Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of \$9.95! We charge money because it costs us \$3,400 per month for bandwidth bills alone, and since we don't believe in shoving popup ads to our registered users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
«1390 »

#### cant cook creole bream posted:

The Grand Hotel works fine in uncountable infinities.
This thing is not quite the same as the grand hotel, since you actually want to map two different points onto the same one, while still making the mapping reversible.

If you have countable infinitives, Loup from universe n (Loup_n) stole the two Annies from universes 2n and 2n+1. This works if n is a natural number. L_1 steals A_2 and A_3, L_2 steals A_4 and A_5... Basically, the tail of Annieless universes grows twice as fast as the ones with a fresh set of two.
For real numbers in uncountable universes, this exact argument breaks apart.
If you set n=1 , L_1 would like to steal A_2 and A_3. But L_(0.5) already took A_2.

I am not sure if you can construct a way to avoid that. It doesn't feel possible.

That's what's irritating Kat. She can't fathom the idea that the number of universes is just countable. This would imply that every quantum collapse has to have a countable set of outcomes. I.e. throwing a coin is alright and splits the universe into two parallel universes. But if you construct a random number generator which can give out every possible real number between 0 and 1, the multiverse just breaks apart. And Kat really needed to built that for her new AI-algorithms.

Looks like Loup knows more about countable infinities than you do!

#### A big flaming stink posted:

seems like the prime powers method works well here:

Nah, this also only works for countable numbers. This argument breaks apart for real numbers since there are numbers x and y, such that 3^x = 5^y. In that case you would need to put them into the same room. I.e. steal the same Annie.
Specifically, that happens on the line y = x*log(3)/log(5).

#### Bongo Bill posted:

Looks like Loup knows more about countable infinities than you do!

Can't argue with that. Maybe Loup just knows how to count "uncountable" infinities.

#### cant cook creole bream posted:

Nah, this also only works for countable numbers. This argument breaks apart for real numbers since there are numbers x and y, such that 3^x = 5^y. In that case you would need to put them into the same room. I.e. steal the same Annie.
Specifically, that happens on the line y = x*log(3)/log(5).

Can't argue with that. Maybe Loup just knows how to count "uncountable" infinities.

oh, right, and you can't just do "pretend each real number is an integer and assign them that way" since the Real set also includes non-terminating non-repeating numbers as well

 Cavelcade Dec 9, 2015 I'm actually a boy! Couldn't you just steal them from the subset of the Reals that corresponds to the integers? You don't need to steal from every universe. # ? May 17, 2020 16:08

#### rannum posted:

GC Tier list (work in progress):
Annie (w/ Lasers)

Annie (no lasers)
Paz

Kat

I'm glad that their conversation has finally progressed to the eventual endpoint of all comic discussions: Can X beat up Y?

Couldn't you just steal them from the subset of the Reals that corresponds to the integers? You don't need to steal from every universe.

You do. Otherwise universes corresponding to nonrepeating nonterminating numbers will have 3 Annies.

I bet the Loups in those universes would be very ... irrational

#### Robo-Slap posted:

You do. Otherwise universes corresponding to nonrepeating nonterminating numbers will have 3 Annies.

I bet the Loups in those universes would be very ... irrational

I guess the point I'm making is that if there are infinite universes, why would all of them have a Loup? So you don't need to steal from every universe.

Or an Annie for that matter.

And if that's the case, to don't need to steal from the non-Loup ones. You just need an infinite number of Annie's. If only the integer universes steal from each other, it's not a problem?

In concision, Kat is right.

I guess the point I'm making is that if there are infinite universes, why would all of them have a Loup? So you don't need to steal from every universe.

Or an Annie for that matter.

And if that's the case, to don't need to steal from the non-Loup ones. You just need an infinite number of Annie's. If only the integer universes steal from each other, it's not a problem?

In concision, Kat is right.

Not quite.... there's a subset of countably infinite universes that Coyote never gave his strength to Ysengrin in... but there's also a subset of countably infinite universes where Loup formed. Within that, you have a countably infinite subset where Loup stole an Annie.

We are in that last subset.

I guess the point I'm making is that if there are infinite universes, why would all of them have a Loup? So you don't need to steal from every universe.

Or an Annie for that matter.

And if that's the case, to don't need to steal from the non-Loup ones. You just need an infinite number of Annie's. If only the integer universes steal from each other, it's not a problem?

In concision, Kat is right.

We have no evidence that the infinite universes are even slightly different from one another.

 YaketySass Jan 15, 2019 Blind Idiot Dog For every universe without a Loup, there's another one with two of them. # ? May 17, 2020 23:39
 Bruceski Aug 21, 2007 The tools of a hero mean nothing without a solid core. If Loup did not exist we would have had to create him. # ? May 18, 2020 00:19
 A Sometimes Food Dec 8, 2010 Relinquish your foolish delusions of control. Kat this is starting to sound an awful like the start of a speech that ends with you declaring some jrpg villain goal. # ? May 18, 2020 07:04

#### A Sometimes Food posted:

Kat this is starting to sound an awful like the start of a speech that ends with you declaring some jrpg villain goal.
or it's Higurashi and she's going to stab one of them and be like "there! now there's no contradiction!! only one annie again!!"

#### A Sometimes Food posted:

Kat this is starting to sound an awful like the start of a speech that ends with you declaring some jrpg villain goal.

The only question is whether the boot drops Wednesday or Friday now.

#### A Sometimes Food posted:

Kat this is starting to sound an awful like the start of a speech that ends with you declaring some jrpg villain goal.

I'll always remember our friendship

 dragon enthusiast Jan 1, 2010 "right now the only thing missing to finish my experiments... is a live specimen" *pulls out arrow from pants* # ? May 18, 2020 18:45

#### The 7th Guest posted:

or it's Higurashi and she's going to stab one of them and be like "there! now there's no contradiction!! only one annie again!!"

"I got a great idea from The Fly!"

 Scaramouche Mar 26, 2001 SPACE FACE! SPACE FACE! Lotta jarring perspective changes in this comic about changing perspectives, just sayin. # ? May 18, 2020 23:30

#### Scaramouche posted:

Lotta jarring perspective changes in this comic about changing perspectives, just sayin.

It reminds me of when Annie learned that her mom died because she was born. Really feels like Kat is losing it.

 Potato Salad Oct 23, 2014 Nobody Cares Tortured By Flan Kat seems to have gone and done that very human thing where a huge deal is made out of nothing. # ? May 19, 2020 14:57

#### Warmachine posted:

The only question is whether the boot drops Wednesday or Friday now.

More importantly, which JRPG Villain theme is going to start playing in the background

#### rannum posted:

More importantly, which JRPG Villain theme is going to start playing in the background

SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE

LIQUIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIID

 A Sometimes Food Dec 8, 2010 Relinquish your foolish delusions of control. Damnit Kat you better not hurt them. # ? May 20, 2020 08:18
 A big flaming stink Apr 26, 2010 yep kat is deffo about to kill one or both of them # ? May 20, 2020 09:02
 cant cook creole bream Aug 15, 2011 I think Fahrenheit is better for weather I really do like that the Annies have a different style with their make up and their choice of clothing. It would be really annoying if you couldn't keep them apart. # ? May 20, 2020 10:34
The most rash thing I can see Kat doing is banishing them both from this timeline, but I doubt she has the tech, so who knows what's about to happen.

#### cant cook creole bream posted:

I really do like that the Annies have a different style with their make up and their choice of clothing. It would be really annoying if you couldn't keep them apart.

It reads like they watch each other and feel a need to differentiate, which honestly makes a lot of sense.

 CJacobs Apr 17, 2011 Keep on keeping on. I feel like I'm getting a different read on this conversation than the rest of the thread. To me it just seems like Kat is struggling with this whole situation and is tired of suppressing it, and Annie and Annie operating in total synthesis to tell her how much they care about her is the opposite of what she wanted to hear. Every time they both share the same thought with her like this it reinforces that it is real, it is possible, and it's totally inexplicable right now and possibly will be forever. CJacobs fucked around with this message at 12:30 on May 20, 2020 # ? May 20, 2020 12:28

#### CJacobs posted:

I feel like I'm getting a different read on this conversation than the rest of the thread. To me it just seems like Kat is struggling with this whole situation and is tired of suppressing it, and Annie and Annie operating in total synthesis to tell her how much they care about her is the opposite of what she wanted to hear. Every time they both share the same thought with her like this it reinforces that it is real, it is possible, and it's totally inexplicable right now and possibly will be forever.

Yeah this is my read too. Up until know I don't think Kat ever really believed all of the stuff Coyote did, assuming Annie even told her the details. Everything that Coyote did that made it to the Court - like his tooth, or knocking over a building - is normal, laws-of-physics stuff; the fact that he is an actual literal god isn't something she ever had to confront. Her first interactions with Shadow involved studying him to see how he worked. She's met ghosts and psychopomps but all that meant is that souls exist, and probably have material properties. She's surrounded by weirdness, but nothing so weird that you can't reasonably believe there's laws underpinning it.
Until suddenly she has two best friends. Now she has to reconcile her physicalist worldview with the fact that a god who can just ignore inconvenient physical laws lives down the road. All of the stories she's heard about Coyote's bizarre incorporeality are no longer just legends and colourful language, they're actual things that happened that have no possible physical explanation.

It's not about the problem of having multiple Annies, it's the problem of Loup - and Coyote and any of the others - existing.

 Synthbuttrange May 6, 2007 I feel the pressure, under more scrutiny And what I do, act more stupidly Kat's conveniently blotted out the fact that Annie's fingerprints are on the moon from her memory # ? May 20, 2020 14:15
 dragon enthusiast Jan 1, 2010 what happened to annies noses # ? May 20, 2020 15:01

#### Synthbuttrange posted:

Kat's conveniently blotted out the fact that Annie's fingerprints are on the moon from her memory

That's just some face-on-mars nonsense.

Or someone with a stick and plenty of time, like crop circles but writ large. And on the surface of the moon.

#### Synthbuttrange posted:

Kat's conveniently blotted out the fact that Annie's fingerprints are on the moon from her memory

That was solar winds, obviously!

I just noticed Matt gave Chang'e his jacket in that chapter. Cute.

 rannum Nov 3, 2012 I wonder what Robot, who is definitely listening in since he's right near by, is going to take from this whole situation # ? May 20, 2020 17:38

#### CJacobs posted:

I feel like I'm getting a different read on this conversation than the rest of the thread. To me it just seems like Kat is struggling with this whole situation and is tired of suppressing it, and Annie and Annie operating in total synthesis to tell her how much they care about her is the opposite of what she wanted to hear. Every time they both share the same thought with her like this it reinforces that it is real, it is possible, and it's totally inexplicable right now and possibly will be forever.

Also my read on it. I imagine their response to what Kat said is extremely overwhelming in these circumstances. The problem is there are two Annies, and now both these Annies are literally surrounding Kat telling her how great she is while that is far from Kat's issue. Annie: continuing to not "get it" socially.

 Classon Ave. Robot Oct 7, 2019 I thought she was crying about the fact that one of the Annies was taken from another timeline and will have to either be banished from this world or leave the other timeline with a very sad Kat who's friend got killed at age 17 as far as she knows. # ? May 20, 2020 18:18

#### catapede posted:

Also my read on it. I imagine their response to what Kat said is extremely overwhelming in these circumstances. The problem is there are two Annies, and now both these Annies are literally surrounding Kat telling her how great she is while that is far from Kat's issue. Annie: continuing to not "get it" socially.

It's also really got to sting when, while you're doubting your entire belief system, your most trusted friend insists on how important and valuable your wisdom and insight are.

#### Classon Ave. Robot posted:

I thought she was crying about the fact that one of the Annies was taken from another timeline and will have to either be banished from this world or leave the other timeline with a very sad Kat who's friend got killed at age 17 as far as she knows.

The information that we currently have is that neither Annie is from this timeline. What happened to this timeline's Annie is unknown.

maltesh fucked around with this message at 11:59 on May 21, 2020

 FronzelNeekburm Jun 1, 2001 STOP, MORTTIME Outrageous Lumpwad Antimony Prime will return to light their darkest hour. # ? May 21, 2020 16:38
 Kennel May 1, 2008 BAWWW-UNH! # ? May 22, 2020 00:21