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Who Killed WCW?
Eric Bischoff
Hulk Hogan
Vince Russo
Jerusalem
View Results
 
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Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


LordPants posted:

I just bought that book yesterday. I love how it's like

"Then I had a match with X who was the greatest wrestler and was really nice and tought me a whole bunch. He did his signature move, and he was such a pro he barely touched me, but I sold the hell out of it.

After that we all went home and had a shower. Keith and Smith pissed in my and Owen's mouths. But the worst was peeing in your eyes, it stung like crazy."

Please be exaggerating this last part. I don't want to think about people peeing on the Hitman.

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Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


This is like learning Chris Jericho is the Goatse guy.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


bobkatt013 posted:

His second greatest thing? The political debate with Scot Stiener

He was also in that Jackie Gayda match. Clearly, he is a man in whose wake travels history.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


"If you could have any superpower, what would it be? Don't say being invisible because Scott Steiner already called that."

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Steiner's explanation was "Bitches won't know what's happening."

Holla if you hear that?

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Perigryn posted:

Do you expect any less from him after "IT'S NOT HOT!"?

IT'S NOT HOT is still my favorite Hogan moment of all time. I don't know the context but I can't imagine one even being imagined that makes it comprehensible.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer



Yeah, that one. I don't know why he's in the cave or why he's surprised the water isn't hot or why anything else is happening. But that just makes it better.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


CombineThresher posted:

Gorilla was perfect for the exact time and place he was in, and I won't hear another word of that slander. :colbert:

What's really sad to me about watching WCW now is seeing how hot the crowd was for some of the upper midcard guys, because after a while the nWo trained WCW's audiences to not give a poo poo about anything.

I blame Hogan. How better to keep people from threatening your position if you're cutting the idea of a midcard off at the knees?

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Jerusalem posted:

I always thought that was overstated or one of those echo-chamber type things where enough people said it to the point people just believed it. Then I heard Jericho tell a bunch of stories about how much Vince legitimately considers "Junior" an insult, the first of which coming from the time Jericho cut a promo where he called somebody junior, and when he came back Vince was all over him laughing and saying,"You called him Junior! That is such a great insult, great job, you really tore him up!"

Vince McMahon is a strange, strange, strange man.


It makes a lot of sense considering the old territory promoters all used to call Vince "Junior" when he was working for his dad in the old days.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Red posted:

Holy poo poo.

If only Vince was even remotely aware of how much money an auto-biography would make him.

I can only imagine how great it would be. Like that Playboy interview he did where he talked about putting crumpled-up leaves inside a girl and how his only regret is that his stepfather died before he could kill him, but 300 pages long.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Aesop Poprock posted:

probably did nothing but taser people (the best way to play)

Just taser them, or taser them until they caught on fire?

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Rusty Shackelford posted:

He was a two time WWF champion as a tweener.

i actually forgot he main evented Mania 13. That's partially because it's the only main event not involving a murderer that WWE decided to leave out of their game focused on the thirty years of WM.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


1st AD posted:

Is Sting still dead?

Well, Lex Luger visited him at the hospital with a "real nice present" for him so I can't imagine Sting is anything but improving right now.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Luigi Thirty posted:

Goldmine!

http://indeedwrestling.blogspot.com/2015/09/wcw-payroll-1996-2000.html

WCW payroll and merch figures 1996 to 2000. Hogan made $3.7 million a year at his peak and got $800,000 in licensing in 1999!

I think that's less surprising than the fact WCW thought Ed Leslie was worth $150,000 a year.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Halloween Jack posted:

That's not a war bonnet, it's a gladiator helmet. It was for his planned feud with Spartacus. You know, that guy who said woo and did the figure four.

"War bonnet" is what Hulk Hogan actually called it. He made those words come out of his mouth.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Son of Man posted:

I'm ashamed to be talking up WWF in this WCW thread, so let me ask a question - what were the best hillbilly gimmicks in WCW?

Ted Turner

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Maxwell Lord posted:

Hogan... being lured back to WWF;

Wonder how THAT would have played out.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


MassRafTer posted:

Hogan threatened to go back basically every year from December of 96 through 99. Brother Love claims talks got really close one year but I kind of doubt it.

I have no doubt that Hogan used to do that. I was more wondering what kind of deal Vince would have hypothetically given him since Austin was

A. Hotter than the surface of the loving sun as a draw

and

B. Vocal about his distaste for Hogan

WOULD Hogan have come back to a deal that didn't offer him creative control and all the perks he was used to?

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


dont even fink about it posted:

I just don't know that this would have been enough in 99-01 to keep him on the shows as anything but a comedy act.

Triple H is a Ric Flair tribute act so it might have worked out regardless.

HHH is the biggest Flair mark ever though. They would have found something for him.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Say Nothing posted:

Favorite Buff Bagwell moments.

- Bagwell gets beaten up for real by Ernest Miller
- Bagwell gets beaten up for real by Scott Steiner
- Bagwell gets beaten up for real by Shane Helms

-Buff Bagwell sucks so bad that Vince flushes his entire Invasion plan

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


ChrisBTY posted:

Man...
So we know WCW couldn't ultimately live with Hogan.
But could they have lived without Hogan?
Was Hogan the only guy who ever moved the needle?
Was WCW's ceiling just 'make money off of Hogan until we can't anymore and die?'

Is that why Bischoff never seemed to think forward in his decision making at all?
Because he knew whatever he did, WCW would die anyway?

Hogan was an asset from the start of the NWO to Starrcade. When he buried Sting instead of letting him go over, it was the end of the company. Not immediately, but that was when Hogan made it clear that he wouldn't ever allow anyone to be bigger than him, even if they should be.

It's not that Sting was going to be the big guy who would carry the company forward, but it should have shown the company not to trust that Hogan w/r/t Goldberg. Because if you ask about people who moved the needle, Goldberg did, for a while.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


ChrisBTY posted:

What was the solution there I wonder? I guess the first solution would have been to not trust Hogan to not get into Patrick's ear and just not do a fast count angle. But when you give a man like Hogan CC, what are your options? What's keeping him from saying 'I'm keeping the belt forever and never losing. And also I demand to be put into a gauntlet match where I beat every single wrestler in the company on a single show."?

Obviously you can't go back and know all the poo poo that's going to happen in hindsight, but this ABSOLUTELY should have been a huge warning sign for when they started to push Goldberg as top face, and Bischoff didn't learn at all. Someone needed to make it clear Goldberg was the top star now and he was going to be the one to utterly destroy the NWO like fans had wanted.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


The Wall was so good he could get someone to cheer Reigns

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Tato posted:

Oh yeah, Goldberg was a lucky life preserver that somehow makes it even sadder that they hosed it up. But Hogan and Nash were very smart in expertly sabotaging him. Not only did they find a way to make him less over after winning the belt, but eventually turned him into a paranoid dude who refused to do jobs as well. I think they would have been just as successful in sabotaging any other phenoms WCW lucked into.

Yeah, you really see where Goldberg gets it from. I can't blame Austin for being paranoid about protecting his spot, considering what happened to him in WCW when Hogan came in.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


corn in the bible posted:

is the joke that chris benoit had such severe brain damage it caused him to commit murder in a fit of rage, is that why the story is funny

Kevin Sullivan framed him

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


This one is great for what happens, for the commentators, and also because I too am not a fan of the University of Oregon.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p4_qmZPdZcI

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Thiel v. Gawker is like Stalin v. Hitler. Thiel is an rear end in a top hat but he was briefly pointed at the right target.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Super No Vacancy posted:

they were right actually unless you wanna cite some case law

Hogan v. Gawker

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Shane Douglas at least has the advantage of less years pushed as a major star despite all evidence to the contrary.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


RealFoxy posted:

Eric kinda showed he was just a one trick pony that caught lightning in a bottle with the NWO era, and too much politicking and creative control ensured that the guys that made the NWO happen were going to make sure they were the only ones at the top of the card.

He was also clearly too easy for the wrestlers to work. Bischoff was desperate to feel cool and getting to be part of the NWO was how he did that.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Pinstripe Hourglass posted:

It is not that hard to sink a three pointer in a gym by yourself, what are you talking about

Imagine if you were made of ham left out in the sun like 99% of Americans are

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


And there would be a pound sign involved.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


NienNunb posted:

It’s hosed up. He spends his whole life taking unprotected shots to the head, and what does he get in return? Murdered by his friend Kevin Sullivan. It’s disgusting

Was it murder or was it Benoit willingly dying so he can protect the business

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


El Gallinero Gros posted:

Hogan and Brain were actually buds (well, as much as one can be friends with a guy like Hogan) despite the on screen feud, right?

Everyone who came over to WCW with Hogan were his friends, as far as I can remember.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


The American Dream posted:

Al snow in 1999 was more over then most of the roster is today and it’s not even close.

Okay, brainstorming session: who on the current roster is more over than Al Snow in 1999? I'll start:

John Cena

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


I think you meant to call him by his real name, Hugh G. Rection.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Two Beans posted:

Paul Heyman in a great interview once discussed how he could book Mark Henry using a headlock as a monster submission.

That was on the Steve Austin Show, I think. He said he'd find the guys who can make their faces turn the reddest and pair them up against Henry.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Is that the 1980s version of "How big is Batista's dick?"

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


El Gallinero Gros posted:

This makes me think of that ad for that SNES game where it's a Gradius type game and somehow they felt the best way to advertise this was a very old hillbilly playing a banjo. Probably in every comic book and game magazine I touched in the early 90's.

I had to google the title, it was called Phalanx.

Goes deeper than you think. That wasn't just an ad, that was the box for the game.

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Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer


Punch McLightning posted:

It was an excuse for wrestling mags to show pics of women SETH ROLLINS!!! in titillating positions.

Having my way

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