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pentyne
Nov 7, 2012


People keep saying "the military" but who is really setting policy for them? Is it one person or a group of generals that meet and agree on what to say?

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Vernii
Dec 7, 2006



pentyne posted:

People keep saying "the military" but who is really setting policy for them? Is it one person or a group of generals that meet and agree on what to say?

Its a group. From the previous page's timeline:

quote:

The minister of defense consults with political advisors and issues a statement from the central command of the army a roughly fifty-member body made up of top brass that basically offers a forty-eight-hour ultimatum to the president to bow to the demands of the opposition.

Kilometers Davis posted:

I hate to sound like a sensationalist news anchor but this is causing a lot of weird excitement and anxiety in me. Knowing that vital history is going to happen at a specific time is a surreal feeling but I suppose it's really nothing new. Social media's fault?

The only thing that will probably happen when the clock runs out is the expiration of the ultimatum. Orders have probably been pre-issued to units that can be trusted, but its still going to take a lot of time to secure government facilities, issue press releases, etc. Much more if Morsi and the MB decide to fight it out. It's not like he's going to pack his bags and hand in the keys to his office at 10 AM EST.

OwlBot 2000
Jun 1, 2009


SCAF (Supreme Council of the Armed Forces) is (or was) in charge, with Tantawi in charge during the anti-Mubarak revolution. He was more or less forced out by Morsi, and now the head guy is Al-Sisi. There are 20 other high-level commanders involved.

Edit: 50? I thought there were 21 "key" guys

Sereri
Sep 30, 2008

awwwrigami



So will this end with the MB getting banned again (or at least from political functions) ?

Sucrose
Dec 9, 2009


The Egyptian health ministry says that 16 people were killed at a pro-Morsi rally yesterday. Things don't look good at all .

Young Freud
Nov 25, 2006



Sereri posted:

So will this end with the MB getting banned again (or at least from political functions) ?

If not officially, then by the will of the people. The Muslim Brotherhood is going to be pretty much akin to running around post-War Germany as the Nazi Party. There's so much ill-will against them now and the longer it takes them to get out of power, the more severe the Egyptian people's reaction is going to be. I think even the guys resigning from government functions are more out to save their own asses than out of hope of saving the MB party as a political entity.

OwlBot 2000
Jun 1, 2009


It's some mix of fun and sad when your predictions are correct. Back in 2011 I was saying things like "The MB in particular and Islamism in general has no coherent economic program, and are only popular because they've been "forbidden" or illegal for so long; once people try it out they'll be disappointed and abandon them." I just had no idea it would happen so fast.

Edit: But my predictions about Libyan intervention being a disaster were wrong, so there's that.

OwlBot 2000 fucked around with this message at Jul 3, 2013 around 07:30

a bad enough dude
Jun 30, 2007

APPARENTLY NOT A BAD ENOUGH DUDE TO STICK TO ONE THING AT A TIME WHETHER ITS PBPS OR A SHITTY BROWSER GAME THAT I BEG MONEY FOR AND RIPPED FROM TROPICO. ALSO I LET RETARDED UKRANIANS THAT CAN'T PROGRAM AND HAVE 2000 HOURS IN GARRY'S MOD RUN MY SHIT.

Are there any polls or actual evidence that actually shows a loss in popularity for the Muslim Brotherhood?

pantslesswithwolves
Oct 27, 2008

Ba-dam ba-DUMMMMMM


Momentary derail- can someone explain exactly what the hell is going on this video from Syria? My Levantine Arabic isn't very good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1fs99vnIpco

pantslesswithwolves
Oct 27, 2008

Ba-dam ba-DUMMMMMM


Al-Gamaa al-Islamiyya is now calling for early presidential elections.

quote:

Ultra-conservative Al-Gamaa Al-Islamiya has called on President Mohamed Morsi to hold early presidential elections, Tarek El-Zomor, a senior member of the group, told Reuters.
The statement by the group a close ally of the president comes after Morsi gave a speech late on Tuesday stating that he would not step down. Morsi claimed he would remain president not for authority and power but to protect the legitimacy of the Egyptian constitution, which was drafted and passed during his first year in office.

"This peaceful, constitutional transfer (of power) will spare blood," El-Zomor told Reuters by telephone, adding that it would also protect the constitution that was passed into law in December.

He said the army's statement on Monday appeared to presage a coup, but this "can be avoided if the president decides to hold a referendum on early presidential elections."

Morsi proposed an initiative that included forming a new government, holding parliamentary elections within six months, forming a committee to review proposed constitutional amendments, resolving disagreements over Egypt's prosecutor-general, and promoting the inclusion of youth in government.

The opposition did not accept Morsi's proposals and called for nationwide protests, including in front of the Qobba presidential palace, where Morsi now resides.

Egyptians are counting down until 16:30pm (14:30 GMT) when the army's 48-hour deadline ends. The army gave Morsi and the opposition the deadline to find an agreement, or else, according to the army's statement on Monday, it will take matters into its own hands and propose a 'roadmap' to move forward.

Morsi dismissed the army's statement stating that no one, either "internally or externally," will interfere in Egypt's affairs.

This is pretty significant, considering how the Brotherhood was cozying up to GI after they had a falling out with Al-Nour, the most prominent Salafi party. The Brotherhood is extremely isolated right now, and they have very few cards left to play.

Edit: never mind- GI is denying this. Al-Nour has been calling for early elections ever since this started, though.

pantslesswithwolves fucked around with this message at Jul 3, 2013 around 09:58

Brown Moses
Feb 22, 2002


Things are obviously more interesting in Syria at the moment, but here's details of the largest incendiary bomb yet used in Syria.
http://brown-moses.blogspot.co.uk/2...es-largest.html

Ham
Apr 30, 2009

You're BALD!


a bad enough dude posted:

Are there any polls or actual evidence that actually shows a loss in popularity for the Muslim Brotherhood?

quote:

But as economic woes rise, frustration with Morsi has steadily seeped into a wider cross-section of Egyptian society. Morsi’s approval rating has dropped from 78 percent after his first 100 days in office to 42 percent last month, according to Baseera, an Egyptian research institution.


http://articles.washingtonpost.com/...gyptians-speech

Al-Saqr
Nov 11, 2007

The Islamic Orb Illuminati.

Ham, do you think that Hamdeen and Baradei will finally man the gently caress up and take advantage of the situation or are they still going to be whiny boycotters and let the felool win?


I feel they'll be the latter. based off experience.

Al-Saqr fucked around with this message at Jul 3, 2013 around 11:42

Ham
Apr 30, 2009

You're BALD!


Al-Saqr posted:

Ham, do you think that Hamdeen and Baradei will finally man the gently caress up and take advantage of the situation or are they still going to be whiny boycotters and let the felool win?


I feel they'll be the latter. based off experience.

Apparently Baradei is now the sole representative of the liberal opposition in negotiations with the military, so yes, they'll probably take advantage of it.

Brown Moses
Feb 22, 2002


The Egyptian army has now reportedly occupied the State TV building.

Al-Saqr
Nov 11, 2007

The Islamic Orb Illuminati.

Brown Moses posted:

The Egyptian army has now reportedly occupied the State TV building.

actually it's the republican guards. I'm not sure if that makes a difference.

Ham
Apr 30, 2009

You're BALD!


15 minutes to go but the speech will bs dealyed probably.

MazelTovCocktail
Jun 23, 2012

Gritty's gonna cut you.


Russell William Thorpe posted:

Thank you for this, I'd been trying to figure out what the hell was going on.

As to the deadline: http://www.morsicountdown.com/

With the music from Man of Steel playing on my phone that Countdown clock is epic as hell. Looks like I picked a good time to catch back up on the days events.

Ham posted:

15 minutes to go but the speech will bs dealyed probably.

My clock says 28 minutes left. The time table change?

Oh any good news feeds?

gimpfarfar
Jan 25, 2006

It's time to play Spot the Looney!

Reuters is currently streaming live from Tahrir Square on their liveblog:

http://live.reuters.com/Event/World_News

MazelTovCocktail
Jun 23, 2012

Gritty's gonna cut you.


gimpfarfar posted:

Reuters is currently streaming live from Tahrir Square on their liveblog:

http://live.reuters.com/Event/World_News

Thanks!

Also the Egyptian Military really seems to get this social networking thing!
Reuters Splash

quote:

Egypt army general command currently meeting with religious, national, political and youth figures: army Facebook page

Rip Testes
Jan 29, 2004

I never forget a face, but in your case I'll be glad to make an exception.

Ultra Carp

Friend of mine is in front of the Presidential Guard HQ, protesting for Morsi to step down. Hope he stays safe.

MazelTovCocktail
Jun 23, 2012

Gritty's gonna cut you.


From the Guardian

quote:

The presidency issued a statement on its Facebook page moments ago, reasserting Morsi's right to the office and accusing the opposition of rejecting dialogue an inflammatory assertion. The statement in Arabic is here. Al Jazeera's Rawya Rageh has been tweeting a translation:

Presidency says transition plan based on constitutional legitimacy, blames opposition for turning down its earlier invites for dialogue

Morsi statement: I can't accept as president any bias (by army?) to one side over another

Presidency statement offers formation of coalition govt to oversee parliamentary elex, committee to amend constitution

Opposition factions argue that Morsi and his allies have allowed countless opportunities for dialogue slide by and it was never a priority for this presidency.

Oh Morsi you shouldn't have allowed comments to be enabled.

pentyne
Nov 7, 2012


gfanikf posted:

From the Guardian


Oh Morsi you shouldn't have allowed comments to be enabled.

My god.

I once joked about FB marriage statuses being elevated to legal standing, but now we have a country on the edge of a breakdown of democracy and order and the head of the government is communicating their position through Facebook posts.

Zeroisanumber
Oct 23, 2010



Nap Ghost

gfanikf posted:

From the Guardian


Oh Morsi you shouldn't have allowed comments to be enabled.

Third comment is noting but over and over again. Which one of you assholes is doing that?

MazelTovCocktail
Jun 23, 2012

Gritty's gonna cut you.


Zeroisanumber posted:

Third comment is noting but over and over again. Which one of you assholes is doing that?

Personally I wanted to call Salfist's a bunch of Jews...among other things. But my account is actually mine and I rather not be a cause of bloodshed...for once.

pantslesswithwolves
Oct 27, 2008

Ba-dam ba-DUMMMMMM


I woke up after two hours of sleep following a long night shift so I could watch this unfold on Al Jazeera.

CapnAndy
Feb 27, 2004

This is how Davos feels.
This is how Davos feels all the time.



I'm sorry to be That Guy but all the news stories have been failing me miserably on this one basic question: Why are the Egyptians so mad at Morsi in the first place? By all accounts I've found the elections were open and fair.

ufarn
May 30, 2009


Breaking: Turkey is seizing construction work on Taksim Square according to Al Jazeera.

Tres Burritos
Sep 3, 2009



gimpfarfar posted:

Reuters is currently streaming live from Tahrir Square on their liveblog:

http://live.reuters.com/Event/World_News

That is a whole lot of people.

mrfreeze
Apr 3, 2009

Jon Arbuckle: Master of pleasuring women



CapnAndy posted:

I'm sorry to be That Guy but all the news stories have been failing me miserably on this one basic question: Why are the Egyptians so mad at Morsi in the first place? By all accounts I've found the elections were open and fair.

The way I understand it is he has let security throughout the country go completely to poo poo, while expending his energy passing crappy laws to pander to Islamists. And apparently the Egyptian economy is still awful due in part to those 2 things, and he has done nothing to try and address it.

gimpfarfar
Jan 25, 2006

It's time to play Spot the Looney!

CapnAndy posted:

I'm sorry to be That Guy but all the news stories have been failing me miserably on this one basic question: Why are the Egyptians so mad at Morsi in the first place? By all accounts I've found the elections were open and fair.

Here's a good article on this very subject. Also, just because you're elected for one term, does not mean you won't have to pack up your poo poo and leave if you screw up:


quote:

It's not the economy, stupid. It is not just about the fuel shortages, power outages, deteriorating economy or soaring prices. Western media rarely, if ever, mention the Muslim Brotherhood's assault on Egyptian identity, culture and way of life as a core cause of protests. Could something so intangible motivate such massive demonstrations?

http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/ori...ity-stupid.html

Hefty Leftist
Jun 26, 2011

"You know how vodka or whiskey are distilled multiple times to taste good? It's the same with shit. After being digested for the third time shit starts to taste reeeeeeaaaally yummy."

CapnAndy posted:

I'm sorry to be That Guy but all the news stories have been failing me miserably on this one basic question: Why are the Egyptians so mad at Morsi in the first place? By all accounts I've found the elections were open and fair.

Got in, bumbled around for a year and did nothing to improve economy/power shortages/crime while building up his personal power and instituted dumb Islamic routed laws

I think

Ham
Apr 30, 2009

You're BALD!


CapnAndy posted:

I'm sorry to be That Guy but all the news stories have been failing me miserably on this one basic question: Why are the Egyptians so mad at Morsi in the first place? By all accounts I've found the elections were open and fair.

Monopolization of legislative and executive power, marginalization of most political groups birthed out of the revolution, use of an unrepresentative upper house of parliament (previously only served an advisory function) majority controlled by the MB to set an MB-tailored constitution, extreme incompetence in dealing with political and social issues, extreme incompetence in dealing with economic issues, massive incessant power outages all over Egypt, extreme fuel shortage over the two weeks prior to the start of the protests, bungling the situation with Ethiopia's Nile River dam and embarrassing the country/administration to no end.

CapnAndy
Feb 27, 2004

This is how Davos feels.
This is how Davos feels all the time.



gimpfarfar posted:

Here's a good article on this very subject. Also, just because you're elected for one term, does not mean you won't have to pack up your poo poo and leave if you screw up:


http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/ori...ity-stupid.html
That is very good, but it leads to my other question: Was just voting this prick out not an option?

silvergoose
Mar 18, 2006

IT IS SAID THE TEARS OF THE BWEENIX CAN HEAL ALL WOUNDS


CapnAndy posted:

That is very good, but it leads to my other question: Was just voting this prick out not an option?

In another 3 years?

gimpfarfar
Jan 25, 2006

It's time to play Spot the Looney!

CapnAndy posted:

That is very good, but it leads to my other question: Was just voting this prick out not an option?

Well, I think the main aim with protests like these in general is to bring on a new election, or change, in a peaceful way - atleast that would be the ideal case. They are calling for Morsi to resign and to have new elections, aren't they?

etalian
Mar 20, 2006


silvergoose posted:

In another 3 years?

Yeah it's a four year term but they forgot to add in a lemon provision.

CapnAndy
Feb 27, 2004

This is how Davos feels.
This is how Davos feels all the time.



etalian posted:

Yeah it's a four year term but they forgot to add in a lemon provision.
Ah.

On the one hand this is really neat -- God knows it'd be nice if Americans would take to the streets loving ever, but on the other hand at some point Egypt needs to handle bad leaders democratically, not with mob rule and asking the army to fix everything for them. Hopefully they get it right this time.

computer parts
Nov 18, 2010

PLEASE CLAP

CapnAndy posted:

I'm sorry to be That Guy but all the news stories have been failing me miserably on this one basic question: Why are the Egyptians so mad at Morsi in the first place? By all accounts I've found the elections were open and fair.

Stuff has gone to poo poo. My friend is Egyptian (living here, but visiting Egypt in a week or two) and she says that stuff like electricity is a lot less reliable than it was during Mubarak's era.

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El Ste
Aug 22, 2010



Ham posted:

Monopolization of legislative and executive power, marginalization of most political groups birthed out of the revolution, use of an unrepresentative upper house of parliament (previously only served an advisory function) majority controlled by the MB to set an MB-tailored constitution, extreme incompetence in dealing with political and social issues, extreme incompetence in dealing with economic issues, massive incessant power outages all over Egypt, extreme fuel shortage over the two weeks prior to the start of the protests, bungling the situation with Ethiopia's Nile River dam and embarrassing the country/administration to no end.

Yep. I wish there was a way to copy/paste in real life conversation because every time my friends ask me I'd like to just say this.

Got a ton of family taking part in the protests. Fingers crossed things don't turn too bloody but I'm not particularly optimistic.

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