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Morose Man posted:Technological question. As has been said, the Iraqi T72s that kept having their turrets blown off in Desert Storm were inferior export models and a generation behind the M1 Abrams, which were one-shotting them from farther away than the Iraqis could see. I've read the after-action report on 73 Easting (and, sadly, lost the link). If you can find it, it'll answer your question -- there was a lot of friendly fire in that battle. I forget the Abrams-vs-Abrams stats (I think they are proof against their own silver bullets on the front and not so much on the sides, as you'd expect, but don't quote me), but the APC results were pretty funny -- drat near every shell hole in a Bradley (and there were quite a few Bradleys hit) was small and "slightly radioactive," which means depleted uranium penetrator, which means it came from an M1. The report does not say whether they were targeted or just drove between an M1 and a T72. Whatever the case, it turns out an APFSDS lawn dart doesn't do much to a lightly-armored APC, it just goes through and leaves a tiny hole and the crew barely notices. The only friendly-fire hard kill was one Bradley putting a TOW missile into another. quote:Will we ever again see a situation like the Russian Front in World War 2 where astonished Panzer commanders saw their shells bounce harmlessly off T-34s? quote:How important will armour be on AFVs in the future? APCs/IFVs are pretty much only proof against small arms, possibly with slat armor to stop RPGs; if you get in a shooting match with a tank, you run the gently caress away and let your tanks take care of it. Tangentially, back in the age of sail it was an unwritten rule that ships of the line wouldn't fire on frigates unless the little guy shot first. The frigates were scouts and messengers and it would be unsporting for the heavies to engage them. Edit: slightly less of a tangent: It amuses me that 73 Easting was basically a heavy cavalry charge, using essentially the same tactics as the knights of old. Sure, you've got depleted-uranium lawn darts and Browning .50s instead of lances and swords, but the movements are the same with tanks as with horses. It makes sense, I suppose -- Patton, who wrote the book on tanks (well, read that magnificent bastard's book and added his own comments) was originally a horseman, and designed the last serious fighting sword before he was put in a tank and out-blitzed the blitzkrieg. Chillbro Baggins fucked around with this message at 03:01 on Sep 11, 2011 |
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Sep 11, 2011 02:33
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Bad Angus! Bad!
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Mr Crustacean posted:How the gently caress does the bradley crew not notice a 2km/s, pyrophoric, long rod penetrator spalling the gently caress outta the insides of their vehicle? I can't find the report I was talking about, but here's somebody else's commentary on the same information; a few Bradleys did catch fire and melt to a puddle when hit, and several soldiers were killed and a great many wounded by shrapnel from the hit and flash burns from secondaries, but in general a Bradley being hit by a 120mm APFSDS seems pretty survivable. As long as you're not in the path of the round itself and it doesn't hit the stack of AT-4s, you'll probably be able to crawl out and survive. Some of them did keep on truckin', and in most of the ones that were disabled, the crews bailed out then went back to grab supplies and destroy the secret bits. As for hot hot Abrams-on-Abrams action, the 120mm "silver bullet" will indeed go right through both sides of the hull from certain angles; another was hit three times in and around the turret and the gunner killed with no penetrations. Only one Abrams took a 120mm to the front; it shrugged it off like a champ, but it had a mine-clearing plow and the hit trashed the plow wiring, causing an electrical fire at the plow controls that gave the driver flash burns and a Halon bath, so they had to bail (after the battle the tank was repaired and operated by a three-man crew, with the loader replacing the injured driver, for a week until somebody decided they really shouldn't be rolling around shorthanded in a tank coated in radioactive dust). Abrams trivia: There is a canister round for the Rheinmetall 120mm, for when a tank needs to ruin the day of an unarmored opponent up to a mile away. Around 1100 (sources vary) 9.5mm tungsten pellets, basically the 0000 buckshot load from hell. Also really effective as a breaching round at short range -- y'know how the infantry has shotguns/underslung Masterkeys for blowing the hinges off doors to get in? An M1A1 firing a canister round can make a door-sized hole in a reinforced concrete wall.  Alchenar posted:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_India_Company
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Sep 17, 2011 09:22
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