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Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.
Just played Ar Nosurge because my gamefly list has reached "games I don't actually want to play why did I add this", and it was surprisingly not bad. I mean, the character designs are terrible, and there's something inherently creepy about taking a bath with an anime girl and telling her I love her, but then they called me out with "What the hell do you know about me?! You're just choosing options off a menu and resetting when you get it wrong!" And the game's battle system seemed to know it would get boring so you just clear the entire area's battles in one swoop. Also the game's kinda unremarkable plot was made more memorable by the use of songs being associated with major events or boss battles, although in retrospect I wonder if I just played through a long music video?

Anyway, I guess the point is that I just enjoyed watching Cass and Delta flirt with each other badly, and helping shopkeepers make jellybeans that give you cancer (because they needed to match the color scheme).

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Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

Mill Village posted:

What difficulty are you playing on? I haven't played the game, but I heard the only mode that's challenging is Veteran.

I played on Normal, and the battles were entirely trivial. Basically the enemies never got an action and I healed to full every turn (not that I was hurt). I considered raising it, but the battle system didn't seem good enough for me to want to spend more effort on them so I didn't.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

The White Dragon posted:

My favorite is the battle mood ring from older Etrian Odyssey games, which would go from blue to red in one step and then you get ambushed and murdered.

To be fair, it's not much of an ambush if you see it coming.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

Firstborn posted:

There's a Persona for PSP, huh? Is it any good? Compared to whatever the original is?

Honestly, the only Persona I played was the very first one, but I would like to try another.

You mean Persona 3 Portable? It's a good remake of Persona 3, to the point where I wouldn't play any other version of Persona 3 if I had the choice. I can't say whether you'd like Persona 3 though, it's half dating sim and half dungeon crawler.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.
I love the clicking because there's nothing I hate more in an RPG than exploring towns.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

Last Celebration posted:

They made a ton of other games in between the Disgaeas that not nearly as many of their fans seemed to like, so this isn't really fair.

If anything, they're desperately trying to make other games, but making the same one over and over again is the only thing that feeds their children.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.
I hate Xenoblade though!

Well, I guess I was just another person who burnt out on it. Too many sidequests made me stop caring about what was going, and then I just stopped playing.


Zeuhl posted:

There's nothing in Xenoblade like Final Fantasy where you go "I'll just spend 5 minutes in town doing a bit of prep and then the next boss is weak to thunder so I will win with no effort, but I'll buy 99 Phoenix Downs too just in case"

In Xenoblade, you don't have the option to prep for a boss in such an obvious and easy manner.

I liked having no crutches to lean on in a JRPG, its exciting!

If your standard is "harder than a Final Fantasy game" then I think you have many options available nowadays.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.
I liked FM4 (relative to 3) because it had faster animations for machine guns and a skill system that made sense. By which I means pilots leveled up and learned skills, as opposed to proccing RapidFire1 6 times in a row because... um... parts, I think? I mean, it's funny to watch a guy shoot someone in slow motion until every part breaks one by one, but it's also annoying.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

prometheusbound2 posted:

The biggest problems with Bioware's games are the Darkspawn and the Reapers. Dragon Age stepped away from the Darkspawn. Dragon Age 2 was...well Dragon Age 2. But Dragon Age Inquistion still had a villain who's main purpose seemed to be being a villain. It doesn't really have to be this way. Loghain was an interesting character and good villain, and a game about Fereldan's relationship with Orlais could have been potentially really interesting.

The problem is that Bioware treats politics as merely an obstacle that you need to get around to fight the monsters. They literally only exist to get in your way when your hero is asking for support. I don't think they have it in them to treat them with any more respect than that, because it would interfere with the fantasy they're selling: that you're a lone hero who's always right and the goal of the game is to bend the setting to your will.

Which honestly I think is a much more fundamental problem with their writing. They like to talk about all the (meaningless) choices they force you to make, but quite frankly there's almost no non-contrived reason for your character to ever be in a position to make those choices. It's almost like you're playing a god-game from a ground level perspective, and that makes it hard to tell a story.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.
Wild Arms 2 is literally an essay about what it means to be a hero, in that it reads more like a high school student's paper than a game or story. Also the translation is terrible. But I still liked it for being weird.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.
Having been inspired by this thread, I tried out the fan translation of Front Mission 5, and I guess I learned why Square decided not to translate it. It is a bad game.

I think the source of most of its problems is its plot. Which... doesn't really exist most of the time. It basically follows the career of this one soldier who isn't particularly compelling and his quest to maybe kind of get revenge on this guy, if he ever happens to coincidentally cross paths with him again within the next couple of decades. There are constant time jumps of several years at a time, and he keeps changing squads which apparently requires an entire pointless mission chain devoted to showing you how they do things (spoiler: it's usually exactly the same as every other mission chain in the entire game because the game rarely gives you interesting maps). These time jumps might have been interesting if he aged at all or anything interesting happened in the meantime, but no, it's pretty much "and then he did that same mission chain over and over again for 10 years, but that's not important so we'll skip it". Accompanying these transitions are all the important characters kind of going away so your essentially have no party at all other than Mr. Soldier Guy and interchangeable generics with no speaking lines in combat. In fact, you're encouraged to switch them out because unless you're grinding way more than is healthy in this relatively easy game, they're always going to be a bit lower level than the next set of recruitable generics. So you don't even have the fun of building up your team: just assemble a brand new one from Alice, Bob, and Carl every time you go back to base.

Basically, every single plot and gameplay feature seems entirely designed to make absolutely sure the player has no investment whatsoever in what's going on, and the battle system is so repetitive after they (slowly) introduce all the mechanics that there's no incentive to do the next mission. This game sucks.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

Tae posted:

Maybe you just dont like front mission or dont talk to anyone at the base. Its a pretty light hearted comedy most of ths times.

Judging by your opinion of 3, 4

The people in the base do have some weird comedy skits sometimes (when they're not talking about politics) but I wouldn't consider that enough to save the game. Unless you're saying that their generic commentary on what's going on makes you invested in a character you're going to throw away next mission for not leveling up their Jamming enough? Although arguably the fan translation was just really bad for those sequences (and I can tell it's bad in other places, so that's fairly reasonable).

I liked both 3 and 4 because they had plots and characters, which gave you an incentive to blow up more robots. Unfortunately 5 has neither. This is what I'd consider the RPG ideal: a battle system interesting enough to keep you engaged while seeking the next plot point. Neither have to be great, but just enough to keep you going. The plot in FM 5 fails so hard that it drags the okay battle system down with it. I simply don't care about anything that's happening.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

Tae posted:

Theyre recurring, you even get back to the initial base after being a seal and tell the new base commander to gently caress himsrlf because hes a green poo poo.

You're also like 10 years older by that point, look exactly the same, and have the exact same relationship with everyone you know. Nothing ever happens.

Tae posted:

Like, you just seem to like the story of previous games and never liked fhe core gameplay, that doesnt make it a bad game. It means fm as a franchise isnt your thing.

I like blowing up robots, I just don't like blowing up the same robots in the same way for 30 hours. Gameplay in this one boils down to "surround and link, repeat" and not even bosses provide the slightest amount of challenge because you can heal infinitely with no cost. I'll admit that it's not too different from the previous games, but the previous games supplemented it with other things I cared about, like character progression. As I mentioned, there are no characters in FM5. You don't even get the joy of leveling up a generic like in FFT or Disgaea, since all members of the same class are exactly the same, and fresh recruits are always better than the ones you raised. Which is possibly the silliest design decision ever.

Clarste fucked around with this message at 15:49 on Feb 18, 2015

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

Tae posted:

Its not really the same outside of the age thing, but i pick out the details more i guess because ive been in the military. Its close to how people react to a scrub promoted when theyre not doing comedy.

So you're saying it's a good "being promoted in the military" simulator. That's possible, but that still doesn't mean it has a plot or character development. The generics now salute you sometimes or freak out that you've been promoted above them, yay?

...to be honest I hadn't thought of it as a Persona style life sim, but that perspective actually makes more sense I guess. Follow the trials and tribulations of "officer trying to talk to his long distance girlfriend" in between doing boring generic missions that serve no purpose.

Clarste fucked around with this message at 16:04 on Feb 18, 2015

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

Rascyc posted:

FM5 is actually stitching together all the plots of the various other Front Mission games together and filling in plot holes and stuff. It is a very hard plot to follow and gets mistaken as the generic plot about a guy getting revenge and loving a girl a lot (which is there for everyone else to at least have something if they don't understand what's going on). A lot of the military personnel actually talk about various events going on in other parts of the world that directly reference other Front Mission games, the rest just spout random jokes and military talk.

I definitely got the impression something like that was going on, but frankly even if I knew the backstory in more detail, the tone of it feels more like fanfiction than a good plot. "Hey, remember this thing from that other game? I do too! Aren't we both cool for remembering that?" None of it was actually, you know, relevant. You're just hopping around between different cameos.

I assume that's also why it jumps forward in time so much: to keep sync with the other stuff it's referencing.

Clarste fucked around with this message at 02:41 on Feb 19, 2015

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

Mr. Sunabouzu posted:

I just remembered Wild Arms exists and I've never played any of them. I know 5 is terrible, but whats the best one.

3, probably.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.
4 wasn't that good, but I've always cut it some slack for being a weird experimental game. 5 took all of 4's interesting ideas and drove off the cliff with them. It took all of 4's flaws and somehow made them worse. That game is just bad.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

U-DO Burger posted:

Wild Arms 5 is good actually. In terms of gameplay and music, anyway. The plot is terrible, featuring such gems like forgiving genocide because killing people made the people giving the commands feel sad inside, and the true villain being killed offscreen by an NPC about ten seconds after making his first appearance to the heroes, only not played for humor.

No comment about the music, but I thought the gameplay was pretty boring and generic coming from 4.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

ImpAtom posted:

The gameplay was a fair bit more polished than 4 overall. It fixed a lot of 4's weaker elements although it had its own share of flaws.

I'd rather deal with 5's stupid plot then 4's stupid plot though, if just because the core concept of 4's plot is so loving bad and the ending was borderline offensive in its stupidity. 5 at least was just a dumb mecha show with some stupid stupid fantasy racism.

I didn't like the way they made everything generic and homogenous. In 4, everything was a gimmick boss because they knew exactly what your party could do, and each of your characters had wildly different roles (Raquel stands out as being the slowest and strongest of any slow/strong character I've ever seen), while in 5 they let you mix up your powers, even creating copies so you could give the same power to all your characters, but the only effect this had was to make so that nothing ever mattered. Instead of gimmick bosses, you have entirely forgettable bosses who I honestly couldn't even begin to describe. The whole thing just becomes this strange interchangeable haze. There was not a single interesting thing in the entire battle system.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

RadicalR posted:

What. How does this even work?

The boss does max damage with all his attacks (anti-tank chainsaw). If you let him stand in the center of the map then he just swings in a circle and kills everyone.

Having bosses that either kill you instantly or are completely invincible is the main thematic thing in the game. It's supposed to make you feel like a bunch of kids in over your heads.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

bloodychill posted:

I was one of those people who enjoyed the third act of BD immensely. Turning off random encounters and speeding up battles in low level areas was necessary though, so I probably would have never finished the original JP release.

The only thing that bugged me was that while most of the asterisk holders had new story and dialogue for each section, a few notables had nothing new. Also, I hated the last boss' classic FF "kill everyone" attacks and abused friend summons to beat him even though I was fairly high level, enough to handle the chapter 8 gauntlet without much trouble.

If you use alchemy to raise your max HP above 999, it's impossible for him to kill you. And the fight becomes the most boring thing ever. What annoyed me about it was that his attack wasn't counterable with Bushido for absolutely no reason.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.
I don't think the bonus battle exp from Hardcore matters at all because almost all your experience comes from doing sidequests (although sidequest experience is added to the next battle you fight, so you always do the level up dance in battles). Within the first couple of hours you outlevel the enemies so much that battles give you 1 exp, and then you continue to level from sidequest exp while still outleveling the enemies for the rest of the game.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

TARDISman posted:

Oh goddammit. :doh: Do they at least bring back being able to buy healing items?

To be honest, I never really wanted to buy healing items in any of the WA games. I'm pretty sure the reason for holding them back is thematic though. All healing items are plants (berries, etc), and since the world is turning into a desert plants are incredibly rare. Except for all the monsters carrying berries, of course.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

Codiekitty posted:

By the way, is Ramsus supposed to be taken seriously? At first it seemed like he was, but now he comes across as a gag villain.

He's supposed to seem kind of pathetic.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

Nakar posted:

In all fairness I think those requests tell you the exact date though.

I played this recently, and I remember one instance where I missed it because I hadn't talked to her in a while and the relevant date passed before I even knew the quest existed. So... talk to her regularly I guess. I'm not entirely sure when she gets new quests.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

corn in the bible posted:

i am excited to find out what the hero will be named

Is it even possible to top Edge Maverick? I mean, Fate Linegod was pretty good in its own right, but I think they might have peaked.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

Ciaphas posted:

Thanks for all the answers. Assuming the response isn't mired in spoilers, what's so 'disappointing' about it?

Chapter 5-6. Also most of the main characters are incredibly stupid sometimes.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.
Atelier Meruru was the greatest RPG of its generation.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

Golden Goat posted:



Looks fine. Absolutely fine. it's fine. Buy it.

They have a playing card theme on their collars, except they threw in a fifth one with a crescent moon. Whose bright idea was that?

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

ImpAtom posted:

The simplest solution isn't always the most effective though, and even on a first playthrough there are optional bosses who show that off. A lot of people tend to go "I won the fight, so that's all I need to do." Which isn't inaccurate but doesn't mean you didn't have other options that could have made the fight go faster. If the fights are taking three times as long it is because you're using the wrong things, not because those mechanics don't work.

They probably should have made the harder modes available from the start but there's actually a fair amount you can do in the game and multiple ways to engage things.

I don't actually remember much about the game, but when I was playing it, it didn't seem like doing the same thing every time was the simple and lazy method, but instead the best possible solution to every problem. And it was kind of complicated too.

Maybe I was missing something huge, and again I don't really remember how it worked at this point, but I just don't recall the enemies having enough variety to justify ever doing anything different. Just make triangles and run in circles shooting forever.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

ImpAtom posted:

Enemies have vulnerable points that you can specifically exploit, have armor that can be broken, have elemental weaknesses, ect, ect. If all you did was make a random triangle and run around in it then you were doing way less damage than you could have.

I mean, yeah, the point of the game is setting up Tri Attacks so you have maximum range and timing, so you're doing a lot of Tri Attacks regardless, but there's a difference between a good tri attack and a bad tri attack and times when tri attacks are not actually what you want to do.

They weren't random triangles, they were well thought-out triangles. I also remember some kind of combo bonus that made bullets later in the combo do ridiculously more damage than earlier ones...?

Well, if those are the kinds of things you're thinking about, then I guess the game is just as repetitive as I remember.

Edit: Complicated is not the opposite of repetitive. That just makes it worse, really.

Clarste fucked around with this message at 00:56 on May 18, 2015

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

Quest For Glory II posted:

At least I have some PS2 jerpigs to go to when this is done. Ys Ark and Suik 3 and Legaia 2. I'll take anything with at least one modern amenity. Wild ARMs doesn't even heal you at save points. And no one's sold MP-replenishing items in the entire first third of the game.

Which means random encounters you're best off just mashing basic attack over and over or else you'll be hosed when you reach a boss.

Wild Arms 2 gets rid of MP entirely. It was actually one of the first series to do so.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.
My understanding is that all the Japanese history and literature questions were stuff that someone who went to school in Japan might reasonably be expected to know. So they weren't all that easier or harder than the other questions. The translation just decided to half-rear end it though.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.
I hate world maps and towns. They make a game less fun. I would prefer it if more games dropped this silly pretense. I also dislike the idea of the castle in Fire Emblem If.

The only series that even remotely makes good use of the world map is Wild Arms, mostly because it hates you. IE: the world map is a challenge you need to overcome. That doesn't necessarily mean it wasn't just busywork to fill time, but so are random battles and other most other gameplay archetypes. Also towns.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.
The easy-to-reach damage cap in FF9 is actually a great tool for balancing the game. It ensures that all characters are equally useful, and no one breaks the game. Because if the devs can know with 100% certainty that everyone will always do 9999 with every turn, then that's the simplest thing ever.

The problem is just that they were pretty uncreative with a lot of abilities, that were just better versions of other abilities and that ended up being totally meaningless.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.
Doing max damage isn't what breaks the game. Having a really boring combat system does. Bravely Default has the same really-easy-to-reach max damage, and while that creates some oddities, but that didn't break the game either because it's simply not important compared to figuring out how to get more turns. And not die. Other things break the game, but max damage is just a thing you do.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

Sakurazuka posted:

I'm looking forward to Tales of lady vampire pirate.

I'm thinking more like werewolf.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.

Rascyc posted:

What exactly does the rub girl minigame give you anyway? Support points or something?

You can also rub the men, for what it's worth.

Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.
I think something slightly more complicated about FE is that you're not just choosing which of your big-breasted sisters to marry. I mean, you have an avatar and obviously it's implied that that's you, but you're also playing matchmaker to every single person in your army. So you're also choosing to set-up your big-breasted sister with the handsome chin-man.

...I'm not entirely sure where I was going with this, but I just think it's relevant that not all the sexiness is targeted directly at you, the player. If it was, I think marrying everyone off to other people would be offensive to the audience in some way (you see this in harem anime: they have to remain faithful and pure).

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Clarste
Apr 15, 2013

Just how many mistakes have you suffered on the way here?

An uncountable number, to be sure.
I think the only problem with random encounters is that you can't clear areas that you've already explored as safe. This becomes a problem when you need to backtrack and hit a switch or something. On the other hand, games with fixed encounters often respawn enemies on screen change, which can be even more frustrating.

I think the best option is to have some way to earn your right to avoid enemies in a reliable way. For example, a system where trivial battles end automatically or where you can turn off encounters in dungeons you've already cleared (the last Wild Arms game had a switch you hit within the dungeon that turned on a magic barrier or whatever). Letting you avoid all enemies always strikes me as sort of admitting that your combat system in unfun, and having unavoidable battles with onscreen enemies (say, standing in front of door) is often just frustrating.

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