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Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Hi thread, first post in CC and I was hoping to get a little advice from the goon brains trust. If there is a better thread for this or if its something that's answered a million times, I apologise in advance.

I mostly just edit and do camera work, but I've always loved grading and want to be more self sufficient.
Basically I'm a little confused as to how I should be grading for studio swing output (16-235).

My footage is shot with slog2 on Sony's XAVC codec which I am editing natively in Premiere and grading/etc... in After Effects.
Is it as simple as having an adjustment layer on top that raises the output black levels to 16 and lowers the output whites to 235 and grading the clips underneath? Or is that unnecessary because it's already rec709?

This seems like I'm throwing out a lot of information and googling it is giving me very different advice.

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Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


WebDog posted:

Oh look the village local is here

XAVC Intra or Long-Gop? Knowing what the hell it was shot in is the first step. You might already be in Rec 709.

Premiere is a bit of a funny beast when it comes to colouspace, firstly it shunts down to 8bit sRGB to speed up playback, so make sure that "composite in max bit depth" is turned on in your sequence settings if you're doing full swing or working with 10bit video.
Have no idea? Drop in a fade to black and if it bands to hell, you're in 8-bit.

If you shot it in Rec 709 then you don't need to do anything to swing it into a studio space, it's already there.
At best you might grade to balance out the changes between shots and it should remain within the right IRE ranges. Typically most broadcast shows are shot in 709 so that there's a faster turn around.

From the sound of it you're applying the clipped range of 709 over a 709 converted clip, which isn't going to look nice and will crush the crap out of your levels.
At best you might simply need to apply a broadcast colours effect to an adjustment layer, but only if your ranges are reading illegal on the scopes.

This article does a good job at explaining the workflow in Premiere and goes into more detail that what I said above.

Ok cool, this confirmed a lot of what I suspected. Forgot to mention it's XAVC-S, so 8-bit and yeah, rec709.
The wolfcrow blog has been really useful but I still wasn't exactly sure how premiere works.

Cheers.

e: "village local"?

ee: ohhhhh, hey neighbour

Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 14:46 on Jul 20, 2015

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


All good advice, thanks. I had been looking at a Flanders and I've used Resolve plenty on jobs, but it's a little much for home use right now. That's the worst thing about setting up your home studio, do you spend your money on production or post gear. A new lens is winning at the moment...

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Schweinhund posted:

I think you just have to right-click on the scale keyframes and change the keyframe interpolation to bezier. You can do amazing things like this http://i.somethingawful.com/u/garbageday/2013/phriday/911_star_wars/part_2/Schweinhund_11.gif

Amazing

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Mocha crashes every time now and it's driving me nuts, I can't go back to the AE tracker. I can't!

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


So I'm in PAL land and am planning on shooting something that I will deliver for Web and a Bluray copy. My instinct is to shoot 23.976p (camera doesn't do true 24) with a 173° shutter angle to avoid flicker, but I was wondering if anyone thinks they can spot the difference between 173° and 180°? Does anyone actually prefer the look of 25p with a180° shutter slowed down, or is that just utter madness? The other reason 25p would be nice is for the off chance it gets broadcast, I don't want them looking at me like a lunatic for not shooting 25p here in Australia.

e: typos

Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 10:30 on Nov 3, 2015

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


WebDog posted:

Can't you just shoot at 25 then drop the frames for Bluray mastering?

Won't that be noticeably choppy?

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


That seems too easy, what's the catch? Wouldn't the three-two pull down of a 25 to 24p clip look even worse if someone's watching on a 60Hz screen? Unless I'm misunderstanding you - you are suggesting discarding a frame a second, right?

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Armagnac posted:

Difference between 178 & 180 shutter speed is negligible and flicker on that front is only an issue when dealing with screens or flickering lights (some fluorescents, very high speed shots, etc...). 23.976 & 24 are relatively interchangeable at the end point of post, and 24 pulls down to 25 decently, and 23.976 pulls down to 29.97 decently. So 23.976 has become a defacto standard. Only issue is when your deliverables are for broadcast do you need to worry as drop-frame when dealing with 23.976 can be painful.


No. Dropping frames creates a jerky look. Adding proper pull down to a 24p adds a field every 24 fields for a 50i image which is a lot smoother.

Also, almost all bluray and modern tv's will play 23.98, so I'd just recommend making a non region locked 23.976 master.


I would never do it this way, and you're just asking to fail QC and drive yourself and your clients crazy by doing it like this. Either have standard pulldown pathway (23.976p->59.94i, 24p->50i) and test it properly or get a teranex, nucoda filmmaster or snell/wilcox or the like to handle a proper format conversion.

The Pulldown should happen *before* you send your file to encore. You want as clean and final as a file as possible before you apply any sort of h.264 or MPEG2 encoding.

Oh god, why do we still use these archaic standards?! I just noticed a typo in my original post, I'd be using 173° shutter, not 178°. Is the difference still negligible?

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Good to hear. Thank. I was just worried that I'd start to noticeably lose motion blur. Watching some tests and unless it's a ceiling fan, I can't pick it.

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Odd question, but is there a good resource for gore stock images? I'm doing some bash temps and would rather not trawl through real life decapitions for hours trying to find something suitably high res. Doesn't have to be too realistic, just enough to help someone get the feel for a scene.

e: ended up finding decent stills on prop maker websites if anyone is interested. Good for several angles.

Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 09:32 on Jan 4, 2016

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


As said above, unfortunately you're not going to get much better out of the source. Using RGB Curves, you can bring the bottom and middle thirds of the curve down a bit to get more detail in their faces (ie, add 3 points along the curve and bring the lowest down a little, the middle a little more again and raise the top a touch) you could maybe also push the gamma towards yellow/red a tad to get some warmth, but it looks pretty well balanced. Really flat lighting of white folk against a white wall isn't going to look great without some more interesting lighting.

This

Ends up like this

Now I'm doing this on a lovely office screen that isn't colour calibrated, so this might be pink as gently caress and crushed to all hell for all I know

Would definitely recommend downloading the free version of Resolve. The scopes are really good and easy to use. Unless you need 3d capability, it has everything you could want for zero dollars.

Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 19:53 on Feb 26, 2016

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


You can use the Wiggler to get random variance too.

http://www.premiumbeat.com/blog/after-effects-wiggle-expression/

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Last big job I did we used trash cans and they were fine for everything until I started using AE, they lost all their hard disk space no matter how often you'd clear the cache. Every time you wiped it, you'd get a couple less gig back until they became unusable. Though I'm told this was probably an indexing error or something. But, they also heated up like crazy under pretty basic conditions.

Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 02:09 on Mar 20, 2016

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


What's making GBS threads me with Premiere at the moment is when I write over a clip exported from AE or whatever with an updated version, it very occasionally won't update the cache and even removing the clip from the project and re-importing doesn't work and I'm stuck with the old version until I copy the file with a new file name and import again. Now that's probably not a good way to do be doing things in the first place, but god drat it's annoying.

WebDog posted:

The MacCans at their most basic only have 256GB of SSD space to play with. Isn't the new version of After Effects more cache hungry as it tries to do live playback?

Is it ever!

Yeah the trashcan has low storage, the issue we were having was that it wasn't giving the space back when stuff was deleted. So every time we'd clean up the drive we'd get less and less until I couldn't preview anything at all. I don't know enough to be able to tell if this is the machine or the OS though. But it did happen on both cans but not the imac

Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 17:25 on Mar 20, 2016

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


It'll be interesting to see how Resolve improves over the next couple versions. It's pretty amazing how far they've come all ready and the free version is a must have for syncing (outside avid) and for colour

Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 10:49 on Mar 29, 2016

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Armagnac posted:

Problem with syncing in Resolve, is that if your audio files have lots of metadata, it will get lost. It doesn't get brought in. Still it's really good, just not perfect. If you're doing 2 system sound, and have a production audio track, you should be synching in avid.

It brings it in, it just wipes it if you use auto sync which I can only assume is a bug to be fixed (no one could WANT that surely). I remember finding a work around for that though, I'll check my notes. But yes, for anything other than dailies, Avid is the way to go.

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Yeah if you can track something reasonably stable on the face in mocha, you can copy the data to a null in after effects and link the footage it.

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Megasabin posted:

New question for this movie power hour. I'm working with many clips of different resolutions. What's my options for not having the smaller sized clips be surrounded by black boxes on each side. I've fooled around with scale to frame and set to frame options, which helps, but doesn't eliminate the black boxes totally. I know I can manually change the scale, but that zooms in on the picture and cuts stuff out. is there anyway I can just stretch the video a bit to fill the frame without zooming in on it?

When you say resolutions, I'm assuming you mean aspect ratios yes?

You can stretch the footage to fit the entire frame but it will look bad. You can really only zoom and crop or have black bars.

Is it a documentary? If so keep the black bars, that's totally normal and looks fine. If it's fiction, well... why was the footage shot at different aspect ratios? Is there a way to explain this in the narrative maybe? (eg. is it surveillance footage or filmed by a character?)

Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 05:02 on Jun 28, 2016

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Anyone have advice for a good grading monitor? It's time to return the Flanders I've been using on extended loan

Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 16:13 on Jul 5, 2016

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


BonoMan posted:

Then it's time to buy one!

No kidding! The Australian dollar has just recovered a bit so I'm looking at options. Do you have a preference?

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


BonoMan posted:

We use the CM171 - it's great! I'm not the colorist though so I couldn't give you a list of pros and cons unfortunately.

Aye that's what I'm looking at, just wondering if there's anything amazing in the world of calibrated monitors that's come out recently before I blow nearly $3.5k of our banana republic, wooden dollars.

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


WebDog posted:

I just got a Dell UP2716D, which arguably is a poor man's monitor (around the $1000 mark) yet it does 100& R.709, sRGB, and Adobe with 98% DCI-P3. You do have to cough up an extra $200 or so for the colour calibration gizmo.

But something like a Flanders or an Ezio is the next step up.

Thanks mate, I'll check it out.

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Chill Penguin posted:

Alright Post-Goons, I need some help here. I'm just getting back into the game after a couple years off, and am about to tear my hair out over this. I have a solid chunk of Canon XF footage which I have captured and can view using the latest Canon XF Utility. I'm trying to get this stuff into FCP7, but it looks like the Canon XF plug-in is only for FCPX. Is there a way to transcode this stuff into .MOV or DVCPRO or whatever so that FCP7 can read it? Or do I have to download some bullshit conversion software? Any help here would be much appreciated.

Don't know about FCP7, but If you're worried about downloading junk conversion software you could just download a month trial of Premiere and transcode to ProRes or DNxHR or whatever. Not a long term solution obviously, unless you want to make the jump to Premiere or Avid....

Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 19:21 on Jul 6, 2016

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Armagnac posted:

Colorist here.

Most calibration tools you buy at the lower levels, (spiders and the like) can cause more problems than they solve. Color Calibration is a really frustrating dark art, with many people shilling poo poo that have no idea about.

Dells are good for UI monitors, and they're trying, but they're not perfect. But for your main reference, just get a flanders. They come calibrated, and you can send them back for re-calibration, and they do know what they're talking about. They're the only solution unless you really know your poo poo, or can hire *really* good calibrators.

Thanks for this. Flanders it is

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


WebDog posted:

Just to re-iterate - the Dell I suggested is calibrated from the factory but you are getting what you pay for as it's on the cheap and cheerful range and as noted it's not really meant for serious colour work. A Flanders is on my wish list when I can afford to drop $2000k and more for shipping.

I did look them up and they look great for the money. But for this kind of investment, I have to go with what I'm familiar with.

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Another thing too is that video cards can have their own colour and gamma settings adding another step in the chain. They can be turned off in your card's utility though.

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


The Gasmask posted:

I've personally had some weird issues related to this; sometimes my system will randomly decide it wants to use the nVidia color settings instead of the system ones, and I'll be left scratching my head as to why everything is dull and dark.

Yeah I was going nuts trying to print something on a work computer that was all washed out until I realized nVidia had the gamma lowered

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Anyone have a stock image sites they like that's particularly good for plants? Specific request I know.

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


BonoMan posted:

Just images? Or footage as well? I'm on my phone so I can't find out if my memory holds up but check agstockimages.com

Both would be great, but I'd settle for images. Thanks I'll check that out.

e: good site, but it's very US-centric and (surprise) mostly agricultural images. Maybe a botany focused site would be more what I'm after.

Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 01:01 on Jul 24, 2016

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.



Closer, might have to find a Korean or Chinese site and get it translated since it's sesame plants I'm after.

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Hey folks quick question about h264 export for youtube upload: I used a slightly higher variable bitrate than they suggest and youtube left my video looking nice until the final cut to black before a white logo over black, the logo was blocky as all hell. Is this just bad luck with the compression?

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


1st AD posted:

What's the bitrate? I usually overdo it by a lot knowing that YouTube will do their own transcodes after the fact.

You could also try adding a touch of grain to the logo just to make sure you're not getting the bad end of 8-bit dithering.

20Mbps variable for 1080p and there was a little grain over the whole video. Who knows. Just wondering if it was a known issue with youtube's compression killing the last couple seconds or just not coping with quick dips to black maybe. I think I just got bad luck the one time I was in too much of a rush to be able to re-upload (Australian internet is the pig's rear end in a top hat, as the old saying goes)

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


melon cat posted:

Video effects question- what kind of effect is used in this part (1:03 to 1:05) of this fighting clip? The flashes of light. Looks lens-flare-ish. But I can't quite identify how that look was achieved.

Seems like they're going for a light leak effect. You can look up light leaks or film burns to find plenty of motion and still examples and there's plenty of sites that sell (or give away) pre made packs.

It's as simple as overlaying the footage and choosing a blend mode you like. Often stacking the original footage on top again and experimenting with blend modes can get a more subtle effect.

If you're after very specific positioning, timing or shapes, you'll probably have to play around with masks. There's also tutorials for creating light leaks from scratch.

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Resolve is incredible for a free program and they're constantly pushing it towards a full blown edit platform. It's not quite there yet but it's good enough for simple stuff. Plus the colouring abilities are top notch. You can key in it and it's very fast for rendering, beats AE by a long shot on a standard desktop. As mentioned, it does require a reasonably powerful rig and isn't the most beginner friendly. Black magic are going to be huge and it's nice to see

Basically there's no down side to getting it since it's free.

Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 18:38 on Oct 19, 2016

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


He's getting a sweet deal! *hits go on yoyotta before bed, wakes up to beer*

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Hoo boy, too superstitious to update in the middle of a job though. Anything new/exciting under the hood?

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


BonoMan posted:

I don't think that's "superstitious" as much as it's "standard operating procedure" .

Premiere and AE both have healthy updates with, supposedly realtime playback in AE loving finally.

Hah yeah, but I won't even update at home until something's done, you never know...

zeldadude posted:

I actually tried that but I kept getting an XML error that it would never move past. I'll do some more Google searching to see if I can figure out a workaround. Cheers!

As mentioned above check all your project settings and source files, could be as simple as your audio sample rate being mismatched.

Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


Unmature posted:

Question about Premiere proxies:

I recorded video and audio from separate sources with the intention of piecing them together. What's the cleanest and easiest way to do this with proxies?

Basically after you sync the audio with the sound (do you have useful timecode? If not I hope you have a visual/audio cue like a clapper) you just need to make sure you keep the same video file names when you export your proxies, that way it's a simple task of relinking to the original files.

Resolve is free and very simple to sync and export sequences as individual clips, I like using that for proxies.

Actually scratch that, do what they said.
\/\/\/

My brain was stuck in dailies work flow. Export proxies in Media Encoder, keep the same file names, sync in premiere, edit, then replace footage when done.

Lizard Combatant fucked around with this message at 17:02 on Nov 3, 2016

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Lizard Combatant
Sep 29, 2010

I have some notes.


melon cat posted:

Does anyone know how to achieve this effect in After Effects CC?



The way that connecting line follows the circle outline, while the circle outline tracks the boxer's hand. Neat effect, but I'm not quite sure how to get that connecting line to follow a specific target. Any advice on how to do this?

Many ways you can do it, the simplest off the top of my head (assuming it's a simple solid line) is to use the beam effect and link the start position to the moving element (in this case the circle or a null) and the end position to whatever part of the body you've tracked. Make sure completion is set to 100%

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