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Super Dan posted:You might even say they got a slight return on Voodoo Child If this were Reddit I would reply with “take your drat upvote and get out”
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Mar 10, 2018 03:10
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A few of us in Rarity's WWF PPV thread have been discussing the the 1994 feud between Dustin Rhodes and the Stud Stable and Dusty and Dustin teaming together. It's fun little angle from that summer that started with Dustin getting beaten down a few times by the Stud Stable. Dustin goes for the best option he knows: Arn Anderson. Despite Anderson warning him that he was playing with fire, the two team up for a few occasions. I wish I could find Anderson's promo there because it was incredible. So we get some tag matches on TV with the two, including this babyface cheating match against Bad Attitude (Steve Keirn and Bobby Eaton). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsfq9B1Vkrs They make the Bash at the Beach pay-per-view and surprise, surprise. Arn Anderson turned on Dustin Rhodes and joined the Stud Stable. Dusty Rhodes came out on Saturday Night to discuss this with Dustin, arguably one of his best promos. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pOli1iSjr7s In the end, Rhodes clan teamed with a newly turned Nasty Boys team. There was a segment where Dusty went down to whatever it was the Nastys called their lair and earned their respect. They combined to beat the Stud Stable in War Games. Afterwards, there were some blowoff cage matches at some house shows, which is the one time I ever saw Dusty Rhodes wrestle in person. It's a shame that Dustin couldn't stay healthy. His character was a such a wuss in WCW, but in 1994, he could go in the ring.
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Mar 10, 2018 04:21
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Thunder on the Network now. First episode, nine minutes in: Lee Marshall: "You remember Tony there was a comic strip years ago called Pogo? And it was a great political commentary and one of the things Pogo said was "We have seen the enemy and it is us." And I think that's what's happening within the nWo." God drat I love it. Thank you WWE Network for bringing us this art. Also, the cave set from the first few episodes of Thunder loving rules.
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Mar 20, 2018 05:28
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Lee Marshall's nonsensical ramblings were such a great part of early Thunder RIP you were taken too soon
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Mar 20, 2018 05:40
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Man, Arn as a babyface is the most bizarre thing to watch. It's Arn
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Mar 20, 2018 05:47
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Tato posted:Lee Marshall: "You remember Tony there was a comic strip years ago called Pogo? And it was a great political commentary and one of the things Pogo said was "We have seen the enemy and it is us." And I think that's what's happening within the nWo." holy poo poo that's a deep cut for wrestling commentary, I wonder how many people in the 90s had any clue what he was talking about other than hardcore comic nerds e: like that's basically "what if Matt Striker was loving elderly"
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Mar 20, 2018 20:35
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So this is just sort of WCW Retrospective thread, right? I was listening to Raven's awesome WCW theme and i found this video of Raven talking about leaving WCW: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHlqinxJjAw Near the start he talks about people in '99 that were sort of "waiting in the wings" to be main eventers. He lists himself, Booker T, Jericho and Konnan. Is that accurate? Of course I remember there were tons of big names in WCW but they naturally couldn't all be in the main event. I think maybe only DDP was a "new guy" that was in the main event? But were Raven and Konnan big enough to be main eventers at the time? I do remember Konnan being popular, although a lot of folks online hate him nowadays it seems.
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Mar 24, 2018 09:08
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It’s literally why Jericho left. Because he knew he was stuck in his spot and waaaaay more talented then mid-card. Probably not even upper mid-card in 99. Raven was upper mid card that could have been a credible main event jobber every once in awhile. Konnan probably would have been another buff bagwell at best. Jeff Jarrett at worst type of main eventer that no one wanted there.
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Mar 24, 2018 09:56
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NikkolasKing posted:So this is just sort of WCW Retrospective thread, right? Jericho is only one of the biggest stars in the world so of course he could have. Booker T's main event runs were more of a mixed bag but he was capable of being a main event player. Konnan was only one of the biggest stars in Mexico at a time when they were hotter than anywhere on the planet. Raven had the promos to main event, he had a good grasp of psychology, and he was capable of getting over at that level. Now could they have all become main eventers at once? With the right booking sure. I feel like two new main event stars is a safer goal in a calendar year but the main thing is all four guys saw WCW had no interest in elevating them. Konnan was hugely over in 98 and at the start of 99 but never got elevated. Jericho ran on a treadmill no matter how over he got in 98, same with Booker and Raven got booked weaker as time went on.
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Mar 24, 2018 15:52
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I'm having trouble envisioning Hogan or Nash feuding with Konnan or Raven. Less so with Jericho or Booker. That might be the line. Or maybe it's just because I've seen the latter two be pushed as Main Eventers so I'm more used to perceiving them as bigger deals.
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Mar 24, 2018 17:42
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The American Dream posted:It’s literally why Jericho left. Because he knew he was stuck in his spot and waaaaay more talented then mid-card. Probably not even upper mid-card in 99. its basically why 3 of the 4 left or tried to leave WCW Jericho realized he wasn't going anywhere, and left Raven hated the booking direction and that he wasn't going anywhere and got his release Konnan left when Sullivan replaced Russo in January 2000 but never actually got his release, so they suspended him for 3 months instead at which point Russo was back in as booker, so Konnan came back because he liked Russo.
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Mar 24, 2018 20:54
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ChrisBTY posted:I'm having trouble envisioning Hogan or Nash feuding with Konnan or Raven. Main Event WCW/WWE Raven would be akin to Bray Wyatt - IE something people want to see but probably would end up booked terribly. Sadistic heel, probably one better with cronies. He sticks around long enough, he probably becomes what he was on the indies - a fallen hero face. Konnan could have probably pushed higher as a DDP-type. Everyman style character who would probably be more catch-phrase driven. Dude was a legend in Mexico and getting the crowd behind you at that level is pretty universal everywhere. You need the booking though, and he didn't have that.
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Mar 24, 2018 23:42
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I loving hate Konnan unless he's on WOR as a guest so I'm glad he got buried
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Mar 25, 2018 01:52
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I'm wondering why the hell Konnan is a Russo guy. I'm just picturing their April 2000 meeting. "What's up K-Dogg" "Yo' Ru-Dogg, what's the plan." "Well the plan is to have you and your extraordinarily talented friend languish in the mid-card in unfocused, nonsensical bullshit angles from now until the end of days. Also, we'll stick you with Disco Inferno." "Tight, what are the odds of another tequila on a pole match?" "We fired all the other Mexicans so...maybe." "Sweet. How are your Nazi friends." "Probably not hating hispanics. I think." "I love everything I'm hearing here. Keep it real Ru-Dogg."
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Mar 25, 2018 02:29
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NameHurtBrain posted:Konnan could have probably pushed higher as a DDP-type. Everyman style character who would probably be more catch-phrase driven. Dude was a legend in Mexico and getting the crowd behind you at that level is pretty universal everywhere. You need the booking though, and he didn't have that.
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Mar 25, 2018 02:38
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Mar 25, 2018 02:57
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god hes the coolest
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Mar 25, 2018 03:00
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No that outfit rules actually. I mean when on a random Nitro he'd be like "okay I need a wifebeater, a plaid shirt, and some different plaid boxers. And some mechanic's gloves. Oh and I'm bald now. Okay a bandana, and a hat, and some sunglasses on the hat."
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Mar 25, 2018 03:05
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ChrisBTY posted:I'm having trouble envisioning Hogan or Nash feuding with Konnan or Raven. I could see Konnan feuding with Hogan. His promo ability was top notch, and his in-ring style I think would have actually gelled very well with Hogan's. Nash is a different matter, but when Konnan was most over he was Nash's #2 in the NWO Red and Black (if I recall correctly) so if they'd actually gotten behind him in that role (and booked the Wulfpac in a non-stupid way), things might have been very different. Raven's gimmick in WCW where he would sit in the corner and make his stable wrestle for him I think could have had a lot of legs against Hall and Nash, because he could hold his own against them on the mic and would never really have to wrestle them. But that would require Nash being willing to make him look good. His more natural opponents in WCW at the main event level would have been Flair and Sting, I think those would have been two real money feuds. DDP as well.
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Mar 25, 2018 03:10
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Sanguinia posted:I could see Konnan feuding with Hogan. His promo ability was top notch, and his in-ring style I think would have actually gelled very well with Hogan's. Nash is a different matter, but when Konnan was most over he was Nash's #2 in the NWO Red and Black (if I recall correctly) so if they'd actually gotten behind him in that role (and booked the Wulfpac in a non-stupid way), things might have been very different. Kannan very nearly DID feud with Hogan. When they signed him the idea was to have a superface team of Konnan and Hogan against Dungeon of Doom I think? Then Konnan was to turn on him or somesuch. There's promo photos together, tug of warring over the WCW belt.
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Mar 25, 2018 03:15
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Almost huh? Wonder why they didn't pull the trigger.
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Mar 25, 2018 03:19
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ChrisBTY posted:Almost huh? MRT could probably answer that
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Mar 25, 2018 03:32
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Fashion in 1999-2000 was god’s mistake.
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Mar 25, 2018 23:17
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Hey Tygress, like my cow cosplay? Wanna touch it? DAS ENOUGH
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Mar 25, 2018 23:46
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MassRafTer posted:Hey Tygress, like my cow cosplay? Wanna touch it? I absolutely hated him trying to get “das enuff” over.
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Mar 26, 2018 00:14
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fart blood posted:I absolutely hated him trying to get “das enuff” over. It's the worst part of WCW outside of everything else.
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Mar 26, 2018 00:25
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ChrisBTY posted:Almost huh? He's just not on my level brother
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Mar 26, 2018 02:43
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Re-watching WCW and re-reading old Observers, it's kind of shocking how little Kevin Nash and Scott Hall do once the nWo is in full effect. As The Outsiders they're perpetual tag champions, but they never defend the belts and when they do they just win in some quickie schmozz thing. For being so highly paid, over, and master politicians (at least Nash), they never really ever challenge Hogan or come close to becoming "the man." Both of them won World World 3, but neither were ever the focal point of the company. Hogan was always front and center, feuding with other old guys or having matches with celebrities. The Wolfpac angle fell into the background just like Goldberg as champ, because the spotlight was always Hogan Hogan Hogan. poo poo, even when Nash has the book and puts himself over Goldberg, he instantly gives the belt back to Hogan and takes a backseat again. I guess none of it matters because when you're smart like Nash, you make a shitload of money without caring about dumb mark stuff like being the world champion. Hell, it's even better because when you aren't a singles champ, you don't ever have to wrestle and defend it. I was just kind of surprised at how seldom Nash and Hall wrestled during the peak nWo period and how rarely they were involved with top programs. It's hard to think of the height of WCW without those two jumping to mind immediately, but they were never the most over guys, even at the peak. poo poo, there's that one Observer tidbit during 1998 when WCW had to beg a licensee to make Nash air fresheners even though no one gave enough of a poo poo about Nash to buy his merch. It's even harder to think of meaningful or GOOD matches the two ever had in WCW. I think Scott Hall's only single matches of note in WCW all involved ladders. I can't even think of a Nash match that approached decent. Tato fucked around with this message at 03:15 on Mar 26, 2018 |
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Mar 26, 2018 03:13
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El Gallinero Gros posted:MRT could probably answer that I keep thinking there is a more interesting story to this than "Hogan thought Konnan wasn't on his level" but I can't remember anything.
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Mar 26, 2018 03:21
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Tato posted:Re-watching WCW and re-reading old Observers, it's kind of shocking how little Kevin Nash and Scott Hall do once the nWo is in full effect. As The Outsiders they're perpetual tag champions, but they never defend the belts and when they do they just win in some quickie schmozz thing. For being so highly paid, over, and master politicians (at least Nash), they never really ever challenge Hogan or come close to becoming "the man." Both of them won World World 3, but neither were ever the focal point of the company. Hogan was always front and center, feuding with other old guys or having matches with celebrities. The Wolfpac angle fell into the background just like Goldberg as champ, because the spotlight was always Hogan Hogan Hogan. poo poo, even when Nash has the book and puts himself over Goldberg, he instantly gives the belt back to Hogan and takes a backseat again. Nash is a guy who booked himself to lose a retirement match. Nash's M.O. was always 'maximize profit, minimize effort' Or to a less cynical observer, "work smarter, not harder"
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Mar 26, 2018 03:24
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Tato posted:It's even harder to think of meaningful or GOOD matches the two ever had in WCW. I think Scott Hall's only single matches of note in WCW all involved ladders. I can't even think of a Nash match that approached decent. The 6-man where Hogan turned heel was their best WCW match
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Mar 26, 2018 03:24
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Why would Kevin Nash want to be champion when he could get half as much money to work fewer dates and have a booking job? Why would Scott Hall want to be champion when he could get paid to be drunk?
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Mar 26, 2018 03:27
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Man... So we know WCW couldn't ultimately live with Hogan. But could they have lived without Hogan? Was Hogan the only guy who ever moved the needle? Was WCW's ceiling just 'make money off of Hogan until we can't anymore and die?' Is that why Bischoff never seemed to think forward in his decision making at all? Because he knew whatever he did, WCW would die anyway?
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Mar 26, 2018 03:29
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Tato posted:Re-watching WCW and re-reading old Observers, it's kind of shocking how little Kevin Nash and Scott Hall do once the nWo is in full effect. As The Outsiders they're perpetual tag champions, but they never defend the belts and when they do they just win in some quickie schmozz thing. For being so highly paid, over, and master politicians (at least Nash), they never really ever challenge Hogan or come close to becoming "the man." Both of them won World World 3, but neither were ever the focal point of the company. Hogan was always front and center, feuding with other old guys or having matches with celebrities. The Wolfpac angle fell into the background just like Goldberg as champ, because the spotlight was always Hogan Hogan Hogan. poo poo, even when Nash has the book and puts himself over Goldberg, he instantly gives the belt back to Hogan and takes a backseat again. JR had a blog post from many years ago now where he said Nash was pretty much the smartest guy in the business. He knew how to make the money, save it and avoid killing himself while doing all this. I suppose he probably did kill his legs though power bombing Big Show around three times. (the infamous botch and two pretty impressive ones) Nash's best matches in WWF were with Shawn, weren't they? Maybe one of his bouts with Bret? The point is, the Kliq were good about putting each other over but there was nobody in WCW for Nash to really "try" to make look good. Just go in, do his five moves, ,aybe cut an awesome promo. collect a paycheck. No real reason to put in effort. And Scott was really falling apart in WCW, wasn't he? I dunno when exactly that started. I just know healways had his issues and WCW only exacerbated them.
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Mar 26, 2018 03:29
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ChrisBTY posted:Man... Hogan was an asset from the start of the NWO to Starrcade. When he buried Sting instead of letting him go over, it was the end of the company. Not immediately, but that was when Hogan made it clear that he wouldn't ever allow anyone to be bigger than him, even if they should be. It's not that Sting was going to be the big guy who would carry the company forward, but it should have shown the company not to trust that Hogan w/r/t Goldberg. Because if you ask about people who moved the needle, Goldberg did, for a while.
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Mar 26, 2018 04:20
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What did you guys think of Bischoff as an on-screen talent? So many focus on what he did or didn't do right as the guy backstage but I have always loved him as a heel, even as a kid. In some ways I prefer him to "Mr. McMahon" because Eric was always this weaseling little toady who just wanted to cling to the cool kids' bandwagon. It wasn't all about him, while the Corporation and all that did start and end with Vince. Plus, Bischoff had that blowing kisses to the crowd while smirking and he just conducted himself like the smuggest rear end in a top hat alive. I loved it.
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Mar 26, 2018 04:56
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NikkolasKing posted:What did you guys think of Bischoff as an on-screen talent? So many focus on what he did or didn't do right as the guy backstage but I have always loved him as a heel, even as a kid. In some ways I prefer him to "Mr. McMahon" because Eric was always this weaseling little toady who just wanted to cling to the cool kids' bandwagon. It wasn't all about him, while the Corporation and all that did start and end with Vince. In WCW? Awful, mostly. I really liked him as RAW GM though, especially how occasionally he'd grow a spine if a heel got a little too familiar and he'd gently caress them over just to remind them who the boss was.
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Mar 26, 2018 05:06
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ChrisBTY posted:Man... Sure, they don't renew Hogan's contract in early 98 or negotiate it so he no longer has creative control. Realistically that isn't going to happen and realistically the company is always going to be booked like poo poo so it doesn't really matter if Hogan is around or not, even though his presence does hurt things in late 98 when he and Nash decide to divide up the streak and the belt. And that's why Nash never moved to actually feud for the title during the nWo hot period. If he feuded with Hogan that was the end, he'd get killed. If he avoided Hogan and did his own thing he'd be a huge star, make a lot of money and Hall could do all the work. The Outsiders had some good matches in late 96, and then Hall's life fell apart in 97 and from there they really didn't.
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Mar 26, 2018 05:17
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NikkolasKing posted:Eric was always this weaseling little toady who just wanted to cling to the cool kids' bandwagon.
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Mar 26, 2018 05:22
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Defiance Industries posted:Hogan was an asset from the start of the NWO to Starrcade. When he buried Sting instead of letting him go over, it was the end of the company. Not immediately, but that was when Hogan made it clear that he wouldn't ever allow anyone to be bigger than him, even if they should be. What was the solution there I wonder? I guess the first solution would have been to not trust Hogan to not get into Patrick's ear and just not do a fast count angle. But when you give a man like Hogan CC, what are your options? What's keeping him from saying 'I'm keeping the belt forever and never losing. And also I demand to be put into a gauntlet match where I beat every single wrestler in the company on a single show."?
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Mar 26, 2018 05:30
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