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NecroMonster
Jan 4, 2009



So my 11 year old pen tablet is dying and I'm going to need to replace it.

I'm thinking about maybe getting a pen monitor, but i need to know what the gently caress I'd be getting myself into, and that means asking questions.

What manufacturers are there?
What are their prices like?
How about the longevity of their products?
I'm running a multi monitor set up, is that going to be a problem? I've got open HDMI and display ports still.
Also, I'm using a rather old version of photoshop, problem or not?

Oh. I can spend about 600 bux but I'd really rather spend less than that you know.

NecroMonster fucked around with this message at 08:20 on Dec 1, 2019

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the_lion
Jun 8, 2010

On the hunt for prey...

NecroMonster posted:

So my 11 year old pen tablet is dying and I'm going to need to replace it.

I'm thinking about maybe getting a pen monitor, but i need to know what the gently caress I'd be getting myself into, and that means asking questions.

What manufacturers are there?
What are their prices like?
How about the longevity of their products?
I'm running a multi monitor set up, is that going to be a problem? I've got open HDMI and display ports still.
Also, I'm using a rather old version of photoshop, problem or not?

Oh. I can spend about 600 bux but I'd really rather spend less than that you know.

If you're doing it on the cheap, check out the Huion and Xp-pens on Amazon. I think Brad Colbow on YouTube has a lot of good reviews as well.

Had a Huion for 3 years now, I forget which model but they no longer sell it (it's 720p).

lllllllllllllllllll
Feb 28, 2010

Now the scene's lighting is perfect!


Thanks for all the answers! Sorry for taking so long to respond.

Wowporn posted:

Kinda sounds like one of the newer iPads that work with the Apple Pencil would be your best bet, a screen tablet thatís not connected to a computer with cheap/easy to use software. For a kid I figured that would be the most approachable option, but I donít know what the newer ones go for so Iím not sure if itís good price wise
I will consider this. Since I never owned an iPad, this raises more questions, but it might be worth a shot. Thank you!

Krispy Wafer posted:

You'll be able to get a base model iPad that can double as a drawing tablet for about $250 on Black Friday. The Apple Pencil is another $100. That might be more than you were planning on spending, but it's probably the cheapest stand alone art tablet ever and you get a tablet computer.

Another vote for the iPad. If this should be a adequate replacement this could be just what I was looking for. Thanks Krispy Wafer!

lofi posted:

How old is the kid? Drawing software tends to get complex and can be pretty frustrating, it might end up putting them off as much as encouraging them.

She's twelve (maybe I shouldn't have used the word "child") and doesn't usually destroy things. But yeah, when it comes to the intricacies of a drawing software this might overwhelm a young teenager. I mean, on the other hand choosing between a few tools and saving and loading shouldn't be to difficult. Thank you, lofi.

gmc9987 posted:

I'd give Lofi's answer some serious consideration - how old the child in question is is going to affect how long they're going to use the tablet, as well as how likely they are to break it through misuse/dropping it/yanking the cords out so the connectors break/etc. Digital drawing doesn't magically make you a better artist either, so if this is a child who wants to learn how to draw as opposed to one who is already drawing regularly, this could end up being a big de-motivator since drawing digitally has a big learning curve associated with it.
  • A tablet without a screen connects to the computer through USB, and small ones can be found for less than $100 USD.
  • A monitor that you connect to your computer and draw directly on will need a USB connection and an HDMI connection. The cheapest Wacom monitor of this style starts at about $550 USD, other brands like Huion will run cheaper for the same size but still multiple hundreds of dollars.
  • The Wacom MobileStudio Pro is the current offering from Wacom that is an all-in-one portable computer and drawing tablet, it starts at ~$3500 USD.
  • As others mentioned, getting an iPad with an Apple Pencil is probably the cheapest all-around option for an all-in-one tablet/computer, and that has the benefit of also being useful for things other than drawing. You could even go the refurbished route, and find an older model on the cheap if you miss out on the Black Friday sales.
I wouldn't personally give my kid a specialized tool worth multiple hundreds of dollars until they were well into their teenage years and had proven they could handle them and had a need for them, but a small tablet of their own as an add-on to your current computer setup or an Apple Pencil and drawing app they could screw around with if you already had an iPad around for general use would be pretty reasonable in my eyes.
Thanks for the info, gmc9987, that's what I was looking for.550$ is a lot of money. Hm, I will give this some more thought. She already has a Android tablet and I just found out that there is a 27$ "S Pen" which is probably compatible with her Samsung Galaxy tablet from 2016. Getting this might be the cheapest way to have her draw digitally. Maybe I'll try that. Thanks all!

lofi
Apr 2, 2018






What tablet does she have? IIRC, the s-pen is for the 'Note' series (I have one, it was cool till it had a magnet-related-accident!), so check compatibility. The good news is that the s-pen is awesome for drawing, and there's decent android drawing apps for only a few bucks.

beergod
Nov 1, 2004


I'm not saying Trump donated money to NAMBLA, but people are saying that. It's something I've heard, but I don't believe Donald Trump donated several million dollars to NAMBLA over the last several years. Still, if he did that would be a great reason to not release his tax returns


Just picked up an Intuous pro medium. Looking to do digital photo editing and learn 3D sculpting.

Any thread-consensus resources to get me started?

the_lion
Jun 8, 2010

On the hunt for prey...

beergod posted:

Just picked up an Intuous pro medium. Looking to do digital photo editing and learn 3D sculpting.

Any thread-consensus resources to get me started?

Start with blender 2.8, and then give zbrush a try once you've been doing it for a while. Blender is great, particularly for free. Zbrush and Zbrushcore are a bit on the pricey side, but it feels more fluid than Blender to me. Zbrush you buy once and you get unlimited upgrades.

Photo editing, I think Photoshop is $10/month. Affinity sell a good photo editor, that's just a once off payment but probably not as good imo.

lofi
Apr 2, 2018






How's GIMP for photo editing? It's freeware not-photoshop, but I've not used it enough to say if it's any good.

Synthbuttrange
May 6, 2007

I feel the pressure,
under more scrutiny
And what I do,
act more stupidly




Kind of horrific really.

lofi
Apr 2, 2018






Fair enough. shame.

Neon Noodle
Nov 11, 2016

there's nothing wrong here in montana

lofi posted:

How's GIMP for photo editing? It's freeware not-photoshop, but I've not used it enough to say if it's any good.
Use Krita, it's much better and also FOSS.

GATOS Y VATOS
Aug 22, 2002






Soiled Meat

Argue posted:

Cool, you need a subscription just to import your brushes. Cool cool cool. Get hosed

Only registered members can see post attachments!

GATOS Y VATOS
Aug 22, 2002






Soiled Meat

Also for Clip Studio Paint users (both desktop and iPad), it's been updated to 1.9.5 and there have been great interface changes. Read about them here:
http://www.clipstudio.net/en/dl/release_note

squirrelzipper
Nov 2, 2011



the_lion posted:

Start with blender 2.8, and then give zbrush a try once you've been doing it for a while. Blender is great, particularly for free. Zbrush and Zbrushcore are a bit on the pricey side, but it feels more fluid than Blender to me. Zbrush you buy once and you get unlimited upgrades.

Photo editing, I think Photoshop is $10/month. Affinity sell a good photo editor, that's just a once off payment but probably not as good imo.

Just to add, Photoshop is great I spend a lot time in there, but it has a ton of capabilities that if youíre just interested in photo editing are overkill. Affinity is really really good and performs better than PS, I would seriously consider it if youíre not locked into Adobes products. Blender is awesome.

taqueso
Mar 8, 2004









Fun Shoe

Gimp is pretty good for photo manipulations, krita is great for painting but doesn't quite have as much filtering type poo poo.

Krita's tablet support is way way way better. And the interface is way better, too. Honestly its one of the best open source graphics program GUIs ever. (which is not a high bar, but still it's p good)

I want to try out Affinity, the price is certainly good and gently caress adobe

taqueso fucked around with this message at 16:49 on Dec 5, 2019

Listerine
Jan 5, 2005

Exquisite Corpse

the_lion posted:

Start with blender 2.8, and then give zbrush a try once you've been doing it for a while. Blender is great, particularly for free. Zbrush and Zbrushcore are a bit on the pricey side, but it feels more fluid than Blender to me. Zbrush you buy once and you get unlimited upgrades.

Sculptris was a free sculpter and got bought by the Zbrush folks, not sure it it's still out there or supported but that used to be a good free intro to sculpting.

the_lion
Jun 8, 2010

On the hunt for prey...

Listerine posted:

Sculptris was a free sculpter and got bought by the Zbrush folks, not sure it it's still out there or supported but that used to be a good free intro to sculpting.

Yeah, but it is more limited than Blender. Blender you have most of the zbrush style brushes, sculptris you have a very small toolset so you end up compromising.

Argue
Sep 29, 2005

I represent the Philippines

Anyone in London know where I can get a screen protector for a 24 inch Cintiq? Since I'm touring the rest of the time, I can't order from Amazon since nobody can receive the package for me at this Airbnb, and the ones on Amazon are dispatched by the manufacturers, so they won't deliver to an Amazon Locker either. Plus since they're not fulfilled by Amazon there's no expedited option that will guarantee its arrival before I go home on Tuesday anyway.

Koramei
Nov 11, 2011

I just pretend to be nice.


Lipstick Apathy

I donít really understand why everyone is down on the photoshop subscription model, is everyone forgetting how the buy-once versions used to be like $800? Paying $120 annually by comparison is just like...I donít really understand how anyone can think that is worse. Unless you would have only bought it once a decade before itís not costing any more money, and this way you get the updates too (and while this yearís kinda blew, the 3 years prior had all been amazing stuff).

Sucks that a lot of other companies have started going subscription for things that werenít stupidly expensive before, but I donít really get why adobe is always the scapegoat here.

taqueso
Mar 8, 2004









Fun Shoe

They always seem to be acting in the way that will make them the most money. Which, I mean, capitalism, but most companies don't make it so obvious. I feel like they have very little goodwill towards me as a customer. So, if they ever do decide to act in my interests a little bit, I probably won't believe it.

Synthbuttrange
May 6, 2007

I feel the pressure,
under more scrutiny
And what I do,
act more stupidly




Their subscription prices have gone up over 300% here in australia since I started subscribing to them.

squirrelzipper
Nov 2, 2011



Koramei posted:

I donít really understand why everyone is down on the photoshop subscription model, is everyone forgetting how the buy-once versions used to be like $800? Paying $120 annually by comparison is just like...I donít really understand how anyone can think that is worse. Unless you would have only bought it once a decade before itís not costing any more money, and this way you get the updates too (and while this yearís kinda blew, the 3 years prior had all been amazing stuff).

Sucks that a lot of other companies have started going subscription for things that werenít stupidly expensive before, but I donít really get why adobe is always the scapegoat here.

I mean I need Illustrator, InDesign and Photoshop. So that means I pretty much have to get the complete CC which is $80 a month Canadian. So $960 a year. As a bonus though I get Premiere and AE which I do use. My primary complaint isnít cost though, itís performance. The CC suite is really bloated and slow and doesnít get better, it just gets worse. In every category itís competition is way faster and more responsive. It is what it is but the cost and lack of any real focus on improvement is what irks me. Some of their stuff is great (like web font access & XD).

Anyway I donít hate them, it is what it is.

Koramei
Nov 11, 2011

I just pretend to be nice.


Lipstick Apathy

I mean you donít have to get CC though; the three of those are like $50-60 arenít they? $600 a year is still lots but then like $2400 or whatever the old prices were is too.

Not gonna argue that too hard though, I agree it gets murkier when you throw in the other apps and their $20/mo pricing in. Photoshop is what tends to get the hate though, and (in the US anyway, sorry Aussies) itís still the same $10.

mutata
Mar 1, 2003

You walk in with the Turnips, you leave with the Bells.



The only reason I didn't switch to Affinity's trilogy of apps this year is because I was able to swing educator pricing on CC. Before that I got it through my uncle who works for Adobe. I bought Affinity's apps this black Friday so I'll start getting acquainted. The subscription price is only going to go up and they are only ever going to get more and more bloated with features you will never use. They're also going to continue to arbitrarily change the UI, shortcut keys, and tool behaviors for no reason, but most companies do that. Then there was that whole awkward "if you use old versions of PS you could get sued maybe?" thing that was wtf.

If nothing else, I'm happy to support competition. If we have to live in a stupid late capitalist helldimension I'll at least support the small capitalist im the spirit of pretending that competition can be a thing anymore.

gmc9987
Jul 25, 2007


Koramei posted:

I donít really understand why everyone is down on the photoshop subscription model, is everyone forgetting how the buy-once versions used to be like $800? Paying $120 annually by comparison is just like...I donít really understand how anyone can think that is worse. Unless you would have only bought it once a decade before itís not costing any more money, and this way you get the updates too (and while this yearís kinda blew, the 3 years prior had all been amazing stuff).

Sucks that a lot of other companies have started going subscription for things that werenít stupidly expensive before, but I donít really get why adobe is always the scapegoat here.

The reason so many people are down is that it's fully possible to build a creative career using Photoshop without having the latest version, and the subscription model locks you into paying for the most recent versions of the software whether you update on your computer or not. Also Adobe has started retroactively applying their "software as a license/service" model to older versions of their apps, and have at least talked about suing people who are using software they bought outright from 9 or 10 years ago before they started their cloud subscription service.

Subscription models can work well but Adobe is attempting to make their model the only option, even for people who bought the software before it was a thing. It does offer some benefits but I'm not super keen about being forced to pay for updates that I may not even be able to use depending on how old my computer and OS is.

Doctor_Fruitbat
Jun 2, 2013



It's the software equivalent of hardware leasing, where they desperately want to convince you that regular payments for the newest of the new is the only option you need, while any professional in any industry, creative or otherwise, will tell you that rarely do you need to update your setup that often at all (security patches notwithstanding), especially when you're good enough to do what you need with the tools that you have.

By all means keep updating and give people easy upgrade paths, but it's just more late capitalist horseshit where they try to strongarm you into spending more money than you want to for things you don't need instead of giving you the choice to spend when you're ready.

gmc9987
Jul 25, 2007


Yeah, like - it makes sense for some people to lease cars. But for the majority of car owners, leasing is a terrible financial move. Adobe's model is the equivalent of forcing everyone who needs a car to lease one instead of being able to buy it outright, while also claiming that anyone who previously bought a car needs to give them back the title to their car so that Adobe can lease it to them again after they've already paid it off.

Listerine
Jan 5, 2005

Exquisite Corpse

I'm in medical education and research. For what I do I haven't needed an update to photoshop, illustrator, premiere or after effects since CS6. When they announced the end of perpetual licenses and went all in on the rental model, I specifically bought two copies of CS6 suites.

My livelihood kind of depends on being able to use image editing/creation software, but not like a graphic designer etc. I can go months without opening photoshop, but then I'll need it suddenly for two weeks straight. I understand with the subscription model I can stop/start the subscription service, which might sound like the smart route for someone like me, except that I'm behind a disgusting amount of security due to HIPAA concerns, which makes things like installing/activating software, periodically communicating with license servers, etc. a nightmare. I might need to use Photoshop the first week of the month, but IT can't get to my ticket until the 3rd week, and I can't predict my needs in advance.

I just need to pay a one time fee for a perpetual license, and have that software absolutely available the moment I need to use it, and forget about it for years at a time. Software rental makes things harder and more expensive for me.

Koramei
Nov 11, 2011

I just pretend to be nice.


Lipstick Apathy

gmc9987 posted:

Yeah, like - it makes sense for some people to lease cars. But for the majority of car owners, leasing is a terrible financial move. Adobe's model is the equivalent of forcing everyone who needs a car to lease one instead of being able to buy it outright, while also claiming that anyone who previously bought a car needs to give them back the title to their car so that Adobe can lease it to them again after they've already paid it off.

I donít really think cars are comparable to software, and Iím also extremely unconvinced that it is actually worse financially for all but a tiny minority of users (and maybe non-US peeps if theyíre hiking the price there). Like Listerineís situation definitely should not happen, but that kinda situation does not apply to the vast majority of people.

OTOH I did not know about them going after pre-CC users; that is some serious horseshit right there.

taqueso
Mar 8, 2004









Fun Shoe

I'm used to the expensive software from work requiring yearly maintenance agreements. But they all let us keep using the software if we stop paying, we just lose support and updates.

The nightmare is having files you cannot open because you can't use the software they were created with. Enough stuff can process adobe files now that it isn't a big scare but it's still a dick move.

Listerine
Jan 5, 2005

Exquisite Corpse

Koramei posted:

Like Listerineís situation definitely should not happen,

Don't even get me started on the $5,000 workstation IT bricked because its disc image was "too different" from all the other computers they service in our department.

Koramei posted:

OTOH I did not know about them going after pre-CC users; that is some serious horseshit right there.

It's why I bought Affinity licenses during a recent sale. I'm used to the tools and workflow with Adobe products but if I can't reinstall/reactivate my perpetual CS6 licenses at some point without getting threatened with litigation, the low cost of Affinity is just a no-brainer when I'm not already using 90% of the tools from the CS6 release.

Rapt0rCharles9231
Oct 20, 2008


IIRC the Adobe litigation thing was them telling people "if you continue using the old software, you may be at risk for being sued by... somebody! Some sort of... third party! Not our problem!" and didn't elaborate on who what or why. Coincidentally they were in the middle of a lawsuit with Dolby atmos for not paying them royalties/license fees for audio technology used in some older Adobe products soooooo...

Personally I think Dolby has better things to do than suing individual people for using old photoshop.

I'm trapped into the Adobe ecosystem professionally and I don't think I could ever adjust out, but man are the options for art programs nowadays real good. Back in my day you had, what, Open canvas 1.1b? Now you got the powerhouses that are krita or clip studio paint.

Kortel
Jan 7, 2008

Nothing to see here.


My 27QHD Wacom died a few weeks ago. Ordered a Huion KMAVAS Pro 12 GT-116. Other than the color being a little off, it's not very bright, and the lack of true tilt support, it's been a nice change. Little 1080p screen, very little parallax except on the extreme edges. For a few hundred bucks I can say it's an awesome little piece of hardware.
Edit: I'm very unlikely to buy another WACOM product after the debacle of the 27QHD dying. Wanted an additional $1700 to fix it before even doing a diagnostic on it. Plus 300 to ship.

Kortel fucked around with this message at 20:21 on Dec 10, 2019

Jacobus Spades
Oct 29, 2004

Oh wow!

lllllllllllllllllll posted:

Thanks for the info, gmc9987, that's what I was looking for.550$ is a lot of money. Hm, I will give this some more thought. She already has a Android tablet and I just found out that there is a 27$ "S Pen" which is probably compatible with her Samsung Galaxy tablet from 2016. Getting this might be the cheapest way to have her draw digitally. Maybe I'll try that. Thanks all!

lofi posted:

What tablet does she have? IIRC, the s-pen is for the 'Note' series (I have one, it was cool till it had a magnet-related-accident!), so check compatibility. The good news is that the s-pen is awesome for drawing, and there's decent android drawing apps for only a few bucks.

Samsung actually uses the S-Pen moniker for the Galaxy Note, "Galaxy Tab A with S-Pen", Galaxy Tab S, and Galaxy Book lines of devices. They're technically intercompatible since they're all Wacom tech but some of the tablets don't have digitizers at all so.... yeah, check compatibility.

InsertPotPun
Apr 16, 2018
Probation
Can't post for 3 days!


I want a drawing tablet that I can just carry with me and use, to replace my little pad and pencils. I'm not technologically inclined at all, I'm going to have a hard time "downloading" "drivers" (only a slight exaggeration) I just want to sit down, turn it on, and draw as a hobby. I'm absolute rubbish at researching this stuff so any help would be appreciated.

Neon Noodle
Nov 11, 2016

there's nothing wrong here in montana

InsertPotPun posted:

I want a drawing tablet that I can just carry with me and use, to replace my little pad and pencils. I'm not technologically inclined at all, I'm going to have a hard time "downloading" "drivers" (only a slight exaggeration) I just want to sit down, turn it on, and draw as a hobby. I'm absolute rubbish at researching this stuff so any help would be appreciated.
Get an iPad and Apple Pencil.

gmc9987
Jul 25, 2007


iPad + Pencil is exactly what you want.

InsertPotPun
Apr 16, 2018
Probation
Can't post for 3 days!


ok, thank you

Good Soldier Svejk
Jul 5, 2010

Great times call for great men


Nap Ghost

Got a kamvas pro 16 over the holidays and though I've never been much of a painter, it+krita make me feel like a natural
hands down the best digital tablet experience I've ever used (vs surface/bamboo)

(first time with it/krita)

lofi
Apr 2, 2018






I've heard the kamvas has issues with parralax and drawing straight lines, any sign of that? I'm thinking of upgrading to one, but I'm really hesitant to go non-wacom without being able to actually try one before I buy.

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Good Soldier Svejk
Jul 5, 2010

Great times call for great men


Nap Ghost

lofi posted:

I've heard the kamvas has issues with parralax and drawing straight lines, any sign of that? I'm thinking of upgrading to one, but I'm really hesitant to go non-wacom without being able to actually try one before I buy.

I haven't had any issues with the parallax. Admittedly I don't often try to draw straight lines without some sort of assistance so I may not be the best to ask about that but I haven't noticed any hindrance in regards to stroke/line detection.
It really is as close to sketching on paper that I think a tablet has come, and I think a lot of that has to do with the laminated screen.

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