Aeronautical Insanity: switching to secondary tolerances

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Slo-Tek: Jun 8, 2001; WINDOWS 98 BEAT HIS FRIEND WITH A SHOVEL

Nebakenezzer posted:

The constant nightmare of the milhist thread

Got a question if anybody knows the answer. In World War 2, did anybody work on aerial refueling aside from the Germans? I'm working on a infodump post and I'm surprised 1) how far the Germans actually were in its development, and 2) that nobody else even thought to mess around with similar systems.

Not really milhist, but the WB-2 Columbia flew for 51 hours and change over Roosevelt Field in NY in 1927, being refuelled by jerry cans handed down on a rope from another aircraft.

# ? May 9, 2017 19:37

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# ? Apr 29, 2024 18:03

Nebakenezzer: Sep 13, 2005; The Mote in God's Eye

Slo-Tek posted:

Not really milhist, but the WB-2 Columbia flew for 51 hours and change over Roosevelt Field in NY in 1927, being refuelled by jerry cans handed down on a rope from another aircraft.

A quick check of Wikipedia reveals Empire class flying boats were being aerial refueled just before World War 2 started, but it seems the idea was dropped by the British until they were planning to support the American invasion of the Japanese home islands six years later.

# ? May 9, 2017 20:10

Phanatic: Mar 13, 2007; Please don't forget that I am an extremely racist idiot who also has terrible opinions about the Culture series.

Slo-Tek posted:

Not really milhist, but the WB-2 Columbia flew for 51 hours and change over Roosevelt Field in NY in 1927, being refuelled by jerry cans handed down on a rope from another aircraft.

Heh, nice.

World record for continuous manned flight is 1500 hours, held by two guys flying a Cessna 172. They'd fly at 20 feet and lower a rope to a fuel truck driving beneath them, then pull up the fuel hose. Sometimes the pump wouldn't work and they had to do the jerry can bit.

https://disciplesofflight.com/flight-endurance/

# ? May 9, 2017 20:25

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

That's one way to get to ATPL minimums I guess :v:

# ? May 9, 2017 20:27

hobbesmaster: Jan 28, 2008

Phanatic posted:

Heh, nice.

World record for continuous manned flight is 1500 hours, held by two guys flying a Cessna 172. They'd fly at 20 feet and lower a rope to a fuel truck driving beneath them, then pull up the fuel hose. Sometimes the pump wouldn't work and they had to do the jerry can bit.

https://disciplesofflight.com/flight-endurance/

And now it's on display above the exit from McCarran to remind you that your flight could've been longer!

# ? May 9, 2017 22:08

CBJamo: Jul 15, 2012

hobbesmaster posted:

And now it's on display above the exit from McCarran to remind you that your flight could've been longer!

The little museum at McCarran is actually pretty alright. I got stuck there once and reading the history plaques and looking at the little displays was a cool way to kill an hour.

# ? May 9, 2017 23:07

Terrible Robot: Jul 2, 2010; FRIED CHICKEN; Slippery Tilde

The only time I flew into McCarran the baggage claim area where the Cessna is was being renovated so I only got a glimpse of it, and couldn't see the plaques at all. It wasn't until years later I found out the significance of that plane.

# ? May 9, 2017 23:54

slidebite: Nov 6, 2005; Good egg

Buddy of mine just made a deal on this beautiful old girl as his first personal aircraft
http://www.airplanemart.com/aircraft-for-sale/Single-Engine-Piston/1946-Aeronca-11AC-Chief/13012/

# ? May 10, 2017 05:13

HookedOnChthonics: Dec 5, 2015; Profoundly dull

Icon A5 lead engineer dies in Icon A5 crash

# ? May 10, 2017 05:38

Sagebrush: Feb 26, 2012

slidebite posted:

Buddy of mine just made a deal on this beautiful old girl as his first personal aircraft
http://www.airplanemart.com/aircraft-for-sale/Single-Engine-Piston/1946-Aeronca-11AC-Chief/13012/

Purty.

# ? May 10, 2017 05:47

drunkill: Sep 25, 2007; me @ ur posting; Fallen Rib

A good video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSxSgbNQi-g - Small Planes Over Big Oceans (ETOPS Explained)

# ? May 10, 2017 10:26

Ola: Jul 19, 2004

https://twitter.com/scott_kerr/status/861515100951334912

# ? May 10, 2017 13:08

simplefish: Mar 28, 2011; So long, and thanks for all the ~~fish~~ gallbladdΣrs!

If anyone has an article about this, I'd love to read it:
https://m.imgur.com/r/nonononoyes/fj9JqVJ

# ? May 10, 2017 18:20

joat mon: Oct 15, 2009; I am the master of my lamp;
I am the captain of my tub.

simplefish posted:

If anyone has an article about this, I'd love to read it:
https://m.imgur.com/r/nonononoyes/fj9JqVJ

Just copy the imgur blurb and Google it.
Here's an article.

# ? May 10, 2017 18:45

slidebite: Nov 6, 2005; Good egg

I know there is a lot of focus on airlines lately, but Air Canada is getting in on the action now too. Cancelled a minors flight and apparently left him to fend for himself in YYZ

https://ca.yahoo.com/finance/news/air-canada-leaves-teen-apos-090000411.html

quote:

Air Canada cannot use construction at Toronto's Pearson airport as an excuse for forcing a 15-year-old boy to spend a long, scary night alone, says the boy's mother.

Derrin Espinola was flying alone on May 1 from Denver to Thunder Bay, with a stopover in Toronto, when a flight delay leaving Denver caused the teen to miss his connecting flight.

Espinola said that when he arrived in Toronto around 8 p.m., Air Canada rebooked him on a flight to Thunder Bay the following day, at 6 p.m., but did not offer him any accommodation or vouchers for food.

"I was trapped in the airport and there was nowhere I could go. I could not leave. I could not get a hotel, because I am a minor," Espinola told CBC News in an interview a week after his long, lonely night. "It was like being held prisoner."

'Very tired, very scared'

The teen said he spent part of the night running between Air Canada service desks explaining that he was a minor and needed help. When none was offered, he did his best to stay alert and awake for fear he would be robbed if he let his guard down.

"I was very hungry, very tired, very scared," Espinola said. "I didn't know really what was going to happen to me."

Meanwhile, his mother, Karin Patock, said she spent 10 hours on the phone, trying to get through to Air Canada and make arrangements for her son.

Airline policy promises help

Patock said she purposely booked with Air Canada from Denver through to Thunder Bay, trusting the airline would live up to the policy about flight delays stated on its website: "Youths travelling alone (ages 12 to 17) � will be taken care of by our agents. We will also arrange for accommodations, meals and transportation if needed."

Air Canada knew that a three-hour flight delay in a departure would cause her son to miss his connecting flight, but did not make any contingency plans for him, Patock said.

Instead, she said, the airline "rebooked him like any other person, into the next day with no thought what's going to happen to him when he lands in Toronto in one of the biggest airports in Canada, all by himself."

Patock was making the three-hour drive from her home in Geraldton, Ont., to pick up her son in Thunder Bay when the events started to unfold.

'Unacceptable'

Phone calls to Air Canada got a message, "basically saying 'the airport is under construction and we cannot accommodate anyone right now, so call back later,'" she said. "To me that is unacceptable"

Air Canada must have known back in January when she booked her son's ticket that the construction at Pearson would cause delays, Patock said, and if they'd warned her, Espinola could have connected through Winnipeg instead.

In the end, the family intervened and booked the teen a flight, at their own cost, on another airline, Patock said.

It was to save him from spending another night alone in Toronto, after the May 2 flight he'd been booked on was cancelled and Espinola was rebooked, a second time, on an Air Canada flight departing May 3.

Patock has filed a complaint with Air Canada and the Canadian Transportation Agency in hopes of preventing any other teen from going through what her son did.

"It has been a challenge with the ongoing runway construction at Toronto Pearson, which was also compounded by severe weather conditions last week in the Toronto-Montreal-Ottawa and surrounding areas, including recent adverse conditions in Thunder Bay," a spokesperson for Air Canada wrote in an email in response to questions from CBC News.

The airline said it is looking into what happened with Espinola's flight and will be "reaching out to the family."

# ? May 10, 2017 20:01

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

Air Canada sucks, and they definitely hosed up, but frankly a 15-year-old should be able to function by themselves for a night or two. And what the gently caress were the parents thinking not making sure he had some money available, even on a prepaid VISA card or something? Everyone in the entire story is a fuckup this time around.

# ? May 10, 2017 20:19

Safety Dance: Sep 10, 2007; Five degrees to starboard!

PT6A posted:

Air Canada sucks, and they definitely hosed up, but frankly a 15-year-old should be able to function by themselves for a night or two. And what the gently caress were the parents thinking not making sure he had some money available, even on a prepaid VISA card or something? Everyone in the entire story is a fuckup this time around.

A major problem is that teenagers aren't allowed, by law and/or societal convention, to function by themselves for a night or two. He can't get a hotel room, what recourse does he have but to sleep in the airport?

# ? May 10, 2017 20:50

Mortabis: Jul 8, 2010; I am stupid

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2017/05/10/u-s-to-ban-laptops-in-all-cabins-of-flights-from-europe

quote:

The Department of Homeland Security will ban laptops in the cabins of all flights from Europe to the United States, European security officials told The Daily Beast. The announcement is expected Thursday.

Initially a ban on laptops and tablets was applied only to U.S.-bound flights from 10 airports in North Africa and the Middle East. The ban was based on U.S. fears that terrorists have found a way to convert laptops into bombs capable of bringing down an airplane. It is unclear if the European ban will also apply to tablets.

DHS said in a statement to The Daily Beast:

�No final decisions have been made on expanding the restriction on large electronic devices in aircraft cabins; however, it is under consideration. DHS continues to evaluate the threat environment and will make changes when necessary to keep air travelers safe.�

Hopefully this turns out to be fake.

I'll just lay all my cards on the table: I'm willing to accept a plane or two blown up each year in return for having laptops in cabins.

# ? May 10, 2017 20:54

Jealous Cow: Apr 4, 2002; by Fluffdaddy

Mortabis posted:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2017/05/10/u-s-to-ban-laptops-in-all-cabins-of-flights-from-europe

Hopefully this turns out to be fake.

I'll just lay all my cards on the table: I'm willing to accept a plane or two blown up each year in return for having laptops in cabins.

Instand of a plane or two blowing up each year it'll just be a few brought down my cargo fires instead.

# ? May 10, 2017 20:57

Mortabis: Jul 8, 2010; I am stupid

Well also if you can put a laptop bomb in your carry-on you can put it in your checked bag too.

# ? May 10, 2017 20:59

evil_bunnY: Apr 2, 2003

Mortabis posted:

I'll just lay all my cards on the table: I'm willing to accept a plane or two blown up each year in return for having laptops in cabins.

It's double hilarious because you can take a whole bunch of lipoly packs into the cabin with no issues.

# ? May 10, 2017 20:59

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

Safety Dance posted:

A major problem is that teenagers aren't allowed, by law and/or societal convention, to function by themselves for a night or two. He can't get a hotel room, what recourse does he have but to sleep in the airport?

Teenagers stay in their own room all the time, they just can't actually sign a contract for the room. His parents could've provided a CC number to the hotel and accepted the contract on his behalf, I'm sure.

Or he could've harassed the Air Canada staff until they let him into the maple leaf lounge, solving the food and (partially) the accommodation problem.

# ? May 10, 2017 21:22

MrChips: Jun 10, 2005; FLIGHT SAFETY TIP: Fatties out first

drunkill posted:

A good video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSxSgbNQi-g - Small Planes Over Big Oceans (ETOPS Explained)

Oh hey that is a good video in that he didn't completely gently caress it up for once.

Wendover Productions is bad and you shouldn't watch it.

# ? May 10, 2017 21:29

Ola: Jul 19, 2004

A helicopter just crashed in the sea in view from our kitchen table. Didn't see the crash, but saw boats gathering around it, rescue divers approaching and two inflatable pontoons in the water. News link in Norwegian with some pics: http://www.bt.no/nyheter/lokalt/Helikopter-styrtet-i-sjoen-i-Sandviken-334369b.html

Apparently it was landing on a yacht, got its skid caught on something and did a dynamic rollover. Rotor shattered against the hull. All three aboard survived, but one in critical condition.

# ? May 10, 2017 21:44

wolrah: May 8, 2006; what?

simplefish posted:

If anyone has an article about this, I'd love to read it:
https://m.imgur.com/r/nonononoyes/fj9JqVJ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ng3ULAsAUB4

# ? May 10, 2017 21:50

Tide: Mar 27, 2010; by FactsAreUseless

PT6A posted:

Air Canada sucks, and they definitely hosed up, but frankly a 15-year-old should be able to function by themselves for a night or two. And what the gently caress were the parents thinking not making sure he had some money available, even on a prepaid VISA card or something? Everyone in the entire story is a fuckup this time around.

Yeah, not sure how this couldnt have been solved by looking up the nearest hotel and saying 'My son is delayed at x airport, can you book a room for me please? credit card number is...'

# ? May 10, 2017 21:56

hobbesmaster: Jan 28, 2008

PT6A posted:

Teenagers stay in their own room all the time, they just can't actually sign a contract for the room. His parents could've provided a CC number to the hotel and accepted the contract on his behalf, I'm sure.

Or he could've harassed the Air Canada staff until they let him into the maple leaf lounge, solving the food and (partially) the accommodation problem.

Someone 18, or 21 in some hotels has to be there to sign for the room. Yes a lot of front desks will ignore it but they'd get in big trouble for someone under 18.

Note that this does not prevent air Canada itself from booking him a room.

# ? May 10, 2017 22:07

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

hobbesmaster posted:

Someone 18, or 21 in some hotels has to be there to sign for the room. Yes a lot of front desks will ignore it but they'd get in big trouble for someone under 18.

Note that this does not prevent air Canada itself from booking him a room.

Yeah, all I'm saying is that everyone in the story pisses me off because none of them did anything correctly to actually solve their problems or prevent them in the first place.

Sleeping in an airport loving sucks, but ultimately it shouldn't leave you hungry and scared -- just a little tired and a lot pissed off. And Air Canada was clearly very useless, even moreso than usual.

# ? May 10, 2017 22:26

vessbot: Jun 17, 2005; I don't like you because you're dangerous

Y'all remember when there was the shoe bomber, and they banned shoes?

# ? May 10, 2017 22:41

BIG HEADLINE: Jun 13, 2006; "Stand back, Ottawan ruffian, or face my lumens!"

So for those in here who've traveled to Dayton for the USAF Museum and done multiple days with a hotel stay, if you could PM me some hotel advice, I'd appreciate it. All the hotels in Dayton look lovely, so I'm thinking of staying in Springfield instead.

# ? May 10, 2017 22:45

hobbesmaster: Jan 28, 2008

vessbot posted:

Y'all remember when there was the shoe bomber, and they banned shoes?

Laptops are legitimately more dangerous than shoes - a normal laptop can malfunction and set a fire.

# ? May 10, 2017 22:49

Spaced God: Feb 8, 2014; All torment, trouble, wonder and amazement
Inhabits here: some heavenly power guide us
Out of this fearful country!

hobbesmaster posted:

Laptops are legitimately more dangerous than shoes - a normal laptop can malfunction and set a fire.

(they're more worried about information, not explosions :ssh:

)

# ? May 10, 2017 22:51

Party Plane Jones: Jul 1, 2007; by Reene; Fun Shoe

Let's see how the United mess is settling dow---

quote:

United Passenger Says Crew Left Her No Choice but to Pee in a Cup

Oh, well, good job there United. Totally turning a corner.

# ? May 10, 2017 22:59

hobbesmaster: Jan 28, 2008

Party Plane Jones posted:

Let's see how the United mess is settling dow---

Oh, well, good job there United. Totally turning a corner.

That's very light on details. I wonder what stage of flight that was.

# ? May 10, 2017 23:01

Slo-Tek: Jun 8, 2001; WINDOWS 98 BEAT HIS FRIEND WITH A SHOVEL

BIG HEADLINE posted:

So for those in here who've traveled to Dayton for the USAF Museum and done multiple days with a hotel stay, if you could PM me some hotel advice, I'd appreciate it. All the hotels in Dayton look lovely, so I'm thinking of staying in Springfield instead.

You looking for something special and boutiquey and chocolates on the pillows? They have all the standard freeway hotels, you won't treasure your night at the Hampton Inn and Suites for all eternity, but it is a bed and a waffle machine in the morning for 100$. Indistinguishable from every other 100$ bed and waffle machine in the morning experience in America.

# ? May 10, 2017 23:03

Party Plane Jones: Jul 1, 2007; by Reene; Fun Shoe

hobbesmaster posted:

That's very light on details. I wonder what stage of flight that was.

quote:

United Airlines is under scrutiny again this week after a passenger posted her horror story on Facebook.

Nicole Harper, a nurse and mother of two from Kansas City, Missouri, said she was on a United flight returning home from Houston on April 10 � just one day after Dr. David Dao was infamously dragged off a different United flight.

Harper suffers from an overactive bladder and told flight attendants she had to use the restroom, she said. When they told her to return to her seat, she said she tried to explain the urgency of the situation.

"I said 'I'm going to need to use the restroom or I'm going to need a cup,'" Harper told NBC's Kansas City affiliate. "[They] didn't understand that I don't have any control over the situation."

That's when Harper said the flight crew did something surprising: They handed her a cup.

The St. Luke's Health System nurse told NBC's KSHB the cup was so small, she had to ask for a second one.

"A completely humiliating situation," said Harper. "There was people all around ... you know, strangers."

Harper said she alerted the flight crew of her condition, an overactive bladder she's lived with her entire life.

"I don't know if they just didn't understand that, you know, I really did not have any control over the situation," said Harper.

Harper filed a complaint with United as soon as the plane landed, she said in a Facebook post. She has since also filed a complaint with the Department of Transportation.

On Wednesday, United issued a statement denying that a flight attendant encouraged Harper to urinate into a cup.

"Customer safety is always our first priority. Initial reports from the Mesa Airlines flight attendants indicate that Ms. Harper attempted to visit the lavatory on descent and was instructed to remain seated with the seat belt fastened per FAA regulations," said the United Airlines statement.

"At no point during the flight did flight attendants suggest that Ms. Harper use cups instead of the lavatory," the statement continued. "We have reached out to Ms. Harper to better understand what occurred and we continue to review what happened."

# ? May 10, 2017 23:05

Saukkis: May 16, 2003; Unless I'm on the inside curve pointing straight at oncoming traffic the high beams stay on and I laugh at your puny protest flashes.
I am Most Important Man. Most Important Man in the World.

I've been on few flights with a friend and his father-in-law. Since Cessnas are limited in lavatories an elderly man must be prepared, so he has made his own bottle and tubing setup. Seems to work.

As a glider pilot peeing in bags should be a second nature, but I must admit I have never been able to do it. Maybe my penis is just too small to manage peeing inside a tiny cabin while reclining and strapped in 5-point safety belt.

# ? May 10, 2017 23:22

BIG HEADLINE: Jun 13, 2006; "Stand back, Ottawan ruffian, or face my lumens!"

Slo-Tek posted:

You looking for something special and boutiquey and chocolates on the pillows? They have all the standard freeway hotels, you won't treasure your night at the Hampton Inn and Suites for all eternity, but it is a bed and a waffle machine in the morning for 100$. Indistinguishable from every other 100$ bed and waffle machine in the morning experience in America.

Figured as much. I was looking at downtown Springfield simply because it'd give me an area to walk around in the evenings. I know it's ~30 minutes from the museum, but given the choice of staying in a smallish city and staying next to an industrial park, I think I'll take the former.

# ? May 10, 2017 23:22