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MJ12 posted:Not talking about PTN, talking about why there isn't a Royal Flashman in any other literature. Excuse me. 
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Jul 12, 2011 13:45
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Tempest_56 posted:I'm going to have to disagree here - the Flashman is actually one of my least favorite mechs from the TRO 2750. It falls into a trap not unlike that of the Charger, to my eye. For it's 75 ton size, it has far too little throw-weight for it's vulnerability. The weapon profile calls it a brawler - but it mounts an XL engine. The speed profile calls it a cavalry mech - but it has too little firepower for that role and lacks the jump jets to leverage what it has. The tonnage suggests a mech of the line - but it has a tiny engagement envelope. If you want a Flashman for the modern era you have got to get the 9M. Slower than the standard Flashman at only 4/6 but mounts a truly fearsome punch 2 HPPCs for ranged terror and if something tries to get close you drop the HPPCs for 4 Medium lasers and 4 medium pulses which should dish out a world of hurt. Also it comes with C3i which is handy when used by the phone companies. Its a pretty solid mech overall I only have a few as part of a Marik force but it is pretty nasty when paired with something like the Orion 2M.
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Jul 12, 2011 13:57
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Tempest_56 posted:
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Jul 12, 2011 14:01
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^^And you can get a cluster of MLs on a 35 ton mech that moves nearly twice as fast and costs half as much. When you're nearly an assault, your primary weapon shouldn't be medium lasers.Ferrosol posted:If you want a Flashman for the modern era you have got to get the 9M. The -9M is a good mech, but it's a hugely different machine than the -8K. Different speed, different engine, different armor, different range profile... I'd say the -9M is closer to the Penetrator than the standard Flashman.
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Jul 12, 2011 14:07
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If you're going for pure Med Laser delivery take a Swayback or, for even MORE Med Lasers a Komodo.landcollector posted:You have seen this happen? If so, wow.
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Jul 12, 2011 14:35
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Arquinsiel posted:If you're going for pure Med Laser delivery take a Swayback or, for even MORE Med Lasers a Komodo. I guess it depends on the era cause the ones i had from the late 90s held up pretty well!
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Jul 12, 2011 15:14
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Those were mostly one and two-parters, apart from the clan Omnis. Have you tried building a Phoenix Hawk recently?
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Jul 12, 2011 15:19
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John Charity Spring posted:Excuse me. Thank you.
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Jul 12, 2011 15:22
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Tempest_56 posted:I'm going to have to disagree here - the Flashman is actually one of my least favorite mechs from the TRO 2750. It falls into a trap not unlike that of the Charger, to my eye. For it's 75 ton size, it has far too little throw-weight for it's vulnerability. The weapon profile calls it a brawler - but it mounts an XL engine. The speed profile calls it a cavalry mech - but it has too little firepower for that role and lacks the jump jets to leverage what it has. The tonnage suggests a mech of the line - but it has a tiny engagement envelope. 3x LL/5x ML is not "too little firepower for a cavalry mech" at all. You cite the Rakshasa and the Falconer. Okay, let's play that game - the Rakshasa-1A has greater range, but also more significant heat problems, and its "maximum damage" is pretty much purely theoretical. The Flashman's heat-limited damage potential is much greater, particularly in close, and the Flashman's marginal extra armor and lesser amount of ammunition make it a bit more survivable than the Rakshasa. The Falconer can jump, but usually won't at range, and runs into the same problem as the Rakshasa in that it's more effective at range than in close, relatively speaking. The Flashman meanwhile is brutally effective in close, with 2 LL + however many MLs you feel like firing providing a notable damage boost on either of the two cavalry mechs. With the Penetrator, it is merely a stylistic choice - speed and heat efficiency for accuracy and durability. But the advantage of 5/8 compared to 4/6 is very, very significant, much more so than you seem to be letting on, and minimizes the "tiny engagement envelope" significantly. The difference between a +2 and a +3 movement mod is very, very important, and the extra two movement also makes a big difference range bracket-wise on the rush. I mean, I've used plenty of FLSs and I feel like I have a fairly good handle on what they can and cannot do. They are truly excellent at hunting enemy fire support in the heavy/assault weight class, and they are very good (alongside appropriate support or en masse) against clans in bv-matched games. They are good both in a cavalry role and as anti-cavalry; and they are quite competent against most heavy/assault brawlers as well; the extra speed helps minimize some of the danger from opposing weapons, lets you flank or backstab, and so on. They have problems with fast mediums and lights with pulse (but what doesn't?), but on the whole they're an excellent workhorse cavalry. There's also the 9C which takes all of the 8K's "weaknesses" and nullifies them, by achieving medium pulses and ER Larges. The 8K itself is perfectly fine; but the 9C is downright unfair and mean.
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Jul 12, 2011 19:45
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Fraction Jackson posted:There's also the 9C which takes all of the 8K's "weaknesses" and nullifies them, by achieving medium pulses and ER Larges. The 8K itself is perfectly fine; but the 9C is downright unfair and mean. I respect your opinion, but I still think it's a junker. I've had nothing but poor experiences with it. And I just can't respect a mech that has an engagement range of under 10 hexes, carries the liability of both an XL engine and unCASEd ammo, has mediocre armor penetration, is of low-average mobility for it's class/role and wants me to invest as much BV into it as I would an Imp or a King Crab.
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Jul 12, 2011 20:33
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(So, I thought this was due. I took some liberties with the design because the IS powers don't have an XL engine yet, but it makes the design even funnier). "Those bastards! They took Kempner's head clean off!" "There'll be time to mourn later, Leutnant Clover. If he's down, one way or another, you're next..." Promotional consideration for A Call to Action: The Story of the Battle of Somerset was paid for by a grant from the Lyran Commonwealth Armed Forces Department of Military Recruitment and this corporate partner... BattleMechs are On the Cutting Edge of Awesome Brought to you by Coventry Metal Works. CMW: We don't have to hide under a mountain like bitches.  See that? That's us firing a Gauss rifle. You know what that is? It's the newest weapon in our arsenal, and we at Coventry Metal Works have come up with a new way to get them to you. See, the guys at Defiance Industries are retrofitting them on to the biggest designs like the Atlas, Banshee and Cyclops. And that's all well and good, and we're not going to trash-talk them because we're all in this together. Like it says on those recruiting posters for the LCAF, "Through Solidarity, We Will Triumph," right? Well, we at CMW came up with a slightly different idea. Rather than try and retrofit this new game-changer on to our old chassis, we invented a new, inexpensive platform to put as many of these new Gauss rifles on the field as possible: the BZK-F2 Hollander. This 35-ton weapons platform is powered by an inexpensive class 140 fusion engine (that's right, the same one we've been salvaging from those Panthers for centuries but haven't had anything to put them in!) and protected by nearly 5 tons of armor. The armor is mostly perfunctory, as the extreme range of the Gauss rifle will leave the Hollander as a fire-support machine, a direct-fire compliment to your Archers, but at half the cost! The centerpiece of this new design is, of course, the Poland Main Model A Gauss rifle. If you're not familiar with the capabilities of this weapon, let me elaborate. It's okay, it's brand new. For the longest time, people had been asking us "loving magnets... how do they work?" And our top scientists unraveled that mystery completely on their own without any help. Once we know how magnets work, we realized we could use them to propel slugs of solid metal at incredible speeds. As a result, the range of this weapon surpasses even the LRM and PPC. It's damage is half-again that of a PPC bolt, and firing this weapon generates one-tenth the heat. That's right, just one-tenth! And even though it is an ammunition-based weapon, the ammo is completely inert and doesn't explode when hit. Talk about a life-saver! Of course, the gun is mildly explosive, but we'd like to stress "mildly." All in all, we believe the Hollander will be a success in putting as many of these amazing new weapons on the field as possible and giving Lyran MechWarriors a new edge on the battlefield. So when you're watching A Call to Action: The Story of the Battle of Somerset, know that our soldiers are still out there fighting, and we at Coventry Metal Works are doing our best to keep 'em firing. Coventry Metal Works: We're doing our part... are you? Defiance Industries fucked around with this message at 20:43 on Jul 12, 2011 |
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Jul 12, 2011 20:37
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Defiance Industries posted:The centerpiece of this new design is, of course, the Poland Main Model A Gauss rifle. If you're not familiar with the capabilities of this weapon, let me elaborate. It's okay, it's brand new. For the longest time, people had been asking us "loving magnets... how do they work?" And our top scientists unraveled that mystery completely on their own without any help. Wait... so they're not just banging rocks together over there?
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Jul 12, 2011 20:44
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W.T. Fits posted:Wait... so they're not just banging rocks together over there? The great thing about Battletech is realizing that the PR guy who wrote that knows even less about magnets than your average tech, who knows far less about magnets than the smartest engineer at the greatest research lab in the galaxy (outside the CrabGuard) who didn't know enough about magnets to actually envision how to build a gauss rifle, much less actually create a prototype. In other words, in humanity's grimdark future, knowledge about magnets is about seventeen degrees of lost. I bet they use little pieces of myomer to hold notes to refrigerators.
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Jul 12, 2011 20:58
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TildeATH posted:The great thing about Battletech is realizing that the PR guy who wrote that knows even less about magnets than your average tech, who knows far less about magnets than the smartest engineer at the greatest research lab in the galaxy (outside the CrabGuard) who didn't know enough about magnets to actually envision how to build a gauss rifle, much less actually create a prototype. Coventry Metal Works' other slogan is "Yo, we built and designed the ORIGINAL Lyran Assault mechs, so maybe you should back the gently caress up."
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Jul 12, 2011 20:59
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TildeATH posted:In other words, in humanity's grimdark future, knowledge about magnets is about seventeen degrees of lost. I bet they use little pieces of myomer to hold notes to refrigerators. No, it's not. They have electricity, even on fairly backwater worlds, so they get magnets. That's entirely different from the kind of hot superconductor nonsense you need for a Gauss Rifle though.
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Jul 12, 2011 21:13
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SynthOrange posted:Huh. The Flashman sort of looks like Urbanmech's big brother. And an Imp can be the daddy. You could actually build a "Mini-Imp" Urbie. 30 tons, 3/5/3 movement, 10 DHS, 6.5 tons of armor and an armament of 2 Light PPCs, 5 ER Small Lasers and a LRM5 with a ton of CASE-protected ammo. It's actually quite the little terror, especially in built-up terrain. Pretty cheap, too, at about 2 million C-bills.
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Jul 12, 2011 21:22
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wiegieman posted:No, it's not. They have electricity, even on fairly backwater worlds, so they get magnets. That's entirely different from the kind of hot superconductor nonsense you need for a Gauss Rifle though. That electricity is generated via Double-and-a-Third-Strength Myomer Turbines, as detailed in TRO: 3022 - We Make EveryThing out of Myomer Now. Don't make me dig up a cartoon kobold to prove my point...
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Jul 12, 2011 21:23
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Magni posted:You could actually build a "Mini-Imp" Urbie. 30 tons, 3/5/3 movement, 10 DHS, 6.5 tons of armor and an armament of 2 Light PPCs, 5 ER Small Lasers and a LRM5 with a ton of CASE-protected ammo. It's actually quite the little terror, especially in built-up terrain. Pretty cheap, too, at about 2 million C-bills. I've always preferred the mini-Hollander Urbie. 30 tons, 6-9, Guass Rifle, no armor to speak of. Build lots of them and pray for headshots.
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Jul 12, 2011 21:39
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If gauss weapons were as simple as merely understanding electromagnetism, we'd have had naval gauss weapons in WWI.
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Jul 12, 2011 21:48
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Leperflesh posted:If gauss weapons were as simple as merely understanding electromagnetism, we'd have had naval gauss weapons in WWI. I think you are giving WW1 generals and tactics too much credit. Why invent new weapons and original thinking when we can send waves upon waves of the poor and downtrodden into the meatgrinder? 
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Jul 12, 2011 22:06
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Trast posted:I think you are giving WW1 generals and tactics too much credit. Why invent new weapons and original thinking when we can send waves upon waves of the poor and downtrodden into the meatgrinder? True, but the ADMIRALS weren't so bad. You had sub warfare and the first aircraft carrier at sea before the end of World War I.
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Jul 12, 2011 22:08
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The Hollander is such a derpy little mech, yet it is so Lyran that I can't help but love it.
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Jul 12, 2011 22:09
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KnoxZone posted:The Hollander is such a derpy little mech, yet it is so Lyran that I can't help but love it. Isn't the Hollander an attempt to copy the Uller? Specifically its A config?
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Jul 12, 2011 22:46
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Boogle posted:Isn't the Hollander an attempt to copy the Uller? Specifically its A config? I would call it an attempt at overcompensation on the part of the Lyrans. I mean, just look at it. It just screams "Freud."
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Jul 12, 2011 23:01
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The idea was "field a ton of Gauss rifles as cheaply as possible and don't worry too much about aesthetics." they built the whole thing around a gun rather than building a gum into the machine.
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Jul 13, 2011 00:26
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That leads me to discover the Arctic Fox, based on the Kit Fox, a damned decent looking light which comes complete with shark jaws, paired up SRM4/MLAS, and an ER Penis Projection Cannon.
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Jul 13, 2011 00:33
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Defiance Industries posted:they built the whole thing around a gun rather than building a gum into the machine. This philosophy would be later used in construction of the ultimate fast mech.  The Lyrans do things in style.
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Jul 13, 2011 00:37
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My 2nd Donegal Assault/C3 company uses the variant of those that ditches the UAC/20 for a C3 slave, heavy PPC and seven jump jets. They are vicious flankers AND they spot for my Hauptmenn and Devastators and other poo poo.
Defiance Industries fucked around with this message at 00:42 on Jul 13, 2011 |
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Jul 13, 2011 00:39
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Defiance Industries posted:Hollander PM me stats on that, and we'll see them used. There will be a 3-month "fast forward" after this mission is over, putting us right at the beginning of Wave 3 of the Clan Invasion (we're skipping wave 2).
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Jul 13, 2011 01:55
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PoptartsNinja posted:There will be a 3-month "fast forward" after this mission is over, putting us right at the beginning of Wave 3 of the Clan Invasion (we're skipping wave 2). That... doesn't sound promising for the Inner Sphere. 
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Jul 13, 2011 02:02
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PoptartsNinja posted:PM me stats on that, and we'll see them used. This... is actually really neat. The clans can stop being mysterious and the IS can finally start coordinating some resistance. Was it wave 3 or 4 that Twycross happened in canon?
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Jul 13, 2011 02:07
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In what wave does the Lyran Civil War finally undermine Frederick Steiner's military position sufficiently for the Steel Vipers to make their push on Tharkad?  Because I will punch a baby for that to be a PC scenario, eventually, if it happens. Luthien does not have poo poo on Tharkad, baby.
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Jul 13, 2011 02:09
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KnoxZone posted:This... is actually really neat. The clans can stop being mysterious and the IS can finally start coordinating some resistance. Was it wave 3 or 4 that Twycross happened in canon? Wave 4 was the death of the Ilkhan. Wave 5 was the assault on Luthien. Wave 7 was Tukayyid.
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Jul 13, 2011 02:16
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jng2058 posted:True, but the ADMIRALS weren't so bad. You had sub warfare and the first aircraft carrier at sea before the end of World War I.
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Jul 13, 2011 02:23
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PoptartsNinja posted:PM me stats on that, and we'll see them used. Man, I feel bad for the guy who gets that ride... 4/6 and 4.5 tons of armor.
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Jul 13, 2011 02:24
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Defiance Industries posted:Man, I feel bad for the guy who gets that ride... 4/6 and 4.5 tons of armor. Not that bad for an ambush or city fighter; it'll go right alongside the Liao "Gauss Rifle Surprise" 'Mech (that ComStar didn't expect them to upgrade) and Hanse Davion's unexpected counter.
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Jul 13, 2011 02:28
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It does exactly what I designed it to do, and perfectly at that: it puts an extra Gauss, which outranges every other weapon the IS has by a couple hexes, on the field for super-cheap, and it can at least keep pace with your fire support units like Archers. I just mean the pilot is gon' get his poo poo ruined.
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Jul 13, 2011 02:37
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Some interesting order alterations. This turn is going to be fun. Edit: Hahaha, oh that is awesome. I wondered if anyone would notice that. Double Edit: Looking for a quick update from X-Mas Future, since there's an option he (or she, I suppose) missed that would allow him (or her) to leverage more of his (or whatever) firepower. PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 03:28 on Jul 13, 2011 |
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Jul 13, 2011 03:08
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The suspense! I love and hate it. But though we're all eager to see what's cooking, don't feel the need to rush on our account. We can be patient while the last layer of polish dries. Also go, Xmas, leverage more of your gender indeterminate firepower. What could possibly go wrong? 
Runa fucked around with this message at 03:40 on Jul 13, 2011 |
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Jul 13, 2011 03:38
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T.G. Xarbala posted:Also go, Xmas, leverage more of your gender indeterminate firepower. What could possibly go wrong? That's the thing: the best part of this plan is, he or she also gains the benefits of partial cover; and nothing ever goes wrong when you have partial cover. Fun Fact, the Starslayer was originally going to be a Scorpion but I'm not that big an rear end in a top hat. Also, Revenant Threshhold should get back to me as well; since he can fire an additional weapon (and by that, I mean he can Alpha Strike) pretty safely since he decided not to use his jump jets this turn. PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 03:51 on Jul 13, 2011 |
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Jul 13, 2011 03:43
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