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Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


The GPU Megathread is here, this thread is about CPUs, APUs, and AMD platforms in general.

:siren:Don't loving buy an AMD FX-series CPU.:siren:


:frogsiren: Breaking news: :frogsiren:

Bulldozer delayed until late July due to disappointing performance

AnandTech posted:

Just above Llano we will have the long awaited Bulldozer CPU. AMD originally wanted to launch Bulldozer at Computex but performance issues with its B0 and B1 stepping chips pushed back the launch. Now we're looking at a late July launch with B2 silicon, but performance today is a big unknown. Apparently the performance of B1 stepping silicon doesn't look too good.

Bulldozer will be mechanically compatible with Socket-AM3 motherboards but AMD will only officially support the CPU on AM3+ motherboards.

Also from that article, Info on the 9-series chipset:

AnandTech posted:

To differentiate AM3+ from AM3 motherboards AMD is releasing a new chipset: the 9-series. Functionally the 9-series chipset is no different from the 8-series that it replaces; it'll simply be used on AM3+ boards exclusively.

What The gently caress is Bulldozer?
Bulldozer is the next-generation micro-architecture and processor design developed from AMD. Bulldozer will be the first major redesign of AMDís processor architecture since 2003, when they launched their K8 (Athlon 64/Opteron) processors. :hellyeah:

:eng101: Technical poo poo: :eng101:
Bulldozer core "modules" will consist of two 4-pipeline cores that share a Float Point Scheduler and two 128-bit FMACs. Since a very small amount (outside of HPC) is FP calculations in today's code, the shared FP scheduler allows some significant power savings. The shared dual 128-bit FMACs can be used by each core or doubled up and used as a 256-bit FMAC. For this to be beneficial however, it will have to be specifically coded for.

These cores also share an L2 cache. These modules can be arranged and connected via HyperTransport Bus facilities build multi-core processors. The 6000 series server processors will have 12 to 16 cores, or 6 to 8 modules. The 4000 series will have 4 to 8 cores. Server side chipset will be identical to what is currently on the market and G34 (6000 series) and C32 (4000 series) sockets will accept these server processors. These processors will work inside the exact same thermal envelopes as the previous processors, but will of course have up to double the cores.

Block diagram:


"Significant enhancements" have been made to the memory controller that will represent a substantial increase in memory throughput, but that is all that would be said on the matter.

It was interesting to hear AMD compare its Bulldozer module to current Intel HyperThreading architecture and you will see the comparison made on the slides below. AMD seems to be of the mind, "Why do we need something akin to HyperThreading when we can add an additional core to our module for about a 5% increase in die size?" AMD kept with the 2-core module to HyperThreading comparison throughout the talk.

More low power states and more advanced and granular clock gating will also be part of Bulldozer and upcoming Northbridge parts for the desktop. Expect to see two channels of DDR3 memory per module as well. As well a new modes of AMD's TurboCore technology that "overclocks" the processors.

Just to reiterate:
Each Bulldozer die will be made up of multiple modules. Each module has 2 integer cores and a shared FPU.

  • An 8-core bulldozer die has 4 modules and 8 total integer cores.
  • The product will be marketed as an 8-core processor
  • The system (hardware)will see 8 cores.
  • The OS will see 8 cores.
  • The applications will see 8 cores.

Don't get hung up on modules. They only exist to the designers and in powerpoint slides. They will not be visible to the system or to the software. The OS cannot see the module, it only sees integer cores.

New Socket Time!
Bulldozer uses the AM3+ socket for the desktop, and Sockets G34 (LGA1974) and C32 (LGA1207) will be used in serverland.

AM3 boards will not take AM3+ CPUs
AM3+ boards will take AM3 CPUs

Let me reiterate that for you, just so we're absolutely positively unequivocally clear on this:

AM3 board + AM3+ CPU? NO
AM3+ board with AM3 CPU? YES

The advantages of AM3+ are:
  • Making you buy a new motherboard,
  • Hyper Transport 3.1, (3.20 GHz, 6.4 GT/s, 25.6 GB/s, 16-bit uplink/16-bit downlink)
  • Improved support for power saving features,

Motherboards So Far Announced:


Info on the 9-series chipset:

AnandTech posted:

To differentiate AM3+ from AM3 motherboards AMD is releasing a new chipset: the 9-series. Functionally the 9-series chipset is no different from the 8-series that it replaces; it'll simply be used on AM3+ boards exclusively.

Known BD models:
  • All of the Opterons in red italics on this list:

  • AMD plans to release four eight-core AMD FX8000-series chips, two six-core AMD FX6000-series microprocessors and two quad-core AMD FX4000-series central processing units (CPUs) this year. Shipments of AMD FX-series high-end desktop microprocessors will commence on the week of June 20th, 2011, the same document indicated.

    The first breed of AMD FX8000, FX6000 and FX4000 currently known under Zambezi code-name will completely support all the advantages that the Bulldozer micro-architecture is supposed to bring, including new Flex FP floating point processing unit. The new chips in maximum eight-core configurations are projected - by AMD's internal documents - to offer roughly 50% performance improvement over Phenom II-series microprocessors in multimedia applications.

Q/A Time: :eng101:

Q: I'm trying to decide if I want to get a new motherboard and use my current processor until Bulldozer comes out or if I should wait and get the whole shebang when it drops?
A: It is a great idea to spread out your spending, if you can. Get something from this list, it will be AM3+ compatible with a BIOS update.

  • Crosshair IV Extreme
  • Crosshair Formula IV
  • M4A89TD PRO/USB3
  • M4A89TD PRO
  • GA-890FXA-UD5 (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-890GPA-UD3H (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-880GA-UD3H (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-880GMA-USB3 (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-880G-USB3 (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-880GM-USB3 (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-870A-UD3 (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-870-UD3P (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-870A-USB3 (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-870A-USB3L (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-MA770T-UD3P (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-MA770T-UD3 (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-770T-D3L (Rev 3.1)
  • MSI 890FXA-GD70
  • MSI 880GMS-E35
  • MSI 890FXA-GD65
  • MSI 870A-G54
  • MSI 890GXM-G65
  • MSI 870A-G54H
  • MSI 880GMA-E55
  • MSI 870A-G46
  • MSI 880GMA-E35
  • MSI 760GM-P33


Updated 5/31/11

Somebody fucked around with this message at 19:43 on Oct 11, 2012

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Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


rsjr posted:

You know you could just not post the thread until you recovered the text right?

I do, it was all there, then when I posted, it was missing the tail end. It is fixed now, though.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Are there any AMD goons?

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


I just updated the first post a bit, tell me if I missed any news.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


June is for the Performance/Mid-Range. Think the line-equivalent to the /i[5|7]-2\d00\w/ models. (Wow, that was nerdy.)

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


adorai posted:

Not bulldozer, but question relating to the new poo poo from AMD. Per clock, can I expect similar performance between an ontario/zacate/llano platform as I can get from PhenomII/AthlonII? I am considering replacing my fileserver, which is currently a 45W AM2 Athlon x2 1.9GHz. If I can replace this with an APU that consumes only 18W, and not have to worry about performance, it's worth it to me (my office has terrible air flow and it gets warm in there). If it goes well I might even replace my VMware server as well (Athlon X2 2.5GHz) since it rarely caps out.

That is true.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


:eng101: New infamashun tiem! :eng101:
BD's FX line has a real release date! June 20th is the proclamation from AMD.

Xbitlabs posted:

AMD plans to release four eight-core AMD FX8000-series chips, two six-core AMD FX6000-series microprocessors and two quad-core AMD FX4000-series central processing units (CPUs) this year; four chips are to be launched in Q2 2011, another four processors will be introduced in Q4 2011.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


PC LOAD LETTER posted:

Another lil' leak that gives some pretty big hints about how AMD expects BD to perform given its price positioning.




...

:eng99:

Welp, there goes my hopes for competition for the Sandy Bridge-E series.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Various places are reporting that some Interlagos benchmarks were leaked. This looks promising.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


But my computer gets 36 points higher on some stupid artificial benchmark for just $500 more! :smug:

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


MeramJert posted:

There is absolutely no way getting a 2500k will only cost you $50-$100 more than an Athlon II x4 system

Parts that are the same:

Athlon II x4 system (Though, for :20bux: + :10bux:, you should go to a 965 instead if you must stick to AMD.)

Total cost: $988.91

2500k system

Total cost for system: $1,093.91

Cost difference from Athlon to 2500k: $26 $105

Chance of MeramJert still talking out his rear end: Priceless. 100%

Well, mate, I think $105 ≈ $100.

Sinestro fucked around with this message at 09:50 on Apr 1, 2011

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


I build systems on the side, so I was just copying from my log. :effort:

Sinestro fucked around with this message at 09:28 on Apr 1, 2011

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Updated, and you still are in the buttspeak range. :owned:

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Look at the forum name! Hardware is serious business. :smug:

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


madprocess posted:

I'm sorry but I must inform you that if your son has requested a new "processor" from a company called "AMD", this is genuine cause for alarm. AMD is a third-world based company who make inferior, "knock-off" copies of American processor chips. They use child labor extensively in their third world sweatshops, and they deliberately disable the security features that American processor makers, such as Intel, use to prevent hacking. AMD chips are never sold in stores, and you will most likely be told that you have to order them from internet sites. Do not buy this chip! This is one request that you must refuse your son, if you are to have any hope of raising him well.

                     
kidding of course
                     


Is this a reference to something? If so, do tell.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


All this nostalgia poo poo is great, but can we talk about the new processor to :fh: over instead?

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Updated OP w/ GIGABYTE release info and basic info on the FX line.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Get something from this list, it will be AM3+ compatible with a BIOS update.

  • Crosshair IV Extreme
  • Crosshair Formula IV
  • M4A89TD PRO/USB3
  • M4A89TD PRO
  • GA-890FXA-UD5 (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-890GPA-UD3H (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-880GA-UD3H (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-880GMA-USB3 (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-880G-USB3 (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-880GM-USB3 (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-870A-UD3 (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-870-UD3P (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-870A-USB3 (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-870A-USB3L (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-MA770T-UD3P (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-MA770T-UD3 (Rev 3.1)
  • GA-770T-D3L (Rev 3.1)
  • MSI 890FXA-GD70
  • MSI 880GMS-E35
  • MSI 890FXA-GD65
  • MSI 870A-G54
  • MSI 890GXM-G65
  • MSI 870A-G54H
  • MSI 880GMA-E55
  • MSI 870A-G46
  • MSI 880GMA-E35
  • MSI 760GM-P33

Added info to OP.

Sinestro fucked around with this message at 00:55 on Apr 10, 2011

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Inept posted:

Does anyone know for sure what the limitations may be of using AM3 boards instead of AM3+ ones? I've read something along the lines of voltage adjustment for power savings not being as good along with something related to Hyper Transport speeds.

No one will know until June.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


I going to buy the gently caress out of a 2P Interlagos build.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Alereon posted:

The 28nm successor to the AMD Ontario and Zacate low-power x86 processors, the Wichita series, has taped out at AMD for production at TSMC. "Taping out" means the chip design has been completed and sent for initial test manufacturing, after which they make any further necessary changes. About two weeks ago we learned that the AMD Radeon HD 7000-series taped out about six weeks prior, indicating that both products may be on track for a launch potentially as early as Q3. I'd expect the new C- and E-series processors to have VLIW4-based Radeon HD 7300 graphics or something to that effect, I'm thinking it will have 64 shaders (one VLIW4 SIMD block), but they could double this if they don't scale clockspeeds instead.

Given how awesome the x120e and friends are, I can't wait for this. :popcorn:

Sinestro fucked around with this message at 18:42 on Apr 13, 2011

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Quote != edit. Durr.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Space Gopher posted:

The rumor mills are saying that Zacate's supply is seriously constrained, and that prices should fall naturally once AMD ramps up production to fulfill demand. Given that you can buy a complete 15.6" laptop with an E-350 for under $350, I don't think that the price of the chip itself is what's driving prices on stuff like Zacate mITX and desktop boards so high.

I hope they drop soon. I need a new NAS, and I want as much money for drives and a RAID card as possible.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Alereon posted:

AMD CPUs are currently manufactured at Global Foundaries on the 45nm Silicon-On-Insulator process, transitioning to 32nm. AMD GPUs are currently manufactured at TSMC on a bulk-silicon 40nm process, transitioning to 28nm. You can't make AMD CPUs at TSMC because they're designed for GF's Silicon-On-Insulator tech, and vice versa. GPUs have historically been made at "half-node" processes, which are sort of like half-steps beteween process shrinks. For example, while CPUs shrank from 90nm to 65nm to 45nm, GPUs went from 80nm to 55nm to 40nm.

Wow, that makes no sense at all. It is both SOI, why is it different? (Took one class on IC design in school, never used or thought about it since)

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Alereon posted:

Global Foundries is using SOI, TSMC (and nearly everybody else) isn't, sorry if I wasn't being clear. That means there's pretty substantial differences in the processes and the resulting chips. Those significant differences are why it made sense for AMD to fab their Zacate APUs at TSMC, since they were reusing their graphics cores and could design new CPU cores for TSMC's bulk CMOS process.

E: Apparently I can't spell foundries.

Ah, that makes much more sense. I thought you were saying that TSMC had SOI as well and I was all :wtf:.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Cuntpunch posted:

I will admit to finally going back to Intel after nearly a decade with AMD. I respect the company but I just couldn't find it in myself to wait an indefinite amount of time to be able to upgrade to the next-gen tech. However, I would be terribly sad to see AMD start to falter, but as far as I can tell they've put themselves between a rock and a hard place with Bulldozer. Even if they can manage spectacular performance(and price ratios as is their way) compared to Sandy Bridge, it seems like they'll have taken center stage just in time for Ivy Bridge to come around.

I am hoping for a neck-and-neck, if not a winner.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Ryokurin posted:

Unless Intel steps it up Ivy Bridge won't happen until next year. I don't expect AMD to match but at least shorten the gap. if it's within 10% Ill be happy.

I don't care about brands, but Intel needs to stop the hyper-segmentation bullcrap

Mods, could you rename this to "Bulldozer - Rumored release: Computex"

Sinestro fucked around with this message at 21:11 on Apr 16, 2011

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Wow, I went from never to constantly on Q!=E.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Arsten posted:

What do you mean by "hyper-segmentation"? I honestly don't get the reference.

I mean the whole B65/H61/H67/P67/Q65/Q67/Z68 thing.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Nonpython posted:

I mean the whole B65/H61/H67/P67/Q65/Q67/Z68 thing.

And for me, that you must choose between VM extensions and overclocking sucks too.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


If it is real, I will be :stare::fh: all over that poo poo.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


eames posted:

Then itíll probably be their last screwup, because I donít see how they have a chance in the x86 game once Ivy Bridge is out.
See Intelís 22nm Tri-Gate Transistors and AMDís lack of having something comparable within the near future.

Mmm, Kool-Aid.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Any new developments in AMDland?

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


I know this is pretty :downs: of me, but is BD going on laptops, or is it just Llano?

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Bob Morales posted:

Has AMD ever had a compelling laptop chipset? (Except for the current Zacate setups)

The initial platform kicked the Pentium 4-M's rear end, Puma was better than Intel's ULV offering, Champlain is only as bad as AMD's current desktop offering, and Kite Enhanced invented the new SSD cache tech in Z68.

EDIT: Me english real good.
EDIT 2: 4-M != M.

Sinestro fucked around with this message at 15:59 on May 19, 2011

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


SaderBiscut posted:

uh what.

I meant 4-M. As HalloKitty said, mobile Netburst = :downsbravo:.

Sinestro fucked around with this message at 15:20 on May 19, 2011

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


SaderBiscut posted:

My T42 completely blew my A31 out of the water despite having a lower clock-speed and the same amount of ram, but you know.

That is Pentium M, which became Core. This is the Pentium 4-M/ Mobile Pentium 4, which is just a Northwood P4 (later Prescott) with the TDP scaled down.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


wicka posted:

What is Zacate?

Two Bobcat cores (distant decendant of Clawhammer optimised for low TDP) with a IGP on die.

Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


Tab8715 posted:

The hell? They can't be right, the integrated graphics core has a R 6550? That's what I've got in my desktop right now...

Llano's IGP line is :krad:.

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Sinestro
Oct 31, 2010

The perfect day needs the perfect set of wheels.


I still expect it to slaughter the Intel HD 3000, though.

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