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BWV
Feb 24, 2005



I haven't read ball don't lie in forever but that was one of the OG basketball websites. I know it's just Dwyer leaving, and multiple people have ran that site, but it still feels like the end of an era. Basketball Twitter is its glorious self because of those mid 2000s blogs and the (now) ease of finding of nbastreams

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morestuff
Aug 2, 2008

You can't stop what's coming


Teemu Pokemon posted:

ESPN slowly killed spots journalism and Twitter pissed on its grave

In terms of the actual craft sports writing is probably in the best place it's ever been. It just sucks if you want to make a living.

euphronius
Feb 18, 2009




Sports Podcasts are amazing right now

Teemu Pokemon
Jun 19, 2004

To sign them is my real test

With full no movement clause


morestuff posted:

In terms of the actual craft sports writing is probably in the best place it's ever been. It just sucks if you want to make a living.

Well, any craft will get better over time, but unless there's more long form, and less worrying about TAEKS, it'll be a travesty regardless of how good, talented, pure, and well compensated any specific person within the industry is

But that also operates on the assumption that people want to read long form, and that's where Twitter comes in..

euphronius posted:

Sports Podcasts are amazing right now



Podcasts aren't really journalism, but totally agree.

Teemu Pokemon fucked around with this message at Jun 15, 2017 around 00:18

morestuff
Aug 2, 2008

You can't stop what's coming


Teemu Pokemon posted:

Well, any craft will get better over time, but unless there's more long form, and less worrying about TAEKS, it'll be a travesty regardless of how good, talented, pure, and well compensated any specific person within the industry is

But that also operates on the assumption that people want to read long form, and that's where Twitter comes in..


Podcasts aren't really journalism, but totally agree.

Not sure what era you had in mind but even a few decades ago your options were basically your local paper, SI, and a few other magazines. It's not like blowhard columnists were hard to find then, either.

There's a lot more of everything since the internet lowered the barrier to entry, good and bad, but it's pretty easy to find what you want and ignore what you don't. In theory there might be fewer outlets with the deep pockets that can fund really in-depth reporting, but even in the publishing golden age there wasn't much of that in sports sections.

Teemu Pokemon
Jun 19, 2004

To sign them is my real test

With full no movement clause


morestuff posted:

Not sure what era you had in mind but even a few decades ago your options were basically your local paper, SI, and a few other magazines. It's not like blowhard columnists were hard to find then, either.

Well now what I'm commenting on is that The Worldwide Leader made blowhards the standard in the early aughts when ATH and PTI really hit their stride and that shaped the industry. It's been only downhill from there.

I like to think there's a reason why Max Kellerman only covers boxing

quote:

There's a lot more of everything since the internet lowered the barrier to entry, good and bad, but it's pretty easy to find what you want and ignore what you don't. In theory there might be fewer outlets with the deep pockets that can fund really in-depth reporting, but even in the publishing golden age there wasn't much of that in sports sections.

While that all may be true, that lowered "barrier for entry" has done just as much bad as good imho

Teemu Pokemon fucked around with this message at Jun 15, 2017 around 01:29

euphronius
Feb 18, 2009




I followed sports in the 80s and it was local sports newspaper , tv , and si.
Sports talk radio was early 90s iirc

morestuff
Aug 2, 2008

You can't stop what's coming


Teemu Pokemon posted:

Well now what I'm commenting on is that The Worldwide Leader made blowhards the standard in the early aughts when ATH and PTI really hit their stride and that shaped the industry. It's been only downhill from there.

I like to think there's a reason why Max Kellerman only covers boxing


While that all may be true, that lowered "barrier for entry" has done just as much bad as good imho

I feel like both these are only true if you're ignoring all the good stuff out there and actively choosing to wallow in poo poo

Rick
Feb 23, 2004
And now the whole nation - pulpit and all - will take up the war-cry, and shout itself hoarse, and mob any honest man who ventures to open his mouth; and presently such mouths will cease to open.


He's one of my faves, and the reason why Yahoo is the place I went to first when I wanted to read about sports and couldn't get to forums for some reason.

Voodoofly
Jul 3, 2002

Some days even my lucky rocketship underpants don't help

Bye bye ball don't lie! Maybe he can join his old website pal on the starters or some other NBA channel show

chunkles
Aug 14, 2005



Are they getting rid of all the BDL people or just Dwyer?

I'm reminded of that episode a couple months back where he pointed out the sleazy nature of some team owner (I think it was the Amway guy?) and some Yahoo exec wanted him fired for it.

e: http://awfulannouncing.com/the-lock...rts-behest.html

Teemu Pokemon
Jun 19, 2004

To sign them is my real test

With full no movement clause


morestuff posted:

I feel like both these are only true if you're ignoring all the good stuff out there and actively choosing to wallow in poo poo

I just feel that no matter how exceptional or prevalent the good poo poo out there is, it's not as close as it seems to dictating how the industry operates. There's a reason why ESPN and other outlets are dropping legitimate journalists but are still employing Stephen A



ESPN has been the Fox News of sports since Fox News was getting its feet wet and that kind of ~~~*content*~~~ ain't going away quietly

Teemu Pokemon fucked around with this message at Jun 15, 2017 around 04:21

Harlock
Jan 15, 2006

Tap "A" to drink!!!



Succinct and instant news is what people want with easily digestible takes.


Longform journalism and analysis is dead.

Kibner
Oct 21, 2008

Cookin' for my family

Grimey Drawer

Harlock posted:

Succinct and instant news is what people want with easily digestible takes.


Longform journalism and analysis is dead.

Unless it tells a fantastic and entertaining story. Non-fiction short story, basically.

morestuff
Aug 2, 2008

You can't stop what's coming


Harlock posted:

Succinct and instant news is what people want with easily digestible takes.


Longform journalism and analysis is dead.

Here's more than a dozen 1000+-word articles covering a variety of sports, tones, and outlets published in the past week or so. I found those by clicking around for five minutes.

DJExile
Jun 27, 2007

If loving you is binturong, I don't want to binturight.

MMA reporters have formed a professional association

BWV
Feb 24, 2005



Harlock posted:

Succinct and instant news is what people want with easily digestible takes.


Longform journalism and analysis is dead.

I think, like so much of journalism content, long form is actually thriving. It's just people aren't really getting paid for it and the pieces don't stay in the zeitgeist for very long. If anything, the problem is that there is so much good poo poo out there being published on a daily basis that it's difficult to capture anyone's attention for that long. This isn't so much a problem with long form journalism but just the general speed at which we seem to consume and the way people are now getting paid to do work. Maybe it will eventually lead to no one getting paid for anything and bots just writing hot takes but we are at least for now still living in an era with awesome writers writing awesome articles.

So maybe long form journalism is thriving but the long form journalist is on his/her death bed

BWV fucked around with this message at Jun 15, 2017 around 19:39

ChickenMedium
Sep 2, 2001
Forum Veteran And Professor Emeritus of Condiment Studies

euphronius posted:

I followed sports in the 80s and it was local sports newspaper , tv , and si.
Sports talk radio was early 90s iirc

It's all been downhill since The George Michael Sports Machine went off the air imo

exploded mummy
Sep 10, 2008

   'Cause she's so high
      High above me,
       she's so lovely
           
     - Everclear


Doctor Rope


Give Meltzer a position.

Niwrad
Jul 1, 2008



Harlock posted:

Longform journalism and analysis is dead.

Analysis is everywhere. Now people can get it from someone on SBNation instead of ESPN. And SBNation doesn't need to pay much if anything at all to their writers (which is ironic since it's owned by Vox).

I think longform journalism has its place and is still popular. But you are going to struggle if that's all your site has to offer.

Vertical Lime
Dec 11, 2004

Hail To The King

another yahoo-verizon casualty

https://twitter.com/Sean_Leahy/stat...767361722363905

Mind_Taker
May 7, 2007

He's the best mindfuck yet


It should have been rlam

Scaramouche
Mar 26, 2001

SPACE FACE! SPACE FACE!

I'm surprised all NHL/Puck Daddy isn't on the chopping block.

Zeeman
May 8, 2007

Say WHAT?! You KNOW that post is wack, homie!


Does that make Wysh and Lambert the only remaining Puck Daddy people (for now)?

Teemu Pokemon
Jun 19, 2004

To sign them is my real test

With full no movement clause


Kibner posted:

Unless it tells a fantastic and entertaining story. Non-fiction short story, basically.

And there's plenty of brilliant writers out there brilliant enough to write them, but not everyone is lucky enough to be Drew Magary, who can save the fiction for novels, the longer form for a national print publication, and the taeks for a site that is that right beautiful mixture of insightful, talented, and an utter joke at the same wonderful moment in time

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DJExile
Jun 27, 2007

If loving you is binturong, I don't want to binturight.

I see Albert Breer is still a racist jackass


MMQB posted:

And yet, this question from those who were there lingers: Does he still want to play?

So in the immediate wake of the most controversial thing he’s done since he started kneeling for the anthem, I’m ready to align with others who’ve said it: It’s time for Kaepernick to talk for himself. Doesn’t matter how he does it. It can be through the legion of reporters friendly to his efforts. It can be through a video released on social media. It can be through a Facebook page or a press conference.

Whatever. It’s just time for Kaepernick to talk.

The problem is in the vacuum that his silence has created. It’s been filled with speculation and tea-leaf reading. Meanwhile, teams unsure if Kaepernick was truly interested in continuing his NFL career (rather than focusing solely on his causes) are still wondering. And that’s so long as they haven’t been convinced by his most recent actions that he’s out.

…As one Niners employee explained it, Kaepernick wouldn’t stay late at the facility during the season like many quarterbacks routinely do, saying he’d take work home. And there were examples where coaches saw what looked like shoddy prep surfacing in inexplicable mental errors in games. Another staffer, asked if he thinks Kaepernick wants to keep playing, answered, “I do think he wants to play—to stay relevant.”

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