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Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

I'm interested in Sandy Bridge, but I'm more interested in Zacate as it's benching faster than a i5m chip. It's giving me hope that Llano will be nice hardware.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/3920/...ce-than-core-i5

http://www.anandtech.com/show/3933/...formance-update

I still think that at least for next year, most of us are still going to want discrete cards, so what I'm shopping for is for HTPCs, which sandy bridge may be a little bit overkill for. if Zacate can handle 1080i without the need for a discrete card I will be overjoyed. I have to ignore all the atoms or most onboard solutions nowadays because no one cares about 1080i.

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Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Doc Block posted:

Unfortunately there are a lot of businesses with no plans whatsoever to upgrade beyond XP in the immediate future.

The same thing happened when NT4 was released. They'll move when MS drops support completely and developers stop writing drivers. I got a feeling developers are going to start dropping driver support next year, and despite what Gizmodo and a other blogs think XP support ends 2014, not 2020. (that's when Windows 7 support ends. MS just said they will allow you to downgrade to XP if you wish but you are unsupported) By 2014 we should be on Windows 8 anyways.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Spime Wrangler posted:

It is if they can't get a strong market to form around their architecture on which they went all-in.


What choice did they have? AMD couldn't afford them, Intel would be a legal nightmare, and VIA's x86 license was questionable up until late. Better to go all in now while you still have major influence than wait until the dust settles.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

and only at the maximum amount set by the AGP aperture size. It was basically meant as a last resort move if the video card's memory was full.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Yep. I have a board right now with USB3 and have never used it for that purpose because ESATA is just as fast and cheaper than USB3 external hard drive cases. People are treating it like USB when it was first released, reasonable right when it came out, and then jacked up in price when it starts to gain ground. The prices will probably get back to normal by next spring

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Very doubtful. Probably the people who started that are the same ones that are saying that Microsoft will allow it next year, when it's been an official option for booting since Vista SP1. It's doubtful because a major reason why there's still a 32-bit version of windows is because up until a year or so ago a decent amount of intel chips were 32-bit only. there's no way Microsoft would ignore millions of machines that could run the next os fine but can't because of some technicality.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Alereon posted:

Wait, prices are still dropping pretty steadily and will be for the near future.

Maybe I'm missing it, but where? I've seen limited 2gb pairs for $50 on sale in the past week or so, but I could have swore that this was the normal price this summer. Most I see is still in the $70-80 range for 4gb. Even the deal I got from newegg went up to $60 the next week.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

I was hoping that laptops were just around the corner as I have a sister who wants to upgrade, not to something with Sandy Bridge but to at least something with better graphics than she has now (x3100 graphics) Oh well.

Hopefully there's a way that AMD can gain some momentum on this

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Zhentar posted:

It's in the IGP output, not the decoding. It doesn't matter whether or not you're using software decoding, it's just plain incapable of sending the right signal to the display. But apparently they have a software patch that will let you do 23.97hz, which comes out to dropping a single frame about every 2 1/2 minutes, so I'd still call it a pretty loving complaint. Plus the low-end HTPC targeted nvidia and ATI cards aren't exactly costly if it really bothers you that much.

Just like the people who can't stand CRT monitors that display at 60hz, the 23.95hz bug is a legit issue for people who can see it. And if my search is correct, the 'fix' isn't really a patch it's just a suggestion to disable UAC, and it only applies to Sandy Bridge, not Clarkedales. If you can't see judder be happy you can't. Maybe it's because I work with video every day and know what to look for but it basically made it a non option to me.

The big deal about this was that this was like the fourth time that a integrated platform was supposed to be the HTPC killer component and something about it hosed it up. 780g couldn't do 7.1 sound, 8300 can't handle 1080i, and Intel has floated on not being able to accelerate what was promised, to not being able to play without judder.

LastCaress posted:

gently caress, bought my asus p8p67 deluxe last friday :\ Read somewhere that boards made before jan 9th were not affected? There's still hope.

January 9th is the original ship date for Sandy Bridge. They pointed it out to make sure people knew they were talking about that and not Clarkedale. If you got it early you still are affected.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Shimrra Jamaane posted:

So what are the symptoms of this problem, meaning when can you tell that things are starting to actually gently caress up, rather then there just being the possibility of a problem? Can you know for certain whether you have or have not experienced the issue yet?

Think of it as like a slight glitch in frames every couple of minutes or so (at least with their fix) in straight 24p it happens every 20-40 seconds however. Anyhow, if you really want to understand it look up judder on google, but keep in mind once you know how to look for it and you find it, you'll probably notice it from here on out.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

fishmech posted:

But does anyone actually have monitors that play back at 23.97 or whatever? I mean no matter what you do you're going to be doing some flavor of pulldown on a 60 hz monitor or 59.94 hz sdtv to display 23.97 fps or 24 fps content

Yes. My 3 year old Samsung A650 has a 24P mode, even though it's a undocumented feature that will only show up if the device tries it.

The thing is, 23.97 or 59.94 is the correct standard. when NTSC was started for the first couple of years it was set to 60hz, but then lowered to 59.94 due to issues of getting hardware that could lock on to that exact speed. it was a tolerance concession. Anyhow, people have just shortened it to 24fps or 60fps for clarity, so any monitor, NTSC, ATSC or computer monitor should take either with ease.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Paino posted:

It's still very annoying, not to mention the more I spend the more the retailer is supposed to help me find an alternative. Say, maybe a used i5 750/760 is sitting in his shop and I can use it until the new mobos come out. Doesn't seem that crazy to me.


I see your point but with these volumes there are a number of ways to sell them anyway and go "ooops!". Some retailers here do it, some don't. I doubt they're gonna go out of business because they sold a handful more mobos to the most annoying customers (and you can be sure I'm among them). Worst case scenario, the manufacturer refuses the return, you give me the new mobo anyway and use the old one wherever: if I were a retailer I'd rather lose spare change than having some customers not buy a whole setup and tell you to go gently caress yourself.

Sorry about the tantrum, I guess I'm a bit frustrated by the situation and my old pc is slowly dying on me.

I used to work at a computer shop where something similar happened to a specific mainboard that a guy ordered. I wanted to cancel the order entirely, but the boss didn't want to give up the sale, so he had me put in a cheaper board and advised the guy to come back two months later when the replacements will be in...

The guy came back alright complaining about how the performance wasn't what he expected and nitpicking every little thing he could think of basically trying to get a refund or at least a discount along with the original board he wanted. Believe me, stores may want to do the right thing but there's too many people who try to take advantage of kindness.

All I can tell you is this is why next time you should buy everything at the same time. Staggered, even if it's just a week or two risks situations like this. What would you have done if it truly was sold out everywhere?

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

You just have to look at the numbers. They were on sale for what like four weeks and they made 8 million of them? that's well over a million units and I'm sure they were looking at it under common users, not early adopters who will likely run it full blast for hours on end.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

WhyteRyce posted:

No one here cares about the 3D transistors in the upcoming Ivy Bridge?
http://www.engadget.com/2011/05/04/...ll-future-cpus/

Old news but adding to what I've learned over the past couple of days about it.

Basically all the manufactures had a choice on which road to take, finFETs (the industry name for Intel's 3D transistor) or going fully depleted Silicon on Insulator which is what almost everyone else has planned. Both are major improvements to processors and currently give similar results in power and performance at this die size. The issue is that Fully depleted SOI is a whole lot more expensive to produce than building a finFET based processor currently. SOI has always been more expensive thus why Intel has never used SOI in their processors.

Around a year ago Intel did give a indication that they would go to SOI around 22nm, but obviously they chose to do finFET instead. I'd figure they'll finally do it on a die shrink or two after 22nm. It's widely expected that everyone else will eventually go with finFETs at some point as well. Don't get it wrong, Intel still should be commended for mas producing finFETs, but I don't personally see it as a bold step, just Intel trying to hold off on increasing costs for as long as possible.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Alereon posted:

The most interesting bit of news is that Intel intends to create a new line of processors in the 10-20W TDP range. These are intended to be significantly more powerful than the <10W Atom CPUs, but presumably more efficient than the severely-underclocked >17W CULV Core CPUs. We don't know anything about the architecture yet, but it will likely either be an enhanced Atom (of the Silvermont generation) or a cut-down derivative of Haswell (Intel's new architecture on 22nm, successor to Ivy Bridge).

Just something good enough to compete with AMD and the C-50s and E-350s as far as processing speed goes. I don't think they are anywhere close to competing video wise, so all they can do is improve CPU performance to make up the difference.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Wasn't Transmeta meant to operate in a similar way? And remember how dog slow it was most of the time?

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Quine Connoisseur posted:

Has there been any word on the chipset USB controller bug?

More than likely, the first batches will have the bug as a chipset, not processor revision is needed to fix. Since it's only affecting S3 sleep it's not a showstopper so it probably will be dealt with only if the end user complains.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Install Gentoo posted:

So? They were more popular then PDAs had been, and we'd already seen "cell phones in general" reach billions sold by that time. As well already knowing that regular computers had taken off.

The only question back then was "when will everyone have a smartphone" not "will smartphones ever be popular". Heck at that point a lot of features once considered exclusive to smartphones - like real data connections, browsers beyond WAP, music playback, screens that could actually show something besides text - had started appearing on regular phones.


They had been saying that for years by that point, and like you said features were starting to overlap. But no one saw items like music streaming or a full featured browser as a potential game change. The need for data was still pretty much seen as something that only business people would need and if a consumer needed it, it was for WAP or IM. People also forget the iPhone was $600 back then. That's why no one took it seriously. Hell even today that price for a unlocked phone makes people cringe.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

necrobobsledder posted:

I still think the tablet game is basically over though without a way for developers to port everything over to x86 quickly. Apple may ironically make x86 mobile rather relevant if they release a solid iOS for x86 tool suite something similar to Rosetta in pursuit of their "iOS ALL THE THINGS" strategy that's highly controversial. The big winning move that could be made with x86 tablets requiring minimal cooperation from the Android / Apple side is if a hypervisor could be started that lets users run iOS, Android, Linux, Windows, etc. on their 10" tablets. That's been awful quiet for a while when I last saw Xen making some moves to do it in 2009 for laptops. ARM virtualization is hardly something at the top of vendors' agendas it seems in favor of baking in user profiles instead while x86 virtualization is basically oldhat now.

I actually see things going back to the mainframe style of computing, that is all the computational power is on a remote server and that info is beamed back to the tablet via something like RemoteFX. That would be a lot easier than trying to fit a proper hypervisor with all the fixings into a device with limited computational/power resources. You still have the problem of bandwidth doing it everywhere, but I can easily see that working in a LAN environment in the short term. Let the device that's best suited for the task do the work, just make sure everything is on the same page to take advantage of it.

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Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Shaocaholica posted:

Anyone care to guess what this ~10 year old top tier mobile CPU can handle?

http://ark.intel.com/products/27596...GHz-400-MHz-FSB

Supposedly it was $600+ when it came out in 2004.

1080p youtube? 1080p H.264 playback?

Paired with an Intel 855GM GPU/chipset. I'd test myself but I won't have the notebook for a few weeks. It was my grad school notebook

1080p is highly doubtful. Maybe 720p. Back in the day, most people had to use codecs like CoreAVC to play on similar systems and even then it wasn't 100% It would be better if the chipset could accelerate H.264 but the 855 did none of that.

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