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I've always been partial to his single actually; ceci n'est pas running the pipe.
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Feb 15, 2011 21:48
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I assume the announcement of a superfight rematch with the Terra is forthcoming.
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Feb 17, 2011 20:22
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Sure, there are a lot of competitors both past and present who probably deserve a write-up and I won’t presume to try to cover everybody but I’ll try to add a post or two whenever I get the time. I’ll start with Marcelo because he’s probably the guy at the top of the sport who I’m the biggest fan of and because between our vaguely similar body types and the enormous man-crush my instructor has on him he’s probably the top competitor I tend to emulate the most.  Marcelo in the process of beating Ricco Rodriguez Marcelo Garcia was born in Formiga, Brazil in 1983 and was awarded his black belt by Fabio Gurgel. Growing up Garcia trained in a number of martial arts, including karate and judo. It was his love for judo that led to his introduction to jiu jitsu, and over time he became increasingly devoted to the sport and his devotion has paid off as he is one of the more decorated competitors in grappling today. He is a four time gold medalist at the Mundials (World Jiu Jitsu championships) and a three time gold medalist at his weight class and a one time silver medalist in the absolute division in ADCC; he is also a three time gold medalist, once in the absolute division, at the Brazillian National Championships. I have no idea if this is reliable but according to Wikipedia his two losses against someone in his own weight class in the last seven years were against Pablo Popovitch at ADCC in 2009 and Michael Langhi at the World Pro Cup, also in ‘09. Popovitch is himself one of the great grapplers in the world who has basically beat everybody but Garcia (who he has lost to twice, both by submission, both in the finals of ADCC) he has faced in the past half decade and Langhi was named the BJJ Competitor of the year in 2009 and also took gold in his weight in the Mundials in '09. As for Garcia’s strengths and weaknesses he’s probably most famous for his use of the X guard, but I suppose his other “signature techniques” would include his arm drag, his guillotine, and his back takes, back mount and rear naked choke. Considering that he basically doesn’t lose in grappling competition except when facing other elite competitors who are significantly bigger than him (Jacare, Roger Gracie, Robert Drysdale, Braulio Estima, Xande, Ribeiro) his main weakness seems to be the fact that he hasn’t had any success (granted in only one professional fight) in MMA. Garcia is one of the world’s best and one of the most entertaining grapplers to watch, none of his ADCC matches that I have come across are anything but entertaining. And his highlight real is endlessly entertaining. Everyone should be a fan of Marcelo Garcia. edit: Also what are you talking about, Jacare is the third Brazillian to lift. Grab Your Foot! fucked around with this message at 04:59 on Feb 18, 2011 |
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Feb 18, 2011 04:48
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Specifically Roger is known for his cross choke from mount, which is a gi choke and can't be done without the gi. Most of the other chokes from mount also involve the gi, and those that don't aren't really unique to or even necessarily best attempted from the mount, like all the arm triangle variants. Plus because most submission attempts require taking some sort of risk (like giving up a sweep if you attempt an armbar from mount and your opponent escapes) and in MMA top position is that much more valuable even really good grapplers often just say gently caress it and punch the dude rather than try for a submission. And the World Championship being referred to is the "World Jiu Jitsu Championship" or the Mundials, which is the most prestigious jiu jitsu (ie with the gi) tournament in the world. Grab Your Foot! fucked around with this message at 07:40 on Feb 20, 2011 |
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Feb 20, 2011 07:38
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Yeah, Overeem won the European qualifiers for ADCC in 2005, and then withdrew from the competition because the tournament proper would have run very close to the second round of the Pride Final Conflict tournament, which was a bigger deal for Overeem because MMA is really more his bag and because it pays better particularly for someone who isn't likely to actually win a tournament like Abu Dhabi. Alistair ended up losing in the semi finals of that tournament to Shogun, who went on to win the tournament. As for Alistair's run in the European ADCC trials, first of all they were legitimately impressive and more so because he won every match via submission and via the same submission, a guillotine. On the other hand the European trials are traditionally the weakest trials to qualify for ADCC (because Europe generally doesn't have very many high level submission grapplers)and I know nothing about anybody Overeem beat in that qualifier. If nothing else it did prove that Overeem's guillotine is nasty, which you can see here as he uses it to win his final match. edit: to not begin every post with specifically. Grab Your Foot! fucked around with this message at 14:38 on Feb 20, 2011 |
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Feb 20, 2011 14:33
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While grappling without a mouthpiece is not a good idea I'm actually happy that I wear headgear way more frequently. Occasionally somebody will elbow you in the mouth or something and then you appreciate the mouthguard but fuckers are all about touching my ears and they do not appreciate the touching. If you care about having nice ears and particularly if you are susceptible to cauliflower ear wear them, because getting ears drained (either by a doctor or the do it yourself version) sucks.
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Feb 23, 2011 20:38
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Yeah that is a little unfortunate, and while the demarcation between gi and no gi competition and what's expected to be able to compete at a certain level in each can be frustrating in a situation like that I've definitely had things go the other way. On the one hand particularly small purple belts at our school might as well not show up for smaller tournaments because odds are there's going to be one or perhaps two competitors available to them. One purple belt had the pleasure of paying eighty dollars to win his advanced no gi division after beating the same guy twice (there was a third person in the division but he lost to the other guy). At a lot of tournaments winning your division at blue belt is at least as impressive as doing so at brown belt just because of the number of matches you have to get through at blue. On the other hand sometimes you get somebody who wanders into the advanced no gi division because they want to put in on their business card or whatever and then you feel like you're wasting your time and money anyway. Sooooo, yeah, tournaments.
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Feb 26, 2011 03:58
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Can't say I've ever been Seagal'ed like that from back control but I've certainly had the pleasure of getting the poo poo ankle locked out of me when I haven't been paying attention and my feet ended up crossed. On the other hand that's always a habit that you sort of have to beat out of somebody by ankle locking them whenever they do cross their feet, sort of a Pavlovian thing. Getting submitted on someone's back is humiliating enough that you learn pretty quick. As for rear naked chokes, if you're letting your arm hang out enough to get caught like that I can't believe anybody is ever going to let you sink in the choke anyway. Plus because everybody will lock everything down as soon as they have time to think with you on their back you really want to get good at hitting whatever you like (RNC and bow and arrow for me, occasionally an Ezekiel) while transitioning into the position. Or flatten your opponent out belly down and lift their hips, then they're pretty much doomed.
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Feb 27, 2011 01:30
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My advice to you is in my username; also wear a gimp mask and fake tap constantly so CXB can pretend to be a palette-swaped Din Thomas. And I I definitely don't hunt for that triangle but the few times I've managed to finish it I completed a kind of a backwards flower sweep to mount with it and a lot of the submission was probably body weight; the one thing I know to do if you can manage that is control a leg.
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Feb 27, 2011 02:07
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That doesn't look anything like Jake Mackenzie. And while jiu jitsu will definitely improve your flexibility over time the white board is right in that flexibility, while a valuable tool in jiu jitsu, shouldn't be the basis of your game and being too flexible can actually slow down your development. Hall feels that way about himself, that he was so flexible that he didn't develop his pass defense and his top game enough early on and when he began to compete against the very best he couldn't get away with it any more. Being flexible provides you with options and allows you to get away with some things but you're better off if you learn how to not have to get away with them. On the other hand I do wish I could omoplata people who have me in side control.
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Feb 28, 2011 04:56
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I wouldn't worry too much about that alteration to the choke if you're doing alright with the normal choke. Personally my RNC has improved dramatically after having done the following: 1: Using my off hand to fend away the far side arm from a collar tie so the choke is much harder to block. 2: clenched my hand in a fist as I bring it across to set up the choke so people don't be bending my fingers. 3. setting up sort of like how you would with the one handed choke with the first hand, grabbing behind the shoulder and hiding the hand to avoid as much hand fighting as possible. 4. Sinking my rear arm low as I draw it across rather than using it to push on the back of the head or anything. 5. Improving my body and head placement, keeping myself roughly even with the person rather than getting high on them. I don't have the skinny arm problem but especially that last thing has really helped, which is important for me considering I prefer working from the back.
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Mar 2, 2011 07:32
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Gi and no gi grappling each have their pros and cons in training and I don't see why training both wouldn't be the best option for just about anybody. Because control is much harder without the gi you have to be very technical offensively to catch anyone, but you can be a little lazy defensively whereas with the gi you can sometimes get away with being a little sloppy offensively but to a lesser extent. Personally I like no-gi a lot because I have a very scramble and transition based style, but if I didn't train gi I would probably be a lot less careful about getting caught in things like triangles, and that's not a good habit to be in.
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Mar 5, 2011 02:32
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Consider this: John Fitch is a wrestly dude who mostly seems to rely on his wrestling to win fights; Chael Sonnen is a wrestly dude who mostly seems to rely on his wrestling to win fights. Fitch is basically impossible to submit, Sonnen is hilariously prone to being submitted. Fitch trains in the gi, Sonnen does not.
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Mar 5, 2011 02:37
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henkman posted:I don't think using the hardest to submit guy in MMA and the easiest to submit guy means anything. I think if Sonnen trained Gi he'd still be easy to submit because he's Stupid, not because Gi would patch up the wholes in his game. Yes and no, the gi thing certainly isn't the only component of the difference but I think it is a component. I think Sonnen is used to being able to power or slip out of submissions and Fitch knows he won't always be able to and that's something that is much more apparent when training with the gi; you get caught and you learn to avoid the situation rather than how to escape it when you get there, because you won't. Edit: Also Fitch has much more submission grappling and jiu jitsu experience, yeah it's not really a great example.
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Mar 5, 2011 02:52
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generatrix posted:True, and my response was more of the comedy options anyways. For the serious record: do not willingly dive into a guillotine. Keep your head up (they can't choke you with their armpit). There are a couple types of modified guillotines that work even if the person getting choked passes to side control. McKenzie uses a prayer choke I think and then there's the elbow up guillotine and they work pretty much the same way I think and can be defended the same way, but it's less about position and more about preventing that arm from coming up. You can't alleviate the choke by moving to cross side but if you can keep your opponents non-choking arm pinned to their side and drive your weight into and through the choke you can avoid the choke while you hand fight and you can pretty much hang out for as long as you want so long as you maintain control of that opposite elbow. I don't actually have much experience with McKenzie's choke so I honestly don't know exactly how to defend a prayer choke but it looks pretty similar, I'll try it out. Here's what I mean: Here's a video of Kenny Florian explaining the modified guillotine. Here's the McKenzie version (I think). Here's Din Thomas defending. Especially for the elbow up version you want that other arm pinning his elbow to his side for as long as you're in the choke.
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Mar 6, 2011 00:38
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Wait for your opponent to pull guard, step a leg over their guard, leg drag their outside leg across your body, tap. Go for gold. A lot of your first tournament is basically learning to chill out and use what you know under stress. I wouldn't try to cram in techniques you aren't familiar with; odds are if you even remember them in a match you won't be very comfortable with them. Most of the one sided matches at white belt I've seen tend to involve one guy who can wrestle and one who can't, maybe work on wrestling this week.
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Mar 10, 2011 22:48
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Myself I love the back and a lot of my game is built around getting there so if someone turtles up on me I'm almost always looking for a way to get to the back, and if not only because I'm responding to something like the other guy reaching back to turn in by going for a guillotine or something. Usually after establishing my hands (I make a fist with my far side arm and try to use it to lever the far side leg out, near side arm levers up under their near side armpit I try a spiral ride or two to see how the guy in turtle reacts, that's kind of like this but using a knee to block your opponent's near side leg so they rotate onto their butt rather than flattening out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxQ8KNlBLnI If my opponent reacts by really widening his base to keep on balance that's usually an opportunity to just sink in the hooks from the turtle, though you should make sure to keep your weight back and probably go with double underhook control if you're having issues being bucked off. If all else fails I personally will try a somersault back take a la Leo Viera against Eddie Bravo, which isn't actually very hard to do, but often doesn't really work because my opponent blocks my hooks, like Bravo did: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCCikDvdrCI And yeah, as you practice techniques they do become instinctual and even better the fundamental ideas behind them become instinct so even if you're in a position that you're not totally sure about you kinda have an idea what to do, and part of that is chilling out, which at the very least will allow you to roll for more than five minutes without gassing. Personally the instinct to go for a rolling back take is beginning to sink in for me and goddamn do I love this back take. Strangely enough I think I first ran into it as a part of Eddie Bravo's twister stuff. It owns: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gjF6DV9QfJ0 Hall pulled it off in his UFC superfight with Hermes Franca off of a waiter sweep from deep half and that's probably my favorite technique chain: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5mJT_PgVgPY&feature=related Please only watch like the first thirty seconds of that. Also, lol: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k5cSqIbH1Y&feature=related
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Mar 11, 2011 03:21
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Speaking of, how does the no posture pass work for people here? I worry that trying to develop it too much tends to make me neglect working on other kinds of passing and I'm just not sure if I can hone it to the point where it can be a go-to pass. Anybody getting a lot of mileage out of it?
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Mar 12, 2011 03:43
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Maybe he would but I can't say I have many blue belts taking my back while working it. My biggest issue is not doing a very good job of creating the angle to step over my leg. Mostly people respond by trying to create space for an omoplata or trying to control the arm to my passing side for a triangle but the back not so much, and I don't mind working to pass half guard from the no posture because it leaves you in pretty good position to do so, good control.
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Mar 12, 2011 04:21
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Not exactly, it's what Wilson attempts here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqocg5_0bzQ&feature=player_detailpage#t=128s and it kinda works before Ryan grabs his foot. Somewhere someone described it as a dumb white belt technique someone went and perfected and that's kind of the appeal and concern to me. I like it but I worry that if I'm not Wilson it'll be the pass that doesn't work against really good people.
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Mar 12, 2011 04:39
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Yeah that's one of those things that seems like a good idea every time I see somebody with one but then never ends up making the trip to the gym, probably should. And thanks for the wrestling write-ups Mardragon, Robles' pin attempts are the coolest thing.
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Mar 15, 2011 21:56
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Echoing interest in a writeup.
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Mar 18, 2011 01:56
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I've never done that but the whatever (wrestler's guillotine) comes up an awful lot from rolling back take attempts, which I do like a lot. I think it's a twister roll to Bravo, I guess Lloyd Irvin calls it a ninja roll, Ryan Hall calls it the crotch lock and roll but generally I don't actually look for a crotch lock before looking for the back. Are you shooting for side control when you use that sweep CXB or do you look for the twist or what's the ideal result? Here's the roll from a side control setup but I use it as much to reset back control or sitting up out of half guard or sort of out of deep half sweeps, I don't think I've ever tried to get the lock out of it.
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Apr 15, 2011 02:41
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Yeah, the roll from side control doesn't get a lot of mileage, it's more of an opportunistic thing. Part of the difference probably comes from our positional preferences; my mount is terrible, particularly without a gi, and I love working from the back so I'm willing to go to some lengths to get there. My half guard passing and half guard sweeps are both strengths so leaving the leg in isn't a huge concern. It comes up more coming out the back out of a waiter sweep or something, you end up in the cobra twist position and depending on leg position you may have to reroll if you want a shot at the back, I've posted this before but kind of like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5mJT_PgVgPY
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Apr 15, 2011 03:12
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Well it's not "normal" exactly, you don't have to have sore ribs if you train jiu jitsu but it's certainly not out of the ordinary in my experience; fat guys hanging on you can be uncomfortable. I don't tend to worry about anything in that area if it's not having a big impact on either my training or quality of life, but what do I know? Probably I am killing myself by pushing my own broken ribs into my heart, but so far I've never had trouble (beyond soreness) just being careful and training through it.
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Apr 19, 2011 15:18
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Yeah, I'm definitely prone to doing things to my body if I take a couple weeks off and jump right in. My knees in particular tend to seize up if I don't stretch well and warm up before grabbing my foot or what have you but I can generally tell the difference between soreness and something I need to worry about. In addition to everything else just make sure to let whoever you train with know what's up, that's why a lot of people will ask you before rolling if anything's hurting, so they don't spend the whole session knee-on-bellying your sore ribs.
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Apr 19, 2011 19:38
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Julio Cesar Fatass posted:I started learning BJJ a couple weeks ago. It really seems like what we cover in class is just stuff the instructor decides on during the warmup. For instance, tonight we focused on escaping the omoplata when half the class (myself included) didn't know an omoplata from a cote de boeuf. Depends, really. There's definitely a period everybody goes through when you first get into the sport where, particularly when rolling, you just don't know what the gently caress to do and it's easy to get frustrated or to feel that the setup isn't really fair to beginners because you're not sure how to avoid getting styled on. Try to avoid being too spastic to compensate and feel free to ask people what they're doing, after you're done rolling. It's hard at a gym for the instructor to go through everything in a particular order because you'll have new people coming in regularly and you can't just drop everything and start from square one with every new student. After that a big gym will have a regular and advanced class or some division like that so you shouldn't be working on your inverted omoplata on day one. The escape to the omoplata is as important to know as the submission itself anyway and will be a lot more useful to you for a while. A lot of gyms will have beginner classes to at least get your feet wet with the basics of the major positions and a couple submissions and escapes but like everything it takes time. Knowing moves or positions or submissions will get you going but eventually knowing how to move and what works in terms of control is what makes you really good at something. My armbar is solid and my triangle is really good once I'm in position but my guard positional control is rear end so nobody who knows what they're doing gives any shits about being in my guard. People far far better than me at jiu jitsu have told me that the stuff you learn on day one is the most important stuff you will ever learn, stuff like how to base out, how to bridge, how to shrimp, I'd be hosed if I didn't know how to base out but I'd probably be okay if I forgot how to do an armbar. You get to a point where you know how to do something then you get to the point where you can do it quickly and then you get to the point where you're comfortable whipping it out and it starts to work. Then you work with better people and it's rear end so you go back and figure out what you're doing wrong and try again and eventually you get to the point where people have to avoid a particular position, forcing you to work on something else. Eventually you can begin to do the right thing in a position even if you've never been there before because you know what's good for you and what's bad, and then you name your move something retarded and market it aggressively and hope you get sponsored by tapout. What a long and terrible answer. Yeah, there's an adjustment period, but there will always be stuff that's new and everybody is there to learn stuff so ask for feedback, ask your instructor to be sure you do stuff right and be anal about everything because if you do something 80% correct when drilling when you roll you're lucky if you're half right.
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Apr 27, 2011 04:33
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The armdrag is also a nice way to get right into a guard if you're not a fan of your other takedown options and something to work in conjunction with bump sweeps or with an underhook from butterfly once you're down. I'm terrible about getting overhooked from guard, rotating my arm out and then getting arm dragged right onto my face, for example.
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Apr 27, 2011 12:07
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I don't even understand that trick, why do you care if you trick some dude into going easy and then crank out a tap in anger? Especially if the guy's going to be attending the gym regularly, you'll tap and be tapped all the time, who cares? And as for mount on big people I tend to be a little floaty if I figure the guy's gonna bench press me off anyway and post with my hands and arms a lot; also cross facing the guy's neck one way or the other makes any kind of mount escape much harder, especially cross facing him away from the side he likes to escape to.
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Apr 29, 2011 05:09
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Go anyway, nothing like having that one dude in the gym hacking up a lung all over his unlucky training partner who's just praying its allergies. gomi pile posted:actually the dude who says "let's roll light" then ends up spitting and sputtering while trying to rape choke you is the only cool guy in the gym Hey, uh, how much do you weigh bro?
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May 3, 2011 03:06
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fatherdog posted:172. Oh yeah, makes sense. I'm only 168. You're still pretty good though.
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May 3, 2011 03:14
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I know you are a huge creature, it was a joke. You ruined it with your creepy carnival barker knowledge of weights.
Grab Your Foot! fucked around with this message at 03:28 on May 3, 2011 |
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May 3, 2011 03:21
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Man I'm like 80% deep half guard and people still ask me how much I weigh, which is instrumental to the process of having you on top of me.
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May 3, 2011 03:24
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When I think of jiu jitsu related exercises I think of turkish get-ups and how much they kick my rear end, but that's all kinds of jiu jitsu related movements. Explosive everything, basing out, standing up because every jiu jitsu'er everywhere is terrible at standing up in guard. Stuff with weight bags also works. In terms of stuff that is straight jiu jitsu standing up in guard over and over and transitioning from guard to the back on a standing partner is always fun. Or just wrestling, man wrestling is tiring. And as long as you assume I'm wrong about everything I say all the questions are cool and keep the thread going.
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May 10, 2011 03:20
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Cool guard stuff, my guard is very bad and I should feel bad. One thing I'm trying to do much more is use bump sweeps to set up stuff, trying to minimize the time people spend postured up in my guard while I don't do anything. Another thing to look for both for posture control and to set up attacks, particularly in the gi is to get an underhook and anchor your arm to your body either by gripping across your stomach or your far hip in no gi or a lapel with the gi. Having that arm allows you to open your guard and to start bringing your opponent's elbow away from his knee and his body in general, and that kind of space allows you to set up attacks. From there you can look for all your normal guard submissions, the armbar, triangle, omoplata, and maybe a cross choke if you can get at the guy's far lapel. Grabbing the near lapel allows you to start bringing the elbow back across your body, looks like what Frank Mir did to Pete Williams, and that elbow movement forces the guy's posture down to the outside, setting up an armbar/shoulder lock if you keep the arm position and move your legs for an armbar. VV Yes, the overhook, that's what I meant. edit 2: Also you can use the overhook to set up an armdrag as long as you keep your other arm (the not-hook) inside of your opponent's arms. If he tries to free his arm he should look to rotate his lower arm and swim it over your stomach, so stuff it down and drag it across. Grab Your Foot! fucked around with this message at 06:14 on May 13, 2011 |
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May 13, 2011 05:28
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Guys with judo backgrounds in predominately jiu jitsu tournaments are awesome. There's always that dude who spends the day tossing blue belts and then getting submitted, but all anybody ever remembers are the sweet, sweet throws.
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May 24, 2011 02:59
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Yeah, any decent school should have a trial period before you're expected to commit to anything financially. I don't know anything about the schools up there but everything seems fine, personally I'm glad I'm not at a school that's part of a larger affiliation but I doubt it makes much difference. Schools will sometimes charge different rates depending on how often you attend, so that's not so out of the ordinary.
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May 24, 2011 04:15
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There are some people who are, whether by accident or design, really hard to choke in general or with one choke in particular. With arm triangles I find I sort of have a feel for what's a good choke and how to get there that sometimes comes and goes. I'm not Xande obviously but sometimes I feel I just naturally get to a good blood choke and sometimes I feel like I don't know what I'm doing. Arm triangles are like that.
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Sep 13, 2011 03:17
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In the process of figuring out what the truck is (it looks okay to me, looks like something halfway through a rolling back take, I'd probably try to get to the back) I found a video of a crazy-rear end sweep/breakdown of the turtle and some really terrible youtube comments.
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Sep 14, 2011 03:46
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I think the idea is if someone tries to turn into you or you just step their top leg over from side control you'd then slide your bottom leg under that leg and hook it before rolling over the guy and using your hook to pull him or her over you into whatever, truck or just right to the back. Here's a cool looking dude doing it. I don't know if you could do that setup reliably because people aren't going to be fond of the idea of letting you break down their legs like that but you can set the same thing up by letting your opponent catch a leg when you go to mount or by getting a knee to the ground out of half guard. I'd still try to go right to mount I think.
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Sep 14, 2011 04:20
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