Middle East Thread of Despair: More Broken Than Syria

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Middle East Thread of Despair: More Broken Than Syria

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

If it's tribes vs. rebels what can NATO do? Maybe this is a slippery strategic move. How much of the army are also part of the tribes?

# ¿ Apr 23, 2011 16:40

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# ¿ Jul 20, 2025 16:47

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

I was reading the Al-Jazeera Engligh Libya live blog for April 23rd and I saw this image of libyan officials showing reports a crater they say is from an airstrike in tripoli.

Is it even remotely possible that a munition launched/dropped from a jet fighter could leave a perfectly symmetrical hole in the ground with what appears to be a nice circle in the middle of the crater, complete with what looks like an intact partial casing laying within the crater itself?

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# ¿ Apr 23, 2011 16:50

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Nenonen posted:

BBC's Jeremy Bowen commented on the scene:

"A big concrete bunker was hit twice. It wasn't right in the centre of Col Gaddafi's leadership compound, it was what appears to be in a subsidiary part.

The weapons cut through the sandy earth on top of the bunker, then penetrated the concrete and reinforced steel.

Officials said it was used for storing water but I didn't think that was credible. However, there is no evidence of a secondary explosion which suggests the bunker did not contain ammunition.

Thanks, that explains the hole quite well!

# ¿ Apr 23, 2011 19:25

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

quote:

AP reports: Libya's deputy foreign minister, Khaled Kaim, said troops have halted operations in Misurata to enable tribal elders to negotiate with the rebels.

If the rebels don't surrender in the next two days, armed tribesmen will fight them in place of the army, he said.

from http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-24?sort=asc

That's a little different than the government's previous statement in which they said they'd leave it up to the tribes to sort out.

# ¿ Apr 24, 2011 08:13

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Pureauthor posted:

I have to wonder why he keeps calling ceasefires since he has to know that everyone knows it's bullshit.

It's hard to resupply your troops so they can continue to bomb/shoot/rape civilians when NATO is bombing you and the rebels are shooting at you.

# ¿ May 1, 2011 11:53

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Mad Doctor Cthulhu posted:

For the Gaddafis to really expect a truce to be taken seriously after all of this shows how loving out of touch they are. There are two choices they have: they can either beg openly for asylum and run like hell, or they can be executed. Given how far this has gone, I would not be surprised to see Twitpics of them in a bloody pile on fire.

Once an international arrest warrant is issued for gaddafi (assuming it happens), isn't asylum out of the question at that point? Libya (the gaddafi government) has claimed it will ignore it since they didn't sign the treaty/whatever that formed the International Criminal Court, but that would effectively freeze his traveling ability wouldn't it?

mr. nobody fucked around with this message at 01:54 on May 17, 2011

# ¿ May 17, 2011 01:51

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Ok how about: what are the implications to Gaddafi, if/when an international arrest warrant is issued for his arrest on the charges against him?

# ¿ May 17, 2011 01:56

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Young Freud posted:

Don't forget familial relations as well. I made a point that, when Saif al-Arab was killed in a bomb attack on a command control center, that the three Qaddafi grandchildren that were also killed were likely military age, because family members are the only ones that Qaddafi would probably trust 99%.

You might have made that point around time he was fake killed:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...ddafis-son.html

# ¿ May 29, 2011 01:30

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

That's a 3-inch piece of shrapnel near his heart, and it's not clear whether he would need surgery? Is that code for "he might just die instead"?

# ¿ Jun 4, 2011 18:34

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Brown Moses posted:

Gaddafi has also thrown out nearly all the foreign journalists from Tripoli, so don't expect much news from there anymore.

Any reasons given by the regime for that move? Will be interesting to read the first-hand accounts of the last day or two of the journalists' stay in Tripoli.

# ¿ Jul 10, 2011 13:53

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

neamp posted:

Notice the big anti tank mine doesn't seem have a fuse installed so probably the small anti personnel mines are supposed to set it off. I suspect they set it up this way because the civilian vehicles used by the rebels are too light to reliably trigger the anti tank mines.

Is this how things go (layered minelaying) or is this a special gently caress you move by what's left of gaddaffi's military?

# ¿ Jul 26, 2011 01:29

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Lascivious Sloth posted:

Gaddafi
quote:
"Traitors, surrender your weapons... Choose: death or surrender."

That line should have been the NTC response.

# ¿ Jul 28, 2011 00:43

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Jut posted:

Probably because I consider protecting civilians more important than removing a bad man. The action in Kosovo set out to protect civilians, not remove Milosevic, and it succeeded in forcing peace. I doubt Milosevic would have taken the peace offer if his stepping down was a precondition of peace.

I like your avatar. It makes it easy to laugh at your posts.

# ¿ Aug 2, 2011 14:07

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Jut posted:

Well done at ignoring the points made and going for the "you're a big poopy head" response.

Then an equally good job at ignoring the situation in Libya and managing to compare it to Kosovo.

# ¿ Aug 2, 2011 14:21

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

I wonder how much sniper fire is actually some other parts of Tripoli's celebratory gunfire landing in other parts of the city.

edit: and then they shoot back at the "sniper" and those bullets land in another part of the city setting off a chain of dumb

# ¿ Aug 26, 2011 00:48

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

I'd like to know more about these medicine/food stores that were located. Are there any articles that discuss it beyond rebel spokesman saying all is well now?

It's been said a billion times but this thread has been the best source of converged coverage of the coverage of all things middle east related, thanks for it.

# ¿ Aug 27, 2011 20:42

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Yeah link that please, I'd like to have been able to see that when I was prepared for it.

# ¿ Aug 28, 2011 15:12

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Xandu posted:

The NYT didn't bother to include the list, any one have a link?

I found this, but it's not dated and I can't tell if it is accurate, if it is what it says it is (The Libyan Interim National Council � Official Website).

http://www.ntclibya.org/english/council-members/

1. Mustafa Mohammed Abdul Jalil (Chairman)
2. Mr. Abdul Hafiz Ghoga (Vice-Chairman)
3. Mr. Fatih Turbel (Youth)
4. Mr. Zubeir Ahmed El-Sharif (Political Prisoners)
5. Mr. Omar Al-Hariri (Military Affairs)
6. Dr. Fatih Mohammed Baja (Political Affairs)
7. Dr. Salwa Fawzi El-Deghali (Legal Affairs and Women)
8. Dr. Abdullah Moussa Al-Mayhoub:
9. Mr. Ahmed Al-Abbar (Economics)
10. Mr. Ashour Bourashed (City of Derna)
11. Mr. Uthman Megrahi (City of Batnan)
12. Dr Suleiman Al-Fortiya (Misrata)
13. Mr. Mohamed Al-Muntasir (Misrata)

# ¿ Aug 28, 2011 18:24

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Brown Moses posted:

Also, if you've not yet read this article about the Battle of Tripoli from the perspective from inside Tripoli then make sure you do, it's really excellent, and includes some amazing stuff.

This was a really good read. I know you previously linked it but I skipped over it the first time. I'm glad I didn't the second time, that was a quality article.

# ¿ Sep 3, 2011 19:21

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

OwlBot 2000 posted:

Can someone explain why every single person in these videos shouts ALLAHU AKBAR! nonstop?

http://www.slate.com/id/2149455/

It looks to be more of a general celebratory phrase, the following might apply to general battle situations not just suicide stuff

quote:

Militants on suicide missions often say "Allahu akbar" because they believe they are committing a righteous act and because it's good form to die with praise for Allah on your lips.

# ¿ Sep 18, 2011 14:11

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Cao Ni Ma posted:

Gotta keep those buffs up.

Holy poo poo that had me laughing so hard.

That picture I do not think could possibly be put into context to make any sense.

Brown Moses those picture posts organized by timeframe are great.

# ¿ Oct 12, 2011 00:51

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Kenning posted:

Holy poo poo that was awesome.

Can anyone translate that? I'm envisioning "See how that made you feel? Take that energy to the polls."

# ¿ Oct 19, 2011 03:06

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Sulla-Marius 88 posted:

I hope the arab spring crosses over to the western world and they overthrow dictators operating under the guise of democracy and capitalism.

We do that every 4-8 years on average.

# ¿ Oct 21, 2011 01:47

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

etalian posted:

He's right next to the Forever 21 right now.

More like Forever 69. A rat in a mall freezer; a fitting post-mortem.

# ¿ Oct 22, 2011 06:06

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

This video doesn't show the attack itself, it is not stated how long afterwards it was shot edit: based on the description in the news article I think this is the video it's talking about, the narrator says the militia attacked it but it doesn't say the video captured the attack itself
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOY-HGRb41s

# ¿ Dec 9, 2011 02:18

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Barry the Sprout posted:

Things like the car bombs and suicide bombing in the past month have been indicators to how this has progressed. I don't believe in the slightest that these were false flag operations.

Counterpoint: if it were terrorists like the dictator is proclaiming on state-run TV with no actual proof to back it up, don't terrorist organizations usually claim responsibility for these things to get their message out?

From an outside perspective not having anyone I care about living in Syria, I ask who benefits from that suicide attack, with nobody claiming responsibility for it? The easy answer seems to be whoever wants sympathy the most and right now I think that's a dictator not a crowd of protestors.

# ¿ Jan 11, 2012 02:35

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

az jan jananam posted:

edit- I don't know how to get video tags to work.

You don't have PMs or I'd message you; for youtubes to display in-thread do this:

code:

[video type=""]urlgoeshere[/video]

Forums are parsing in a 'type=""' I didn't type that, just video urlhere /video but with brackets like above.

# ¿ Jan 31, 2012 02:18

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Is there any way for me as a citizen, to request of my government to make a statement to russia about this? I preferably would want a press conference where an official just goes dear world here is our response to russia and silently flips the bird for 2 minutes while glaring, then turns and exits the room without saying anything.

# ¿ Feb 4, 2012 18:06

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Pedrophile posted:

If the CIA were really in Syria there would be a lot more organization by now.

Not-so-hard-conspiracy theory: The Arab monitors were an attempt to get footage out of atrocities by Bashar Al Assad to show the world how brutal he is being.

But don't you see, by not being organized, that just proves they are there because only they would be smart enough to realize that this would fool the world. Lack of proof is the proof!

God it's hard to even type that in jest.

edit: I agree, some skepticism is in order, but there's a huge difference between 'taking news out of syria with a few grains of salt due to the almost total lack of journalistic reports to confirm anything' and all the posts in the last 5+ pages from a certain poster

# ¿ Feb 7, 2012 03:06

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

I admit my relative cultural ignorance here, hence why I am asking:

When journalists translate what someone says from native (presumably arabic) tongue to english, why do they leave words like jihad and allah untranslated? Just taking those two from the most recently posted article in this thread.

edit: I'm not suggesting that nobody understands what those words mean, but why not translate them?

# ¿ Mar 2, 2012 01:39

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

Xandu posted:

edit: there's actually been some debate about not translating shuhada/shaheed as martyr because it gives the wrong connotations to english speakers.
arablit.wordpress.com/2012/02/17/do-you-translate-شهداء-as-martyrs

Thanks for the link, after reading that it is clear that it's not so clear!

# ¿ Mar 2, 2012 05:47

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# ¿ Jul 20, 2025 16:47

mr. nobody: Sep 25, 2004; Net contents 12 fluid oz.

spiralbrain posted:

Yeah, I dont think I want to watch that

Heartbreaking whats going on there.

You don't want to watch that. It isn't the action of a child being shot by a sniper, it's a dead child, that was killed by a sniper.

I should not have watched that, but what's going on there is terrible and ugh no words.

# ¿ Mar 6, 2012 02:11

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