Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
Bad Munki
Nov 4, 2008

We're all mad here.



toplitzin posted:

Did it happen?

Did someone create joinder?
You did, you said it, you're everyone's lawyer now, mazel tov

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Leperflesh
May 17, 2007






As a working professional, in a professional career, with a degree: 100% of the time that someone starts staking out boundaries around their professional status so that they can separate themselves from other "non-professionals," it's coming from a place of bruised vanity that makes them sound absolutely ridiculous.

Nice piece of fish
Jan 29, 2008



Ultra Carp

My pride isn't particularly bruised (lol I'm a lawyer what loving pride) but I also recognize that the definition of "profession" varies between colloquial use, academic and scientific use, historical use and current use.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Profession

By strict definition you could absolutely, for instance, claim that if it's illegal to practice in that profession's field without a license in such a way that it is sanctionable (like, if you try to represent someone in court in my country without the onerous task of aquiring a license as an attorney you are liable for a whole lot of compensation and may also be criminally liable), that constitutes a "profession" as traditonally recognized.

Now, do I give a poo poo about this? Only if some idiot tried that poo poo because it would be hilarious to see them try and fail at it.

euphronius
Feb 18, 2009






employment and labor law also have definitions for professional

toplitzin
Jun 13, 2003


Bad Munki posted:

You did, you said it, you're everyone's lawyer now, mazel tov

Huzzah! Now my mother will finally acknowledge me as a fully grown adult! Baruch Hashem!

euphronius
Feb 18, 2009






Nlra:

(12) The term "professional employee" means--
(a) any employee engaged in work (i) predominantly intellectual and varied in character as opposed to routine mental, manual, mechanical, or physical work; (ii) involving the consistent exercise of discretion and judgment in its performance; (iii) of such a character that the output produced or the result accomplished cannot be standardized in relation to a given period of time; (iv) requiring knowledge of an advanced type in a field of science or learning customarily acquired by a prolonged course of specialized intellectual instruction and study in an institution of higher learning or a hospital, as distinguished from a general academic education or from an apprenticeship or from training in the performance of routine mental, manual, or physical processes; or
(b) any employee, who (i) has completed the courses of specialized intellectual instruction and study described in clause (iv) of paragraph (a), and (ii) is performing related work under the supervision of a professional person to qualify himself to become a professional employee as defined in paragraph (a).

———-


Sandwhich artist would not be a professional under that

Hieronymous Alloy
Jan 30, 2009


Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!



Morbid Hound

In my state barbers require 1500 hours of professional training before they get licensed

in contrast, magistrate judges require only 57 & 1/2 hours

joat mon
Oct 15, 2009

I am the master of my lamp;
I am the captain of my tub.


euphronius posted:

A chef is not normally a professional in the USA

Yet they have white collars.



I await your concession to my checkmate.

Leperflesh
May 17, 2007






joat mon posted:

Yet they have white collars.



I await your concession to my checkmate.

they're also not my employee, so when I send back my burnt steak they can just ignore me

Outrail
Jan 4, 2009

www.sapphicrobotica.com


Nice piece of fish posted:

Do not loving start this. DO NOT. The lawyer discord has litigated the definition of a sandwich to death and back. gently caress you. Shut up.

And? What was the consensus definition of sandwich?

Phil Moscowitz
Feb 19, 2007

Chief Justice of the United States of Anime



Outrail posted:

And? What was the consensus definition of sandwich?

It’s a kind of taco

joat mon
Oct 15, 2009

I am the master of my lamp;
I am the captain of my tub.


Phil Moscowitz posted:

It’s a kind of taco

Which is a kind of pita

homullus
Mar 27, 2009



joat mon posted:

Which is a kind of pita

lawyers are a PITA

pentyne
Nov 7, 2012

I just couldn't look at your old avatar anymore
Fucking nauseating!


homullus posted:

lawyers are a PITA

and not the good kind, like you want

pseudanonymous
Aug 30, 2008

When you make the second entry and the debits and credits balance, and you blow them to hell.

I have a question, for real my friend was in a divorce proceeding, and her lawyer failed to serve her husband so the default order of divorce was vacated.

This is in Oregon.

Does she have any recourse against the attorney for failure to perform?

I mean probably hiring another attorney to sue the first attorney is a lost cause but I thought i'd ask.

I'm not 100% sure yet whether the actual serving appears on the itemized bill yet, I asked her to get them together and send to me, but if it does that seems like fraud.

euphronius
Feb 18, 2009






You can always sue people but the question you have to ask
1. How much will it cost to do so
2. What is your chance of winning
3. How much will you win if you win
4. What are your chances of enforcing the judgment

Things usually break down at 1,2,3 and 4

pseudanonymous
Aug 30, 2008

When you make the second entry and the debits and credits balance, and you blow them to hell.

euphronius posted:

You can always sue people but the question you have to ask
1. How much will it cost to do so
2. What is your chance of winning
3. How much will you win if you win
4. What are your chances of enforcing the judgment

Things usually break down at 1,2,3 and 4

Yeah, I was just thinking more like an ethics complaint than anything else. I also told her to stop paying but I think she's paid up, unfortunately.

euphronius
Feb 18, 2009






Anyway I don’t know the law in that state but my hunch is it is not as clean as you understand it to be

Captain von Trapp
Jan 22, 2006

I don't like it, and I'm sorry I ever had anything to do with it.

Nice piece of fish posted:

By strict definition you could absolutely, for instance, claim that if it's illegal to practice in that profession's field without a license in such a way that it is sanctionable (like, if you try to represent someone in court in my country without the onerous task of aquiring a license as an attorney you are liable for a whole lot of compensation and may also be criminally liable), that constitutes a "profession" as traditonally recognized.

By strict definition that constitutes a "cartel" as traditionally recognized. If the relevant sanctions are administered by a guy with a bone saw.

null_pointer
Nov 9, 2004

Center in, pull back. Stop. Track 45 right. Stop. Center and stop.



Jesus, I knew torta reform was a touchy subject, but come on, guys ...

Phil Moscowitz
Feb 19, 2007

Chief Justice of the United States of Anime



Prosser on Tortas

Discendo Vox
Mar 21, 2013


Would folks prefer for me to cover USDA or FDA precedent on the sandwich matter first?

toplitzin
Jun 13, 2003


Discendo Vox posted:

Would folks prefer for me to cover USDA or FDA precedent on the sandwich matter first?

Is there a NIST Standard Sandwich?

blarzgh
Apr 14, 2009

SNITCHIN' RANDY


Grimey Drawer

Discendo Vox posted:

Would folks prefer for me to cover USDA or FDA precedent on the sandwich matter first?

Go have relations with another person first, then get back to me

Hieronymous Alloy
Jan 30, 2009


Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!



Morbid Hound

blarzgh posted:

Go have relations with another person first, then get back to me

The beast with two backs, by itself, isn't a sandwich. You need something else in between.

BonerGhost
Mar 9, 2007



Hieronymous Alloy posted:

The beast with two backs, by itself, isn't a sandwich. You need something else in between.

I think the weiner makes it a sandwich.

Soylent Pudding
Jun 22, 2007

We've got people!


Javid posted:

Didn't Subway get sued because the foot long buns were only 11 inches?

Who here hasn't also felt embarrassed at only being able to offer 11.5 inches?

Volmarias
Dec 31, 2002


BonerGhost posted:

I think the weiner makes it a sandwich.

Depends entirely if the wieners come in buns

thepopmonster
Feb 18, 2014




euphronius posted:

I have no idea what you mean by “semantically”

If you are saying I am using words with meaning then yes I am doing that. Everyone does that

Did you, at any point, watch, read, or listen to any US political news coverage during the period 1st December 2016 through 21st January 2021?

euphronius
Feb 18, 2009






thepopmonster posted:

Did you, at any point, watch, read, or listen to any US political news coverage during the period 1st December 2016 through 21st January 2021?

Not a lot

I read a lot of tweets I guess

Nice piece of fish
Jan 29, 2008



Ultra Carp

Explains a lot really

Captain von Trapp
Jan 22, 2006

I don't like it, and I'm sorry I ever had anything to do with it.

A Newspaper posted:

A Brainerd, Minn., man who pleaded guilty to helping set fire to a Minneapolis police station during protests over the killing of George Floyd was sentenced Wednesday to four years in federal prison.

Dylan Shakespeare Robinson, 23, was also ordered to serve two years of supervised release and pay back $12 million for damages that resulted from the May 2020 precinct fire. Robinson pleaded guilty in December to one count of conspiracy to commit arson.

Ignore all the politics and whatnot. What happens when your sentence involves a fine bigger than you'd make in multiple lifetimes? Bankruptcy? Some kind of negotiation? Garnishment of a percentage until you die?

pseudanonymous
Aug 30, 2008

When you make the second entry and the debits and credits balance, and you blow them to hell.

Captain von Trapp posted:

Ignore all the politics and whatnot. What happens when your sentence involves a fine bigger than you'd make in multiple lifetimes? Bankruptcy? Some kind of negotiation? Garnishment of a percentage until you die?

you die

blarzgh
Apr 14, 2009

SNITCHIN' RANDY


Grimey Drawer

Captain von Trapp posted:

Ignore all the politics and whatnot. What happens when your sentence involves a fine bigger than you'd make in multiple lifetimes? Bankruptcy? Some kind of negotiation? Garnishment of a percentage until you die?

I understand financial restitution is a condition of probation, not a sentence where you have to pay the money back by the time your probation is over or you go to jail.

Idk what happens if you can't pay a huge criminal judgment, but I don't think intentional torts are dischargeable in bankruptcy, so probably just it hangs over his head for 10 years (or whenever judgments expire in that state) and then they don't renew it and it expires, would be my guess.

Neither the Court nor anyone else expects him to pay any of that.

toplitzin
Jun 13, 2003


blarzgh posted:

I understand financial restitution is a condition of probation, not a sentence where you have to pay the money back by the time your probation is over or you go to jail.

Idk what happens if you can't pay a huge criminal judgment, but I don't think intentional torts are dischargeable in bankruptcy, so probably just it hangs over his head for 10 years (or whenever judgments expire in that state) and then they don't renew it and it expires, would be my guess.

Neither the Court nor anyone else expects him to pay any of that.

Depending on the state (FL) he can't vote till he pays the 12 mil.

Annath
Jan 11, 2009



Clever Betty

So the owners of my apartment complex are apparently going around telling cat owners that the cats have to go. My brother's friend who lives in the same complex as me got a notice yesterday.

I have 2 cats, and have yet to get such a notice.

This is all my lease says about pets:



I have been paying the pet fee each month, although the property manager (who I give the checks to) told me it was $25/mo flat, not per pet, so that is what I have been paying.

If they come around trying to evict my cats, what should I do? I am not financially well off, I am actually in the process of paying off Ch13 Bankruptcy, so I can't afford to move, but I would like to keep my cats unless the only alternative is being evicted myself.

blarzgh
Apr 14, 2009

SNITCHIN' RANDY


Grimey Drawer

Annath posted:

So the owners of my apartment complex are apparently going around telling cat owners that the cats have to go. My brother's friend who lives in the same complex as me got a notice yesterday.

I have 2 cats, and have yet to get such a notice.

This is all my lease says about pets:



I have been paying the pet fee each month, although the property manager (who I give the checks to) told me it was $25/mo flat, not per pet, so that is what I have been paying.

If they come around trying to evict my cats, what should I do? I am not financially well off, I am actually in the process of paying off Ch13 Bankruptcy, so I can't afford to move, but I would like to keep my cats unless the only alternative is being evicted myself.

Since we can't answer your specific question without a) Knowing your state and jurisdictions rules about eviction proceedings and contract actions, and b) without violating criminal law against practicing in your jurisdiction without a license, I would offer you this:

If you live near an area of any remotely substantial population, there will be a legal aid organization that for low or no cost assists people with landlord/tenant issues.

I recommend you Google them, or call your local county bar associations referral service for pro bono assistance.

nm
Jan 28, 2008

"I saw Minos the Space Judge holding a golden sceptre and passing sentence upon the Martians. There he presided, and around him the noble Space Prosecutors sought the firm justice of space law."

blarzgh posted:

I understand financial restitution is a condition of probation, not a sentence where you have to pay the money back by the time your probation is over or you go to jail.

Idk what happens if you can't pay a huge criminal judgment, but I don't think intentional torts are dischargeable in bankruptcy, so probably just it hangs over his head for 10 years (or whenever judgments expire in that state) and then they don't renew it and it expires, would be my guess.

Neither the Court nor anyone else expects him to pay any of that.

In California at least court ordered criminal restitution never dies, like student loans, but there are some protection around ability to pay.

null_pointer
Nov 9, 2004

Center in, pull back. Stop. Track 45 right. Stop. Center and stop.



blarzgh posted:

If you live near an area of any remotely substantial population, there will be a legal aid organization that for low or no cost assists people with landlord/tenant issues.

Not A Lawyer, but isn't this one of those situations that are a) pretty clearly stated in a legally-binding document, but b) even if you fight and win, you'll lose?

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Grip it and rip it
Apr 28, 2020

Be the change you want see in the world


null_pointer posted:

Not A Lawyer, but isn't this one of those situations that are a) pretty clearly stated in a legally-binding document, but b) even if you fight and win, you'll lose?

They should ask their lawyer who practices in their jurisdiction and who has the opportunity to review the entire contract exactly what their situation is. Without all the relevant information it's pointless (and potentially harmful) to speculate.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply