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DarkCrawler
Apr 6, 2009


LOL of course Timo Soini loves Israel, the mark of any true religious retard in Finland (well except the Muslim ones)

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Finlands Sexiest
Feb 26, 2007


Tynkkynen kicked out while in Iceland fighting Nordic Union

No. 1 Callie Fan
Feb 17, 2011

This inkling is your FRIEND
She fights for LOVE


True Finns are finished.

El Perkele
Nov 7, 2002

I HAVE SHIT OPINIONS ON STAR WARS MOVIES!!!

I can't even call the right one bad.


Rexroom posted:

True Finns are finished.

like kepu was back in 2011

Fish of hemp
Apr 1, 2011


El Perkele posted:

like kepu was back in 2011

And they found a new lord and savior, Juha Sipilä, in 2012. In TF there is no god but Soini and Putkonen is his prophet.

Double Bill
Jan 29, 2006



Persu leadership is so loving stupid, it's amazing. Everything they do only erodes their and the party's support further.

DarkCrawler
Apr 6, 2009


Did anyone not see this coming? Since day one of jytky, pound by pound, day by day, they were the dumbest political party with the biggest foot-in-the mouth syndrome I've ever seen in Finnish politics. Their newly elected people just can't stop saying and doing retarded poo poo. Either they listen to all that idiocy which makes getting into or staying in a government in impossible, or they don't, which means they will alienate the part of their base that supports those morons. It was only a matter of time which "principles" of theirs they would lose, though admittedly by joining this goverment they basically decided to lose all of them.

So is this the third MP kicked out by Persus?

Nenonen
Oct 22, 2009



Fallen Rib

Classic douchebaggery all around - Tynkky trying to openly form an internal opposition, then TF politburo striking back when Sebu is drinking mead in Valhalla.

Double Bill
Jan 29, 2006



DarkCrawler posted:

Did anyone not see this coming? Since day one of jytky, pound by pound, day by day, they were the dumbest political party with the biggest foot-in-the mouth syndrome I've ever seen in Finnish politics. Their newly elected people just can't stop saying and doing retarded poo poo. Either they listen to all that idiocy which makes getting into or staying in a government in impossible, or they don't, which means they will alienate the part of their base that supports those morons. It was only a matter of time which "principles" of theirs they would lose, though admittedly by joining this goverment they basically decided to lose all of them.

So is this the third MP kicked out by Persus?

Redneck representatives saying stupid poo poo didn't kill their support though. In fact I wager it didn't affect it negatively whatsoever. This is all Soini & puoluejohto submitting to cock-kusta and either ignoring or being oblivious to the reasons why people voted them in the first place. Their "core" support can't be much more than 5%, and the rest is (or rather was) all protest towards other parties.

Basically Soini traded the party's future for one tenure in government.

Geriatric Pirate
Apr 25, 2008

by Nyc_Tattoo


DarkCrawler posted:

Did anyone not see this coming? Since day one of jytky, pound by pound, day by day, they were the dumbest political party with the biggest foot-in-the mouth syndrome I've ever seen in Finnish politics. Their newly elected people just can't stop saying and doing retarded poo poo. Either they listen to all that idiocy which makes getting into or staying in a government in impossible, or they don't, which means they will alienate the part of their base that supports those morons. It was only a matter of time which "principles" of theirs they would lose, though admittedly by joining this goverment they basically decided to lose all of them.

So is this the third MP kicked out by Persus?

He's not an MP

No. 1 Callie Fan
Feb 17, 2011

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Geriatric Pirate posted:

He's not an MP

No, but he was the third vice chairman of the party. Also he was apparently sacked not according to how it should be done in civil law, since he was elected by the party people, not the leaders, so it should've been a party decision.

Funniest thing is that they first said they sacked him because he broke some law on illegal registers when he took up signatures for that emergency meeting. When they found out the law was removed years ago, they cited his "attitude" as the reason. So it's pretty apparent this was nothing but personal.

BravestOfTheLamps
Oct 12, 2012

by FactsAreUseless


Lipstick Apathy

Rexroom posted:

No, but he was the third vice chairman of the party. Also he was apparently sacked not according to how it should be done in civil law, since he was elected by the party people, not the leaders, so it should've been a party decision.

Funniest thing is that they first said they sacked him because he broke some law on illegal registers when he took up signatures for that emergency meeting. When they found out the law was removed years ago, they cited his "attitude" as the reason. So it's pretty apparent this was nothing but personal.

Pretty clear case of politics interfering with party politics.

DarkCrawler
Apr 6, 2009


Double Bill posted:

Redneck representatives saying stupid poo poo didn't kill their support though. In fact I wager it didn't affect it negatively whatsoever. This is all Soini & puoluejohto submitting to cock-kusta and either ignoring or being oblivious to the reasons why people voted them in the first place. Their "core" support can't be much more than 5%, and the rest is (or rather was) all protest towards other parties.

Basically Soini traded the party's future for one tenure in government.

No, redneck representatives saying stupid poo poo is reflecting that part of the base. But doing virtually anything that part of the base wants to do doesn't work with any of the other parties - especially the ones that got to form the government. So it was always a zero sum game, there was basically no chance of a tenure in government without alienating those people. It's the populist dilemma.

I think Soini knew this and just wanted to be a minister. But the scale and speed of the party meltdown is still pretty impressive.

Geriatric Pirate posted:

He's not an MP

Haha wow, he's been loud enough to convince me otherwise.

EDIT: Apparently the firing might not be entirely legal
http://www.hs.fi/politiikka/a1445828103661

No. 1 Callie Fan
Feb 17, 2011

This inkling is your FRIEND
She fights for LOVE


Ligur
Sep 6, 2000

by Nyc_Tattoo


Soini didn't want him as a vice chairman to begin with since Sebu wasn't one of "his" guys. Soini angry! Sebastian should have trodden carefully indeed in his position, but instead took a piss on the old leaderships morning cereals. Tynkkynen was a bit too bright eyed for his own good.

Double Bill posted:

Redneck representatives saying stupid poo poo didn't kill their support though. In fact I wager it didn't affect it negatively whatsoever. This is all Soini & puoluejohto submitting to cock-kusta and either ignoring or being oblivious to the reasons why people voted them in the first place. Their "core" support can't be much more than 5%, and the rest is (or rather was) all protest towards other parties.

Basically Soini traded the party's future for one tenure in government.

Yep. Redneck reps can say all they want, people didn't vote for TF because they care that much about redneck MPs ululating on television, getting drunk, posting about strengtth and honoare on the weekends or giving weird statements about piety, homomarriage or conspiracy theories, either or.

Pretty sure the 1/3 TF voters who now vote "empty" on the polls are disappointed on TF being unable to make cock-kepu follow follow a Government program they all agreed on. People hollering about populism should remember that. I'm sure ministeri Orpo taking a poo poo on the case of immigration is at the top of the list, but seems like it's a sum of plenty things including securing loans of other EU countries, mentioned immigration, the Euro and mummojen eläkkeet & pakkoruotsi and so on.

If disappointment in question can be alleviated during the next three years TF will be fine. If not, see ya guys. As for the method of dealing with the disappointment that doesn't matter, of course. For example, if TF can improve their communication they can spin it like if we had Green-LA-SDP in the government instead, we would have had 100k more immigrants by the end of this year with their hands out demanding apartments and cars and girlfriends, even if it wasn't true.

If our economy is in better shape in three years that will speak for itself and they can take part of the merit. And so on.

What the near future holds my personal bet is that nothing will change for a while now. The people who are back to voting nothing were tuuliviirii's who were thinking TF can do MIRACLES!!1 in less than half a year. After they calm down for a while they will reconsider. Those more grounded on what can be actually done and in what time are still waiting to see.

Ligur fucked around with this message at Oct 26, 2015 around 12:09

Hogge Wild
Aug 21, 2012





Pillbug

Rexroom posted:

No, but he was the third vice chairman of the party. Also he was apparently sacked not according to how it should be done in civil law, since he was elected by the party people, not the leaders, so it should've been a party decision.

Funniest thing is that they first said they sacked him because he broke some law on illegal registers when he took up signatures for that emergency meeting. When they found out the law was removed years ago, they cited his "attitude" as the reason. So it's pretty apparent this was nothing but personal.

lol

Herman Merman
Jul 6, 2008



lol harsh

Jerry Cotton
Nov 25, 2010


http://www.iltalehti.fi/uutiset/201...562154_uu.shtml

Oh my oh my. Now we'll see how much Soini wants to keep the party together. I mean he may be the hitlerpope but Halla-Aho is the dude a lot of ligurs would go gay for.

vuohi
Nov 22, 2004


DarkCrawler posted:

No, redneck representatives saying stupid poo poo is reflecting that part of the base. But doing virtually anything that part of the base wants to do doesn't work with any of the other parties - especially the ones that got to form the government. So it was always a zero sum game, there was basically no chance of a tenure in government without alienating those people. It's the populist dilemma.

I think Soini knew this and just wanted to be a minister. But the scale and speed of the party meltdown is still pretty impressive.
All parties tend to trade their popular support for actual power when they enter a government. It might hit populist parties the worst, but the situation wouldn't really have to be this bad so soon.

Apart from being largely incompetent and at the mercy of vastly more powerful parties and interest group organizations of NC anc CP, Soini has done all he could to alienate everyone possible. "Hurr hurrr there is no internal opposition, where would they go?" Well apparently half of your voters would stay home now, and SDP is the second largest party according to opinion polls.

It would also be interesting to know if they would have done better in a CP+TF+SDP government. Ironically SDP could have prevented TF shooting themselves in the foot in front of the worker voters.

Rexroom posted:

Funniest thing is that they first said they sacked him because he broke some law on illegal registers when he took up signatures for that emergency meeting. When they found out the law was removed years ago, they cited his "attitude" as the reason. So it's pretty apparent this was nothing but personal.
By this logic the petition that I signed for keeping a small local school is an illegal register.

Hogge Wild
Aug 21, 2012





Pillbug

Jerry Cotton posted:

http://www.iltalehti.fi/uutiset/201...562154_uu.shtml

Oh my oh my. Now we'll see how much Soini wants to keep the party together. I mean he may be the hitlerpope but Halla-Aho is the dude a lot of ligurs would go gay for.

paavinpalvoja potkisi pois mestarinkin ellei mestari olisi niin suosittu

Jerry Cotton
Nov 25, 2010


Hogge Wild posted:

paavinpalvoja potkisi pois mestarinkin ellei mestari olisi niin suosittu

Uhh that was my point

Wheany
Mar 17, 2006

Spinyahahahahahahahahahahahaha!


Doctor Rope





Jerry Cotton
Nov 25, 2010



Kiva!

Ligur
Sep 6, 2000

by Nyc_Tattoo


Speaking of which oh gee whizz, Greece out of money again say hello to loan package #7 or #50 or whatever.

I wonder what is the political utility of repeating the same charade every 3-6 months from now on to forever? Anyone care to throw a guess?

The international banks who loan the money are happy, of course. They have invented a perpetual profit machine! And the people who pay for it are European taxpayers on account of "solidarity" or something I'm not exactly who believes anymore.

Rappaport
Oct 2, 2013


Ligur posted:

Speaking of which oh gee whizz, Greece out of money again say hello to loan package #7 or #50 or whatever.

I wonder what is the political utility of repeating the same charade every 3-6 months from now on to forever? Anyone care to throw a guess?

Jo euroa perustettaessa oli selvää kaikille toimijoille, että yhteisvaluutta ilman yhteistä finanssiministeriötä (ts. liittovaltiobudjettia) on sulaa hulluutta, joten yhteisvaluutta otettiin käyttöön hurskain toivein siitä, että se herättäisi sellaisen solidaarisuuden aallon Euroopan kansoissa että yhdentyminen jatkuisi orgaanisesti. No, näin ei käynyt. Nyt olemme tilanteessa, jossa Kreikan euroero on se ainut järjellinen vaihtoehto (ilman yhteistä EU-budjettia), mutta se edustaa sellaista kasvojen menetystä federalisteille että se nyt vaan ei käy. Näin ollen, näitä avoimia "lainojen" kautta tehtäviä tulonsiirtoja on pakko jatkaa kunnes yhteinen budjetti muuttuu todellisuudeksi. (Toisin kuin esim. Jenkeissä jossa köyhemmät osavaltiot saavat liittovaltion budjetista suoraan tukea vauraimmilta osavaltioilta.) Kuten anglo-saxonit sanoisivat, the beatings will continue until morale improves.

Ja toki drakhmaan palaava Kreikka olisi lähitulevaisuuden vielä pahemmassa kusessa kuin nyt, ainakin talousviisaiden mukaan. Heillä olisi vaan siinä vaiheessa paremmat saumat koittaa kömpiä kusesta pois jossain vaiheessa.

Ligur
Sep 6, 2000

by Nyc_Tattoo


Which reminds me that I think I read 1/3 of the money the state of Finland makes annually, by taxation, is used to pay for just the interest rates of our public debt. So that means about 30% of the money Corporation Finland makes a year through taxation goes directly to foreign financial institutions, instead of being spent on Finland.

In the light of this it is very peculiar when people from especially the left proclaim public debt is meaningless. (Or the size of it, the larger the public sector we can't fund, the more debt we need, and more money flows to foreign investors, ad infinitum.)

That said I still don't mind taking more debt if the money is used for something useful. But we've been doing what the left wants, "Elvyttäminen" by taking more and more debt for the past eight years or so. The results are dismal. We don't have any awesome publicly funded projects that will tahkoo rahoa kuin sampo in the future. The money is instead used to pay the salaries of officials and municipal workers for them to buy products from foreign companies*



*bit of a hyperbole for those morons who take everything posted literally (because it's their favourite word) and get stuck on arguing over it

Rappaport posted:

Ja toki drakhmaan palaava Kreikka olisi lähitulevaisuuden vielä pahemmassa kusessa kuin nyt, ainakin talousviisaiden mukaan. Heillä olisi vaan siinä vaiheessa paremmat saumat koittaa kömpiä kusesta pois jossain vaiheessa.

I can imagine the wisemen are even right and Greece would be in deeper poo poo for a few years but at least recovery would be possible, or rather, inevitable, now it isn't, everyone knows this, and German and French bankers laugh all the way to the office.

Other than that yeah I guess that's what it's about at this point. Losing face.

Ligur fucked around with this message at Oct 26, 2015 around 15:39

Stay Safe
Sep 1, 2008

by FactsAreUseless


Ligur posted:

Speaking of which oh gee whizz, Greece out of money again say hello to loan package #7 or #50 or whatever.

I wonder what is the political utility of repeating the same charade every 3-6 months from now on to forever? Anyone care to throw a guess?

The international banks who loan the money are happy, of course. They have invented a perpetual profit machine! And the people who pay for it are European taxpayers on account of "solidarity" or something I'm not exactly who believes anymore.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nhLWwNnUWRc

vuohi
Nov 22, 2004



hahaha good one

Hogge Wild
Aug 21, 2012





Pillbug



lol

Sulphagnist
Oct 10, 2006

WARNING! INTRUDERS DETECTED



vuohi posted:

It would also be interesting to know if they would have done better in a CP+TF+SDP government. Ironically SDP could have prevented TF shooting themselves in the foot in front of the worker voters.

In that universe TF probably manages to dump every single cut on the other two parties using its Internal Opposition trick and it's SDP standing at the precipice in the polls instead of TF right about now. Dunno how the refugee influx would influence things.

On the other hand, the cuts would probably not be so horrific, at least not on the employed population.

Nenonen
Oct 22, 2009



Fallen Rib

Why is there a nazi lady wearing a bowl hat and a lion necklace in my tv set right now?

Herman Merman
Jul 6, 2008


Ligur posted:

Which reminds me that I think I read 1/3 of the money the state of Finland makes annually, by taxation, is used to pay for just the interest rates of our public debt.

To the surprise of no one at all you're mistaken, by a factor of 10 or so. The interest payments on state debt in 2016 are about 3.8% of the state tax income.

http://www.valtionbudjetti.fi/

DanTheFryingPan
Jan 28, 2006


Ligur posted:

Which reminds me that I think I read 1/3 of the money the state of Finland makes annually, by taxation, is used to pay for just the interest rates of our public debt. So that means about 30% of the money Corporation Finland makes a year through taxation goes directly to foreign financial institutions, instead of being spent on Finland.

In the light of this it is very peculiar when people from especially the left proclaim public debt is meaningless. (Or the size of it, the larger the public sector we can't fund, the more debt we need, and more money flows to foreign investors, ad infinitum.)

That said I still don't mind taking more debt if the money is used for something useful. But we've been doing what the left wants, "Elvyttäminen" by taking more and more debt for the past eight years or so. The results are dismal. We don't have any awesome publicly funded projects that will tahkoo rahoa kuin sampo in the future. The money is instead used to pay the salaries of officials and municipal workers for them to buy products from foreign companies*

Something peculiar is happening.

Sulphagnist
Oct 10, 2006

WARNING! INTRUDERS DETECTED



Meanwhile Americanized nutcase Taneli Heikka, who ~somehow~ keeps getting a platform on Hesari, thinks Finnish MPs should be either independently wealthy or get their money from special interests like their American colleagues.

Also, here's a thought I had the other day. Back when we had an asylum application spike in 2008-2009, the family reunification process was a disaster and the processing times stretched to two years or more per application. However, unlike with the actual asylum applications, there's no financial incentive whatsoever to hire more people to process family reunification cases. After all, an asylum seeker in a refugee centre is costing money every day and you can still quite potentially get rid of them. However with family reunification, the nuiva perspective is that you are paying people money to bring even more scroungers into the country. Up to three or more per refugee!

And if you get your family here easy, that's another vetovoimatekijä! My god!

In other words, expect the family reunification queue to be something like five years this time around! There's basically no reason I can think of not to sabotage the whole thing by underfunding it Republican style so that barely any applications are processed.

Sulphagnist fucked around with this message at Oct 26, 2015 around 20:52

Ligur
Sep 6, 2000

by Nyc_Tattoo


Herman Merman posted:

To the surprise of no one at all you're mistaken, by a factor of 10 or so. The interest payments on state debt in 2016 are about 3.8% of the state tax income.

http://www.valtionbudjetti.fi/

This was about all the income taxation, which I didn't make clear in any manner so my bad, d'oh. If you count out unearned income or whatever the right translation is, 1/3 might be close to the mark. Which is still a fuckton.

No, I don't have the chart that separates income and pääomatulo. In that chart they are bunched together. I think it was talous-linkola Isokallio who said this is the case.*

edit:

*it was

and this


Is an awesome thing *thumbs up*

Ligur fucked around with this message at Oct 26, 2015 around 21:04

No. 1 Callie Fan
Feb 17, 2011

This inkling is your FRIEND
She fights for LOVE




I see the libertarian "taxes are theft" meme has arrived. Didn't expect it to appear in the SDP.

SnowblindFatal
Jan 7, 2011


Hahaha Jungner I had your back but this goes too far!

Nurge
Feb 4, 2009

I'm a real comedian! Check out my comedy guide on why we need to say retard again

Fun Shoe

Rexroom posted:



I see the libertarian "taxes are theft" meme has arrived. Didn't expect it to appear in the SDP.

Clickbait for media exposure. No one is actually that retarded. This is the entire problem with the shitheap that is twitter. Anyone can say anything completely loving stupid and then when challenged go "Well yeah but I couldn't really fit the entire argument into x letters."

Hogge Wild
Aug 21, 2012





Pillbug

Rexroom posted:



I see the libertarian "taxes are theft" meme has arrived. Didn't expect it to appear in the SDP.

oon aina tiennyt että toi jätkä on kehari, mutta tämä oli kyllä sen paras heitto

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Rappaport
Oct 2, 2013


Se on hienoa että tässä uuskielen Suomessa koko keskusteleva kansa on unohtanut sen alkuperäisen yhteiskuntasopimuksen. Kiitos SSS tästäkin!

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