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GreenBuckanneer
Sep 15, 2007

bobomb posted:

You know, maybe punpun has already found himself. Punpun being drawn as human, with only his head being drawn differently. Maybe this is his final transformation into a human monster. I think he's living moment to moment now, and he's truly stopped caring about everything except himself? I mean, he even mentioned that he feels good after the murder, so that might be a good indicator that he might kill again. I mean, "if it feels good, do it"

There tends to be a rush after someone murders another person. It's kinda like a coping mechanism to try and deal with it.

I just caught up and I have to say, I rather prefer punpun now. It was getting tiresome. His assertiveness is refreshing.

Did she stab him in the eye or the finger? I can't tell.

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Weird BIAS
Jul 5, 2007

so... guess that's it, huh? just... don't say i didn't warn you.

GreenBuckanneer posted:

There tends to be a rush after someone murders another person. It's kinda like a coping mechanism to try and deal with it.

I just caught up and I have to say, I rather prefer punpun now. It was getting tiresome. His assertiveness is refreshing.

Did she stab him in the eye or the finger? I can't tell.


Neither. There was sauce on the fork before they talked about removing his eye and his finger is bandaged from Aiko biting it. Punpun is making it sound like she failed to do it.

ANIME AKBAR
Jan 25, 2007

afu~

Personal_Nirvana posted:

^

Exactly. Is so much more powerfull because you are emotionaly invested, and care for the character. Now, i can unerstand why people would want to slap Inio Asano's face. Everyone who follow Punpun is familiar with his dark side, and get tha he's prone to destructive behavior. But no one expected to manifest that way.

Yeah this is what I was trying to say. It's a lot like how in Shamo Ryo is somewhat sympathetic, until he randomly rapes some woman and from then on he's just some sociopathic monster. Though that didn't turn out entirely bad, but that's probably because it was an action manga all along.

GreenBuckanneer
Sep 15, 2007

It's rather cool how well the mangaka is able to convey depression and abuse so well that it just resonates. Punpun's "I can't do this because I suck, and it's because I suck that I can't do this" defeatist attitude (to summarize his feelings) is pretty much in line with major depression. Additionally, Akio was constantly abused (something that was shown way back on her shoulders, though why her shoulders?) and her behavior now is also showing the same kind of signs. She says she loves him, yet it's clear she's acting out of fear. She hated her mom, but she didn't want her to die. No one really does. Her mom was plenty abusive though. Look at the way she talks, it's pretty much textbook for a verbally abusive person. "I'm all you need, no one else cares about you like I do" (while making the other person littler than themselves.) You can see how much of a manipulator she was (verbally abusive people are) by the fact she could walk just fine, it was just how she was able to control Akio.

So now Akio says she loves him, but not truly. She hates him for murdering her mom (even though it began in self defense), but she has no one else and if he's not around she'll be truly alone. It's why she wanted to stab his eye out, but also why she failed to go through with it.

Punpun's current self is the result of his actions throughout the years, how he treats others and himself. "You reap what you sow". This was just the....push out the door he needed to finally change, though obviously not in the right way.

Personal_Nirvana
Dec 28, 2012

ANIME AKBAR posted:

Yeah this is what I was trying to say. It's a lot like how in Shamo Ryo is somewhat sympathetic, until he randomly rapes some woman and from then on he's just some sociopathic monster. Though that didn't turn out entirely bad, but that's probably because it was an action manga all along.


Oh god Shamo. :stonk:



The art is one of the best things i've seen from any manga, but i couldn't for the life of me keep reading after that. Still didn't.

Same with Thomas Covenant.




GreenBuckanneer posted:

It's rather cool how well the mangaka is able to convey depression and abuse so well that it just resonates. Punpun's "I can't do this because I suck, and it's because I suck that I can't do this" defeatist attitude (to summarize his feelings) is pretty much in line with major depression. Additionally, Akio was constantly abused (something that was shown way back on her shoulders, though why her shoulders?) and her behavior now is also showing the same kind of signs. She says she loves him, yet it's clear she's acting out of fear. She hated her mom, but she didn't want her to die. No one really does. Her mom was plenty abusive though. Look at the way she talks, it's pretty much textbook for a verbally abusive person. "I'm all you need, no one else cares about you like I do" (while making the other person littler than themselves.) You can see how much of a manipulator she was (verbally abusive people are) by the fact she could walk just fine, it was just how she was able to control Akio.

So now Akio says she loves him, but not truly. She hates him for murdering her mom (even though it began in self defense), but she has no one else and if he's not around she'll be truly alone. It's why she wanted to stab his eye out, but also why she failed to go through with it.

Punpun's current self is the result of his actions throughout the years, how he treats others and himself. "You reap what you sow". This was just the....push out the door he needed to finally change, though obviously not in the right way.



I liked what you said by the end. I haven't thought trought that perspective. Yea he definitely changed, and only something trully spetacular could break his catharsis. But then again...i had thought he had changed when he "became" his neighbor, only to be a persona he created, hiding behind the mask. Could be the same now? I hope not, otherwise Punpun is on a entire new level of hosed up.



Not for one minute i believed in Aiko's affections, even before the tragedy. She's the personification in what a terrible, terrible upbringing could do to one's self steam and notion of "self". She saw in Punpun a reflection of herself, and lached on the oportunity. Because being miserable is at least better than being utterly alone.















Personal_Nirvana fucked around with this message at 01:57 on Dec 31, 2012

Zorak
Nov 7, 2005

ANIME AKBAR posted:

Yeah this is what I was trying to say. It's a lot like how in Shamo Ryo is somewhat sympathetic, until he randomly rapes some woman and from then on he's just some sociopathic monster. Though that didn't turn out entirely bad, but that's probably because it was an action manga all along.

Well not quite, since with Shamo he has something mildly as an arc of him realizing how horrible he is

ANIME AKBAR
Jan 25, 2007

afu~

Zorak posted:

Well not quite, since with Shamo he has something mildly as an arc of him realizing how horrible he is

And IIRC he quickly suppresses his guilt through more violence or something

And on that note, apparently Shamo volume 28 was scanlated!

[/derail]

Weird BIAS
Jul 5, 2007

so... guess that's it, huh? just... don't say i didn't warn you.

GreenBuckanneer posted:

It's rather cool how well the mangaka is able to convey depression and abuse so well that it just resonates. Punpun's "I can't do this because I suck, and it's because I suck that I can't do this" defeatist attitude (to summarize his feelings) is pretty much in line with major depression. Additionally, Akio was constantly abused (something that was shown way back on her shoulders, though why her shoulders?) and her behavior now is also showing the same kind of signs. She says she loves him, yet it's clear she's acting out of fear. She hated her mom, but she didn't want her to die. No one really does. Her mom was plenty abusive though. Look at the way she talks, it's pretty much textbook for a verbally abusive person. "I'm all you need, no one else cares about you like I do" (while making the other person littler than themselves.) You can see how much of a manipulator she was (verbally abusive people are) by the fact she could walk just fine, it was just how she was able to control Akio.

So now Akio says she loves him, but not truly. She hates him for murdering her mom (even though it began in self defense), but she has no one else and if he's not around she'll be truly alone. It's why she wanted to stab his eye out, but also why she failed to go through with it.

Punpun's current self is the result of his actions throughout the years, how he treats others and himself. "You reap what you sow". This was just the....push out the door he needed to finally change, though obviously not in the right way.


I'm not really sure that Aiko didn't want her dead. Once her mother was dead she kept stabbing her over and over while Punpun got the door. However I agree with the bulk of your post. I'm not sure she is actually in love with him so much as latching onto the only positive thing she has, which is still a pretty hosed up and abusive relationship. I kept feeling that Punpun was going to end up just like his father and Aiko like his mother, trapped in a horrible relationship born out of abusive situations. But with the murder it's in the air. The festival that Pegasus keeps talking about may be the moment that Punpun and Aiko finally are caught or they both die in a horrific way or something. Aiko might die due to the poor patch job Punpun did on her side wound and maybe he kills himself out of despair. Maybe Punpun is that Black Spot Pegasus keeps referring to. I CAN'T WAIT TO FIND OUT.

Anybody know how close they are to the July festival they keep talking about?

GreenBuckanneer
Sep 15, 2007

Weird BIAS posted:

I'm not really sure that Aiko didn't want her dead. Once her mother was dead she kept stabbing her over and over while Punpun got the door. However I agree with the bulk of your post. I'm not sure she is actually in love with him so much as latching onto the only positive thing she has, which is still a pretty hosed up and abusive relationship. I kept feeling that Punpun was going to end up just like his father and Aiko like his mother, trapped in a horrible relationship born out of abusive situations. But with the murder it's in the air. The festival that Pegasus keeps talking about may be the moment that Punpun and Aiko finally are caught or they both die in a horrific way or something. Aiko might die due to the poor patch job Punpun did on her side wound and maybe he kills himself out of despair. Maybe Punpun is that Black Spot Pegasus keeps referring to. I CAN'T WAIT TO FIND OUT.

Anybody know how close they are to the July festival they keep talking about?


Ah yeah i forgot about that part, but the black spot is "god" I believe. There was some allusion towards this when he was thinking about what the black spot was (I think that's how it went). God right now is in the body of that biker guy. I don't think god is part of punpun, but he has been influencing him.

However to take this one step further, god is not a being. God is a...frame of mind? I don't have the right vocabulary right now to explain it. "Evil exists in the hearts of men" basically. God in this manga is like, your ID? In listening to him instead of rejecting him, it's made matters worse. When Punpun didn't hear him all those years, he basically ignored him just kind of stagnated.

The festival is close now, I think prob around a few weeks in story.

Also there was an explosion, maybe what ends up happening is what's his face (the old friend) blows up the building and akio is in it at the time? It could go a few ways. I still don't know the meaning behind that weird toy. It has something to do with the toy falling, which is kind of what happened with punpun, he destroyed it by cranking it at the ground. Maybe that means something.

failedninja
Nov 29, 2008

GreenBuckanneer posted:

I still don't know the meaning behind that weird toy. It has something to do with the toy falling, which is kind of what happened with punpun, he destroyed it by cranking it at the ground. Maybe that means something.

Agree with everything you've said about God.

As for the toy, it's related to wishes, like shooting stars are. It normally starts off with two black eyes (black spots if you will), and you fill in one eye to make your wish, and the other eye when you fulfill it. I don't think Punpun destroyed it. If I remember correctly, he tossed it up, which made it's eyes fall out, and this whole time it's been falling and falling.

Anyway the scene with Punpun and being willing to lose an eye is not a coincidence I'm sure.

Takanago
Jun 2, 2007

You'll see...
Nijigahara Holograph is getting published in English by Fantagraphics as a 200-page hardcover. It should be a really good release, if what they did for Wandering Son is any indication.

I haven't read this, so I'll definitely pick it up when its out.

a kitten
Aug 5, 2006

Takanago posted:

Nijigahara Holograph is getting published in English by Fantagraphics as a 200-page hardcover. It should be a really good release, if what they did for Wandering Son is any indication.

I haven't read this, so I'll definitely pick it up when its out.

Oh that's great news, their volumes of Wandering Son are outstanding and I've been wanting to read that one for a while.

I just finished reading the viz printing of Solanin and I loving loved it. It reminded me of Murakami's novel Norwegian Wood, mixed with David Mitchell's Number9dream, with a tiny dash of the Scott Pilgrim comic for good measure. Not that I think he's cribbing from those sources, it just hit some of the same themes as those do: being in your 20s and not knowing what the hell you're doing or going to do and everything is amazing and terrifying and hopeful and soul-crushing all at once.

Somaen
Nov 19, 2007

by vyelkin

ANIME AKBAR posted:

Up until now, this series was really powerful because it was easy to relate to Punpun, but these recent events have totally destroyed that. This blows.

This is how I felt as well, the manga for me has been about growing up, learning yourself and your own mediocrity while also learning about the absurdity of the world and the irrationality of others, but this volume took it to a weird new level.

Ineffiable
Feb 16, 2008

Some say that his politics are terrifying, and that he once punched a horse to the ground...


Oh man, that was an intense volume. I don't think I've ever had such emotional highs and lows for a manga like this. Can't wait to see how this is all going to wrap up by volume 14.

Somaen posted:

This is how I felt as well, the manga for me has been about growing up, learning yourself and your own mediocrity while also learning about the absurdity of the world and the irrationality of others, but this volume took it to a weird new level.

Seems like the usual Asano to me. Just shows you life can have very depressing lows and to appreciate your highs.

gobbledygoat
Jun 4, 2011

Ask me about
Steaming Early-onset Accessperger's



Free Logical Fallacies only in 2014!
Do not listen to a thing I say.
Just picked up What a Wonderful World from my local comic shop. My god is it good, hard to believe he was as young as I am right now and still understood humans so well the dude is a genius. He's rapidly become my favorite manga writer and one of my top tier authors in general. Are any of his other works besides Solanin licensed? I want all of his work on my book shelf right now :allears:

Also the books themselves are loving beautiful!

Paper Triangle
Jul 27, 2004

more dog than your dog
I don't think any of his other stuff has been released in the US yet, but Fantagraphics licensed Nijigahara Holograph and should be releasing it this year in a single volume.

Suben
Jul 1, 2007

In 1985 Dr. Strange makes a rap album.
So, there's this:

quote:

Columnist Gō Yoshida published his second interview with manga creator Inio Asano in the March issue of Core Magazine's BREAK Max on Friday. The interview revealed that Asano wishes to undergo a sex change. Asano spoke of his admiration for transsexual fashion model and singer Ai Haruna (born as Kenji Ōnishi), and also that just wearing women's clothing did not suit him. "If I'm going to date anyone, it has to be someone like [Japanese actor] Ryo Kase," he said. He also discussed why he began using Twitter, through which he discussed frankly his first experiences he recently had.

Asano suggested that it is possible that his next work will focus on transgender issues. He plans to collect data regarding cross-dressing men and collaborate with another manga creator, Shohei Manabe (Ushijima the Loan Shark, Smuggler). Viz Media published Asano's Solanin and What a wonderful world! manga. Fantagraphics licensed Nijigahara Holograph manga for North American release earlier this month.

failedninja
Nov 29, 2008
I checked out his twitter and there's a tweet from Kengo Hanazawa (I Am a Hero / Boys On the Run) saying that he would totally marry a sex changed Inio. :allears:

Inio then follows that up with "that made me hard". God I love these two.

Lectim
Jan 2, 2010

failedninja posted:

I checked out his twitter and there's a tweet from Kengo Hanazawa (I Am a Hero / Boys On the Run) saying that he would totally marry a sex changed Inio. :allears:

Inio then follows that up with "that made me hard". God I love these two.

That is the most adorable thing I've ever heard.

nerdz
Oct 12, 2004


Complex, statistically improbable things are by their nature more difficult to explain than simple, statistically probable things.
Grimey Drawer
Truly a match made in heaven.

Hedera Helix
Sep 2, 2011

The laws of the fiesta mean nothing!
Wow. This certainly explains the inspiration for a lot of Asano's darker material, given how much torment GID is. I hope that they are able to live their life how they want to, from now on. :unsmith:

bobomb
Jul 22, 2005

Undisputed
Moe Master
My copy of Solanin arrived a few days ago and I'm plowing through it. I really like that the book has a matte cover, and that the cover flaps extend out for some extra art space.

gobbledygoat
Jun 4, 2011

Ask me about
Steaming Early-onset Accessperger's



Free Logical Fallacies only in 2014!
Do not listen to a thing I say.
This is loving crazy time I am so loving stoked for an Inio Asano story featuring Trans* issues

Behold! A Elk!
May 12, 2009
Oh wow, awesome. The world needs more totally rad and out trans* people.

Also does anyone see any hope for punpun ever getting a release in the US? I wouldn't mind having that awesome story with those covers sitting on my bookshelf.

GreenBuckanneer
Sep 15, 2007

Anyone know when the next chapter of this is out? Feels like forever...

failedninja
Nov 29, 2008
There's a new chapter out every week.

It's just that the translator gets it by volume, and on top of that seems to work mostly by himself/herself, so be prepared to wait until August.

Vesi
Jan 12, 2005

pikachu looking at?
the artbook Ctrl-T http://mangafox.me/manga/ctrl_t/ contains some great scenes from Asano's daily life

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Ghost Party
Feb 9, 2013
I just finished catching up on Punpun and holy crap.

I hope Pegasus' prediction about June 7th is right for everybody's sake at this point. This manga hits really close to home for a lot of different subjects for me and reading it reminds me of some of the worst moments of my life.

I really love how his appearance reflects his emotional state. It has made everything so much scarier and more heartbreaking to see how he truly views himself. I want so badly for everything to turn out okay! But I guess after everything that's happened there is just no way in hell. It's tragic because all these characters actions are results of things that happened in their childhood. They never even stood a chance.

nerdz
Oct 12, 2004


Complex, statistically improbable things are by their nature more difficult to explain than simple, statistically probable things.
Grimey Drawer
I just listened to this song and for some reason it reminded me of punpun. Come on, let's see some new volumes already!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JrFmLdcf8sk

Popo
Apr 24, 2008

Homestuck is a true work of art surpassing all of Shakespeare's works.
So it looks like volume 13 is going to be the end of this wild ride;
http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2013-07-01/inio-asano-oyasumi-punpun-manga-to-end

quote:

The 12th volume of Inio Asano's Oyasumi Punpun manga series, which shipped in Japan on Friday, announced that the 13th volume will be the final volume. The 13th volume is scheduled to ship this winter. The series, which began in Shogakukan's Weekly Young Sunday in 2007, has been serialized in Shogakukan's Big Comic Spirits since the magazine's closure.

Asano mentioned in January that it is possible that his next work will focus on transgender issues.

So, by the end of the year we'll be wishing Punpun a good night for the last time. It could end happily, right?

Ringo Roadagain
Mar 27, 2010

I don't really think Punpun deserves a happy ending. Other characters who names I can remember off hand probably do but after the last volume, not him.

Pringleton
Jul 21, 2008
Eff that, I didn't sign up for this poo poo for a happy ending. I was promised Despair Without Light or Hope. If I'm not sobbing like a child after the ending, I'm gonna be disappointed.

Also, I am so loving all about Asano doing a trans focused story.

Semi-related, anybody else here fans of Against Me!? It's not for everybody, but everybody should give it a shot. After years as stalwarts of the modern anarcho-punk scene, they grew up and (to cries of "sellout" from people who didn't), took a more level headed, reasoned approach to punk. And then recently, lead singer Tom Gabel came out as Laura Jane Grace. Even if you're not into loud, angry music, at least give their album "New Wave" a listen, as well as the newer stuff that specifically addresses transgender issues. It's loud and angry, but relatively accessible and kinda poppy at times. It might convert you, or at least get you into a band that's going through a really great transitional phase right now.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBVj9MXUJYQ Against Me! - Transgender Dysphoria Blues - live FYF Fest, September 2, 2012


Apologies if the derail is unwelcome, but I thought it might be something Inio Asano fans are interested in.

suztan
Jul 4, 2012

Ringo Roadagain posted:

I don't really think Punpun deserves a happy ending. Other characters who names I can remember off hand probably do but after the last volume, not him.

If it doesn't turn out to be the most traumatizing ending in all of manga, I will be very disappointed.

That said... I do want Aiko to end up in a better place. :ohdear:

Professor Latency
Mar 30, 2011

No you don't. You secretly want everything to end in a fiery disaster of sadness.

Or maybe that's just me.

Takanago
Jun 2, 2007

You'll see...
With all the heavy poo poo that's happened lately, I think a tragic ending is likely.

But dammit, until the last panel happens I am going to hold out hope that maybe, just maybe, things will be all right for our little bird. :unsmith: Don't worry buddy, life might suck, and you might have contributed to a good portion of that suckiness, but I'm sure everything will work out in the end, right?

Vesi
Jan 12, 2005

pikachu looking at?
I expect no less than the worst, most despair-inducing incident in all history of mankind

Blattdorf
Aug 10, 2012

"This will be the best for both of us, Bradley."
"Meow."
He's just going to die and that will be that.

nerdz
Oct 12, 2004


Complex, statistically improbable things are by their nature more difficult to explain than simple, statistically probable things.
Grimey Drawer

Blattdorf posted:

He's just going to die and that will be that.

Dying sounds better than living at this point for him.

Ytlaya
Nov 13, 2005

I think that him losing Aiko again would be pretty great at this point. He's basically sacrificed the rest of his life for her sake (not in the sense of doing it to help her, but in the sense of doing it to be with her/because of her), so losing her would be the tragic icing on the cake.

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No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_m1owwrh54

Volume 12. August 2.

:unsmigghh:

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