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Alright. I'm pretty sure everything's distinctive enough this time around that I shouldn't need to number the `Mechs on the field. What do you think, goons? Should I number the `Mechs on the field? If I don't number them, I can flip them around 180 as they change facing (I won't do angles since it ruins the sprites). If I add numbers, they're stuck in whatever facing they start with. VVV That's easy enough, I can include their `Mech icon (with ugly "please erase me" technicolor background) with the initial series of PMs. Or, y'know, a visual key everyone can look at. Edit: Yeah, I can definitely work with this: 
PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 08:21 on Aug 20, 2013 |
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Aug 20, 2013 08:07
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Just make sure everyone is clear on which unit they're commanding.
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Aug 20, 2013 08:12
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*sniff* thank you The Merry Marauder and Shoeless Cicada. I know you just did it for the kicks, but you can rest assured if the Concordat wins these battles we'll stomp on plenty of extra radiation sick orphans in your name.
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Aug 20, 2013 09:33
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Hooray for insomnia! The current colors even pass my colorblindness test! 
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Aug 20, 2013 09:41
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Readingaccount posted:*sniff* thank you The Merry Marauder and Shoeless Cicada. If you broadcast your intent to stomp orphans across open channels, the Cappellans will likely switch sides immediately. 
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Aug 20, 2013 10:05
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Ahhh, looks like I was too late and my selection's been finalized. PTN offered to change the exact terms of my unit limits, and I ended up deciding on something even meaner than the Cicada, but guess I got it in too late. Oh well, Cicada's still one nasty jump snipy piece of work!
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Aug 20, 2013 11:40
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It is a good thing the player force has a decent amount of pulse and LB/X. Super mobile enemies aren't quite as scary.
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Aug 20, 2013 15:36
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You stomp on orphans, then the anti-justice foot will have to be crushed by the real deal.
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Aug 20, 2013 15:45
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KnoxZone posted:It is a good thing the player force has a decent amount of pulse and LB/X. Super mobile enemies aren't quite as scary. Assuming PTN didn't choose the map background for the force reveal arbitrarily, those weapons are on the other mapsheet.
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Aug 20, 2013 15:54
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So, no one has any opinion? I'll take that to mean I'm good to go.
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Aug 20, 2013 17:17
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I prefer the numbers personally, but not enough to press the issue.
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Aug 20, 2013 17:20
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Numbers may be more helpful to those more unfamiliar with Battletech, but it's not a huge hurdle to overcome so go ahead with the no-numbering.
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Aug 20, 2013 17:23
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I like the icons, but I'm familiar with playing in Megamek where you can select something if you've forgotten what it is. I think it'll be OK though. The camo patterns should make it clear who is on whose team, and each player should be able to remember what his own mech looks like, and you'll have that reference key (and we've always had to use a key anyway to look up which mech A4 is).
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Aug 20, 2013 17:24
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What would help for not-BT players like myself was if someone made an effortpost about the various Mech's capabilities before the battle starts - like we had at the beginning of the thread, sooo long ago - so we can match the pritty pictures to what we know about the Mechs on the field. Not that I want to guilt anyone into an effortpost of course...
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Aug 20, 2013 18:10
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Yeah, I personally prefer the numbers. I had to look up which number was which mech almost every single round during the film-making  I just don't have enough experience to tell what mech is what solely by model unless its a super-distinctive one like the Battlemaster.
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Aug 20, 2013 18:11
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Would this be distinctive enough?
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Aug 20, 2013 18:16
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Actually, yes, yes it would. Thanks!
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Aug 20, 2013 18:17
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Amhazair posted:What would help for not-BT players like myself was if someone made an effortpost about the various Mech's capabilities before the battle starts - like we had at the beginning of the thread, sooo long ago - so we can match the pritty pictures to what we know about the Mechs on the field. Well I don't know how useful this is gonna be, but hopefully it does the job? First up we have the Watchman. As I believe PTN himself said months and months ago, it's as solid as you can get for a trooper mech. Move profile of 5/8/5 is decent, average of tech level 1 Medium tonnage mechs. The primary weapon is a Large Laser, putting out 8 damage up to 15 hexes away. Backup weapons are a pair of 5-damage Medium Lasers shooting out to 9 hexes for 3 heat, and a pair of MGs (3 hex range, 2 damage for 0 heat) for anti infantry work, complete with an explosive 200 rounds of ammo for them. This isn't quite as bad as it could be, as the Watchman seem to have one piece of Tech Level 2 equipment: CASE. Combined with eight and a half tons of armor (136 out of 137 points, for those like me to whom the tonnage means nothing)and the Watchman 4M can actually take quite a beating before going down. The one thing that it's got to watch out for is its heat. It only packs 12 single heat sinks, and with that Large Laser creating 8 every time it fires, it'll start to overheat just by firing that alone and jumping 5, albeit only by 1. Tactical advice: Try to get at least a +2 to hit move mod if you're not jumping, by moving a total of 5-6 hexes at a walk or run. If you can manage 7-8 hexes for +3, so much the better. If you jump, in all but some exceptional circumstances like needing to get to an enemy's blind spot or in range for a kick, you will want to jump the maximum 5 hexes. Lastly, all your weapons are arm mounted. Large Laser and MGs in the left, Medium Lasers in the right. This'll let you have better arc of fire, at the cost of slightly more vulnerability to losing your weapons if your arms get shot off. Should you find yourself weaponless, remember that you're still 40 tons of war machine. Charges, DFAs, and kicks can still be done. The Blackjack is next. This guy is basically a mini Awesome, in that he's got armor, all energy weapons, and probably isn't gonna go down in a hurry! Move profile of 4/6/4 isn't too bad, though a tad on the slow side for a 45 tonner. This is made up for by its extensive weapons array. Each arm, which are flippable to hit enemies in your rear arc, don't forget!, mounts a PPC for 10 damage out to 18 hexes with a 3 hex minimum range and 10 heat, and Medium Laser. One more Medium Laser is found in each side torso. This Blackjack mounts the same armor as the Watchman, 136/137 points, and even has double heat sinks, a whole ten of them! This should allow you to fire both primary weapons while moving with little overheat, and you can always cool down by not firing one PPC, or switching to PPC+2x Medium Lasers. Tactics: You can brawl and skirmish at range roughly equally well. You're not as fast as the rest of your team so coordinate and don't get separated. If the enemy wants to stay at range, hit them with your PPCs but don't be afraid to get up close and personal with your quad Medium Lasers. And remember your PPC's minimum range, if the enemy gets within that, you're probably better off swapping to the Mediums for that round. Thirdly we have a nice piece of Cappy salvage. Sadly, this variant lacks any EWar capabilities and is a pure combat machine. Moving 5/8/5, it's rather slow for a Light mech, especially one packing two tons of ammo with no CASE. Even so, you've got a pair of MGs with 200 rounds of ammo in the left arm, two Medium Lasers in the right, and an SRM 6 in the right torso, sending up to 6 missiles out to 9 hexes away, two damage per missile, 4 heat. You're pretty well protected for your weight at 112/119 points of armor, and 12 single heat sinks should handle what you can put out as long as you don't constantly jump and alpha. Tactix: wait for the Watchman, Blackjack and Firebee to open holes in the enemy's armor, then fill them with your SRMs and MGs. I believe you have flippy arms like the Blackjack as well, so keep that in mind. The last mech of the first force is the Firebee. Outfitted with a Large Laser, same as the Watchman, along with a quartet of SRM 2s (2 heat each) with a total 100 rounds of ammo between them, the Firebee looks like a solid trooper Light mech. You've got decent offense with some holepunching ability that the Large Laser provides, as well as critseekers with those 8 SRM tubes. With a move profile of 5/8/5 you're on par with the rest of the lance . 96/119 points of armor is quite respectable for a tech level 1 Light mech, half again as much as the well known Jenner and Javelin mount! You only have the base 10 single heat sinks though, so be careful about jumping while firing your Large Laser, or alpha striking even while walking. Tictacs: You're a 5 ton lighter Watchman with slightly different backup weapons. Keep mobile, hit the enemy with your big gun, and when their armor shows holes, bring out the SRMs. Your weapons are scattered across your mech fairly well so any one location removed shouldn't clip your wings too bad. Moving on to the second lance, we start with the Royal Griffin. 5/8/5 on a 55 tonner is quite good, and the weapon and equipment loadout is top notch! You've got an ER PPC firing out to 23 hexes at 10 damage for 15 heat, backed by a pair of SRM 6s with two 15-round ammo bays, enough that you have room for normal and inferno rounds. You've got the most armor yet, at 179/185 points, along with 11 double heat sinks. At the same time, you have CASE protecting your ammo as well as Guardian ECM to mess with any enemy NARC or Artemis IV missile systems. Definitely a top of the line mech. Bloc and Tackle: You can do pretty much any job well. Sniping, holepunching, critseeking, playing a jump hard to hit annoyance, tanking damage, anti infantry with infernos, you name it you can probably do it. Stay mobile and hit the enemy from a distance if you can, though since you'll need to link up with the Cappy survivors that may limit your ability to play keep away. Still, keep mobile, try for +2 to hit mods or better. Enfield is next. Like the Griffin, this baby's chock full of TL 2 stuff. You've got a Large Pulse Laser (10 hex range, 9 damage, 10 heat, -2 to hit mod) paired with an LBX/10 AC (18 hexes, 10 damage OR 10 single-point cluster table, 2 heat) with 10 rounds each of slug and cluster rounds as your primary armaments. Backing this up are two Medium Lasers and a Small Laser (3 hex range 3 damage 1 heat). All in all, nice firepower. Armor's good too at 169/169 points for this 50-ton mech. You have 11 double heat sinks, and move 5/8 which should allow you to fire most weapons while moving and not worry about heat. In fact, baring outside heat sources you can run and alpha all day without worry. CASE protects your ammo bays, however it doesn't really help you that much. Why is that? Well you're packing a fragile XL Engine. Lose either side torso and you're out of the battle. So while CASE might keep your mech from being totaled, a hit to the ammo or just plain enough damage to shear off the left/right torso will render you combat ineffective. Final Battletech Tactics Advance: Same as everyone else in that you want to stay mobile and hard to hit. You've got good armor, good speed, and nice weapons. With your fragility born from XL Engine however, more than any mech previously talked about you want to make yourself hard to hit. Not much terrain on your map it would seem, so there's not a lot you can do to limit the op4's ability to see you. Your Large Pulse Laser is also fairly short ranged, meaning you'll want to get within 7 hexes to get the most benefit from it. It's a balancing act of risk vs reward in that regard, whether you keep at range or close in to brawl. The Huron Warrior is our next mech. Another Medium class mech, you've got the biggest gun so far. Moving 5/8 with a Gauss Rifle (22 hex range, 15 damage, 1 heat, 2 hex minimum range) with 16 rounds of ammo, you're a mobile sniper, capable of headcapping anything the enemy sends. You are the great equalizer, felling a mighty Archangel as easily as you might a Husssar should you hit them in the head. Backing this up is an ER Large Laser (19 hex range, 8 damage, 12 heat) which is honestly rather underwhelming. 4 more hexes of range over a standard Large Laser and 4 more heat per shot, it definitely cements you as the team's sniper. As a backup weapon you have a single Medium Pulse Laser (6 hex range, 6 damage, 4 heat, -2 to hit). 160/169 points of armor is respectable, however you have two massive flaws, one of which may not be immediately obvious. First, you've got another fragile XL engine freeing up the tonnage for that monster Gauss Rifle. You also lack CASE, meaning a Guass Rifle crit will eject you from the mech even if your mech were to somehow survive the 20 point damage hit the explosion causes. If possible, ask PTN about turning off autoeject? Though as you're no Death Commando, he may well not allow it. The second, less noticeable flaw, is that you only have 11 single heat sinks. With one of your weapons creating 12 heat. Yes, it's about as bad as it sounds. As it is you can run, fire the ER Large Laser and Guass and create 4 heat, then not fire the ER Large next round to cool off. I've run out of weird takes on ways to say Tactics: Keep on the move with your fragile engine and explosive Gauss Rifle. Keep hitting the enemy as long as you can, even if you have to stop firing half your primary weapons every other turn because what are double heat sinks. Work with the Griffin if you can to pick enemies off from a distance. Last, the Wolverine. 5/8/5 seems to be quite the popular move speed for this scenario. Weapon loadout is a Large Pulse Laser, a Medium Pulse Laser, and a Small Pulse Laser (3 hex range, 3 damage, 2 heat, -2 to hit) and a pair of SRM 6s with two single ton ammo bays. Bearing the distinction of Most Heavily Armored Mech in this match, you've got 185/185 points of armor, along with 13 double heat sinks. To balance this, you've got an XL Engine and no CASE for your ammo. Tactics: You've got speed and maneuverability, but your weapons max out at range 10. This means that to be effective you'll need to get in close and brawl. Try not to expose your weaker rear armor if possible, and definitely ask if you can have one of your SRM bays loaded with Infernos. You're basically running interception on the enemy force, keeping them from closing with the Griffin and Huron Warrior, letting the snipers continue to beat the enemy from a distance. Hope that provides some help for people unfamiliar with the mechs for this match.
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Aug 20, 2013 19:31
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Listen to this guy he knows what he's talking about. I'm throwing together a googledoc as we speak for the pilots.
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Aug 20, 2013 20:17
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Hurray! I contributed to this thread! I shall live on forever! Or more acurately: I guilted someone else in contributing and rightfuly no one will remember me. But I'm content anyway. 
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Aug 20, 2013 21:12
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I-it's not like I w-wanted to be helpful or anything... I just felt like it!
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Aug 20, 2013 21:17
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As a point for the enfield and other guys with ammo, tell ptn what load out you want (entire lb-x10 ammo is cluster, really it is worth it) griffin might want a ton of infernos etc.
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Aug 20, 2013 21:19
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Thank you Shoeless, I know more now.
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Aug 20, 2013 21:33
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Shoeless posted:The Huron Warrior is our next mech. This has always baffled me about the Huron Warrior. It's already expensive (Gauss rifle, ERLL, XL Engine, Endo Steel), why skimp and put single heats sinks on it? Was there an internal memo at FASA to cripple any potentially useful 'mech? 20 DHS would have made it pretty dang useful.
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Aug 20, 2013 22:31
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Thanks shoeless. I feel I have a much better idea of what I'm doing. This is my first time piloting a mech so advice is always welcome.
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Aug 20, 2013 22:33
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PhotoKirk posted:This has always baffled me about the Huron Warrior. It's already expensive (Gauss rifle, ERLL, XL Engine, Endo Steel), why skimp and put single heats sinks on it? Was there an internal memo at FASA to cripple any potentially useful 'mech? 20 DHS would have made it pretty dang useful. Cost isn't considered a balancing factor, because you generally aren't "playing" the economy side of things.
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Aug 20, 2013 22:40
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PhotoKirk posted:This has always baffled me about the Huron Warrior. It's already expensive (Gauss rifle, ERLL, XL Engine, Endo Steel), why skimp and put single heats sinks on it? Was there an internal memo at FASA to cripple any potentially useful 'mech? 20 DHS would have made it pretty dang useful. Few things - one, not every 'Mech in the pre-Jihad era made sensible design choices; indeed, most did not. This gave units character and was at least in part a nod to the idiosyncrasies of military procurement. Second, TR:3055 was already chock full of Gauss&Hvy Energy/XL/DHS builds, and frankly, anything that differentiates the Huron Warrior is a plus. Third, I don't know where you'd get the tonnage for 20 DHS, but maybe you mean 20 heat dissipation from ten DHS? I mean, you make 15 if you run and fire the big stuff, so it seems relatively low priority.
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Aug 20, 2013 22:46
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A lot of these are fluff, the inner sphere got Gauss Rifles and ERLargeLasers back before they rediscovered DoubleHeatSinks. Endo steel saves more weight for the same bulk as ferro fibrous but, you can just tear off the standard armor and put on ferro very rapidly while rebuilding a mech's skeleton is basically making a whole new mech after all. So a lot of oddities are just for story purposes
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Aug 20, 2013 22:47
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The Merry Marauder posted:Few things - one, not every 'Mech in the pre-Jihad era made sensible design choices; indeed, most did not. This gave units character and was at least in part a nod to the idiosyncrasies of military procurement. Second, TR:3055 was already chock full of Gauss&Hvy Energy/XL/DHS builds, and frankly, anything that differentiates the Huron Warrior is a plus. Third, I don't know where you'd get the tonnage for 20 DHS, but maybe you mean 20 heat dissipation from ten DHS? I mean, you make 15 if you run and fire the big stuff, so it seems relatively low priority. Dammit - 10 DHS, 20 heat dissipation. I need sleep.
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Aug 20, 2013 22:50
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The Merry Marauder posted:Few things - one, not every 'Mech in the pre-Jihad era made sensible design choices; indeed, most did not. This gave units character and was at least in part a nod to the idiosyncrasies of military procurement. Second, TR:3055 was already chock full of Gauss&Hvy Energy/XL/DHS builds, and frankly, anything that differentiates the Huron Warrior is a plus. Third, I don't know where you'd get the tonnage for 20 DHS, but maybe you mean 20 heat dissipation from ten DHS? The Huron Warrior got that upgrade anyways, the R4O basically just trades for doubles and exchanges the 11th sink for another ton of armor in 3065, about 10 years after it was first introduced.
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Aug 20, 2013 22:52
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Soylent Pudding posted:Thanks shoeless. I feel I have a much better idea of what I'm doing. This is my first time piloting a mech so advice is always welcome. No problem. Yeah, the Blackjack you're piloting's pretty good, has a lot of potential to just not die. Which you probably want. As for the Huron Warrior, yeah, I don't even know either. People can talk about "character" and stuff all they want, it's still a bad design decision. Undersinked mechs in level 1 tech, fine. Undersinked to alpha, but sinked when firing in various range bands? Just dandy. But when you're already going all out with XL Engine, TL 2 weapons, etc etc, it just is silly to not include something as basic as making it so your mech can sink all its heat. It would add barely any cost to Cbills, and I don't think even change its BV much if at all. Yes yes real life silly military stuff. But come on this is a major design flaw. It breaks my suspension of disbelief, basically.
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Aug 20, 2013 22:58
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Shoeless, I think the in-universe rationale for the HS issue is that it was supposed to be two LRM-15s at long, and four mediums close, for which you don't actually need DHS. I like that sort of thing, you're free not to, obviously. The original blurb in 3055 might say something else, but I have that packed away, pretty full-color Huron and Unseen IICs notwithstanding. Yeah, they go through and "fix" stuff in the Upgrade series which is fair enough. By that time, it makes sense in-universe, and you don't have to entice people into the construction rules by then in the metagame. The Merry Marauder fucked around with this message at 23:01 on Aug 20, 2013 |
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Aug 20, 2013 22:58
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The Huron Warrior's flaws may be completely mitigated by the AU Capellan Confederation's decision to mount iHS on loving everything
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Aug 20, 2013 23:05
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That would mitigate it yes. I assumed a refit like that would have given it a different designation/production code so I went with the basic. Yeah, be prepared to surprises I guess is a caveat I should have put in that post.
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Aug 20, 2013 23:11
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AU CapCon: Stomping orphans without raising a sweat.
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Aug 20, 2013 23:14
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Soylent Pudding posted:Thanks shoeless. I feel I have a much better idea of what I'm doing. This is my first time piloting a mech so advice is always welcome. Always include backup orders if your first target is unavailable, and never be afraid to ask PTN about whether something will work/be out of range/whatever. Also for the love of god, get your orders in on time! Don't fall into the trap of taking forever to obsess over every detail and burning out - win or lose, it will still be a good story.
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Aug 20, 2013 23:19
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PhotoKirk posted:This has always baffled me about the Huron Warrior. It's already expensive (Gauss rifle, ERLL, XL Engine, Endo Steel), why skimp and put single heats sinks on it? Was there an internal memo at FASA to cripple any potentially useful 'mech? 20 DHS would have made it pretty dang useful. 1. FASA always had a thing for making intentionally not-quite-ideal mechs for canon reasons. Not sure about the Huron Warrior itself, but it could have been a cost-cutting measure in-universe. Like in real life, BTech manufacturers sometimes do weird things for no reason. 2. There actually is a variant with double heat sinks now. 3. Shoeless is pretty on point with most of the analysis. I want to reiterate that for any mech that can, you want to shoot for a walk: 5 or run: 7 every turn; that way the to-hit mods you're inflicting on yourself for moving are less severe than the ones you're forcing your opponents to deal with when they shoot you. Blackjack aside, this force is made for run-n-gun and keeping those move mods up. Try to plot a turn or two ahead so that you can guarantee those walk: 5 or run: 7/8 moves. 4. For the Griffin-Enfield combo - and the WVR if it activates - try to set up shots on people's back where possible. With the LPLs and ERPPC, you can punch a hole, and then fill it with SRMs and LBx pellets. If there's ammo or engines to crit, you will probably get a bunch of crits. And while that applies to firing at any arc on a target, if you can set up the shots from behind you have a good chance to one-turn-kill a target. Never underestimate the power of critseeking.
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Aug 20, 2013 23:26
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PoptartsNinja posted:The Huron Warrior's flaws may be completely mitigated by the AU Capellan Confederation's decision to mount iHS on loving everything  Have I mentioned that you are a wonderful man/Cardassian not spy, with no flaws lately?
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Aug 20, 2013 23:57
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PoptartsNinja posted:The Huron Warrior's flaws may be completely mitigated by the AU Capellan Confederation's decision to mount iHS on loving everything This makes me very happy as the Huron pilot.
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Aug 21, 2013 00:30
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Olothreutes posted:This makes me very happy as the Huron pilot. In this time of need and in the spirit of the star league two great powers reunite to take the fight back to a genocidal bunch of military fanatics. drat there goes my plan to give the capellans a proper
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Aug 21, 2013 00:44
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