Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us $3,400 per month for bandwidth bills alone, and since we don't believe in shoving popup ads to our registered users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
«515 »
  • Post
  • Reply
Jack B Nimble
Dec 25, 2007



Soiled Meat

My take down/general stand up is worse than pretty much anyone else at my gym (that isn't considerably smaller or newer than me, and even some who are) and in last weekend's open mat I got absolutley crushed by a visiting fellow one stripe white belt, every interaction was him getting an immediate take down (and not just one kind) into side control, scarf, or even back. Afterwards we rolled positional, just doing the take downs, and I got him once when he flubbed that basic judo leg trip but he took me down another dozen times. His grips were also out of my league.

The good news is that, rather than being discouraged, I'm excited to see how much room I have to grow and improve. I've been practicing my double leg after each class and starting on my feet with anyone that's willing. My gym will probably host the next open mat in about six months, I hope I see him again.

Jack B Nimble fucked around with this message at Mar 19, 2019 around 15:44

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Decades
Apr 12, 2007

1969 in the sunshine


College Slice

Got another spot of MRSA, second time in a few months. Feels like every time I set my eye on a competition and plan to ramp up my body just goes into rebellion. It's a good excuse to finish resting up my ankle at least, but always a drag losing the momentum.

Tacos Al Pastor
Jun 20, 2003


Decades posted:

Feels like every time I set my eye on a competition and plan to ramp up my body just goes into rebellion.

Same here. Everytime I plan to compete I either end up sick or injured

ICHIBAHN
Feb 21, 2007


Blueberry?

Hellblazer187
Oct 12, 2003

Ozzy and Zakk

ICHIBAHN posted:

Blueberry?

Blue belt. Next flavor is grape but that's some time from now.

Drewjitsu
Sep 2, 2007

Muay Thai is great but Buttscoot-Shin-to-Balls Style is undeniably better.


I'm working towards being poo poo, thank you very much.

Or kiwi maybe?

Hellblazer187
Oct 12, 2003

Ozzy and Zakk

If we're sticking with flavors, chocolate is the most obvious.

Dave Grool
Oct 21, 2008



Grimey Drawer

If the goal is licorice, that's not super motivating

e: candy cane is also not especially appealing

Drewjitsu
Sep 2, 2007

Muay Thai is great but Buttscoot-Shin-to-Balls Style is undeniably better.


Hellblazer187 posted:

If we're sticking with flavors, chocolate is the most obvious.

Yeah, how did I miss that one. Yikes.

Hellblazer187
Oct 12, 2003

Ozzy and Zakk

I actually like licorice a lot lmao. But you know if we're sticking with fruit it can be blackberry as well.

I haven't really thought about the whole food thing that much. I remember asking on some BJJ chat about going back to training when I got my blue in 2015 and then basically did no training at all after early 2017. And someone said "don't worry, you're still a blueberry" and I just decided I liked that.

Jerome Louis
Nov 5, 2002
p

College Slice

Lost my temper last night during a roll and I'm embarrassed.

Big former college wrestler, but a BJJ white belt, been at the gym for a month and he's known for going crazy 100% intensity on top, then if he gets swept he taps. He also asks smaller white belts to start standing and then goes for high velocity throws complete with crashing his weight down on them. He hurt a buddy of mine last week doing this.

Rolled with him last night, I start from butterfly and he immediately starts going full intensity, diving passes, trying to throw me around, etc. I play relaxed for a minute or so but he's going full out. I turtle and he cross faces me hard across the nose - not really to set anything up, just to make me uncomfortable. So I roll to half guard, sweep, get on top and try to smash him into dust.

He tapped literally seconds after I sweep and I see red. I just say "Too bad, we're going to keep going" and he says "No man I smoke I'm so tired" and I just say "That's too bad". He turtles and I clock choke him hard. He taps and I tell him that he can't go full intensity on top and then tap as soon as he loses the advantage, that's BS. He kinda just sits there then goes and sits off the mats for the rest of rolling.

I immediately kind of get embarrassed. I'm 35 years old, I'm not some hot headed 20 year old and I should respect the tap regardless if I think it's a BS reason. I tell my coach and he says not to worry about, that guy needed someone to teach him a lesson and he was glad it was me since I wouldn't have actually hurt him (I'm usually a teddy bear).

So yeah, reflecting on it, the guy needed some guidance, but I lost my temper and didn't respect his tap. I apologized to him during the class bow out and he kinda shrugged it off and said it was fine but he still looked a little upset.

What do you guys think - not a big deal? or did I display full thuggery? Anyone ever lose their poo poo while rolling before?

CommonShore
Jun 6, 2014




Pillbug

Jerome Louis posted:

Lost my temper last night during a roll and I'm embarrassed.

Big former college wrestler, but a BJJ white belt, been at the gym for a month and he's known for going crazy 100% intensity on top, then if he gets swept he taps. He also asks smaller white belts to start standing and then goes for high velocity throws complete with crashing his weight down on them. He hurt a buddy of mine last week doing this.

Rolled with him last night, I start from butterfly and he immediately starts going full intensity, diving passes, trying to throw me around, etc. I play relaxed for a minute or so but he's going full out. I turtle and he cross faces me hard across the nose - not really to set anything up, just to make me uncomfortable. So I roll to half guard, sweep, get on top and try to smash him into dust.

He tapped literally seconds after I sweep and I see red. I just say "Too bad, we're going to keep going" and he says "No man I smoke I'm so tired" and I just say "That's too bad". He turtles and I clock choke him hard. He taps and I tell him that he can't go full intensity on top and then tap as soon as he loses the advantage, that's BS. He kinda just sits there then goes and sits off the mats for the rest of rolling.

I immediately kind of get embarrassed. I'm 35 years old, I'm not some hot headed 20 year old and I should respect the tap regardless if I think it's a BS reason. I tell my coach and he says not to worry about, that guy needed someone to teach him a lesson and he was glad it was me since I wouldn't have actually hurt him (I'm usually a teddy bear).

So yeah, reflecting on it, the guy needed some guidance, but I lost my temper and didn't respect his tap. I apologized to him during the class bow out and he kinda shrugged it off and said it was fine but he still looked a little upset.

What do you guys think - not a big deal? or did I display full thuggery? Anyone ever lose their poo poo while rolling before?

You're wrong not to respect the tap, but less, or at least differently, wrong than him. Your coach really should have intervened with this guy previously if he has been showing a pattern.

I've gotten mad while rolling before, but it usually turns into something that resembles a borderline mma fight, with slams, hard knees on belly, and shoulder punches instead of strikes. It typically happens with one specific dude, a probably-roided military guy with mma experience. He always goes really hard, and rolls to win, even doing things like ignoring the constraints of a positional drill, diving into subs, or continuing to crank a bell to get a tap. poo poo with him always escalates when we roll. One time I was doing a CJJ round with him (it was a military combatives practice at my friend's club) and by the end of the round we were legitimately giving more-than-50% force palm strikes to each other's bodies. And the more he gets challenged, the more he escalates - he's super chill against white belts who he can dominate, he's respectable against brown belts who dominate him, but he goes crazy against the blue/purple belts with whom it's a closer match. I avoid rolling with him now because I always end up with an injury, and I always feel embarrassed that I got dragged into the poo poo. And it happens every time.

Mel Mudkiper
Jan 19, 2012

Is it a Pittsburgh fan?
Is it a Denver fan?
Who can say?

We had a similar situation at our school and our instructor had a really good response to it. He basically told the wrestling guy he had to start from a submissive position every roll for the next week. He basically said "Do you want to win a roll that doesn't matter, or do you want to get better?"

Going forward I would take that direction with him if you see him again. Yeah, you went seriously overboard but I can understand why you got frustrated. I am still on the bench more or less because of a spazzy dude. I think for people like him, its probably better to frame the lesson in "what you are doing will not make you better"

SHOAH NUFF
Nov 14, 2005

Blood Clots
Sweat Dries
Bones Heal
Suck it Up and Keep Wrestling


How often are you guys able to triangle someone from bottom side control? Where you push their head toward your legs and make sure the choking arm is in the right place and then lock it up. any good videos on it?

Mel Mudkiper
Jan 19, 2012

Is it a Pittsburgh fan?
Is it a Denver fan?
Who can say?

SHOAH NUFF posted:

How often are you guys able to triangle someone from bottom side control? Where you push their head toward your legs and make sure the choking arm is in the right place and then lock it up. any good videos on it?

I didn't even know that was possible

SHOAH NUFF
Nov 14, 2005

Blood Clots
Sweat Dries
Bones Heal
Suck it Up and Keep Wrestling


Mel Mudkiper posted:

I didn't even know that was possible

I was asking because I saw this

https://www.instagram.com/housebjj/...id=tknf7jxyu8iy

But was wondering how practical it is in live rolling bc it seems like it requires a lot of brute force to push the top guys head down that far unless they are much lighter than you.

Instagram is a very wasteful place, I see and forget lots of cool yet impractical looking stuff there

CommonShore
Jun 6, 2014




Pillbug

SHOAH NUFF posted:

How often are you guys able to triangle someone from bottom side control? Where you push their head toward your legs and make sure the choking arm is in the right place and then lock it up. any good videos on it?

It's an orthodox judo technique, and there's not much to it: top player hooks your outside leg, you push on the ear and hook the head with your outside leg, triangle the feet and try to snag the wrist int he process. I do it a ton against white belts if they hook my leg. Occasionally I'll make it happen against someone more experienced and try to finish with a toe hold or kimura.

It stops working once people learn to block it by hooking your shoulder or to tear out of it via knee on belly or shin on face.

Jerome Louis
Nov 5, 2002
p

College Slice

SHOAH NUFF posted:

How often are you guys able to triangle someone from bottom side control? Where you push their head toward your legs and make sure the choking arm is in the right place and then lock it up. any good videos on it?

I've never hit it on someone but I've had it done to me a few times when doing over under passes and being sloppy with leaving my arm in as I pass the legs

Mel Mudkiper
Jan 19, 2012

Is it a Pittsburgh fan?
Is it a Denver fan?
Who can say?

SHOAH NUFF posted:

I was asking because I saw this

https://www.instagram.com/housebjj/...id=tknf7jxyu8iy

But was wondering how practical it is in live rolling bc it seems like it requires a lot of brute force to push the top guys head down that far unless they are much lighter than you.

Instagram is a very wasteful place, I see and forget lots of cool yet impractical looking stuff there

God dammit I am gonna be thinking of this until I can roll again

Like, it looks like it will work but I know there is a probably a reason it won't and I want to find out what it is

EDIT: Ah, I see the issue. Someone in side control is probably never gonna be that far over. The balance of the guy on top is all wrong.

Mel Mudkiper fucked around with this message at Mar 20, 2019 around 15:42

CommonShore
Jun 6, 2014




Pillbug

I just watched the video and I'm not so sure about that version of it. If someone did that to me I'd just put my shin on his head, and I'd be more worried about the finish coming from a straight armlock over the shoulder than from the strangle itself.

SHOAH NUFF
Nov 14, 2005

Blood Clots
Sweat Dries
Bones Heal
Suck it Up and Keep Wrestling


Thanks for the responses guys. Here is another version of triangle from bottom SC.

https://www.instagram.com/p/BuysdNo...d=1m6bg22m71kzd


As a beginner I have no clue which one is more practical but in my limited experience the first one seems really hard bc most good BJJ guys will not have their head that far down near your hips unless you do some sort of explosive shrimp and frame to briefly get it there which I suppose is describing any move.

In this 2nd video the guy uses a technique to get the head down near his legs: sleeve control and then pushing on the bicep to lever their body in that direction

Hellblazer187
Oct 12, 2003

Ozzy and Zakk

Seems like big wrestler guy was in your gym just to beat people up. You did the right thing (teach him a lesson) in the wrong way (not respecting a tap). Your professor really should have intervened earlier, especially if he's slamming white belts with high velocity throws.

Did you let the pressure off a bit when he tapped? Was your top game really heavy? I think depending on the nuance here, there would be ways of handling this that look similar to what you did, to be honest. Not respecting a tap is an extremely dangerous game to play but obviously you weren't cranking an armbar or choke at the time.

Truth is I wouldn't feel too embarrassed or upset. Treat it as a learning opportunity for how to deal with this sort of thing in the future.



I want to tap from bottom a lot because I'm a big fat rear end. "no man, I eat candy so I'm tired."

Mel Mudkiper
Jan 19, 2012

Is it a Pittsburgh fan?
Is it a Denver fan?
Who can say?

SHOAH NUFF posted:

Thanks for the responses guys. Here is another version of triangle from bottom SC.

https://www.instagram.com/p/BuysdNo...d=1m6bg22m71kzd


As a beginner I have no clue which one is more practical but in my limited experience the first one seems really hard bc most good BJJ guys will not have their head that far down near your hips unless you do some sort of explosive shrimp and frame to briefly get it there which I suppose is describing any move.

In this 2nd video the guy uses a technique to get the head down near his legs: sleeve control and then pushing on the bicep to lever their body in that direction

Again it seems unlikely to my amateur rear end that a dude on top will be that off-balance voluntarily. In both cases the guy's balance is completely off-center. I would be curious to see what you can do to set the guy up in that position first because I doubt someone would do it consciously.

CommonShore
Jun 6, 2014




Pillbug

SHOAH NUFF posted:

Thanks for the responses guys. Here is another version of triangle from bottom SC.

https://www.instagram.com/p/BuysdNo...d=1m6bg22m71kzd


As a beginner I have no clue which one is more practical but in my limited experience the first one seems really hard bc most good BJJ guys will not have their head that far down near your hips unless you do some sort of explosive shrimp and frame to briefly get it there which I suppose is describing any move.

In this 2nd video the guy uses a technique to get the head down near his legs: sleeve control and then pushing on the bicep to lever their body in that direction

That second version is very different from the first, and the second one is more realistic in my experience. It's just an entry to an inverted triangle, really.

MalleusDei
Mar 21, 2007



CommonShore posted:

That second version is very different from the first, and the second one is more realistic in my experience. It's just an entry to an inverted triangle, really.

The second one is legit. When I was training regularly, a brown belt would catch me in this all the time. If nothing else, you create a little space and distraction while they try to get their arm free. There's also a straight armbar there, if they keep their arm around your neck.

Mel Mudkiper
Jan 19, 2012

Is it a Pittsburgh fan?
Is it a Denver fan?
Who can say?

CommonShore posted:

That second version is very different from the first, and the second one is more realistic in my experience. It's just an entry to an inverted triangle, really.


MalleusDei posted:

The second one is legit. When I was training regularly, a brown belt would catch me in this all the time. If nothing else, you create a little space and distraction while they try to get their arm free. There's also a straight armbar there, if they keep their arm around your neck.

Going back to my question, how do you set someone up to be that far part your sternum from bottom? Most guys I roll with would never let their center of balance be that far over.

Tacos Al Pastor
Jun 20, 2003


Jerome Louis posted:

Lost my temper last night during a roll and I'm embarrassed.

We have a guy in our gym that is exactly like this. As a matter of fact Ill probably see him today at lunch! I have tapped this dude a few times already and each time he just comes at me like his life depends on it. I noticed yesterday he was doing this with a guest of the gym that had rolled in from Brazil. Talk about rude! Hes also a cop and I mean no disrespect to any police out there, but some (a fraction) of them can be total dicks and if you tap them they really really let it affect their ego.

As for losing it, I have only lost my poo poo once on a dude and when I tapped him my coach just looked over at me with a grin on his face because he knew that dude needed to be checked too.

MalleusDei
Mar 21, 2007



Mel Mudkiper posted:

Going back to my question, how do you set someone up to be that far part your sternum from bottom? Most guys I roll with would never let their center of balance be that far over.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Age3Y7UcgOs

I've always fought for wrist control, and then snuck a knee in, to stretch them out and make space (I've got long legs), but Kurt pushes the head in this one.

CommonShore
Jun 6, 2014




Pillbug

Mel Mudkiper posted:

Going back to my question, how do you set someone up to be that far part your sternum from bottom? Most guys I roll with would never let their center of balance be that far over.

It happens in two ways - 1) they hook and cradle your leg, 2) you're shrimping and framing. The latter is especially common against people who are pressure passing through your half guard. In either case as a smaller guy, when I push on the head I move my hips up as much as I move my opponent down. It's a small guy scramble move which relies on chaos or your opponent's error.

Again though, you've really identified the main problem with the technique - that nobody good will get caught by it without some kind of scramble or setup. When I say that it's an orthodox judo technique, I really mean it, and the judo demonstration shows it as ineffective - it's the first (failed) escape for the fourth pin in Gatame no Kata, the extremely old hyper-conservative ground techniques demonstration. It's so old that it's the only place I know of in Kodokan Judo where you can still find a leg lock. Tori gets yoko shiho gatame - side control with an outside leg cradle to a belt grip. Uke's first escape is to push on the head and try to get the triangle; tori counters by pulling on uke's head a bit with the left arm and leaning into uke's face for a bit of shoulder of justice.

Dave Grool
Oct 21, 2008



Grimey Drawer

Tacos Al Pastor posted:

We have a guy in our gym that is exactly like this. As a matter of fact Ill probably see him today at lunch! I have tapped this dude a few times already and each time he just comes at me like his life depends on it. I noticed yesterday he was doing this with a guest of the gym that had rolled in from Brazil. Talk about rude! Hes also a cop and I mean no disrespect to any police out there, but some (a fraction) of them can be total dicks and if you tap them they really really let it affect their ego.

As for losing it, I have only lost my poo poo once on a dude and when I tapped him my coach just looked over at me with a grin on his face because he knew that dude needed to be checked too.

Most cops that do jiu-jitsu aren't dicks, but every person I've ever trained with that made it to blue belt and was still a raging dickhead on the mats has been a cop

Dave Grool fucked around with this message at Mar 20, 2019 around 18:10

Wangsbig
May 27, 2007



ACAB

heeebrew
Sep 6, 2007

Weed smokin', joint tokin', fake Jew of the Weed thread


Here's one of my teammates killing a dude with a triangle from bottom side control - https://www.flograppling.com/video/...s-flytrap-choke

Tacos Al Pastor
Jun 20, 2003


heeebrew posted:

Here's one of my teammates killing a dude with a triangle from bottom side control - https://www.flograppling.com/video/...s-flytrap-choke

I see these types of chokes and Im just like "my leg wont do that", but then Ill go and try it

Drewjitsu
Sep 2, 2007

Muay Thai is great but Buttscoot-Shin-to-Balls Style is undeniably better.


If it makes you guys feel better there's a cop at my gym that I constantly rinse as he's slightly less good at leg locks than I am, and we always get involved in the leg game.

As for the dude who goes hard and then taps when he gets swept, you did the right wrong thing to him, and now it's time to talk to the coach about his behavior. And every time you roll him, it's always knee on belly (read: neck) for the entire time you get in top. No submissions, only knee to the guts.

People like him have to realize that there are people who are better than they are, and constantly victimizing less skilled members is going to drive them away from the club.

Mekchu
Apr 10, 2012



I just hope everyone enjoys their weekend.

I'm hosting a pub quiz at the local bar and got this shirt because I am a fool who easily parts with money.



Bless you all.

Mekchu fucked around with this message at Mar 21, 2019 around 13:14

Jerome Louis
Nov 5, 2002
p

College Slice

Drewjitsu posted:

If it makes you guys feel better there's a cop at my gym that I constantly rinse as he's slightly less good at leg locks than I am, and we always get involved in the leg game.

As for the dude who goes hard and then taps when he gets swept, you did the right wrong thing to him, and now it's time to talk to the coach about his behavior. And every time you roll him, it's always knee on belly (read: neck) for the entire time you get in top. No submissions, only knee to the guts.

People like him have to realize that there are people who are better than they are, and constantly victimizing less skilled members is going to drive them away from the club.

I apologized to him yesterday and he made some a douchey comment about how the only reason he tapped was because of the size difference (I'm bigger, stronger, more technical, and smell better -- BUT, I know how to roll with anyone of any size, and I've seen him tap when smaller people get on top of him). All I did after that comment was smile and shake his hand. So yeah if I roll with him again I'm going to absolutely give him no mercy unless I see that he has made effort to change how he behaves. One of the other coaches is a brown belt female worlds champ that said she is going to go enforcer on him if she sees he keeps pulling that stuff -- so that will be fun.

Jerome Louis fucked around with this message at Mar 21, 2019 around 14:27

Yuns
Aug 19, 2000

There is an idea of a Yuns, some kind of abstraction, but there is no real me, only an entity, something illusory, and though I can hide my cold gaze and you can shake my hand and feel flesh gripping yours and maybe you can even sense our lifestyles are probably comparable: I simply am not there.


Jerome Louis posted:

Lost my temper last night during a roll and I'm embarrassed.

Big former college wrestler, but a BJJ white belt, been at the gym for a month and he's known for going crazy 100% intensity on top, then if he gets swept he taps. He also asks smaller white belts to start standing and then goes for high velocity throws complete with crashing his weight down on them. He hurt a buddy of mine last week doing this.

Rolled with him last night, I start from butterfly and he immediately starts going full intensity, diving passes, trying to throw me around, etc. I play relaxed for a minute or so but he's going full out. I turtle and he cross faces me hard across the nose - not really to set anything up, just to make me uncomfortable. So I roll to half guard, sweep, get on top and try to smash him into dust.

He tapped literally seconds after I sweep and I see red. I just say "Too bad, we're going to keep going" and he says "No man I smoke I'm so tired" and I just say "That's too bad". He turtles and I clock choke him hard. He taps and I tell him that he can't go full intensity on top and then tap as soon as he loses the advantage, that's BS. He kinda just sits there then goes and sits off the mats for the rest of rolling.

I immediately kind of get embarrassed. I'm 35 years old, I'm not some hot headed 20 year old and I should respect the tap regardless if I think it's a BS reason. I tell my coach and he says not to worry about, that guy needed someone to teach him a lesson and he was glad it was me since I wouldn't have actually hurt him (I'm usually a teddy bear).

So yeah, reflecting on it, the guy needed some guidance, but I lost my temper and didn't respect his tap. I apologized to him during the class bow out and he kinda shrugged it off and said it was fine but he still looked a little upset.

What do you guys think - not a big deal? or did I display full thuggery? Anyone ever lose their poo poo while rolling before?
You shouldn't lose your temper but honestly I can't bring myself to care much. Publicly it's all bushido this and honor that but we all know BJJ was born from showmanship bullying and thuggery. Sometimes a meathead doesn't learn until they get a physical lesson.

Mel Mudkiper
Jan 19, 2012

Is it a Pittsburgh fan?
Is it a Denver fan?
Who can say?

Jerome Louis posted:

I apologized to him yesterday and he made some a douchey comment about how the only reason he tapped was because of the size difference

lol ok yeah gently caress that guy

omg chael crash
Jul 8, 2012

I'm a toxic manchild who hates everyone. I should put down the controller and get a life outside of SA and video games, but I won't. I'll also try to laugh this title off and roll with the punches like the dickbag that I am.

Jerome Louis posted:

I apologized to him yesterday and he made some a douchey comment about how the only reason he tapped was because of the size difference (I'm bigger, stronger, more technical, and smell better -- BUT, I know how to roll with anyone of any size, and I've seen him tap when smaller people get on top of him). All I did after that comment was smile and shake his hand. So yeah if I roll with him again I'm going to absolutely give him no mercy unless I see that he has made effort to change how he behaves. One of the other coaches is a brown belt female worlds champ that said she is going to go enforcer on him if she sees he keeps pulling that stuff -- so that will be fun.

Just curious, what belt level are you guys?

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Jerome Louis
Nov 5, 2002
p

College Slice

I'm a purple but am still a little rusty since I took an 8 year lay-off. He's a white belt that used to be a college wrestler

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply
«515 »