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Note also in that image that Eren sees Bertolt from the perspective of the Smiling Titan/Dina the day of Wall Maria was destroyed, which shouldn't be possible based on the information we have currently. Could be that there's an incoming twist that the Founder's connection with the "Source of All Living Matter" means Eren is functionally omniscient and can see the memories of all Eldians, and possibly all living creatures (such as the birds in Chapter 130/131)
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Jan 14, 2021 04:58
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How dare you forget Lobov.
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Jan 19, 2021 07:56
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The farmer may also just think he is the father. Historia could have gotten pregnant with Eren and then hooked up with the farmer. The fact that her baby is seemingly months premature suggests Historia may have lied about when her child was conceived.
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Jan 24, 2021 00:23
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yronic heroism posted:Also did one of the previous chapters explain why Eren and Zeke* couldn’t just touch back in Marley? They were plotting together, Zeke had his plan and Eren wanted to double cross him and rumble. Not sure what the hold up was. Yeah, it's not explicitly explained. I think from Eren's perspective it's just "That's not what his future memories told him". However, that doesn't explain why Zeke wouldn't demand they do it then and there. My best guess is that even Zeke's sterilization plan relied on a partial Rumbling, which required the world to mobilize first so that Eren could crush all of their armies all at once. Additionally, Eren and Zeke would be crushed along with Liberio and Marley if they had activated it then. From Zeke's point of view, they needed to survive to pass on their titans so as to maintain the threat of the Rumbling until all Eldians die off peacefully. Therefore, he and Eren had to wait until they were both on Paradis and then a little while longer (a month or so) so that the world gathers their armies into easily flattened targets. One could argue that Zeke could have insisted that they sterilize the Eldians immediately and then activate the partial Rumbling later, but maybe they were reluctant to meddle with such powerful magic (because that's what it is) more than once.
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Jan 24, 2021 05:36
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Levi: I hate every Beast I see, from Chimpan-a to Chimpan-Zeke.
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Jan 24, 2021 10:52
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Tfw the manga and anime have divergent endings, splintering the fandom over which is better until the end of time.
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Feb 2, 2021 19:28
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I was under the impression that in the days of Eldian Empire, the Founder could just transform Eldians into pure titans at will, and that the syringe-based transformations were a more recent development made necessary by the self-imposed exile of the Founder to Paradis.
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Feb 4, 2021 18:32
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bees x1000 posted:Part of me thinks Isayama wouldn't spend all this time showing the groups at the airbase or the large group at the cliffs and then 'lol no' and they get stomped anyways. But we'll see. I think it would be less "lol no" and more a return to the series' horror roots where the Titans (read: Eren) are an implacable, unstoppable, and irrational foe. The idea I would expect to be conveyed is "It doesn't matter if the remaining Marleyans and the Eldians have made peace, Eren keeps moving forward until his enemies are destroyed". The time spent building up the people at Fort Slava is to underscore Eren's inexorable resolve: that he will obliterate everything, even when the people are demonstrably capable of reconciliation.
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Feb 5, 2021 06:29
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Okay, leaked panels are out in the wild. Confirmation that Zeke gets Talk No Jutsu'd by Armin into allowing himself to die, bringing a stop to the Rumbling. Let's brush past how silly that sounds or how that doesn't quite jive with what we have learned previously. Maybe it will be better in context. But I think now we can sort of see the patented Isayama twist incoming: Zeke died without being eaten, which means the Beast Titan is transferred through Paths to a random newborn Eldian. Guess who is being born as we speak? Eren and Historia's child. In other words, another shifter with Royal blood. The twist is that Eren's either already in Paradis or is going to return there after dealing with Alliance, pick up his kid, and reactivate the Rumbling. Final panel is Eren crying as he tells his daughter she is free while using her to commit genocide. My assumption is that once the Rumbling is complete, he can remove Ymir's Curse, thereby preserving his child's life beyond the thirteen year time limit (as well as his own). I suppose everything we have seen so far was Eren making the timing of his daughter's birth coincide with Zeke's death, explaining why Eren didn't do anything and relied on Ymir entirely. His precognition basically answers any questions about "Why didn't he x or y?", albeit a little unsatisfactorily.
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Feb 6, 2021 05:02
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I'd be much more disappointed if it wasn't such an obvious fake out.
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Feb 8, 2021 21:32
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*Next chapter* "My god, that's Eren's entrance music!"
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Feb 8, 2021 23:06
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RatHat posted:Hasn't this been brought up in the manga(Specifically the "everyone becomes friends over a common enemy") and the other characters were like "No that's stupid and wouldn't work."?  More recently, Jean and Hange discussed the consequences of stopping Eren, and determined that it would mean Paradis' inevitable destruction.
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Feb 9, 2021 00:08
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I wonder if Eren's complete lack of action up to this point was one final test of his precognition, hoping that Ymir would defeat the Alliance alone and spare him the torment of needing to murder his friends himself.
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Feb 10, 2021 06:41
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Eren can touch Historia without triggering flashbacks. There's the scene where she frees him from the chains in the cavern beneath the Reiss chapel and ends up holding onto him for dear life when Rod transforms, or Jean's comment about Eren and Historia spending time holding each other's hands without effect.
In It For The Tank fucked around with this message at 05:22 on Feb 16, 2021 |
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Feb 16, 2021 05:19
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Thanks for the warning. Next chapter may well be make or break for the series, so I'm going dark on all AOT now so I can read the chapter in its entirety when it's released.
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Mar 1, 2021 19:01
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OK I caved and read the leaks because I am weak. If the leaks are true and (POTENTIALLY HUGE SPOILERS) Armin's Colossal nuke evaporated the Hallucigenia's spinal fluid, turning it into a chemical weapon that turns every Eldian it touches into a titan like in Ragako, then that is funniest loving thing I have ever heard and Isayama is an absolute madman. The Alliance (POTENTIALLY HUGE SPOILERS) literally beat themselves. Eren didn't fight because he didn't have to.
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Mar 5, 2021 01:48
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  I do like Isayama flexing by releasing this chapter so that it coincides with the airing of the next episode of the anime, which will no doubt feature the gas attack in Ragako and the scene where Eren tells Mikasa he hates her and beats up Armin.
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Mar 5, 2021 19:46
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One of my largest criticisms of this final arc is Isayama appears to be playing fast and loose with some of the rules surrounding titans. Stuff like Eren being in the Colossal's mouth rather than its nape (and Mikasa knowing this before seeing it), Falco transforming into a bird titan on his second attempt and maintaining his titan form for several hours after flying across a continent the size of Africa, Zeke's death stopping the Rumbling when Ymir is ostensibly free of the Royal Family mandate, and the shifters being able to transform even though Ymir (who is opposing them) is presumably constructing their bodies. There's still a chapter left where some (preferably all) of this may be explained but it's gonna have to be a doozy of a chapter to answer the most pressing questions left and deliver an emotionally satisfying ending. I'm hoping, like the Uprising Arc, the conclusion will tie things together and these last chapters will be improved upon reread.
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Mar 6, 2021 22:47
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Marluxia posted:Hasn't this already been addressed by Eren? He explicitly told the Eldians through the path that he could easily mind control them to just let him complete the rumble but he's not gonna do that because that would be robbing them of their freedom? This would extend to allowing them to shift. That has been said and I don't buy it at all. He (or rather Ymir) chucked a barrage of rocks at their plane as they approached and tried to snipe them out of the air before they even got the chance to fight. How is that any better than taking way their ability to transform? And even if Eren was being truthful here, why would Ymir go along with it when she (presumably) has to build them? "Hey Ymir, you're free to make your own choices now but also I command you to let my friends try and stop us so that you can stay trapped in the Paths for all eternity. Do you mind building two Armors, two Females, a Colossal, a custom Jaws order, and a 1,000 Cart Titans for me?" Like, there's the extradiegetic reason, which is Isayama wanted a climactic final battle and realized that Eren and Ymir are gods who can win instantly if they wanted to. But from an in-universe perspective, I'm hoping for a better answer than what has been offered so far. I expect we'll get one that basically just explains that everything we say was part of The Plan™, made possible by Eren's precognition. It will really just come down to Isayama's writing ability about how satisfying it ends up being. I just dread the answer being "Eren wanted to lose". Saagonsa posted:A lot of those are explained tho, especially Eren being in the mouth, that's just what the Warhammer can do. If it was the Warhammer's power, why wasn't he in a protective crystal like Lara Tybur was? Why would he chose the mouth as the location rather than... basically anywhere you can imagine? How did Mikasa know he was in there? In It For The Tank fucked around with this message at 03:25 on Mar 7, 2021 |
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Mar 7, 2021 03:22
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Saagonsa posted:Did you not read the part where Eren very explicitly said "I will not take your freedom to fight me away from you"? Like, that's kind of Eren's whole Thing. Because there appears to be a discrepancy between what Eren said and what he did (/is doing). I acknowledge that Eren said it, I just don't believe he was telling the truth. Or not the whole truth.
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Mar 7, 2021 03:28
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I also recall Mikasa completely misinterperting Eren's expression when he succeeds in the 3DMG training. Armin and the rest (correctly) see Eren's determination and passion, whereas Mikasa perceives Eren being happy he won't be separated from her.
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Mar 7, 2021 06:41
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I wonder if Mikasa's headaches are caused by the moment at the end of the last chapter. Eren may have (inadvertently?) tried to manipulate Mikasa's memories using the Founding Titan ("Forget about me") and, through PATHS, that rippled backwards through time because Eren is also simultaneously sending his memories back to his 10-year-old self ("See you later, Eren"). As a result, the "echo" of Eren's mind control manifests in Mikasa in instances where Eren's life is threatened or she experiences doubts about him, which seems to be the trigger for when her headaches to occur. However, Ackermans are immune to the Founder's mind control so it doesn't work, it just harms Mikasa instead. Alternatively: more simply, Mikasa is touching Eren when he sends his memories back and she gets glimpses of the future through this contact. Her younger self's mind cannot comprehend the memories but she gets headaches whenever she is subconciously reminded of Eren's "death". In It For The Tank fucked around with this message at 18:23 on Mar 9, 2021 |
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Mar 9, 2021 18:17
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Elias_Maluco posted:The titans will surely transform back to humans once the worm is killed God I hope not. There are currently zero stakes in this fight since Eren let himself be beaten and it seems so likely the titans are going to be reverted. The poor Hallucigenia is the only one putting in the work and making the Alliance bleed for their victory. I hope its minor accomplishment of wiping out the suppporting cast remains even after its inevitable death just so that there is some sense of pathos (with the characters the readers are invested in). I never thought we'd have one chapter left and I'd not have an idea about how it's all going to end. The story has definitely not gone in the direction I thought it would. I can't say I fully enjoyed what we got but it remains to be seen how it will look once it has all been tied together. However, based on how the final arc played out, I am skeptical of Isayama's ability to bring the story to a satisfying conclusion with just one chapter. From a logical perspective, I know next chapter we'll get Eren's POV and closure for Historia's character, including the revelation that Eren is the father and the child will be named Ymir (and likely, the original Ymir's reincarnation). Anything else would be bad writing IMO. Why else sideline one of the best characters in the story and introduce this ambiguity about her and Eren's motivations unless there would be pay-off? As for the ultimate outcome, I still maintain hope that Eren will complete the Rumbling and the ending will be AnR-lite: everywhere but Paradis is destroyed, Eren survives (death is too easy) and is haunted forever by what he has done. A peace ending seems at odds with the themes of the story (and was dismissed as idealistic by Isayama earlier in the manga) and implies that Eren's genocide was justified. Someone said it best earlier in the thread: a partial Rumbling resulting in peace implicitly conveys that "genocide = bad, targeted genocide = good". At least if the Rumbling is successful, the story becomes a cautionary tale of the dangers of dehumanization and systemic persecution - and neatly sidesteps any moral quandries by allowing the audience to categorically rebuke Eren's actions. In It For The Tank fucked around with this message at 19:05 on Mar 12, 2021 |
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Mar 12, 2021 18:57
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Grisha really is the worst father. He thrust so much responsibility onto Zeke, did it again when he gave Eren the Attack Titan (despite knowing what the result would be...?), and seemingly was complicit in Zeke's death in Chapter 137, and possibly Eren's in Chapter 138. Sure, he felt bad about his actions later - but still, gently caress him. In a series full of horrible people who commit all manner of atrocities, Grisha stands out as somehow worse because there's something visceral and familiar about him. He's like a sports dad; an abusive parent who sees his children as tools to live vicariously through and do the things he couldn't (or refuses to).
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Mar 22, 2021 00:03
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Game of Thrones Season 8.
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Apr 7, 2021 19:30
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Nuebot posted:Speaking of Historia Remember all that speculation that her kid's father was secretly Eren? Or that it was all a ruse to fool the military people? Nah I guess she really did just fall for her childhood bully and become a non-character just like him. Historia is the biggest question mark for me. With everything else you can squint and kind of see what Isayama may have been going for (even if it's nonsense), but Historia's storyline defies explanation. The ambiguity regarding the father of her child was just... well, bad writing I guess. Details like the Farmer being an non-character who has no name or face, Historia discussing getting pregnant with Eren, Eren's presence when Historia made her move on the Farmer, Historia's dead-eyed expression whenever she looked at the Farmer, the paper-thin justification for their relationship, the noted irregularity that Historia didn't marry the Farmer, or that her child's due date didn't match what she told the military, or that the birth just happened to coincide with the final confrontation... amounted to nothing. She just marries the Farmer during the time skip and nothing more about their relationship is said. For me, it seems like there was something planned that got dropped. I literally cannot believe that Eren isn't the father - or at least that it wasn't in the cards at some point. It would have so clearly exemplified the pronatalism theme of the story ("Because he was born into this world"/"Start a family... love someone in the walls") had Eren been motivated by the life of his child rather than Mikasa. It also would have made Historia's sidelining more palatable - not completely fine but better than what we got. Instead, the pronatalism theme was quietly dropped and Historia was basically written out of half the story. Truly bizarre.
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Apr 8, 2021 07:32
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The official translation for that line: Armin: Eren... Thank you. You became a mass murderer for our sake... I promise I won't let this error go to waste.
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Apr 8, 2021 21:19
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Captain Baal posted:Mikasa finally got what she wanted in the end Mikasa walked from the Atlas Mountains to Madagascar through a continent that had been trampled flat. She 100% ate his head en route.
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Apr 8, 2021 22:40
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The only answer I can think of is that something must have happened behind the scenes that resulted in a dramatic change in the ending. That's the only way to make sense of the final chapter - and, indeed, much of the final arc.
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Apr 9, 2021 23:54
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DaveKap posted:Can someone post the official "thanks for committing genocide, Eren!" panel here? Please, thank you. 
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Apr 10, 2021 21:06
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Remember how Eren told Louise to throw Mikasa's scarf away? I guess he expected Mikasa to go rifling through the garbage for it.
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Apr 11, 2021 20:44
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DamnitGannet posted:Did we ever find out why pure titans are compelled to eat people or did I just forget the explanation? I like to think it is an enduring echo of King Fritz's command to "Eat, my daughters."
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Apr 29, 2021 19:07
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If the leaks are true, Isayama saw that some people actually defended the ending and decided that they needed to suffer as well.
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May 11, 2021 21:54
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What a loving waste this story was.
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May 18, 2021 18:16
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The problem with saying "This ending proves that Eren was wrong and his actions solved nothing" is that the only flaw in Eren's plan was that he didn't go far enough. If Eren had committed a complete genocide of the outside world, Paradis would have survived. In fact, it is the only way in which Paradis would have survived, since if Eren had done absolutely nothing, the world still would have destroyed Paradis after Willy's declaration of war. The message of the series is therefore "Kill all your enemies before they kill you. If you don't follow through, your descendants will suffer the consequences". Yes, Paradis would not suddenly become a utopia if the Rumbling had been completed. Internecine warfare would inevitably still occur. However, the point is that the Paradisians would never be killed just because of their race, which is what the story displays as inevitable, and the cycle of dehumanization would be broken. Would people still find reasons to hate each other based on other traits? Of course. But that's not what the story is about. As is, the cycle continues. People continue to suffer for their ancestors' actions. Children continue to be conscripted. The titans still exist. The ending is somehow bleaker than a complete Rumbling of the outside world.
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May 19, 2021 06:32
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Remember Paradis was still infested with titans during the Battle of Shiganshina. There is a limit to how much of an army Marley could mobilize, especially when it is implied that conventional armies were wholly unprepared to fight titans until the creation of anti-titan weaponry four years later. Marley could only bring as many people as Zeke and Pieck could transport/escort, which seems to have been one squad with enough gas to titanize one village. During the Battle of Shiganshina, it looks like they only brought Eldian cannon fodder for Zeke to transform into titans. I don't know much about dirigibles, but I assume you can't just land them anywhere. And an aerial bombardment would risk killing Eren. The story has bullshit in it, but I think it's mostly relegated to the final arc. In It For The Tank fucked around with this message at 22:24 on Jun 8, 2021 |
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Jun 8, 2021 22:21
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VROOM VROOM posted:I long suspected without bothering to confirm that people were getting real worked up about a lovely translation but yep that appears to be the case That's because the arigatō happened two panels earlier:  For those wondering, Armin's first speech bubble says ...エレン ("...Eren"). His second says ありがとう ("Thank you"). Then he says the "You became a mass murderer..." yadda yadda yadda line.
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Nov 18, 2021 04:34
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If anything, I expect them to double down on the worst parts of the manga ending. I would love an improved anime original ending, but this series has burnt through all my benefit of the doubt.
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Jan 12, 2022 18:11
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I know it was basically already implied, but there's no way they're gonna finish the series this season given the pacing the anime is going. We're definitely getting a movie ending.
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Jan 16, 2022 21:33
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I want to believe in an AOE but I just can't get my hopes up again. 139 (and, in hindsight, much of the last 5 chapters) was such a disappointment - one that still bums me out to this day - that I struggle to muster up any faith that the anime could possibly fix things. The popular theory that there are multiple timelines is admittedly compelling - in that it would effectively wipe the manga ending out of existence - but I fear it's just wishful thinking. I would love to eat my words though. If nothing else, ending with a movie (as appears to be the case) will force them to change the order and pacing of certain things. If they don't, it will really highlight how absurd parts of the final arc are, like the whiplash of all the secondary characters getting titanized and then getting reverted five minutes later. Anonymous Zebra posted:They're not changing anything. The negative reaction to the ending is purely among Western audiences. No one involved with the manga/anime has any reason to want to change it. I guess you didn't hear about how japanese fans are vocal about the ending and they are not happy...
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Jan 24, 2022 09:50
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