Aeronautical Insanity: switching to secondary tolerances

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Automotive Insanity > Aeronautical Insanity: switching to secondary tolerances

Bishop: Aug 15, 2000

I'm sure you all have gotten this exact question a million times but... is it even possible to invert a mad dog like Denzel Washington does in "Flight"? I've found conflicting answers online.

# ¿ May 30, 2013 20:49

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# ¿ May 1, 2024 12:53

Bishop: Aug 15, 2000

Thanks for your responses. I'm just a dude that flies a lot so I wanted some better opinions.

MrChips posted:

The engines will starve themselves of both fuel and oil after a short period of time (in the order of a minute or so), at which point you would need to start trading altitude for airspeed - in other words, you're no longer maintaining inverted flight.

They lose oil pressure to their engines very shortly after inverting, so that seems accurate. I just watched the movie and thought that the crash scene, while well done and intense, was unrealistic because I've always been under the impression that a commercial airliner is not designed to ever fly inverted. I could be very wrong though which is why I'm here. Here's the scene:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sAxrWl5DGU

# ¿ May 30, 2013 22:41

Bishop: Aug 15, 2000

polpotpotpotpotpot posted:

Holy poo poo. What a crazy story...

Jesus christ. It's gonna be hard to top that one on black box transcripts.

# ¿ May 31, 2013 05:59

Bishop: Aug 15, 2000

hobbesmaster posted:

Kinda sad that they made such an unrealistic film based on that failure; there was some incredible piloting down on 261 but the plane was completely unrecoverable.

What was unrealistic about the scene? Honest question. From my point of view as a layman I kind of facepalmed when they inverted the aircraft, but that's apparently doable as long as you are OK with oil and fuel pressure dropping and destroying your engines very quickly. The movie got that part right too. Which parts do you find unrealistic?

# ¿ May 31, 2013 16:32

Bishop: Aug 15, 2000

Phanatic posted:

When you pull the extinguisher handle on an engine, engine's killed. They did that with both engines and then still kept moving throttles around like they'd do anything with both engines dead.

Yeah that makes sense. They seem to kill the left engine and then intentionally burn it up while rolling back. It almost seems like an editing error because they do make sure to show that the engines won't last long while inverted.

I'm a boater and I've got a big red button that floods the engine room with CO2 if there is a fire down there. It ruins everything but hey, you are no longer on fire. Do aircraft have a similar system?

# ¿ May 31, 2013 18:37

Bishop: Aug 15, 2000

hobbesmaster posted:

This is in context of a movie where the pilot is high on cocaine.

edit: since we're in fantasy land anyways, I do that in DCS A-10 because uh: 1. its a simulator. 2. you have an ejection seat. 3. its a loving a-10 the only thing thats going to kill you is the ground

I know it's all fantasy land, but from a non pilot's perspective they do seem to include a lot of little details. It would be odd for them to mess up something as simple as killing an engine then using it again. Oh well it was a good scene and thanks for all the answers!

Another quick question. Do airline pilots usually use "port or starboard" instead of "left or right?" It makes all the difference in the world on boats if you are not facing the same direction as the person you are talking to. Since airplane jagon seems so similar I was a little confused about that. Especially when they were putting out fires on engines while inverted.

PS: From this thread and others I'm under the impression that mad dogs own. This is correct, right?

Bishop fucked around with this message at 07:12 on Jun 1, 2013

# ¿ Jun 1, 2013 06:44

Bishop: Aug 15, 2000

SCOTLAND posted:

Don't think I have used port or starboard ever in real life other than in reading old rear end manuals. Left/Right, N/S/E/W or the points on the clock. I have no experience in Africa or the Middle East so maybe they do.

I know they are pretty antiquated terms, but they can make a big difference. It might be more important in marine navigation because you are often radioing someone that is below decks, or another ship, etc.

For instance in the scene in "flight" I was briefly confused about which engine the co-pilot was shutting down because he was using "left" and "right" and they were inverted, whereas port and starboard never change. If everyone knows "left" always means "to the left of the pilot" that makes things simpler. Also just to give some advice back for you guys answering my questions: don't try to invert a boat it doesn't work out very well.

Bishop fucked around with this message at 20:40 on Jun 1, 2013

# ¿ Jun 1, 2013 20:36

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# ¿ May 1, 2024 12:53

Bishop: Aug 15, 2000

What the... OK yeah that one may need some special terms. "MY rear end ENGINE HAS FAILED But THE TAINT ONE FEELS OK SO FAR"

Bishop fucked around with this message at 01:52 on Jun 2, 2013

# ¿ Jun 2, 2013 01:48

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Automotive Insanity > Aeronautical Insanity: switching to secondary tolerances