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drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

Well, there doesn't seem to be a thread about Gordon Murray's T25 so it probably belongs in here.

Gordon Murray, designer of countless winning race cars, the LCC Rocket, and the McLaren F1 road car, has been working away on a city car, the T25. Now, it is a city car. Yes it's small. Yes it would be terrible on a US freeway. That is besides the point, it is a city car. Now I've got that out the way, will it succeed as a city car? The 3 seat layout is cool, and it's Gordon loving Murray, but look at that door and then imagine what happens when you want to get out and it's raining. Or you want to go to work but there's a foot of snow on the roof, because it still rains and snows in cities.








Here's what Autocar have to say:

quote:

It foreshadows a new era of tiny, great-to-drive economy cars as well as a highly original manufacturing process called iStream that slashes the investment, factory space and energy required for manufacturing.
The T25, which it has been confirmed weighs around 575kg, has a much smaller road footprint than today’s smallest production cars, the Smart Fortwo and Toyota iQ.
It is 240cm long, 130cm wide and 140cm high - meaning it can be forward parked in spaces, and that three T25s would fit in the space traditionally occupied by one parrallel parked car. It has a turning circle of six metres

It has independent suspension front and rear and is designed to be powered by a rear-mounted 51bhp 660cc, three-cylinder engine with 42lb ft of torque, linked to a five-speed clutchless transmission.
That translates to a restricted top speed of 90mph, 0-62mph time of 16.2sec . Co2 emissions are rated at 86g/km, while economy is 74mpg.

It also has anti-lock brakes, stability control, traction control and an airbag, plus front and rear crush structures. Murray says the Formula One inspired tubular steel and composite floor chassis frame design creates a safety cell that is “immensely strong”.

Murray is aiming to have the T25 ready for production in two years’ time, and there are strong indications that the first iStream factory will be in the UK.

Eventually they could appear across the globe, close to the biggest population centres. Murray said the car’s unusual design and progressive values have powerful appeal both to leading automotive and non-automotive brands.

The car is also noteworthy for its revolutionary single door, which swings up to allow easy access even when the car is tightly parked.

The driver sits centrally with a passenger on either side and slightly to the rear.
Despite the T25’s compactness, there is still space for several large suitcases. The rear seats also fold, meaning it has an official capacity of between 160 litres and 720 litres.

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drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

Murray is 6'+, I think Its safe to say that tall people can fit in his cars.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

So the more I think about the T25, the more I think I'd love one for my commute. The turbo version that weighs 500kg would be more than nippy enough, and you'd be able to carve your way through traffic because it's so narrow. Murray needs someone to style it though.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

MonkeyNutZ posted:

Oh finally, I've been waiting for a production Bluesport roadster. Not that the US will ever see the diesel version

The lack of decent diesels over here is really pissing me off. Why can't I buy an XF or XJ diesel? For that matter, why are the non-R Jags limited to 121 mph?

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

But they know they can fit Z rated tyres because the XFR and XJR have them! Not that I'm doubting you, but I'd been starting to seriously think about getting a Jag in the next few years and now they can gently caress off. My old man's company recently loaned them €75 million, he should have told them they could only have the money if they weren't retarded.

It does raise the question though - if you replaced the rubber for something decent, how easy would it be to change the limiter?

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

kimbo305 posted:

I know it's a principle thing, but are you really going to track your bigass XF or XJ sedan? I suspect the brakes will cook long before you have a chance to bemoan top speed issues.
I recall you being from the US. If you're storming the autobahn, that'd be different.

oh yeah --

No, that's the sad part, it is just the principle of the thing. I think the lack of a diesel is more of an issue for me (and yes, I live in the US now but grew up in the UK). It's basically as fast as the V8, but does 33 mpg as opposed to 23. You'd hope that at some point we start seeing more decent diesels over here.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

MikeyTsi posted:

Technically Rover was a "domestic" there for a while (owned by Ford), although now they're owned by Tata.

I'm just being an rear end in a top hat now though.

Land Rover was owned by Ford Rover was bought back by management and dive bombed into the ground post-BMW.

If you're going to be an rear end in a top hat I'll be a pedantic arsehole

The Evoque isn't bad looking IMO, but I'm a terrible judge because I like some bits of the X6.

Saw my first XJ on the road here in DC today, the nostril at the front is bigger than i though, but I think EU pedestrian safety regs mean we better get used to that kind of look.

drgitlin fucked around with this message at 01:56 on Jul 3, 2010

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

What the gently caress is going on at Hethel? They've announced a line up of five new cars, none of which seems it have anything to do with the sorts of things you would expect from Lotus. The Elise replacement is 200 kg heavier than the current one! Totally appalling. If you live in the UK you can probably pick up an Evora for cheap now. Makes me want to find a good S1 Elise and store it for the future.

pictures here

Jaguar made up for it though with some new Supercar that does 25g/km CO2 or something.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

bidikyoopi posted:

If you haven't heard the news, Lotus came out swinging with 5 concepts at the Paris Motor Show. New Elise, V6 Elan, V8 Esprit, then two weird hybrid ones: hard top convertible Elite and four door Eterne. Critics going batshit about 3200lbs vs the 2900 old Esprit, but gently caress em, the first three ones look awesome.

No, we hadn't heard the news, tell us all about it.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

It's almost as if Lamborghini and Lotus decided to switch missions. All the new Lotuses look like Lambos anyway.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

grover posted:

VW is rumored to be entering NASCAR, and Porsche returning to Formula 1.

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/10/01/...k-to-formula-1/

Don't know how I feel about that. Porsche doesn't really have any business in F1. They've tried it a couple of times in the past but it's not in the firm's DNA the way sportscar racing is. Audi would be a much better fit, but since Audi are pinning everything on TDi they won't leave prototypes and that means Porsche can't enter.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

I take back my previous whine about Porsche being in F1, since I was dumb enough to forget the TAG engine they made for McLaren that was actually pretty good.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

KlementGottwald posted:

What?

Porsche was in F1 for 4 years[83-87](The 1991 Footwork Literally never existed, we shall not speak of that..that...thing) and took two constructors championships, 3 driver titles, and managed to win 25 races. I think they should be in the sport.

Yes, I know, I forgot about the TAG engines.

That Jag looks interesting but it's not like any of that technology actually works, so it's meaningless. If JLR somehow manage to get it working (something they say will take about 8 years) then I'll be superimpressed. But much as it pains me to say it, this is the British car industry we're talking about.

drgitlin fucked around with this message at 04:06 on Oct 13, 2010

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

MetaJew posted:

So am I a complete tool for really wanting a 4 door Golf R when it comes out in mid-2011? Of course, it's not a fancy AWD system like the one found in Subies, but I bet it's fun.

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/12/09/...erica-official/



Click here for the full 1280x853 image.


So, 270 HP from a 2.0 l turbo, AWD, and a six speed? It won't compete with the STi or EVO (and it will probably be just as expensive), but I bet it'll be a great daily driver car and have a great interior.

\/\/\/\/ Yeah, the $34k price tag is little too much. I guess I'll have to find an in-between car.

Edit: My major concern with this engine, and DI engines in general(see: MZR 2.3 DISI, but not Toyota's DIs) is the issue of carbon buildup in the intake and on the intake valves. I've read that running an oil catch can from the get go greatly reduces this problem, along with running seafoam through a booster line at every oil change. I haven't read through the VW/Audi thread enough to see if those guys are having this problem or what-- but it's a concern.

It's also not really AWD - most of the time it's FWD and occasionally it'll shuttle 10% of the power to the back wheels. Evo compared it to the new STI and an Evo and came away wondering what the R really added over the regular GTI.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

Throatwarbler posted:

The 612 has a manual transmission but there's nothing in the video or pictures showing a manual transmission for this one.

Like the California and the 458, it's DCT or nothing.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

Embargoes are down for the new McLaren MP4-12C:

Evo: http://www.evo.co.uk/carreviews/evo...12c_review.html (includes Chris Harris video)

Car: http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives...AR-review-2011/

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives...eo-review-here/

Autocar: http://www.autocar.co.uk/CarReviews...-3.8-V8/255434/

Autocar video with Jenson Button: http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-video/...n-button-video/

I do not understand how people say it's boring to look at and doesn't look special in the way a 458 does, but then I don't like Ferrari and I do like McLaren. Looks like the car has moved the game on from the 458, makes me wonder what they're going to do for their next car, which will be a replacement for the mighty F1. The really interesting one will be the final car, which is going to be aimed at the 911 and be a car you can drive every day (and possibly afford, too).

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

Yes, but it's only going on sale, a combination of (I believe) making sure production testing was very thorough and also taking time to have the dealer network in place (McLaren have been making a big thing about the dealer experience and how it won't be the same sort of "you better be in the club" way Ferrari work. I can sort of attest to this - the nice man from McLaren called me last week to tell me the car was about to go on sale. I had to tell him that I don't think I'm going to be buying one any time soon. Hopefully by the time the 911-rival goes on sale that will change.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

Throatwarbler posted:

Here's my theory on stuff like the Hummer and the G-wagon. They are originally designed as specialized fleet(military or otherwise) vehicles. There is virtually no civillian market for them, and the total fleet volume isn't enough to warrant a capital intensive production line. According to wikipedia the G-wagon line rolls out about 5,000 units per year. So basically they are all "hand made" trucks, because it would be too expensive to set up a modern automated production line. Whatever their actual unit production cost, which must be high but probably not $100k per, MB rekons it can at least sell a few a year to rappers and movie stars who for whatever reason want to sit in an uncomfortable body-on-frame box held up by 2 live axles, so they throw in some minimal creature comforts and price it accordingly. They know very few people are going to buy it and they don't care, because it's all just a sunk cost at this point.

Do any serious off-roaders actually buy them? I can't imagine why, since I'm pretty sure $100k can buy you a jeep with as many differentials as you want.

They say the new Range Rover is actually a better off roader now than a Defender, on the same tyres.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

Has anyone linked Chris Harris' epic anti-Ferrari rant yet?

http://jalopnik.com/!5760248

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

kimbo305 posted:

On a Chris Harris roll, he does a quick review the MP4:
http://www.evo.co.uk/carreviews/evo...12c_review.html
It's crazy that its suspension is designed with minimal sway bars. That must be the holy grail of independentness. No LSD!

I don't know if I'm on ignore or something, but I posted that exact link on Monday.

Here are the other UK mags:

Car: http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives...AR-review-2011/

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives...eo-review-here/

Autocar: http://www.autocar.co.uk/CarReviews...-3.8-V8/255434/

Autocar video with Jenson Button: http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-video/...n-button-video/

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

heat posted:

Canada spends less than one thirtieth as much on military, doesn't pay pharmaceutical companies full retail price for drugs bought by the ton, and hasn't been steadily cutting funding for education while increasing funding for prisons. I'm gonna let you in on a little secret: almost nothing is better or cheaper in America.

On the other hand, Canada is why US-spec 911s have those loving horrible lumps sticking out either side of the rear license plate.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

Next Corvette could have a 3l V8 that revs to 10k. Before everyone gets all abloobloobloo, imagine the noise that fucker would make!

quote:

General Motors will equip its all-new Corvette C7 with a high-revving turbocharged V8 engine as part of its desire to offer a mainstream rival to Porsche and Ferrari.
The new V8 will be just over 3.0 litres in capacity and is expected to have around 400bhp. Senior GM sources claim it could rev as high as 10,000rpm.

GM won’t abandon the Corvette’s ‘There’s no replacement for displacement’ philosophy entirely, however. Other engines will be offered, including a classic big-block OHV V8 designed to appeal to the Corvette’s traditional buyers.
The new downsized V8 could also find use in Cadillac’s high-performance V models, including the CTS-V range.

http://www.autocar.co.uk/News/NewsA...AllCars/257498/

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

MrChips posted:

I suppose it's going to be mid-engined too? Every time the Corvette nears the end of its model cycle, these retarded rumours surface again. Why would GM spend all kinds of money (which they don't really have) developing an exotic new V8 that would conceivably be used in only one, limited-production model?

I would say it is far more likely that we'd see a turbo V6 if GM decides to stray from the small-block V8 in the Corvette.

Funny you should say that http://www.autocar.co.uk/News/NewsA...AllCars/256918/

What could be cool is if they developed the 3l V8 into an Indycar engine too.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

eames posted:

Porsche needs to drop the Boxster with it’s wannabe-911 image and revive a classic like the 356 or 914 as a small-ish electric car with a radically different design.
In any case, it sounds like its going to be a pretty nice city car.

I’m envisioning the Active Sound Design tuners of the future, where ricers take the sound unit out of the latest V12-immitating Ferrari EV, turn up the volume to 11 and put it in their Prius.

Isn't that the plan for the Porsche version of the Bluemotion?

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

I hate the new 911

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/News/S...ges-of-the-991/

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

Boaz MacPhereson posted:

The rear end is too long. The 911 has always sloped from the roof all the way down the back to the ground (with the exception of a tail here and there). This one's too long. As it curves down, it almost seems to flatten back out before dropping off the back. It's kinda weird.

Yeah, it's too elongated. You can see why they did it, to make more interior room, but it looks off. I also think the front is a bit too delicate. Interior is stunning though.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

Wired have an interview with Gordon Murray on his iSTREAM stuff: http://www.wired.com/autopia/2011/09/gordon-murray-qa/

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

grover posted:

FYI, there's a wikipedia page with all the nurburgring times. Radical SR8 LM has the street legal production car record at 6:48, nearly a full minute faster. A non-road-legal Zonda R did it in 6:47.50 (video!). The ZL1 is nowhere near the 7:20ish top times for GTR, Z06, ZR1 and Viper ACR. I always have to wonder what mods had been made and what tires all those cars were running, though.

There's also a page with Top Gear track times.

When Caparo manage to finally complete a lap I think they might well beat the SR8.

Oh, and the SR8 that set that time was driven to the track. From the UK. Evo wrote it up as a feature back when it happened.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

Cream_Filling posted:

I think there was actual statistical evidence to this effect as well.

Looking into it, there's a report from NHTSA that says there's a decrease in accidents but it's not significant, and one from the EU that says the decrease is probably significant but they can't really say how much.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

The new Focus RS looks nice: http://www.autoblog.com/2012/02/15/...nd-active-nois/



Ford really needs to start selling these over here.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

Throatwarbler posted:

That's just a pic of the current RS500.

D'oh, so it is. Oops.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

Cream_Filling posted:

Hey now, that front end is 95% indistinguishable from a Mazda 3. Don't you forget it.


They look really different in the flesh. The Peugeot RC is much closer to a TT in overall shape than the Mazda.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

Cream_Filling posted:

Just like computers. Most people just want to know what button to press to go to their youtubes and cat pictures. They will either buy the shittiest piece of plastic with swoopy designs or big numbers that matches their budget, or else they will pay thousands for the latest hermetically sealed Apple product. People who can actually figure out what's going on with their computer without taking it into the store are rarer than you think, though, like the food thing above, your perception may be altered by the kind of people you see most of the time.

OK, enough now with the horrid car/computer analogies. And FWIW, your ideas about how expensive Apple laptops are are dangerously out of date, they're very competitive with similar Lenovos etc.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

CornHolio posted:

Awww, the one thing I thought it had going for it, a somewhat unique exhaust design.

gently caress you, Toyota.

In fairness, even the Maserati MC12 uses fake pipes like that.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

IOwnCalculus posted:

I've got a passenger on my commute for three days a week, and you're not going to even get into the HOV lane without getting shot if you're not doing at least 70, and you will get a line of very angry drivers behind you if you're not doing at least 75. If I'm going to spend new car money on a car, it had better be able to handle driving in that speed range at least as well as my 2.5L Ranger, and trust me, that's not much of a bar to set.

Good for you. My commute to work, when I drive and don't take Metro, is 10 miles across DC to Bethesda, and the fastest I'll ever go is 50 mph, which is still 15 mph over the posted limit.

If I had somewhere to plug an electric car in at home, you can bet I'd have one instead of dealing with WMATA.

See? Different people have different needs.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

KozmoNaut posted:

Once you've experienced the effortless, instant and glassy-smooth torque of an electric motor, anything else feels ridiculously primitive in comparison.


It's all fun and games in an i-MiEV until you try taking an on-ramp too fast. Yes, effortless torque, but also no front grip!

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

PT6A posted:


Any place with long tunnels (I'm thinking specifically about the ones between Golden and Revelstoke on the Trans-Canada, but any tunnels will do) will also have the morons that cannot read (or choose to ignore) the "use lights through tunnel" sign. Guess what? The automatic sensor isn't going to react quickly enough. Twist the fuckin' dial one spot over so I don't run into your stupid slow-driving rear end.

This is a real problem in DC in the 3rd St tunnel.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

Throatwarbler posted:

I heard an interview with Ford engineers and they said the iron block was done on purpose in order to make the engine smaller, and going to Al would not have saved any weight. They also went to a conventional timing belt instead of a chain in order to reduce drivetrain friction.

I interviewed Ford engineers on this exact topic (you can read the results at Ars Technica) and Dan Kapp told me that for the 1l 3 cal car, the weight saving with Al wasn't worth the extra effort. He did say that Al would be used for larger derivatives though.

Cream_Filling posted:

Well, maybe not profitability. The 5.0 might be cheaper to make and also possibly cheaper to maintain than the ecoboost. Especially since direct injection is a pretty new technology. Also, I think the 5.0 tends to be slightly lighter in standard setups (though when the whole vehicle weighs 5000+ lbs, you're not going to notice a hundred lbs much).

The EcoBoost now accounts for 40% of F150 sales.

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

Spatule posted:

WTF Ferrari ?






I can't believe they're calling it the F-150 again. Ford sued (and won) when they tried calling their F1 car an F-150, this time they don't even have the excuse about it not being a road car.

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drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003
luv 2 get custom titles from a forum that goes into revolt when its told to stop using a bad word.

You'd think there was even less chance of someone cross-shopping a 1/4 ton pick up and an F1 car that you can't actually buy* but the Blue Oval was less convinced.





*Yes, I am aware you will at some point be able to buy one through Corsa Cliente but really, you'd have to be even more pedantic than me to point that out.

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