do you feel similarly towards the organizations and industry as a whole? The debt collection industry I find to be pretty genius. It runs primarily on the understanding that the average person does not know and will not attempt to exercise their rights, or even make the tiniest effort to contest what is being asked of them. Only something like 2-5% of debt lawsuit defendants in small claims court mount a defense or show up to court. They've found a vein of resources and do their best to tap it as much as they can. It takes a lot of balls for them to sue people with no standing, no supporting documentation, and having proceeded with their debt collection violating any number of state and federal statues (all of which can open them up to four and five-figure lawsuits.) The whole industry would be out of business if consumers were better educated about their rights, but I don't see that happening. The average person is scared shitless by a court summons and will start groveling at the feet of the collector to settle out of court so they don't have to be at the hearing date. That's where the collector will generously take 80% of the amount to go away (and report the tradeline as settled, not delete.) It's also why so many of their suits will crumble immediately if you just show up - they can sit in the courtroom for a half-hour and make $200-500k in default judgments, why waste billable hours on your one case for $1-10k? There are ethical, well-run, law-abiding collectors out there (and I've done pay-for-deletes with a few of them and they honored their end of the deal) and there are the scumbags (who end up writing me some nicely-sized checks to buy my silence) and in the end I don't see the industry as any different than any other one that has good and bad apples and the ability for some to cut corners and act unethically/illegally to get things done. The tables are turning on the whole industry now, though, and I can see it being vastly reformed or changed in the next few years because credit card suits are dropping off (a lot of those firms have moved to collecting on payday loans - those are a massive cash cow.) A big change has been in something called arbitration. Arbitration, as recently as 12-24 months ago, was a debtor's biggest nightmare and there were whole books written on how to get out of it if the creditor tried to put you in. But things changed. If you look at your credit card agreement, you'll probably see a section on arbitration. Most of those agreements say that it can be used as an alternative to the courtroom - and for a long time most of the major banks would put you there instead of filing suit. This was done because many of them used the National Arbitration Forum (NAF.) NAF was hugely pro-creditor, and took their cases no matter how flimsy. At one point, something like 95%+ of all arbitrations were judged for the credit card company, and the decision wasn't subject to an appeal since arbitration waived the right to litigate. Then the Minnesota Attorney General stepped in amidst complaints of NAF's bias, investigated, and shut them down. They cannot take credit card arbitrations anymore. There are two other national arbitration firms: AAA and JAMS. AAA was a lot like NAF in their bias towards creditors, but they've seen what happened to NAF and have chosen to get out of the credit card arbs until they re-draft their rules to be 'pro-consumer.' JAMS has generally been fair to consumers, but has also said that they won't take arbs initiated by the credit card company. This is why Bank of America and Chase have recently dropped their arbitration provisions - not because it's more fair to the consumer, but because at this point, a consumer electing arbitration on a debt all but torpedoes the creditor's claim. It still waives the right to take it to court, but the creditor will find it very difficult if not impossible to find a forum to take their arb claim. To get out of it, they would have to strike their own arbitration clause, which in many states would (if it would even be approved by a judge, "Your honor, we put this in to gently caress over the consumer, now it's loving us over, we want it out") invalidate the entire contract. I have a friend in another state who just started the arbitration proceedings with a major bank - he had to initiate, so he filed a claim against them for nearly $150,000 due to state/FDCPA violations and general damages. The bank is required to pay the fees to the arbitrator (somewhere around $3000 up front + travel and lodging for the arbitrator and his normal hourly rate once the session happens) and have run out of time to file a counterclaim. So they just haven't paid, and arbitration won't move forward, and his case can't go back to court. He's even thinking of suing them for not continuing arbitration in violation of the court order, but he's even more aggressively litigous than I am (he made $20,000 off a creditor trying to collect $450, but his state allows for a ton more damages.) CubsWoo fucked around with this message at 11:18 on Nov 30, 2009 |
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Nov 30, 2009 11:13
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clubfedgoon posted:It seems you could make a living off having various credit cards in default and then wait for the collectors to violate the FDCPA(which they always seem to do) so you can sue.. If low-mid five figures in settlements (which aren't guaranteed) every seven years sounds like a good living, then get applying for cards you have no interest in paying back. Even with all these wins, my credit's been shot and it's going to be bad for a few more years yet until everything drops off my report. Don't go looking for this situation. If you want to do what I've done intentionally, go to law school and become a consumer lawyer. CubsWoo fucked around with this message at 22:28 on Nov 30, 2009 |
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Nov 30, 2009 22:26
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Kaal posted:Thanks for the awesome response. That was a really interesting read. What are some of the good resources you've found that have helped you deal with debt collectors? What are some of the most common mistakes made by debtors, creditors and collectors? If you could do it all again, what would you change (other than simply getting into debt in the first place?) What changes would you like to see made to the system as a whole? CreditInfoCenter is pretty good - they're full of ads for things like report checking and credit cards to help you rebuild credit but once you get beyond those there's a lot of good information and flowcharts on how to deal with collectors. There's also a ton of forums on getting advice, from creditboards (mostly on how to defend yourself when you're sued) to debtorboards (who advocate suing your creditors early and often) and I go to a handful of debt collector boards to lurk and see what they're talking about. The most important site is probably your state court pages on the civil codes, though. Find out how long the creditor has to litigate, what they can sue you for, what they can't sue you for, what constitutes a valid suit, and how to file paperwork and motions to support your case. Mistakes debtors make: - Not educated. Easy. Don't know how (or even if) they're being screwed with. Don't know their credit score. When you're doing credit repair it's worth it to have paid accounts with the credit bureaus because then you can pull your credit report as much as you like (without a ding on your score) and have super easy access to disputing inaccurate information. Most importantly, again, don't show up to court when they're summoned - and if they do they just sheepishly admit to the debt and let the plaintiff's attorney add in $1000+ in court costs and fees. Even if you feel you can't handle being in court yourself, there are places to go for free legal advice (my county has an entire pro se assistance department as well as a referral service for low-income defendants.) Mistakes creditors make: - Not suing themselves as the original creditor. This is changing, though. How is usually goes is this: 1. Account gets defaulted, moves to OC's default/legal department, they try to contact you for ~6-12 months after default to pay. If you don't: 2. Account is sold in batches for pennies on the dollar to a collection agency. Adds in additional fees because they feel like it. Cycle starts again, usually for 6-18 months. May file suit, if your account looks juicy. If not: 3. Account sold again, for fractions of a penny on the dollar, to a junk debt buyer. These people buy the worthless paper - accounts where no address/phone # is valid, accounts out of statute, you name it (one of them tried to collect on my grandfather for a 22 year old Sears card balance of $200!) Will probably file suit at some point, if it's not sold to 2 or 3 other JDBs first for less and less money. The farther down the chain your account goes, the less and less likely the person buying it has any valid, correct information about the account. For example, I was sued by a JDB for $4500. When I sent my request for documents, the final statement from the bank said I owed $2650 12 months ago. I asked the judge to have them show how $2650 turned into $4500 - they couldn't, and that won me the case. Once you get 2/3 buyers removed, they're probably not buying anything more about your account than an Excel spreadsheet with an account number and your name and last known address. When an original creditor sues you, they almost always have all their ducks in a row. Easy access to your contract, agreements, statements, everything. Those are the suits to fear, and thankfully I've only had to defend myself against one. I'll admit I got lucky in that suit because the legal counsel they hired were... less than stellar (and that's all I'll say to avoid breaking my NDA.) Mistakes collectors make: - Well, they don't make many because they aren't capitalized on. Oh, they lie to the consumer, threaten them, file frivolous lawsuits where their only evidence is basically someone in the company saying "Yup, you owe this, pay up!" and do many other unscrupulous things, but they don't care. Remember, they're buying your $10000 account, usually for as little as $50. If they buy 100 of those accounts and collect on just ONE of them at 60% of the balance, they've made $1000 on that portfolio! They'll take 30 of those to court, win let's say 25 of them (probably 28-30 in reality) and be countersued for $10000 by a debtor (and they settle for $5000.) So on a $5000 initial investment (and probably $25000 in legal fees/attorney fees) they've made about a quarter-million dollars. They don't sweat being scumbags, because the odds are in their favor. quote:What changes would you like to see made to the system as a whole? I'd like to see settling debt be more significant in regards to improving your credit. Right now, most people have no incentive to pay down a debt they've let default when they can aggressively challenge it and have it removed without paying or just stall the creditor out until the debt is time-barred. I'd like to see more regulation of what kinds of accounts debt buyers are able to purchase, with a requirement that they come with all the relevant paperwork showing title to the debt. I've had three different companies claim title to one Best Buy credit card of mine, and that shouldn't happen. Maybe increase the penalties allowable under the FCDPA to discourage frivolous lawsuits. Mostly, though, I'd like people to be more informed on how they can challenge what's being asked of them. I don't advocate walking away from your debt as some sort of sound strategy or cunning plan or anything. It's stressful, it's difficult, and if you make mistakes you're going to be on the hook, legally, and in most states that means wage garnishments and account seizures. But too many people assume that if they're being sued or told they have to pay, well, they must have a good foundation to prove it, and that's more likely than not the case.
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Nov 30, 2009 23:13
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Azure Renraku posted:Also, another big thing, is credit card companies saying that your rates are going up all of a sudden. You opt out and they tell you they want payment within 30 days and the account is frozen at the previous interest rate. Sorry, it doesn't work like that, you want to talk to me in court? Where such contracts are often proven unconscionable? Good luck! This really does depend on your contract, your state, and the judge. Most credit cards just have a stipulation that the account is frozen at that rate, and you can pay it off over time. I've never had a card that demanded payment in full at the time of closure, but maybe that's changing with newer cards. The worst thing that can happen is when you have a judge who's clearly pro-creditor, one that denies your motions and grants multiple extensions for them to produce paperwork they likely do not have. You can usually move to have the judge replaced, or use their bias in an appeal, but that just takes more time and more effort on your part. Utz posted:My girlfriend owes about $25k on two credit cards. Servicing that debt has grown onerous to the point that she's having trouble making her monthly expenses (rent, food, etc). What should she do? Let it default and go into collections or try working something out with the CC company? Her goal is to keep her credit in good shape, and she's willing to pay back the money, she's just having trouble keeping up since they raised their monthly minimums. I'll disclaimer again that I'm not a lawyer and this ain't legal advice - but she's going to have to make a hard decision. Regardless of whether or not you pay the debt once it defaults, it's likely going to stay on your record for 7 years, unless you negotiate a pay-for-delete (and then the tradeline's gone, which is still worse than having one in good standing.) I'd try to work out a more flexible payment schedule with the original creditor - if they'll allow it, and they don't mark the account as 'under settlement plan' or otherwise close the card. That's just about as bad as it being in collections, score-wise. If it's something she absolutely can't pay (and honestly, $25k of unsecured debt is not something you want to consider bankruptcy over) without making her monthly expenses, walking away may be a good idea, as long as she takes the time to research what to do when they start calling/writing letters/demanding large sums of money from her immediately. Also, if she has any secured debt (cars, properties, etc) do not default on those. Repos are terrible for your credit, and they don't go away very easily. antwizzle posted:Thread delivers, thanks! I'll keep it vague due to the multiple NDAs, but I had more credit cards/lines of credit than you could count on two hands, and the total debt owed was somewhere in the middle five figures. quote:What state do you live in? (again sorry if too specific) Illinois. Home of "Sorry, Small Claims doesn't allow for discovery, good luck!" quote:Did your debt ever force you to consider bankrupcy? Yes. It was either go bankrupt or fight. quote:How do you feel about the Credit C.A.R.D. Act passed by Congress? Sucks. Is only going to make it more difficult for people rebuilding their credit to start getting cards. Banks are raising their requirements for getting cards. You'll see less of the 0%/low rate balance transfer offers, too, since they won't be as profitable for the bank. Doesn't do anything for currently open accounts (check GBS for the thread on people getting their rates hiked to 29.99% just because) and I think some of the smaller issuers will be swallowed up by CapOne/Chase/BoA and you'll see less choice in the market. quote:How do you feel about the credit card/consumer debt industry in general? I hate the debt consolidators you see on late night commercials. All they really do is give you a single place to pay and sometimes a drop in the amounts you owe. I know plenty of horror stories using them (company didn't forward payments to the bank, forwarded payments to the wrong companies, closed every account in consolidation without telling the consumer, etc) and generally they can't do anything the consumer couldn't with a few phone calls to the right people at the bank. The credit card companies are what they are, and they won't change too much aside from getting more tight-fisted. Credit's always been something of a scummy business.
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Dec 1, 2009 07:19
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OneEightHundred posted:Semi-related, is there a surefire way to make collectors chasing someone else's debt via my address/phone number gently caress off? Send them a cease communications/cease and desist letter. Google that to find templates and send it off Certified Mail with a return receipt, so you know they got it. If the contact you after you get the little green card back, log every time they call and once they've called 5-10 times, let them know they've violated the FDCPA and you're intending to sue... but you might just let them go if they cut you a check for $1000!
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Dec 1, 2009 13:12
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Daedalus101 posted:I've got a related question for you. At least 6 months ago I started getting letters from local attorneys saying they saw I had been sued and wanted me to hire them to make it all go away. They even mentioned the creditor who was suing me so I assume they just got it from public records. The statute of limitations on a defaulted card was coming up so I figured "yeah, I'm getting sued. big deal." A few days latter i found a little card taped to my door from the county sheriffs dept. that said i urgently needed to call them about an important legal matter. I assume this was them trying to serve me and never called them back. I've heard nothing more of this and am wondering if there is a way to find out if a default judgment was entered against me? . . . Your credit report would show a judgment on the account, or you can go to your county courthouse and see if anything has been entered. Some counties have online/phone databases as well. Since you were never formally given a summons/complaint, if you do have a default judgment, you may have a case to have the judgment vacated, but that can be pretty complicated and you may want to seek legal help to file that properly.
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Dec 1, 2009 22:47
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antwizzle posted:A few more questions if you don't mind: Not many, I think. I even worked for a credit card company for a while with a sub-550 credit score. quote:What did you spend all that money on? I have maxed out 4 credit cards for about $13,000 during college, about 1/2 of that being somewhat justified (medical payments, tuition, books) and the other 1/2 frivolous spending (beer, gifts for my girlfriend, taking friends out to the bar etc.) About what you spent it on. I really can't comment further. quote:How do your friends & family feel about your choice on dealing with the situation? They're ok with it. Some of the older generation think I should pay up 100% (the whole 'moral obligation' thing) but my fiance is fully supportive of what I'm doing. quote:What's the worst thing a debt collector has done to you? Threats of physical harm. Total scumbag collector who softened up considerably once I hit them with a summons for $30,000 in violations and damages. quote:During the worst time how many calls per day on average did you get from them? Once or twice every hour. Some at work (which is a violation.) They mostly went away when I stopped home phone service and move to cell-only. I changed my phone number at least 4 or 5 times during the worst times, too. As for stories, I'll first talk about the last lawyer I had to deal with. Most debt collection lawyers are on the low end of the totem pole of their firm. As such, they aren't very good at thinking on their feet or dealing with challenges from educated pro se defendants. During the three hearings we had pre-trial he: - Could not keep straight the amount the plaintiff claimed I owed - Tried to tell me that fighting the lawsuit 'only adds legal fees I'll add on when I win' (not allowable, also a FDCPA violation) - Continually insulted me for not being a lawyer, told me how amazing he was because he went to some Ivy League school. When I asked him why he was taking these cases instead of something more glamorous, he just said 'you wouldn't understand' and shut up. - Told me his case was air-tight, but also said I didn't have the right to see the evidence he claimed he had on me. Didn't attach said evidence to his complaint, either. The case was dismissed last month by a judge who was very upset at the lawyer's lack of basic competence (with prejudice, so they cannot re-file) and I'm currently in contact with the firm about what they would like to do for me so I don't hit them with a FDCPA suit. Most of these lawyers do not expect and cannot handle being challenged on these suits. They want to show up, point to the spot where you aren't, and collect the full judgment without hassle. If you are being sued DO NOT LET THIS HAPPEN.
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Dec 2, 2009 02:41
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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^H110Hawk posted:You aren't behind and they're raising your rates? Call up any other bank and ask about free balance transfers. (0% fee or 0% interest over X months. Run the math on which is better for you.) Tell them how much money you have on your cards and that you have a clean payment history. They'll pull your credit report and verify that. Once you've transferred all the money over call up Citi and tell them to get hosed. You have above average credit if you've never missed a payment, even if your debt:income ratio is off the charts. Ask these other banks about converting your card to a personal loan, but that is a long shot. Good luck getting favorable balance transfer rates right now. Credit is tight as hell at most of the banks, and the default rates on balance transfers have skyrocketed over the last 2 years. If you have excellent credit, maybe. I've got friends who work at Chase Bank and they've told me you'd be lucky to get a 7-10% rate on a transfer for 6-12 months, plus a 3% transfer fee. And those are going to people with good credit. If your credit's average or below, the door's shut. Especially for new customers, banks don't need people playing the transfer shuffle and paying little or no interest on more debt for the company. T Zero posted:I'm not sure how to go about this. Is this a good idea? I'd like to get a second opinion and see if there is a way to settle without completely trashing my credit. If you're not looking to trash your credit, walking away from any of your cards isn't an option. You will see major dips in your rating as soon as 60-90 days from your first batch of missed payments. If you're looking to do a settlement with them, they also won't even talk to you about doing one usually until you're 120-210 days overdue on payments and they're about to send your account to be sold to a collection agency or set up for a lawsuit. Even a settled, closed card will probably sit on your credit and ding it down for 2-7 years and most banks will challenge a report dispute on it nowadays. I've never done anything in regards to using a merchant account to act as a de facto balance transfer, but if you can get the balance on one card I'd recommend it. Just don't then run up the empty card now that the credit's available! However, if you do decide to walk away, then walk away now. Stop making payments and sock some of that money away for savings/settlements later. If you absolutely need credit open for an emergency, consider applying for a card from another bank or a credit union while your score is still high, and only have it available for major emergencies, aside from using it once or twice a month to fill up your tank and immediately pay it off so they don't close it for inactivity. That card will likely see a rate reduction/credit limit drop as your score plummets. You will get letters and phone calls from Citi and Amex. Ignore them. At the 180 day mark or so, call them and try to negotiate a pay-for-delete at 20-30% of what you owed. Make it clear that if you don't get a full delete (or, at worst, a 'closed by consumer') you aren't paying. Most original creditors will not do this. Don't worry, at least you tried. 30-90 days after this, one of two things will happen: 1) You'll get what's called a dunning letter from the people who bought your account(s). This lets you know who now owns your account and your rights as a debtor. Send them a letter back demanding they verify that the account is yours, they have the proper documentation, and that the account was sold legally. At the same time, dispute the account with the credit bureaus. If they continue collections without validating, that's a violation. Note it. If they validate with the bureau but send you nothing, violation. After 30 days, if they don't hear from the debt buyer, the agency will delete the tradeline - and if they put it back on, that's a violation if they haven't validated with you. Note any and all violations of how they contact you by mail (does it expressly say it's a communication to collect a debt?) and by phone (Are they calling at allowable times? Only at home? Do the discuss the debt with your family/roommates/anyone but you?) and if they contact you at all if you included a cease communication request in your letter. If you include that, they can only contact you to let you know they've sold the debt to someone else, or to sue you. Give this 2-6 months, and generally the buyer will have committed enough violations for you to make a move. Write them (or call, if you're brave) and demand a pay-for-delete at 10% of what they claim you owe, or you will begin lawsuit proceedings against them for FDCPA violations. If they accept(go up to about 30-35% if they reject 10%), get the terms in writing, then pay them and dispute the tradeline - if it doesn't go away in 30 days, sue them. 2) The original creditor will open a lawsuit against you in your county, using rent-a-lawyers in your area. You'll be served with a summons that has a return date where you have to appear. This is not your trial date but you do need to attend or you lose automatically. Expect this from AmEx - they're very sue-happy right now. Citi will probably sell your debt before they sue, but you can never tell. Read up on your state's Rules of Civil Procedure. In my state, showing up at the appearance date and saying you deny the claims is enough to proceed. In other states, you will need to file a written answer (I'd suggest filing the answer anyway, even if you don't have to. The other side will need time to read it, and that can buy you 1-2 months between court dates. I had a suit that began in July 07 that didn't have a firm trial date until September 08. Courts can be slooooowwwwww.) Examine the summons and complaint. What are they suing you for/what evidence did they attach? Since it's the original creditor, they'll likely have everything they need to beat you, but many rent-a-lawyers can be very, very bad at managing even slam-dunk cases when they're pressed. As of right now your best defense against an OC is electing arbitration. 95% of all cards that began prior to August of this year will have an arbitration clause, and electing it waives the courtroom proceedings into a private setting. I can go deeper into why arbitration is so good for consumers right now (and did a bit a few posts up) but let's put it this way - there are cases right now where AmEx's lawyers are trying to say that their own clause should be invalidated because they are having difficulty finding an arbitration forum to take their claim. If you need more information I'll be happy to answer your questions. CubsWoo fucked around with this message at 08:59 on Dec 2, 2009 |
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Dec 2, 2009 08:54
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You may not have been sued either because they can't find you or they feel your debt isn't worth suing for.Squared posted:A lot of my accounts are several years overdue, and I imagine my freshest one must be approaching 2-3 years now. Do you have any advice for someone in my situation regarding what course of action to take? Order your credit reports. All 3 bureaus will give you a free trial for a week or so, which is enough time to check all the accounts on your record and who claims to own them now. Check your state for how long the statute of limitations is, and if any of the accounts are over 7 years old. Anything over those timeframes is no longer your legal responsibility to pay, and the people who own it can't legally collect. Send those collectors/creditors letters demanding they be removed from your credit report and dispute them with the bureaus. If it's prior to 7 years, likely it won't be pruned from your report - but they may mistakenly start trying to collect, and that's something you can threaten a lawsuit on. Anything that's still within statute you have to be more careful on. If they're not currently contacting you, there's a good chance they don't know where you are/don't care about your debt. This means if you don't need your credit better immediately, you can sit back and wait for the statute to expire. If you do want to start repair right now, dispute the debts through the bureaus and force them to validate. This will give those agencies your current address (and possibly phone number, if not through the bureau then probably through a Lexis search) and put you back on their radar. If you just want it over with and you have the money to settle, offer them a pay-for-delete at 10-20% of what they claim you owe and see if they bite. Don't let them go too much higher, they wrote your account off for dead long ago and the fact they get anything at all from you is profit. quote:If I do end up getting sued, I will most likely be hosed, even more than I currently am somehow. I noticed in your list of options that filing for bankruptcy wasn't listed. Had you considered this at all? I certainly have been thinking about it, but I am not sure where to start or who to call. I'm not a big fan of bankruptcy - it sticks on your credit report for 10 years instead of 7 and the changes in the rules and rulings can still leave you with debt issues. It's something I think should only be considered as a nuclear option, and while I don't have experience with it I'm sure there are plenty of bankruptcy forums out there who could help much better than I.
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Dec 3, 2009 04:21
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Rubber Johnny posted:This thread has been a real eye opener for me concerning my debt issues. I can't thank you enough for setting me in a direction I never thought possible. I have a question I hope you can shed some light on. The car situation, I think, makes it securitized debt which isn't my forte. However, it's probably possible to follow the same steps once they take the car and try to collect on the remainder. You may want to ask on creditboards or one of the other major debt-related forums for more advice. Check the terms and conditions of your loan. Is arbitration an option? The current climate regarding how pro-consumer it is can scare collectors away if you threaten to elect it in a letter. CubsWoo fucked around with this message at 08:05 on Dec 3, 2009 |
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Dec 3, 2009 08:01
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Basketofpancakes posted:Hey, I guess I should ask you for advice. At this point, lawsuit wise, I would say you probably don't have much to worry about. I won't speak on the car loan, but most of the time creditors won't sue on unsecured debt that's less than about $2000 - it's generally not worth the effort to pay to have the suit filed and hire local counsel to go through the motions. Note I say most of the time, though, banks like Cap1 have been known to sue for $300 cards in the past. And even if they can't collect on the debt immediately, having a judgment on your credit report hurts far worse than an unpaid card (and stays there 7 years from the judgment date) so that's something to worry about. If you're not getting mail, they don't know where you live and aren't bothering to try to find out. I would check your credit report sometime and see if they have levied a judgment against you at your previous address. As I've said before, collectors/their scumbag attorneys will do things like sue you at your last known address, falsify a proof of summons, and obtain a default judgment against you without you ever knowing it. (Someone I know had a judgment against them claiming they were served at an abandoned strip mall, of all places.) In that case, you'd need to have the judgment vacated (a process that I'm not going to go over in this post - if you have that going on, let me know and I'll cover it) and move from there. Small potatoes cards I wouldn't be too concerned about in terms of legal action, but when you start making more cash you may want to consider trying to do a PFD on those credit cards to get them off your record. That's $3000 in debt that you'd probably be able to get deleted off your record for under $1000 if you're savvy in dealing with them. Also, if you're going to get serious about credit repair, you may want to consider getting a secured credit card from Bank of America or one of the other banks that offer it (try local credit unions, or anywhere that has a manageable annual fee. No-fee secured cards are difficult-to-impossible to find, and there are a lot of scam companies that will say "Here's a $300 limit, but we pile on $250 in fees to start up the card, what a sweet deal!" Don't ever do those.) They usually let you start the card with $300-500, and if you're responsible with it and keep up your payments, after 12-24 months there's a good chance they'll move it into an unsecured card and convert your cash deposit into a savings or checking account. You can also try applying for store credit cards - they generally have low acceptance standards, and buying 1 thing a month from that store and paying it off in full looks good on your report. One of my first post-repair cards actually came from Macy's, with a $100 limit. So every month I bought a pack of socks or a meal at the cafe and paid it off, and in less than a year they jumped my limit to $1500, and that being reported at 0% utilization helped my score a bit.
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Dec 3, 2009 14:23
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Zarrr posted:As a lawyer who does a small amount of debt collection, this is all pretty much untrue where I practice. Perhaps things are different where you live, but I'm frequently challenged on judgment recovery suits (also frequently they do go unchallenged) and am absolutely fine with that happening. The more work a lawyer does on a file, the more he gets to bill. No skin off my back if you want to fight it. And that's fine, but it's usually skin off your plaintiff's back. A defendant who shows up to defend costs exponentially more than a default judgment, and the costs in billable hours and time to collect skyrockets again if they're filing answers, motions, discovery, and nowadays especially - arbitration. Cap1 now fires local counsel off the case if arbitration is even mentioned by the debtor. I think BoA and Chase are doing that too. At some point the plaintiff has to weigh the fact that they're spending $5000 on legal fees and 6-8 months of time chasing after at $3000 debt (fees they won't get awarded from the court) and consider the case no longer worth it when that same lawyer can move to the stack of default judgments that they'll earn in full with two hours worth of work. I have yet to be sued by a lawyer (and we're talking double-digit numbers of law firms in my state) that provided even a minimal level of acceptable proof that they had standing to sue, that proved my obligation to pay, or that what they claimed I owed was the correct amount. I'm sued without contracts. Sued without evidence of the account being sold. Sued by firms that believed tripling the balance due in fees they couldn't document was acceptable. Motions filed full of spelling errors, sent to the court unsigned and not notarized. Motions filed where a copy wasn't sent to me in an attempt to weasel a default judgment for not showing up (thank goodness I check the county website every few days for changes!) It is my opinion, and the opinion of many similar-experienced pro se litigators, that most lawyers representing small claims suits brought by creditors/junk debt buyers are not the cream of the legal crop, and are fairly easy to defeat given an educated pro se defense. Your mileage may vary! quote:I agree with the general thrust of this thread, that if you are in bad financial shape it is difficult for a creditor to do anything meaningful to collect. That said, 98% of people will face significant problems if they default as they have something to lose. I regularly garnish wages, enforce against assets, register/execute against property, etc. In my view it's only those people with nothing but big unsecured debt (and a lack of concern for their own credit rating/"moral obligation") and nothing to show for it that should be doing anything recommended in this thread. Again, that's based on where I practice. I agree. Again, I'm not a lawyer. I just beat lawyers as a defendant in debt collection cases and a plaintiff in FDCPA/FDCRA cases. I cannot guarantee that what works for me will work for you. In many cases, a lawyer will do what I do better, for a price. And in terms of 'having nothing to lose,' well, that was me. If you cannot pay the debt you've accrued (regardless of why, I know sob stories are not effective defenses) there's no point in sitting back and allowing judgments onto your record. If you win, great! If you lose, aside from any state where they collect legal fees, you are no worse off than you were the day you were served. In nearly every case, you have nothing to lose by challenging a lawsuit against you. I will make one caveat - if the amount owed is too much to be seen in small claims, you will probably want hired counsel. I recommend the National Consumer Law Center (consumerlaw.org) to find a good consumer lawyer in your area. friendship waffle posted:I constantly get calls on my cell for someone else who apparently owes various companies money and likes to put down my phone number. I've called back, told them to stop calling, done everything I could. Find out who's calling, get their address and send them a cease and desist letter certified mail with a return receipt. Once the green card comes back, log every call you take from them (and if you can record the calls in your state, do so.) After a few weeks/month of phone calls, contact them with an intent to sue for harassing you for a debt that isn't yours. I don't know the exact areas that falls under for the FDCPA/your state rules, but give your intent to sue for the maximum allowed + damages for pain and suffering. State you will reconsider suing if they wish to settle with you for $1000-2000, depending on how many times they called. They may pay you at this point, they may ignore you. It might take having them served with the suit before they get serious, but generally if you do it right they'll cave before that.
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Dec 3, 2009 22:18
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3 Stacked Midgets posted:I've got a very interesting issue. If it's off your credit report, it's not hurting you, but that doesn't mean they can't try to collect if it's in statute. Keep an eye on your reports and see if someone claims that debt. If nobody has claimed the debt and it's not reporting, it's probably best to ignore it until someone tries to claim it and collect/the statute runs out. It also may have changed names for some reason - any large debts you don't recognize? Dispute them. Transunion having wrong information is something you can correct - the 20k debt may not be yours legally (possibly your father's?) and they have to either prove you owe it or move it off your report. Namirsolo posted:I have a friend who is receiving calls at work from a creditor. How can she get them to stop? What action can she take to make sure that they aren't endangering her job? I should put this in the OP, I guess. Have her find the address of the group who's calling her at work and write them a cease and desist letter, certified mail, with a return receipt. That should stop the phone calls. In terms of job endangerment, getting the calls stopped should help. If it doesn't, damages from job loss/personal humiliation in addition to the FDCPA violation could be considered in a small claims lawsuit, if it goes that far.
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Dec 4, 2009 09:35
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antwizzle posted:How exactly doesthe statute of limitations figure in? For example, I live in Texas(4 years), but let's say a defaulted card balance is sold to a collector in Delaware (6 years). Do they have 4 years to sue me or 6? What if you move to a different state with a longer SOL? Typically the statute that applies is the one where you live. Some lawyers will try to argue a longer statute applies, there's case law both ways. Most of the time moving does change your statute if the new state is different. The FDCPA applies to anyone trying to collect a debt. This includes original creditors, collection agencies, junk debt buyers, and lawyers representing any of the above. Smerdyakov posted:Question for OP (or for the debt lawyer): In the last place I lived I would get phone calls at 6 in the morning saying that someone owed such and such a debt. The calls were all from an unlisted number, and every time I called their number and gave them the twenty digit code they mentioned every time, I would get routed to someone in India who would immediately disconnect if I told them I was not the person they were trying to contact, if I asked what the name of their company was, etc. That has to be some kind of violation, but what is there to do in that situation? I ended up just unplugging the phone every night and plugging it in every morning when I woke up. This can be difficult to track down, you may want to contact your phone company and see if they can trace the blocked number.
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Dec 5, 2009 04:36
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quality management posted:you could have used all this effort avoiding your obligations and screwing over the people who lent you money when you needed it but didn't have it coming up with ways of obtaining money and paying them back This is a good point! A better point is that by the time I was able to earn the money in question, paying the people back who claimed I owed them money was not going to benefit me in any way! This is further proven by the court case I just closed last week that stops a collector from trying to collect on one of the larger accounts (~$7000) and may, if I want to, put about $3000 in my pocket that I will use to pay creditors that actually play by the rules! Squared posted:If you have any advice as to how I should start making contact with these people as to not gently caress myself over, I would greatly appreciate it. Generally the people listed on your credit report are those who are currently reporting as owners of your debt. You can sometimes find the contact info on your credit report or you can just Google the names of those companies. Dispute all the records as not valid and see if they confirm, that'll get them to start sending you letters and such and you can go from there. duz posted:Make sure you remember to cancel the recurring billing and use annualcreditreport.com next time. annualcreditreport.com is great but if you're going to do dedicated credit repair I don't mind paying the monthly fees for the bureau subscriptions, they make it very easy to process disputes and get nearly real-time updates on the items on your report falling off. ClearWhiteLight posted:Should I just stop paying everything but my student loans, and get cash advances from my one reasonably open line of credit to make lump sum settlement payments? Or what? How hosed am I? You might want to walk away from that amount of debt if it's pulling you underwater. If you can keep paying and comfortably live, do so, because defaulting on that much is going to murder your credit for a very, very long time. If you can live with that, walk away from it and ignore the calls/change your phone number while you sock away money to deal with later settlements or court costs. If the student loans are federal, keep paying, because those defaults can't be discharged in bankruptcy and they'll just garnish your tax return if you stop paying. Loco179 posted:I am having a issue with my former apartment. The validation looks good - as for getting your deposit back, check the tenant laws for your state. I've never needed to do that before, so I can't really help.
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Dec 10, 2009 18:13
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EVG posted:Wow, this is very interesting. If the debt is outside of statute, their attempts to collect are violations of the FDCPA, and if they're trying to re-age (change the last date of delinquency so that the debt appears to be in statute) that's a violation of the FDCRA. Send them a letter demanding they stop trying to collect or you plan to sue because they're trying to collect on a time-barred debt. Do not pay them anything. If they're trying to collect on a time-barred debt, you can be almost 100% sure they won't honor any settlement pay/delete agreements. Burning Beard posted:What about Business Cards? Apparently I may be on the hook for CC cards that were issued to me from a business I was involved in. It's total bullshit and has hosed me hard. Personally my stuff is perfect and in order save for some student loans. In other words, five cards want ME to pay the entire debt of a small Corporation that went out of business 4 years ago. This fight has been going on for ages. I haven't ever needed to deal with a business/corporate CC, but from others I've heard it can be maddening once the debt has been sold to the junk buyers. You'd probably get better advice asking over on creditboards or one of the other dedicated sites - the companies who've been buying that debt have been playing this account smart by selling it to someone else when you demand verification and trying to sneak through a suit to land a default judgment. Talk to your lawyer about counter-suing once this case is over to try and recoup any attorney fees plus damages - and have him look for an arbitration clause in the contract language, that could win you the case tomorrow.
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Dec 10, 2009 23:10
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ville2ville posted:
The date where you stopped paying is considered your date of first delinquency, and it's the day the clock normally starts on the statute of limitations/the 7 year clock to have it fall off your credit report. The older a debt/transgression, the less impact it has on your score. As for the cell bill, with its age and low amount, you might be able to get a PFD for $100 or less if you play your cards right. The name of the collector on your credit report should be the one who owns it - send them a validation letter and dispute the listing. If they validate properly, work with them for a PFD. Do this with your other cards as well, and if you now have the disposable income to pay them off, do so and get those negatives deleted. Just make sure the reporting dates on your report are correct - many companies will re-age accounts to try and make them seem in statute when they aren't. If you've kept good records you should know when your last payment to that company was and can cross-reference that with the report. If that's wrong or been moved up, you're dealing with a scumbag and can probably get the report deleted without paying by collecting FDCPA violations and threatening to sue if they don't delete. quote:I know you can get a free credit report something like once a year, and i've done that recently although I wasn't sure exactly what I was looking at on each of the three branches. Is there a number to the agency that currently owns my papers? Is there anyway to know how far down the line it is? Like whether its a 'junk' CA or the original? Google the names of the companies who claim your debt. Most original creditors will show up as their name or their DBA (Chase, Cap1, AT&T, public utilities, it'll be a name you recognize.) Most of the others like Asset Acceptance, Midland, LVNV, and so on are the junk debt buyers. Most of their Google searches will show Ripoffreport complaints and the like. Generally a debt gets sold 3-5 times before it falls out of statute (and then it gets sold 2-3 more) but normally there's no real way to know how many hands it's passed through besides seeing how little they'll settle for. quote:If you are never 'served' in person is it possible to still be sued and auto settled against for no show if you never knew it happened? Or can the court date not be set until it is confirmed you have been notified. YES. And it's against the rules. Many of the scummy buyers/lawyers will try serving you in ridiculous places (at schools, abandoned properties, a home you lived in years ago) and say you were served/supply fraudulent proof to get a default judgment. They need to follow very precise rules (file suit in the county you currently live in, most counties require personal service to the defendant or a family member, some allow for mailed services but not all - check your county court, the summons must have the complaint and in most states, the evidence they have on you) and not getting served is an easy way to get a judge to vacate the judgment and start the process all over. It's also a FDCPA violation, even if it's not malicious (but it is malicious, since they proceeded with the suit knowingly without a proper summons, but whatever) so you turn around and tell the plaintiff/their lawyer that you're suing if they don't stop legal action on you.
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Dec 11, 2009 03:59
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ville2ville posted:Wow, thanks for the info. Since i've read this thread i've got my 3 annual reports from the bureaus (well I haven't got my Trans yet because they locked me out after I didn't answer a question right). Do you think you could take a look at them and let me know what you see, if anything? Maybe this is something you aren't supposed to do and that's fine. Or if it's asking for something that is normally charged good money for, that's fine too. But let me know. Thanks for your confidence in me, but I'm not comfortable looking over someone else's credit report. Go read up on creditboards or https://www.debt-consolidation-credit-repair-service.com on how to go over your report, or see if your area has a free consumer counseling center/program to get more help.
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Dec 11, 2009 05:44
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Iron Squid posted:I had an old-as-gently caress bill from 1995 that some collection agency has begun calling me about. One of their reps told me if I didn't pay it off, it would go back on my credit report. Can they do this? No. Tell the guy you know he's lying and to gently caress off or you'll come after him and his company with a suit. That should get them to stop.
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Dec 12, 2009 05:42
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Iron Squid posted:Can you provide me a legal reference for telling them to cease or I'll sue, for the state of California? Somehow "Stop calling or I'm calling my lawyer" is something they probably hear a hundred times a day, 99.9% of which is a bluff. But if I can say "You are in violation of California statute blah blah blah...", it'll probably strengthen my arguement. If they want it in writing, look up their phone number on Google, find their corporate address, and send them a letter that looks something like this: quote:To whom it may concern: Sign it, date it, and send it certified mail/return receipt to them. Or just cite the FDCPA and the CA Civil Code over the phone.
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Dec 12, 2009 07:16
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Iron Squid posted:15 U.S.C. § 1692c(c) says all such requests must be made in writing, and nothing about suing them if they continue to call my cell phone. California Civil Code § 1788.17 just says to obey federal law, as far as I can tell. I've been able to successfully sue (well, threaten to, they opened up their checkbook well before it reached trial) over calling my cell phone after being told not to in writing, and most judges have interpreted the FDCPA to consider cell numbers as home numbers for the purposes of cease communication letters. Most collectors will stop if you cite the FDCPA over the phone, but you're dealing with someone who's collecting on a debt nearly 9 years out of statute so this may not apply. Not to mention them saying the debt can go on your credit report is considered misrepresenting the status of a debt and a FDCPA violation as would them trying to re-attach it to your report. Send a validation letter alongside your cease communication and you're hitting them twice with the need to stop contacting you about the debt. Have you even received a dunning letter? CubsWoo fucked around with this message at 13:46 on Dec 12, 2009 |
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Dec 12, 2009 13:42
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Ryokurin posted:I have a debt from a company that recently went over the seven year statue earlier this year. Part of the reason I have never paid it was because the amount they want has changed over the years, and when you really get down to it, some of it was outrageous, like $2000 for a cable box I never ordered. It has gone through several agency's and I have had credit for a couple of years while my score is decent but not great (670) I still feel that it's probably is a key reason why I can't seem to raise my score much higher. If it's out of statute, and thus time-barred, they can't do anything legally to collect the debt. It should be off your report, too - dispute it as a time-barred or out of statute debt and it should disappear. If you have proof the debt is >7 years old, you can talk to the bureaus and make sure it stays away. If they try to put it back or re-age the debt you have grounds to start legal action against the collectors. The Big Rhino posted:Cubswoo, He is correct. I don't even think he needs to make a payment. It's probably going to be harder than he thinks, though, since generally credit cards have a daily limit on how much you can take out in cash advances and they're quick to pull the plug on his card/limit if he thinks he's trying to drain the card and walk away. This is a somewhat common thing for people to do, though, write one of those checks that come in your statement out to themselves, deposit it in their bank account and use the money. He can be pretty sure that if he does this, though, his bank will probably be very quick to file a civil suit for the balance and have an excellent collection of evidence to win with. So it'll be risky, but if he wants to do it that's his choice. I wouldn't ever recommend intentionally running up credit cards, though. Iron Squid posted:And I don't believe I have received a "dunning letter". What is this exactly? A dunning letter is a letter sent from the collector letting you know that this company/agency has purchased or acquired your debt and is attempting to collect. A proper dunning letter will tell you your rights as a consumer, that you have 30 days to dispute the information, and a disclaimer that says their communication is an attempt to collect a debt. Things like that. CubsWoo fucked around with this message at 20:06 on Dec 12, 2009 |
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Dec 12, 2009 20:03
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keelem posted:I received a dunning letter almost 2 months ago from a lawyer for CACH LLC, a company that bought the debt (~17k) I owed to a credit card company. Being the unmotivated person I am, I didn't do any research on the subject and took no action. I haven't been sued or anything yet, though. Since its been way over the 30 day limit to dispute, is there a point to sending a debt verification letter? What should I do? If it's past the 30 days, your options are a bit more limited but you can still force them to verify by sending the DV letter and at the same time disputing the debt with the bureaus. If they don't mark the debt as disputed - violation. If they continue collection on a disputed debt - violation. Once they validate, though, they can continue collection, so add in a cease communication along with the DV language to get rid of the calls. They may be calling your mother's number because it's the only connection to you on file (probably obtained through a Nexis/skip trace search) but you can't really sue unless they're knowingly talking to a third party about your debt (generally, a "please call X number regarding your account" isn't sufficient to sue, but it can be if they're not saying something along the lines of "this call is an effort to collect a debt" or other similar language) but if your mother picks up and tells them you're not at that number and not to call again, as long as that's recorded, it's something to add to a pile of violations. I probably wouldn't try to sue just on phone calls, though - those that violate calls will do other violations when talked to/in writing.
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Dec 14, 2009 00:40
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antwizzle posted:Wow, so if this is true, according to 805.c: I changed my phone number before I was really aware of my rights and started fighting back instead of ducking and cowering. Sending these letters with the return receipt, certified mail is the most important part - save all those green cards, because it's a simple defense for them to say 'we never got your letter' unless you have proof through those mailings. Some people go so far as to have FedEx/UPS deliver them, but I don't feel that's necessary. It also gives you standing if the letter comes back unopened, because you can show a good faith effort to exercise your rights that was denied because they wouldn't accept your letter. Also correct that they can only call once per day, during acceptable hours.
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Dec 14, 2009 08:21
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Kase Im Licht posted:Before anyone gets themselves in trouble or makes a fool of themselves I'll just point out that THE FDCPA DOES NOT APPLY TO ORIGINAL CREDITORS. Basically every single web page you can find talking about the FDCPA will point this out. This is correct, but I should clarify: The FDCPA may not apply to original creditors - but many states in the nation have state laws/statutes that basically extend the FDCPA to original creditors, and (I believe) all of them have a law or statute that is similar in scope, if not in damages allowable. Check your state laws! Not to mention, if the OC files suit against you, their hired firm IS bound to the FDCPA, since they're considered a third party. I'm not sure if in-house counsel would be - i've never had to deal with that. OC's are also bound to the FCRA, so make sure your debt is being reported properly. EVG posted:Real sorry if I missed it in the thread, but can you give me a basic example of what a letter like this should look like? RE: Account 2492374892739234 Dear Debt Collector Fuckface, I request that you cease and desist your efforts to collect on the above referenced alleged account. The alleged debt is time-barred as per 735 Illinois Compiled Statute 5/13-205 and I am under no obligation to pay any amount on this alleged debt you claim I owe. Do not contact me, my family, or any third party in regards to this debt in future, by any means, with the exception of a letter agreeing that you have received this and agree to never contact me again in any form. Attempts to misrepresent this alleged debt may result in my initiation of legal action against your company for violations of the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act (FDCPA,) the Fair Credit Reporting Act (FCRA) and the Illinois Uniform Commercial Code (UCC.) Thank you, Name CubsWoo fucked around with this message at 21:27 on Dec 14, 2009 |
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Dec 14, 2009 21:20
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quepasa18 posted:By licensed to collect, do you mean licensed to practice law? Because if you owe me a debt, I don't have to be "licensed" to attempt to collect it from you, nor does a collection agency I hire to collect the debt up until a lawsuit is filed. If you're talking about attorneys, that and the statute of limitations will come up if they sue you in court. In the meantime, the FDCPA doesn't require that information be given to you, unless there's a particular law in your state that requires it. This is pretty much correct, check your state laws. Some states require the agency provide you with a license showing that they're either licensed in your state or in their home state. Generally, though, even if they've excluded that information, that's a sufficient DV letter. Check the info they've given you. Does it jive with the records you have? You've got a right (sometimes before court, sometimes during, again check state laws) to have a full accounting of the debt and how they came to the number they claim you owe.
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Dec 16, 2009 23:34
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Cannabis posted:Maybe this was asked before...but didn't catch it. Let's say if you are about to reach the SOL for an account, and then another collector purchases that account...does it start over? Or does it only start over if you send a payment? No. Statute can only restart if you make a payment.
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Dec 17, 2009 03:15
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keelem posted:If I got a dunning letter from an attorney saying he represents the debt collector, should all my communication to the debt collector be addressed to him? Yes. quote:Also, you suggested I dispute my debt with a credit agency. I checked my credit report and only the charged-off credit card account is showing up. There's no other information there about an account in collections with the debt collector that bought my debt. How should I go about disputing it? The debt may not have been reassigned to the new agency/collector. Dispute it and make them update it with proper information, this can be done either with a letter to the bureaus or online. Pagan posted:Excellent thread! I've got a few questions, tho. Send a verification letter to the collector and dispute with the bureaus - again, you can do this online or with a letter (it's super easy to do online if you have the paid monthly account with the bureau; slightly less so if you don't but still possible, they bury it on the sites.) As for Chexsystems I've never had to deal with them - when you paid the collector, did you get in writing that they'd send you the 'paid in full' letter? If it's still on your report, dispute it as paid and if the bureau asks you for more info you can send them a copy of the cancelled check as proof. And yes, you can contest multiple debts in one letter/website visit, just make sure you include as much info as you can about them in your letter. samizdat posted:I'm wondering if it's worth it to call the lawyers up and saying something like, "Sorry dudes, but I'm basically on welfare. You aren't going to get your money within the next several years, so please just make this all go away"? The lawyers don't care, honestly. You might be able to get somewhere with a goodwill letter (basically telling your sob story and asking that they don't litigate/saying you're not worth their time) but all they care about is getting the judgment on your record. They stay on your report for ~10 years (and in some states can be collectable for 20 or more years) and they'll just check up on you every six months after getting the judgment and see if you now have a garnishable income or bank account that can be taken. On top of that, the judgment does collect interest, so once you're back on your feet you may find your money going towards the old debt. I wouldn't declare bankruptcy - if they do decide to sue, fight back pro se/get help from a local free legal help center. If you're on public assistance you'll qualify.
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Dec 20, 2009 03:51
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OMGLOLetcetc posted:I hope during income tax time I can take my whole check and haggle with some of the folks I owe money too. I already have my credit report printed with everyone I owe money to. My action plan is to just call them, offer the least I can, and hope they take it. If they don't, they are at the bottom of the totem pole and I move on to the next. That's a pretty good plan - start all your offers at 10% of what they claim you owe. If you can get them to settle for 15-20%, that's not too bad as long as it's for a delete and not just a settle. Remember, if they won't delete, you don't pay. ZoneManagement posted:I got a phone call tonight and this thread popped into my mind. Tell them to gently caress off. If it's off your credit report and that far outside statute (they might - might have a case in Ohio or Kentucky but most cases have ruled credit as an open-ended account and not a written note) they'll get laughed out of any courtroom and you instantly countersue for at least a grand. You have no legal obligation to pay that debt and if they keep bothering you, send a Cease Communication letter to them and force them to. ZoneManagement posted:I also have a friend who has a open an account, that is in good status, that has been open for 4 years now, with a 12,000 dollar limit, with a high of 5400 dollars. He's never heard of this account. He also has a C/O of 1295 dollars with BoA from a secured credit card. BoA also got a judgment on him in the amount of 1295. If the judgment has been levied, there's not much he can do. The account will stay on the report as will the judgment. There may be a few avenues to try, though. - Did he know about the lawsuit? Was he served properly, in the right county, etc? If not, he may have a chance at getting the judgment vacated and sent back to trial. - If he was served properly and got a default levied, or just lost, it wouldn't hurt to send a goodwill letter to BoA regarding the debt. Have they tried to garnish wages or seize any of his accounts to take the money? If not, they may be having a hard time finding his assets (if he has any) and could be willing to take what they can get. Be aware, though, a company will almost never agree to delete a judgment off your record (thus paying it will look slightly better) and they've won the legal ability to collect the full amount they sued for, so some companies will just say 'tough poo poo, no deal, pay what we were awarded.' Either way, BoA has him by the nuts and it's up to them how to handle it.
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Dec 24, 2009 14:11
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Loco179 posted:I did a debt validation letter. They filed suit before they sent it out. As far as I can tell the collector has done things right. They filed suit prior to receiving your DV letter, which is acceptable, and once the suit is filed the time for a DV letter is over. A few tips regarding the case: (once again, not a lawyer, this is not legal advice.) - What is the debt for? Credit card, back rent/utilities, payday loan, something else? What, aside from the court summons, was included with the complaint? If all they attached was a complaint or an affidavit, you may be able to fight the case because they filed without standing. - Check your state laws regarding service. They may have served improperly if the state requires an in-person service, which backlogs their case and buys you time. At that point they may just serve you in the courtroom but that pushes back the appearance date, usually for a month or more. quote:I know I am going to have to pay it. Its less than 800 bucks. gently caress that. Fight the case. The absolute worst thing that can happen is you pay what they wanted in the first place. A small debt like that will probably be dropped whoever owns it as soon as you make the law firm work for it. As long as your state doesn't allow lawyer bills to be attached to a judgment, fight. If the firm spends more than 5-10 hours on your case, that's worth more than the amount they're going after. This is very, very easy to do. First, file an answer to the complaint. It can be as simple as this: quote:Comes now, Defendant Loco179 in answer to Plaintiff Jerkoff Creditor's Complaint. Then you add in what are called Affirmative Defenses, where you attack their ability to sue and other things. Read this thread: http://creditboards.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=132612 (you have to register at the site, but it's a free forum.) Your appearance date isn't your trial, it's to set that up. If you bring an answer there's a good chance opposing counsel will ask for more time to respond, and you'll push the trial back farther. In between, attack their evidence with motions, ask for discovery, all that good stuff. Bury them in paperwork and make them quit. ZoneManagement posted:I pulled my credit report from annualcreditreport.com and - oddly enough - wasn't able to pull it from transunion or equifax. Equifax said I didn't answer their questions right - which I did, and transunion had an error. Odd. I wonder if I had spent money if they would have had issues. The lien can stay on your report even after it's paid off until it falls off naturally, but you should be able to submit proof to the bureaus that it was paid and get them to update your report to reflect that. Call the bureaus and see what/where to submit information.
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Dec 30, 2009 11:56
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stewdiny posted:One of my closest friends who is American and his wife who is from one of the Slavic countries in the European Union were hit hard by the recession. Both are college educated, lost their jobs, could not find work, and were struggling hard. Well about five months back they said they lost all faith in the US and its government and were leaving to go live in her country at a small home her parents gave them. They sold off all their assets, cashed in their stocks, IRA’s, and savings. No, this is correct. Debt doesn't travel with you country to country (at least, American debt doesn't.) Unsecured debt in these forms is in almost every case a civil matter, not a criminal one. As such, he's probably got a ton of judgments against him as well as a lien on any future tax returns he might file with the US government, not that it matters if he's out of the country. My state even specifically says that the state has no power to jail you or otherwise punish you for failure to pay a debt outside of putting a garnishment on your paycheck to satisfy a judgment. Once you leave the US you're virtually untouchable outside of maybe some laughable attempts at international correspondence by a desperate debt buyer.
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Dec 30, 2009 23:37
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jassi007 posted:I'd imagine they'd have to prove said accident took place. Someone can probably tell you the proper legalese to say "prove there was an accident by sending me a copy of the accident report." It doesn't even have to be in legalese. Something as simple as 'I deny your claim that I was in an accident on that date and request proof that I am a liable party for this claim' which is kinda legalese but not really should be more than enough. Couple that with a cease communication request ("Aside from providing me said proof, don't contact me about this anymore" should do it) and you should be done with them. I'm not sure if insurance disputes go on your credit report, I'd assume they do but I've never dealt with one myself.
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Jan 6, 2010 01:52
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Thanks TWiNKiE for your input - it's nice to get someone else's perspective on this.TWiNKiE posted:I'll jump in, since I've been through a lot of this. This is good advice if the online disputes aren't working. Personally I've only had one problem mark that didn't go away with an online dispute, but a written one sent to the bureaus will generally be more effective. Then again, I've been happy with online disputing. quote:Call them and work something out, or declare bankruptcy. This, on the other hand, is terrible advice. Especially in today's climate regarding the use of arbitration. UltimateKO, check to see if your BoA card has pushed through a 'Change in Terms' notice recently. If you've been keeping good records of the items you've received from the company, you'll have a copy of it. If you haven't had your terms changed recently, you're in luck, and you should stop paying on the card. If they pursue you for the debt (and they will, trust me) mention in any letters to them that you will choose to elect (and use 'elect,' that's important) arbitration to settle the matter privately. This sucks BoA into a black hole that they likely will not get out of - they need to pay for nearly the whole cost of the proceedings (you pay $250, and if you're at 300% of the poverty line or below, you get a waiver - AND BoA, as per your agreement, may need to forward you the money to begin as per the contract language!) and the climate of arbitrators has shifted very pro-consumer. BoA will not want to throw $50000 and years of their time into arbitration to get your $11k, trust me. I've recently dealt with them for an amount close to what you owe, and they've thrown up the white flag. Also, arbitration waives both parties right to litigate - so you have an angle to countersue if they move to sue you after you elect. Now, if they've changed the terms to strike the arb clause, you'll want to try to work out a plan with them, as TWiNKiE said. quote:But over the past year or so? Collections and capital losses mean something very different now. To be honest, I wouldn't gently caress around with any debt over $500 that's within SOL and went in to collections less than two years ago. So far I haven't seen collectors or OC's wisen up one bit about collecting fairly or properly yet, and if anything have become more aggressive, more frustrated, and more likely to violate now that the public's wallets have tightened up. quote:If nothing else, it lets the collector know that you're not pulling a "gently caress you, sue me." bluff. And as there's no such thing as debtor's jail (at least, in the US), it also gets them a step closer to realizing that you don't have the money to pay. Judgement or not, they can't get $2,000 out of you if you don't have $2,000. And if they garnish your wages (assuming you have wages to garnish in the first place), they're potentially getting smaller payments than they would if they just worked with you. You can try to hammer out a settlement, but in my experience once they've pulled the lawsuit trigger they're gunning for the judgment. In their eyes, they've already spent the time and money putting the lawyer on retainer, they've spent the initial filing fee for the case (usually around $250-300) and they haven't gotten anything from you so far. In talking with lawyers on the collection side, they're often told not to settle for less than 60%+ of what's being asked, up front, if at all. A lot of the time, these settlements end up not being paid, and they have to go back to court in a few months to try collection efforts again. The last time I had to be in court to file motions, the debt lawyers weren't doing their pre-trial settlement conferences. They're in it for the full amounts now. And the judges, at least here, don't care. They're more annoyed that you're defending yourself at all instead of him ruling a default, and in their eyes there's nothing unreasonable about the plaintiff pushing for everything they're owed. Plus, judgments usually can be collected for 10, sometimes 20+ years depending on the state (and bear interest the whole time) so they can just sit back and wait for you to have an income to garnish. quote:Unless you're just loving with the collectors, or have a rock-solid case, I'd always suggest talking to a lawyer. Problem is: it's going to cost you. If you don't have $2,000 to pay the collector, you probably don't have $800 or so to pay a lawyer. My area has a free legal help center for the poor/indigent, as do many others. Even if that's not available, check to see if your county courthouse has something like a 'pro se help day' or something similar. Mine does once a week, and they have people on staff to assist with court procedure, paperwork filing, and searches in the law library.
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Jan 7, 2010 06:15
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Alcoe80 posted:Pulled my credit report this morning and I see 4 collection accounts that have been "closed". What exactly does that mean? I never reached a settlement with any of them. "Closed" can mean a lot of things, usually the report will say 'closed by consumer' or 'closed by creditor' or something like that. Generally an account will stay on your report for 7 years from the month you stopped paying on the account (or in the case of a non-collections account, paid off the balance in full) and then falls off. Some creditors will try to 're-age' the account and make it look newer than it is, and that's what you need to look out for. Make sure the dates on your report match up with your own records. quote:Although I think that in debt cases, if they can show that you have a lot of money hiding overseas, you can be hit with contempt of court charges if you refuse to pay after a judgement. I'm not sure, I don't really know the law. Most states have specific statutes that say the court will not press charges or otherwise pursue criminal cases against people who don't pay unsecured debt. It would have to be a lot of money and an air-tight case where the creditors could prove clear intent of fraud. CubsWoo fucked around with this message at 15:50 on Jan 7, 2010 |
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Jan 7, 2010 15:47
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TWiNKiE posted:Beyond the reasons I've already pointed out for disputing via mail CMRR, is you literally start a paper trail. I totally agree that sending paper requests to the bureau is better. In my case, I've been lazy, and it's yet to bite me in the rear end, but if you want to be 100% sure, send your disputes CMRRR. quote:I think we'll have to agree to disagree here. This isn't true anymore. Less than a year ago I would have fought to stay out of arbitration, but NAF (the main arb forum that was used) has been shut down by the MN AG, and the second forum (AAA) doesn't take debt collection arbs anymore because they fear the same fate as NAF. That just leaves one forum, JAMS, and JAMS is very, very pro-consumer. By electing, you handcuff the plaintiff into playing by a very specific, difficult to navigate set of rules on their part, not to mention the delays. This timeline is coming from a friend of mine who's currently working through 3 or 4 cases this way: - Court case is stayed/dismissed pending arbitration - Court determines who initiates arbitration. If court says collector must initiate, you win, because AAA isn't take debt cases at all and JAMS won't take cases that are initiated from the collector. Collector also can't re-open the case because electing arb waives the court path. Failure to arbitrate does not mean litigation returns. If consumer must initiate, you file with JAMS and hit the creditor with a massive claim based on pain and suffering due to the stress of the litigation (my friend typically claims 5-10x what the collector is asking for.) JAMS says consumer must pay $250 to initiate - do not send this yet. Wait to be billed. Also, if your credit card contract says you use NAF for your arbitration, you must now agree on a new forum. Take 6 months or so to decide if the one the creditor wants is acceptable! (Note: The Federal Arbitration Act only allows a judge to set a specific arbitrator within a forum, not the forum itself.) - 3 months later, JAMS will bill you the $250. Wait 30 days and request the fee waiver if your income is sub-300% poverty line. 30-60 days after that, JAMS will rule on your waiver. After this, the collector is now responsible for all arbitration fees on the case from this point forward. Typically the case dies here, because the collector usually will be billed at least $2500-4000 for initial arbitrator fees. - Spend 6 months debating on what kind of rules you want the arbitrator to follow, whether you want a 1-person or 3-person arb panel (always choose 3), choice of venue, and myriad other things. - Even if everything goes through arbitration and you still somehow lose (which, with JAMS, is not going to happen often) they have to get the arbitration award confirmed in court to collect. At this point, you hire a good consumer lawyer and try to get the award nullified. In today's climate, arbitration at worst eats up 2-3 years of a creditor's time and legal expenses (that can't be recouped per JAMS rules) to get your money, and at best short-circuits their case immediately. There's a reason all the companies are dropping their mandatory arb clauses. They're biting the creditors in the rear end. quote:It's always cheaper to stay out of court, and working something out doesn't waive their right to haul you in to court if you stop paying. I agree that you don't want to do form-letter 'defense by numbers' or anything like that, but the resources for pro se defendants are very expansive and helpful, and the majority of debt lawsuits don't expect the debtor to put up even a token defense, let alone show up. I will agree that in most cases, pre-lawsuit, it's a better idea to try and work with them. But once they've moved to sue, you have nothing to lose by making them do the actual work to prove their case instead of sheepishly taking a judgment or settlement. quote:Courts don't necessarily have the burden to collect on a judgement. They tell you to pay the plaintiff, and you're supposed to. If you don't the plaintiff can go back to the court and say "The defendant didn't pay me!", at which time the court will send a summons to the defendant and ask about all of their finances, to try and determine why payment hasn't been made. In my state, at least, the judge can't force you to pay a debt even with a judgment. They can order your accounts seized and your pay garnished(and subpoena you to find these things), but post-judgment, even if you have money, if none of it can be seized via a garnishment/seizure order, they can't legally press charges for not wanting to pay.
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Jan 8, 2010 00:40
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tuzalu posted:I pulled my wife's credit report and there were a few negatives on it. The negatives will probably stay on if they're valid, but some people have had luck sending good will letters to the creditors asking for the marks to be deleted. It doesn't work very often, but it also doesn't hurt to try.
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Jan 8, 2010 00:42
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Lief posted:I was called about 8 times with a spoofed number (000-000-0000) by FIA Card Services (B of A goons) after I asked them to make all correspondence through the mail. I was behind on a payment. Can I sue? A suit will be difficult if you don't have proof of the spoofed calls coming from BoA. If your phone bill records numbers, great - if not, check to see if you can record calls in your state without mutual consent. Beyond that, suing just on phone calls can be hard anyway, but sending an intent to sue letter can be enough to get them to stop.
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Jan 8, 2010 17:17
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TWiNKiE posted:This is predicated on a lot of assumptions, and if it isn't followed to the letter, you wind up with a CO on your report that you can't do anything about, because you haven't gone through arbitration (and won't for a long time). This is true. Considering this specific scenario, though, I assumed the person with $11k in debt doesn't have the money to pay it off and is therefore going to get a negative tradeline on the report no matter what, and in my experience with BoA they refuse to do pay-for-deletes - so gently caress 'em. Even at a 30% settlement you're maybe looking at a 10 or 20 point bump on your credit report going from closed/unpaid and in collections to closed/settled for over $3000 and that's not a wise use of your money. quote:If the plaintiff has you on a legitimate debt, is the original creditor (or is acting on their behalf), and hasn't slammed you with unconscionable fees and / or interest, you have nothing to gain by going to court, other than hoping that they don't show up, or that you can catch them on a technicality that will only postpone the inevitable (at best). You're also assuming the OC or local counsel will take a settlement once legal action has started. This used to be true, my courthouse, prior to the docket call, would have all the debt lawyers line people up outside the courtroom by plaintiff and say 'see if you can reach a settlement before your case is called.' They don't do this anymore (at least, not here) and answering the summons, running the trial, and losing only puts you out the hours you tried. If you affirm the debt, they're taking court costs and fees anyway and you get the judgment on your report that much earlier. If you can settle/PFD before legal action, it may be a better idea. Once you have been served, there is absolutely no reason not to fight the case tooth and nail. My last three cases were worth about $18000 in unsecured debt and I had settlement offers of around $7k to change my tradeline to 'settled' (no PFD offers.) Instead, I have 2 cases dismissed with prejudice and 1 stayed indefinitely (creditor refuses to pay arbitration fees to continue arbitration, so the case is effectively dead) for a grand total of $20 spent on postage, plus 20 or 30 man-hours on the weekends researching and formulating the documents. quote:The person who shows up in court to sue you is typically not the same person making $8 an hour to nag you on the phone. If you have a non-JDB hauling you in to court, they're much more likely to have their i's dotted and t's crossed. You need a legitimate defense, or a defense that's as good as legitimate. No, it's not, but most creditors hire out legal counsel locally (for high-dollar cases and some cards will you in-house, but it's rare) and in my experience they're the more junior, less experienced, less savvy legal 'professionals'. I put that in quotes because they've been as rude, inconsiderate, and FDCPA-violating as the $8/hr customer service reps who call. Capital One is notorious for this, they hire out counsel at bargain basement prices and gun for default judgments. One neat thing - most CapOne rentalawyers will immediately move to dismiss the case (typically w/prejudice) if you pull the arbitration level, because once the case is stayed by the judge, CapOne fires the local counsel and doesn't re-hire them for a period of time. jassi007 posted:One other odd question, one of her credit cards is with Walmart, who she works for. My sister thinks she could have a problem if she stopped paying that one. Any idea? Will Walmart come after her through her wages since she is an employee? They'd need a garnishment to take wages, which would come after a court case and legal judgment in the bank's favor. What she'll want to check is if Wal-Mart itself has some kind of contractual clause that gives them grounds to terminate employment if you're not paying the card. Something of a different scenario, but I used to work for a major credit card company and was given access to their premier tier of cards despite my (at the time) bad credit. However, we were told at orientation that if any of our credit accounts with the company (be they from before we started working there, or one of the store-only cards they managed) ended up defaulting, that was something you could be immediately terminated for. I'd be surprised if Wal-Mart does the same thing, but it's worth checking out.
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Jan 8, 2010 23:45
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