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Re: Last page: I have no doubt about the Kurds being well-organized, but I'm highly skeptical that whoever wins the war will risk enraging Turkey by giving them some measure of autonomy.
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Sep 7, 2012 20:27
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That's really cool and all, but you might have mistaken this thread with the Congress. A common error, really.
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Sep 9, 2012 16:05
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Arzy posted:Go look at the picture on Drudge right now and tell me you have no emotional response to the lifeless body of a US Ambassador being carried around. It is normal to have some emotional response. It is not normal to call for blood to flow and to treat Middle East as if it were your sandbox that you can just clean up whenever you want, and not a community of sovereign countries that will deal with the situation according to their own laws and procedures. That's not emotional, that's hatred and internalized imperialism.
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Sep 12, 2012 14:20
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^^^ Why do Americans feel they have to reinvent the wheel every time they encounter a problem? Modern justice, both as a theoretical science and as a branch of power, is robust enough to handle something like that, as evidenced by numerous examples from other democratic regimes. SolarFire2 posted:We need to throw Bill Maher in prison for that 'Religulous' movie, then?o Not all regulations have to be equivalent to blasphemy laws, for Christ's sake. Germany, for instance, has a complex system of laws forbidding all sorts of attacks against human dignity. Yet, it remains arguably one of the more liberal countries even in the western world. steinrokkan fucked around with this message at 15:15 on Sep 12, 2012 |
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Sep 12, 2012 15:11
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Origami Dali posted:I can't believe people in here are actually trying to square the circle of being able to keep free speech while criminalizing those who produce subversive art (however poor the quality). Free speech? Freedom is the recognition of necessity.
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Sep 12, 2012 15:38
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Origami Dali posted:If speech were oil, this would actually make sense. Umm... What? Recognizing arbitrary freedom as it relates to substantial forms of human nature has nothing to do with freedom as a commodity or whatever you were trying to say.
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Sep 12, 2012 15:49
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Flagellum posted:Exactly. Just like American extremists can't differentiate between brown-skinned people, Islamist extremists often don't see any need to differentiate between the many subjects of the Great Satan.
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Sep 12, 2012 16:20
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Flagellum posted:No trolling, just some alcoholic beverages and shitposting on my side. It is not. The video is a conscious part of an ongoing symbolic "debate" between certain politically and ideologically affiliated groups. A debate in which peoples' lives are amongst the used media.
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Sep 12, 2012 16:26
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Fog Tripper posted:Posts like this really are annoying as gently caress. Nobody wants tanks rolling in to commit mass genocide. People are simply having reaction to a not even day-old tragedy involving one of our own e-buddies. So, can we knock the poo poo off and just let people speak their minds? No. Not if it involves violence and dehumanization of others. Or if it reinforces the abhorrent trend of US imperialism and cultural superiority.
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Sep 12, 2012 21:23
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xyzzyx posted:I only found out about Vilerat's death today. I'm angry. I'm so loving angry right now. And there's nothing we can do about it. Yeah, Middle East, when will you learn that civilized people carry out their murders on other continents and en masse, guided by their slightly less invisible friend (but even more bloodthirsty) called "geopolitics" (plus her friends "blind racial hatred", "tribalism" and "utter disregard for people who do not share some vague identity with me")? steinrokkan fucked around with this message at 21:48 on Sep 13, 2012 |
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Sep 13, 2012 21:43
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Jarmak posted:You are the stereotype that Fox News et al use to scare mainstream Americans away from "liberal" policies and politicians. No. If those people were mere lunatics, their actions would be far different. Those groups are organized, backed by an ideology and they have political goals. They are the Red brigades of the Arab world, except their foot soldiers are people for whom life lost all other reason, and not spoiled European kids. When dealing with such threats, understanding and communication are vital: They gain power via socialization, they can only be defeated via socialization. If you do not attempt to unroot the ontological narrative offered by the extremists, it will spread unchallenged through the desperate underclass of the Arab world.
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Sep 14, 2012 12:12
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Jarmak posted:This might be accurate in regards to some movements, this one is a bunch of wildly unpopular people who are trying to get their way with guns after failing democratically. They didn't just materialize. They had to be organized under leadership capable of forward planning, and they had to create somewhat efficient ways to sustain the ongoing war of attrition between clashing interests. They may not be particularly popular, but they do exist, they are relevant, and they do operate as a differentiated group.
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Sep 14, 2012 13:05
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Jarmak posted:And your point is what? This isn't a socially supported movement. You keep posting crap that sounds like its straight out of the Army COIN manual but none of it has been applied to actually contradicting what I've said, or even the specific situation. Reducing the issue to "they are thugs, end of discussion" is dangerous and idiotic.
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Sep 14, 2012 13:45
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Since 1996, Syria has been the occasional home of Admiral Kuznetsov, Russia's only carrier of her class since the purchase of Varyag by China. I would argue that makes Syria a significant strategic staging point for Russian fleet operations. Also, the uprising came at a time of another planned (since 2010) mission of A. K. (and her escort) in the area.
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Oct 4, 2012 22:37
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Ardennes posted:Eh, I don't think the Kuznetsov actually docked in that base, it probably sat off shore. The carrier is probably physically larger than the base itself. While that is true, I believe that the capability of providing immediate support from a Mediterranean port is vital for maintaining the Baltic and Mediterranean fleet as a relevant force capable of reaching the Atlantic Ocean, as shown by Kuznetsov's less than stellar operational record (constant failures and need of extensive maintenance). Russia tries to maintain its face and it looks like it won't be able to keep the game up if it loses even what seems like an apparently insignificant base. I don't believe any sort of "Red Dawn" scenario is even remotely possible, in fact I consider any speculations to that effect to be outright ridiculous (it's not the 19th century anymore, for Christ's sake), but I understand Russia's position and stern opposition to toppling the status quo. steinrokkan fucked around with this message at 22:58 on Oct 4, 2012 |
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Oct 4, 2012 22:55
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McDowell posted:As the Middle East falls apart they will probably start to make power plays where it suits them (mainly involving Pacific claims). No one is going to provoke China, they will take the initiative when the time comes. It is more than likely that China has much, much more to gain by playing the role of a power of reconciliation and reconstruction than by trying to project military power.
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Oct 4, 2012 23:15
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Brown Moses posted:This video gives a good example of the size of an area that can be effected by cluster bombs, you see both plenty of unexploded bomblets, plus the holes left by the ones that did explode This actually makes it look like there are more defective bomblets than functional ones. Is that normal / misleading / indicative of how underequipped Syria is?
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Oct 30, 2012 22:46
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I believe it was Daniel Louis Seiler who theorized (based on Rokkan and Lipset) that the secularism × Church split occurred during the national revolution. That is, before the invention of the nation state, there was little contention between the state and organized religion - both philosophically, and practically. And after the nation state became an uncontested reality, this cleavage was functionally replaced with the worker × owner clash, muting the intensity of religiousness in politics. Based on that, it would seem that the issue of secularism pretty much becomes most important when societies approach the tipping-point of modernization and relegate traditional institutions to a supplementary role compared with the dominant institutions of the legal state. And that's what is possibly going on in several countries and why religious influences are not perceived as that much of a threat in the post-industrial USA (again, according to Seiler, the USA is in the final documented stage of development in which there are dominant statism × minimalism cleavages that have replaced the previous capital × labour structuring of loyalties).
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Dec 2, 2012 12:32
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Muffiner posted:That sounds very interesting, and I've been thinking about the history of political paradigms recently. Do you have any suggested reading on this subject? I wish I did, but I mostly read continental comparative politics and have no ideas about the state of English translations in the field :-/
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Dec 2, 2012 21:05
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Devil Child posted:Marx managed to recognize the superiority of the science and social systems of the Western World while at the same time recognizing they had nothing to do with genetics, could change to another area of the world at any time, and still kept a keen critical eye on the atrocities committed by the Western World at the time. He never ceased fighting against these atrocities, and always managed to articulate his points practically without compromising his principles or priorities. As the JJ pointed out, the term superior will cause problems. I guess it would be more fruitful to talk about the complexity of political systems and related economies. Raymond Aron pioneered this approach after he abandoned Sartre's pro-Soviet intellectual circle. Modern secular (industrial) societies can be seen as resulting from the need to retain political control over increasingly complex societies. These industrial states could assume varying forms of capitalist and socialist constitutions, but in the end were motivated by the same issues of organization, adaptation and control in new and difficult conditions. Now, it could be argued that the developing of Europe and America into industrial states doesn't really have implications for the rest of the world: But I don't think that's true. Be it because of historical ties, because of structural imperatives of the center - periphery dynamics, or because of West's dominance in constructing the concept of good governance, even traditional countries reform themselves to fit the industrial order, coming to face the same old problems Aron talked about. If we are truly living in a globalized world, we must recognize the importance of reproducing old means of development, whether we like it or not. That's not really a good thing per se: Aron recognized, together with his peers, that industrial society represented a new quality in organized violence, and saw totalitarian regimes as one of possible outcomes of development. Huntington was aware of the challenges of industrial modernity which can be easily defeated by its complexity (http://www.wright.edu/~gordon.welty/Perlmutter_98.pdf). I think a sound hypothesis about this issue would be that "As a political system adapts to more complex forms of organization, it necessarily isolates traditional institutions of religion etc. from their previous privileged position, and opens access to interest groups identified with the industrial basis of the new regime." It doesn't include the normative element of secularization and merely paints it as a means to achieving an instrumental goal, plus it shows that religion isn't actively "pushed away" in secular states, that it just doesn't have anything to say anymore.
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Dec 3, 2012 11:21
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SilentD posted:I can't really "otherize" rabbits as I am not a rabbit, this is common sense. You sound like a pleasant human being. I bet talking about killing animals in cold blood is a perfect ice breaker at parties. Now shut up, please. mynamewas posted:The revolution only happened a little under two years ago and most people viewing the situation understood that Mubarak's military remained basically unmolested and that the Muslim Brotherhood only holds power because they made a pact with the military. The people genuinely made secular demands for freedom and equality, and they know they have to fight for it. Well, yeah, he made pact with the army - but what other options were there? Making peace with the softer wing of the ruling elites is generally a better guarantee of democracy in the long run than trying to oust them as fast as possible and risking their fighting back. I'm afraid it won't be possible to tell whether or not democracy has a chance before a significant generational change in leadership occurs: Then the new politicians will be able to decide between using democratic institutions in the way they were intended, or installing an authoritarian regime. What we have now is just a transitional period before that decision.
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Dec 7, 2012 01:15
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Is hating on Christmas just because it exists this year's flavour of cool non-conformism.
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Dec 29, 2014 15:24
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Al-Saqr posted:because it's a natural ending to a dictator who with full support from the west destroyed any possibility for democracy and peaceful change in his country through a huge police state, and when the revolution kicked off he killed thousands of people with the army, leading to only the most radical people to end up being strong enough to take control once he hosed off. Besides there being more head scarves in the streets, the youth of Iran is still very much in touch with Western fashion trends, actually. It didn't die out with the Shah's fall.
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Mar 6, 2015 15:12
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Napoleon loving loved the Pyramids, "Soldiers, from the summit of yonder pyramids forty centuries look down upon you" and all that jazz
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Mar 12, 2015 17:21
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A Fancy 400 lbs posted:On a scale of Amarna to Alexandria,I'm thinking it'll be closer to the Amarna side of the spectrum. Amarna was the best period of Egyptian history, so I guess it means good things?
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Mar 14, 2015 02:25
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karl fungus posted:What's stopping ISIS from using every possible outlawed weapon during their attacks, like chemical and biological weapons? I see they're using chlorine now, but what's next? In addition to what Nintendo said - their enemies have far greater stockpiles of those weapons, so it may not be a great idea to rock the boat too much.
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Mar 15, 2015 01:07
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So... I haven't followed this thread for long, so I can't tell if there is a definite goon answer to this: What alternative is there to Assad in actually ending the war? I mean, Assad is supported by at least two major powers, Russian and Iran, that are both willing to have boots on the ground, and are inherently invested in Middle Eastern security. In contrast to this, the other factions are at best supported by air power, which has never won a war on its own.
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Apr 30, 2016 23:32
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Chalk this up as yet another horrible event that in retrospective is amazing to have never happened before. Don't need guns, don't need explosives, don't even need a plan just a truck going really fast into a densely packed crowd. It happened - just not in service of Islamic radicals.
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Jul 14, 2016 23:36
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Volkerball posted:I'm sure the roads were closed, but putting up a little folding road closed sign isn't going to stop an 18-wheeler.
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Jul 14, 2016 23:47
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steinrokkan posted:How resilient would an 18 wheeler be against steel road pylons used to mark pedestrian zones? Seems like a couple of them would strip down some of its vital systems, but maybe not. Like this is an overkill, but the idea remains: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6oUBYkgZuf0
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Jul 14, 2016 23:51
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Grouchio posted:Can a political party be both leftist and progressive yet anti-immigration at the same time? That might be what Europe needs in the ensuing decades. Yes, it's called unionism. Preventing outsiders, including immigrants, from undermining the position of unionized workers has been historically among the main goals of unions. But good luck getting a (corporatist) system with a strong, state-guaranteed unions representation to emerge in any European country these days.
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Jul 15, 2016 10:55
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Edible Hat posted:It seems pretty obvious to anyone who has taken a cursory glance at history or anthropology that the doctrine of human rights is indeed not universal. ... says comfortably the guy who is at no risk of having his human rights revoked The fact that basic rights were / are usurped from people under various reasonings says nothing about their validity. A: "Murder is bad." B: "A cursory glance at history will reveal that a murder has happened at some time. So maybe murder is... good" steinrokkan fucked around with this message at 13:53 on Jul 15, 2016 |
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Jul 15, 2016 13:48
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Fados posted:Problem is, I see a big difference between 'maximum possible benefits for all people' to Congolese Permawar, Middle East permawar, etc and tbh this type of crappy euphemism doesnt really make you stand out from the cynical post-political establishment that usually hides behind human rights rethoric (this is to get back at the Maoist remark, no hard feelings). Now as for alternatives, I think you kinda spelled it out. Just look at this old socialist Bernie Sanders fellow I've been hearing about here in barbaric Europe, he seems like he goes for these old-fashioned motifs of economic equality, anti big capital, etc that the left abandoned since 68 for the dream of a 'tame' capitalism. He didn't win sure, but he did seem to get a lot more (working even!) people enthused about the prospect of a progressive program than I've seen in decades. Bernie Sanders, noted opponent of the concept of human rights, advocate of an elitist society with no accountability for the leaders.
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Jul 15, 2016 15:52
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Fados posted:Right, as I said, empty signifier which can mean anything. What the hell does the name of some random organization have to do with anything. Are you one of those guys who say that the Nazis were socialists because they had it in the name? http://www.faculty.umb.edu/gary_zabel/Courses/Phil%20108-08/Habermas.%20Kosovo.html
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Jul 15, 2016 16:21
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Thug Lessons posted:If this does pan out, that'll make a whole 19 years since Turkey had a coup. Is that a new record? Well, Turkish military coups have generally been a force for good, imho. It's an aberration, but the Kemalist ideology of the army elites seems to have worked, historically, as it was supposed to.
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Jul 15, 2016 21:29
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I hope Erdogan gets loving booted so hard.
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Jul 15, 2016 21:30
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FourLeaf posted:Why are so many Twitter sources are speaking in the past tense, and saying "thwarted coup" even though it still seems to be going on Relying on government sources?
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Jul 15, 2016 21:31
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Friendly Humour posted:Whoah, now this is something I did not expect. I thought Erdogan purged the military to prevent precisely this eventuality. Getting rid of army leaders, and replacing them with people who implicitly know you regard them as disposable puppets whose (metaphorical) survival depends on your whim won't work in the long term unless you are Stalin.
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Jul 15, 2016 21:34
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Fuligin posted:My very sketchy understanding is that the Turkish military has generally operated as a safeguard of democracy, right? I know Erdogan is an increasingly authoritarian shitheel, but was there something in the past few weeks that might have directly precipitated action this drastic? Window of opportunity due to him leaving on a foreign trip, combined with rising internal tensions, security deterioration, and compromising the national secular order the army hjas prided itself on upholding in the past.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:06
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Young Freud posted:If Erdogan's out of the country, would that still make him the government in exile? Part of me wants Obama and everyone to go "Yeah...about that" and kick his rear end to the curb. I guess he will become another Yanukovich unless his cronies push back against the military effectively enough / the uprising turns out to be more limited than it seems.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:09
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