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MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Schwarzwald posted:

What do you mean "Marley would never allow this?" What influence does Marley have to prevent other nations from working with Paradise? All their power came from the apparent invulnerability of their titans -- and that invulnerability has now been thoroughly dispelled.

I'm not suggesting that all the nations of the world will welcome the people of Paradise with loving arms, but I expect that many of them hold a lot on enmity toward Marley and will decide it's in their interest to back the people who have proven they can take them out but conveniently lack the infrastructure to establish their own empire.


The issue is that once Marley gets wind of any major cooperation between Paradis and anyone else, they’re still going to be like “gently caress it we’re steam rolling them and getting our titans back,” only pushed further up in the schedule.

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MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Raxivace posted:

I wonder if Baraka could defeat a Titan.

Probably, assuming he had an easy way to climb a titan.

But you give him a 3D Gear, he may just end up giving it to Outworld...

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Kerning Chameleon posted:

I mean, at this point he did The Thing he wanted to do, his plan is complete. All that's left is to watch the fallout and maybe have one last Eren vs Armin/Zeke/Levi/Mikasa/Entire Survey Corps fight or whatever.

There has to be something more to it because The Thing isn’t necessarily going to stop things from repeating somehow in the future

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Kerning Chameleon posted:

In that case, how hosed up and ironic would it be if she was forced out of her crystal, only for it and the tremors from the rumbling to cave her chamber down around her?

It would be hosed up, but kind of a missed opportunity since we have literally every titan shifter alive in the same place.

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


witchcore ricepunk posted:

Presumably her tongue was regenerated after she gained the titan power. But her lack of speech might be further evidence that she really internalized her servitude.

I mean, if her tongue was cut before or while she was learning to speak, she was probably never really taught how to really speak for real

MechaX fucked around with this message at 03:36 on Oct 6, 2019

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


I guess a warhammer titan could just make a bow and arrow to shoot it out of the sky

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


bees x1000 posted:

Well yeah but I’d prefer that to ‘Eren was the bad guy and manipulating Ymir this entire time’.

I dunno given how absolutely horrified he was on multiple occasions about these events, plus his attempts to try to change the future, I don’t see Eren being 100% willing to do this to the degree that he’d be influencing Ymir

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Eeepies posted:

Pieck looks frightening when she's fighting seriously, her constant transformations back and forth is insane.

I love how she manages to be simultaneously terrifying but still super aloof and somewhat clumsy like when she was stumbling down that lance or when she realized that Jean was already loving gone in the middle of her monologue

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


That would fall in line with Eren wanting Armin to get the serum besides Armin being his friend; Attack Titan future vision told him that Armin is going to be the one to save the world somehow in the end

Although I will lol if Armin is just like "hey Zeke lets try this idea" and Zeke, probably stuck making Titans for god knows how long is just "okay"

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Unless it gets revealed that Eren had to do the Rumbling because Paths bullshit showed him all the possible futures without it were somehow even worse and told Historia about this

Hopefully it won’t go this route, and I can’t really name the VN game series that went this route, but let’s just say there is a non zero chance that Eren’s motives might be complex...

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


punk rebel ecks posted:

How can it be the final season if the manga isn't finished?

The manga finishes in April

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


MorningMoon posted:

I am informed that in Malesia, the Colossal Titan has drip


https://twitter.com/TotallyNotMark/status/1357034232414093314

My mind instantly thought that the Female Titan would have a sports bra and gym shorts, but the actual answer is more magnificent than I could have ever dreamed

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Wait a minute

so Armin and Zeke were able to talk no jutsu Bert and the others to flipping... but if all of those titans on the spine were Warhammer defense mechanisms, who is exactly controlling the ones that are still fighting the alliance even after Zeke dies? And why could they only flip those shifter recreations, even Eren Kruger (at least I think one of them is Kruger) whom technically neither Zeke nor Armin have met before? It just seems odd that if they could flip shifters neither have met, why wouldn't they just... stop every titan on the spine

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Rewatching Grisha's speech after mightygerm's last post and... man

Grisha wants Eren to absolutely reach the end of his road, whatever it is, and he definitely wants him to master his power to save everyone despite knowing that he can't even use the Founder under normal circumstances and knowing that at face value, the Rumbling has killed a lot of people and saved no one as of right now.

I really, really, really hope they follow up on this in the last few chapters because I can't even fathom why Grisha would give Eren the Founder/Attack Titan and expect him to save anyone at all knowing that the Rumbling actually will happen.

It would be some Xanatos-rear end poo poo if Eren wasn't even there and is back in Paradis, did this so that his child inherits the beast titan at this exact moment, and then does... something with the Founder at the precise moment the centipede thing is active. very unlikely but that would be the biggest reverse uno card Eren could ever pull

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


In It For The Tank posted:

OK I caved and read the leaks because I am weak.

If the leaks are true and (POTENTIALLY HUGE SPOILERS) Armin's Colossal nuke evaporated the Hallucigenia's spinal fluid, turning it into a chemical weapon that turns every Eldian it touches into a titan like in Ragako, then that is funniest loving thing I have ever heard and Isayama is an absolute madman. The Alliance (POTENTIALLY HUGE SPOILERS) literally beat themselves. Eren didn't fight because he didn't have to.

While I highly doubt that would be true, this, this is absolutely hilarious

This would literally be a "well, Eren was kinda right in the end because every option we had was pretty poo poo from jump because of this centipede thing and the only freedom possible was being free of it by catastrophic means" ending for people to sit on forever

MechaX fucked around with this message at 03:33 on Mar 5, 2021

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


I dunno if this is going to be Bleach levels of “oh my god I have to wrap this up in how many pages??”

But uh... this.. this really seems like a lot to wrap up in 45 more pages

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Speaking of Reiner, I'm hilariously banking on a final chapter reveal that if Eren did nothing or did stuff differently, the worm would pull the same poo poo for another n'th thousand years, but this was the only future in which Reiner would actually do something genuinely heroic and end the cycle and he bet on that

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Wait if both Ymir and Eren were out of paths, and Zeke was dead, who built the Colossal Eren?

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


TheHan posted:

And did you say the forests were extinct Eren?

yeah.. if that is accurate what Eren actually did was stop his genocide when the probable death of life on the entire planet is assured

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


After re-reading the better translation, it... really seems like Isayama decided to channel the OG Mass Effect 3 ending hard in the sense that there are things that kind of happen, but it is not clear that Isayama really understands the true gravity and ramifications of what actually happened.

1. Eren noted that the rumbling killed 80% of humanity on two separate occasions. That... is absolutely insane (for a metric for our world, that would have meant that Eren killed five point six billion people). The geopolitics right now aside, Paradis is literally the only nation that probably didn't get turbo-hosed by the Rumbling. But this comes to a second point;

2. Eren noted that in the process of eliminating several billion people, he also destroyed most of the forests across the world. Someone should have told Isayama what the ramifications of losing the forests worldwide would be, because I can't really bring myself to care about.. well... any of the fallout of Marley/Paradis right now; humanity and likely the rest of the planet is irrevocably hosed within the next few generations because of this.

MechaX fucked around with this message at 13:26 on Apr 8, 2021

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Still loving lol @ human society is now largely either Marley or Paradis, and the best thing people can hope for is that they don’t wipe each other out before the eco-ramifications of the Rumbling starts knocking on their door and probably even more painfully

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Vanderdeath posted:

Eren just lightly mentions that the Rumbling destroyed most of the world's forests which means that Earth's ecology is hosed for a longass time before everything can regrow. Between 80 percent of humanity being dead and Paradis likely being one of the few governments left on the planet, this is pretty much the worst possible outcome. Not to mention there's likely millions of century-old Eldians that will likely die horribly now too after being turned back.

Eren Jaeger commits genocide, gets thanked for it, dies and then turns into a bird. What the gently caress, man.

Man, I just cannot let go of the fact that Grisha let himself get eaten just for a future where the choices are between the 1/5th of society left either destroying itself, or the planet eventually does it for them because just imagine how much critical plant/animal life the rumbling made extinct probably

But hey I guess Paradis is okay for now I guess

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


You know, re-reading some of the pages of the official translation here, uh... I am not entirely convinced that Eren really made an informed decision here either with all this Rumbling poo poo. Yeah he says he would have done it anyway, but having the Founding Titan discombobulate your mind so much where you see the past, present, and future simultaneously doesn't sound like someone was playing with a full deck upstairs. Like, at all.

Ccs posted:

Maybe it’s a good thing that Berserk will never end...

[Berserk Spoilers]: "Thank you Griffith, you became a mass murderer for our sake..."

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Schwarzwald posted:

I got the impression that Marley was one of the countries nearest to Paradise, and Eren was killed before the titans marched through the totality of it. So unless I'm forgetting something (I may be) or unless all of humanity is just living in a concentric circle around the island, the 80% number is a retcon from the immediately previous chapters.

I guess there were the Wall Titans who marched, who were all in Marley, and the Wall Titans who either power-walked or just ran across the remainder of the globe off screen

Mecca-Benghazi posted:

It's out on comixology and you can get it for free by signing up for a trial of comixology unlimited.

Anyway the 80% line is this in the official


I don't have the comixology app open but there's another page where Eren also says "I wiped out 4/5ths of society"

MechaX fucked around with this message at 18:45 on Apr 10, 2021

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


What I also think was a missed opportunity about the ending is that we never really find out what Eren told the other members of the Alliance either (well, Eren didn't talk to Pieck probably because he didn't really know her at all, and it doesn't seem like he spoke to Falco/Gabi either).

Like what in the gently caress did he tell Annie that got her broken up over his death after all of this nonsense, and man I would have loved to be a fly on the wall to see Eren's awkward conversation with Levi.

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


You do not thank people for committing genocide even when the genocide technically was meant for your benefit

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


It was jarring to me in the sense that the surviving cast is laser focused on peace with Marley and don't even mention the fact that there is a very high likelihood that humanity is loving screwed due to the damage the Rumbling did to the ecosystem.

Even a single line from Armin being like "we're trying to get the survivors to see past this petty bullshit because we will probably die off within a few generations if we don't pull it together now" would have been some kind of acknowledgement that if you look beyond Marley or Paradis stuff, the planet is in a super, super dire spot.

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"



Eren wiped out most, if not likely all the forests outside of Paradis, and the act of having colossal titans trample over the Earth is going to make large swaths of land wastelands for many, many, many years. And this doesn't even account for plant and animal life it wrecked too. No matter how self-sufficient Paradis is, this eventually will come back to bite them in the rear end hard (either the planet is going to do it, or Marley is going to pop off pretty hard when the inevitable food crisis starts).

Plus, eighty percent of humanity gone is also a gigantic deal in of itself. The people outside of Marley and Paradis either have to migrate to Paradis/Marley (which they also won't know survived) or take their chances out there with limited support.

MechaX fucked around with this message at 23:49 on Apr 27, 2021

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Conspiratiorist posted:

Shouldn't be.

I mean it's bad from a biodiversity standpoint, but it's not a biosphere death sentence.

I mean... yeah, it is a death sentence

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20190911-what-would-happen-if-all-the-worlds-trees-disappeared

And this could have been alleviated even in universe with the explanation of "Eren was never actually taught this but Armin is smart enough to realize how vital it is that what is left of humanity needs to work together"

MechaX fucked around with this message at 00:47 on Apr 28, 2021

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Conspiratiorist posted:

Still not a biosphere death sentence. If anything, it got staved off by a few centuries that with the massive depopulation.

Actual mass extinctions begin in the oceans, by altering ocean biochemistry. The one time carbon release from the Rumbling would be a blip absent a global industrial civilization pumping deeply sequestered carbon back into the cycle.

Expect a few weird weather years, and massive dustbowls in some regions until the ravaged biomes transition into grasslands, but the long-term consequences wouldn't be anywhere near close to as apocalyptic as the Rumbling in the first place.

I mean, especially based on the article I cited I think you are vastly underestimating how bad eliminating the forests, let alone how much damage to the planet Eren must have done to eliminate 4/5ths of human society, really is, because by all accounts this really isn't just a biodiversity problem. Carbon gets released even by cutting down trees alone, but that's also not even accounting for stuff like land gradually being lost to the ocean if rain occurs by drought, or if it doesn't occur, mass soil erosion making a lot of land uninhabitable, oxygen and air pollution issues, etc, etc.

And the only real nations left are the ones with a 1000+ year old history and grudge.

Nah, that's not something you just walk off and deal with the inconvenience of weird weather for a bit. And unlike the Rumbling which somehow did catastrophic damage in a matter of days, this will be a very long, arduous, and drawn out suffering.

And I would say that Isayama at least considered this for a bit, because it really seems like a weirdly specific thing to just kind of throw in when what we end up seeing doesn't really match the tone of what must of happened.

MechaX fucked around with this message at 12:32 on Apr 28, 2021

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Elias_Maluco posted:

It inst just forests: the rumbling would have flattened most ecosystem on earth. I do believe Paradis could survive, but they would also face some kind of climatic backlash too

I think Paradis could hold on (at least for awhile) given that's been mostly self-sufficient up to now, but yeah, in a few generations I could see things getting real rough once the climate implications start to show. Plus I guess some of Paradis had to be rumbled for the wall titans to even get out of there too, so that might suck in the short term too.

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Pththya-lyi posted:

No, really: why are we reading strict scientific accuracy into the series on this one plot point? Why can we suspend our disbelief for humans instantly poofing into immortal giants, but can't take the text's word for it that humanity is able to rebuild after the Rumbling? I don't understand why this is different.

I mean, no one is disputing the fact that Marley specifically is able to rebuild because for some ungodly reason, Eren apparently chose to flatten the direct antagonistic nation to Paradis absolutely last.

The key question at this point is "how long can this possibly last" and I am not alone in the thought of "not long lmao"

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


McConnell posted:

Where is it mentioned in the story that Marley survived?

I'm looking at the page with Levi/Gabi/Falco, could have sworn that Marley had a similar location to that.

If that is not the case, I guess it's what's left of the world vs. Paradis.

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Ibram Gaunt posted:

I thought the 80% was what his plan was, not whatt he managed to accomplish before being stopped. Is that not the case?

Eren knows when and how he'll be stopped, and he mentions this on two occasions.

1. The first thing Armin asks is even if Eren is stopped, wouldn't the world be able to retaliate against Paradis immediately. Eren essentially tells Armin not to worry about that because the Rumbling will wipe out 80% of the population as a matter of fact and they won't be able to wage war immediately because of this. The ending events corroborate this detail.

2. Eren sees the past, present, future simultaneously and later says "I murdered four-fifths of society" like he already did it, even though chronologically it wouldn't have happened yet. Regardless of when the Rumbling is stopped, Eren knows that he would have killed off that extent of the population by the time Armin stops him.

3. He also tells Armin that even if he had no idea Armin/Mikasa would stop him, he still would have flattened the world. It is weird that he says this in the past tense like it already happened rather than "I would want to flatten the world" still if he was uncertain this would actually happen. Again, Eren sees the end result already; he did end up flattening most of the world by the time he's stopped. If anything it seemed like his actual plan was more than 80%; he wanted to wipe out everything except for Paradis

MechaX fucked around with this message at 13:19 on Apr 29, 2021

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


I mean, if we’re at the point where we have to assume the person with near-omnipotent powers and seemingly omniscient foresight into a unchanging future was just wrong or lying about important details for the story to logically work with what we were presented with, Isayama probably should have went back to the drawing board on a few things

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


loving lmao if any of that ends up being true, Isayama would be on some End of Evangelion-Anno mode kind of spite

Just lol if the remaining 20% destroy Paradis anyway and the hallucigenia is like “actually I lived, y’all still like Titans right?”

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


Yeah writing yourself into a position where your options are “justify global genocide” and “everything really was meaningless despite what I said about the cycle of violence before, gg humanity” is not ideal

I’ll wait for the full chapter for the actual confirmation/context but... yikes

MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


I dunno, I feel like the ending is better, but I'm at the Mass Effect 3 Extended Cut part of things where I'm just like "... it's mediocre, it's fine" and I'll leave it at that. I agree that Ron Perlman might as well narrate "War never changes" in every language when this hits the anime, but it's weird given that the first 3/4ths of the series was not quite about promoting this specific message. And I'm also not really too keen on pushing the eradication of 80% of humanity as something that is just... inherent to the species (and I feel like I would have liked it better if Armin verbally dragged Eren for even doing that).

But I dunno, it seems like the last page in particular doesn't really try to pick between a total grim-dark washout ending like Devilman, or something more hopeful, but instead just shrugs and is like "eh, who knows what will happen now, but go home unless Attack on Titan: Road to Boruto happens" and I'm left with nothing but "well... that was a thing"

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MechaX
Nov 19, 2011

"Let's be positive! Let's start a fire!"


MonsterEnvy posted:

That did not answer my question. I meant which interview was fake. The one by Isayama or the one by his editor.

I dunno what the other poster was talking about; all indications I’ve seen were that the interviews were real but the various accounts have some translation differences

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