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I was thinking about doing up a custom deck of loyalty cards given how cheap it is at Artscow right now. Any opinions on these? New cylon reveals: - you may look at the top 3 cards of the Destination Deck. You may choose to bury all three or return them in any order. - you may damage 2 Vipers in the Hanger Bay, or damage 1 Viper in space. - you may force the Admiral to discard 1 Nuke token. - name a location on Galactia other than the Brig or Sickbay. Each human player must randomly discard 1 Skill Card or immediately move to the named location. - you may force the President to randomly discard 3 Quorum Cards. - you may add two Civs to the board Changed: - Damage Galactia goes from 5 tokens to 4 - Draw treachery changes to allow the cylon to pick and keep two of the discarded cards Also, anybody have thoughts on other interesting personal goals I could add? Crackbone fucked around with this message at 20:15 on Jun 27, 2011 |
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Jun 27, 2011 20:07
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Cocks Cable posted:1) Too weak. Easily undone with a scout or two. 1) Yeah, probably right, and I'm not sure how you could fix it. EDIT: What about look at top 4/5, and you can choose which to bury and which to put back on top? 2) If it's two in space, should it allow piloted vipers? 4 in hangar is kinda bad but popping two manned vipers seems really good. 4) Disrupting the XO chain is pretty good though. What if I bumped up the escape clause to two cards of player's choice? 5) I'm not against that, but thought it would be too powerful. Crackbone fucked around with this message at 20:38 on Jun 27, 2011 |
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Jun 27, 2011 20:30
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Railing Kill posted:This one is great. Thank you. (I'm ashamed of not coming up with this on my own). I don't think anybody's ever compiled an official list, but you can look through the linked games on the OP to get a feel for what people did. Keep in mind house rules are also going to depend on what poo poo from the expansions you are using.
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Jul 7, 2011 15:00
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ConorT posted:I've been to distance 8 and I'm going to take us there has ended in a Human victory! Has there ever been a quicker game? I  'ed when I saw only 8 pages in the thread.
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Jul 25, 2011 17:23
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Stormgale posted:Highlight of the game:We used a starbuck OPG on Legendary discovery I was skimming, but that was just dicking around, right? Unless I'm missing something that was game over had you passed it.
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Jul 25, 2011 18:00
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ConorT posted:BSG: Move armorery, shoot robt w/ space guns BSG: Who the frak jarked off in my frakkin' coffee??
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Jul 26, 2011 00:41
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Cocks Cable posted:Why does no one seem to like conflicted loyalties? Two big things for me: - Potentially having the last cylon "buried" in the loyalty deck causes more problems than it's worth - Personal goals sound good but the execution is kind of lousy. Several of the goals can be near impossible for certain characters to have any control over. Then the mechanic that penalizes you with another loyalty card for completing your goal early, AND requiring an action all seems punitive. I don't mind the final five cards nearly as much.
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Aug 1, 2011 21:20
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Malloreon posted:At first when I read that wording of Romo's static I thought it meant he gets a card from each of another character's skill sets, aka 2-5 cards per character he shares a location with. If that's not your intention (cause it would be insanely overpowered) the wording needs to be changed. I agree with you. It should read: If you end your movement in a location with other characters, you may draw 1 Skill Card per character from among those character's skill sets (unless you are in the Brig). Honestly, I don't even know if the Brig thing is needed. I like Hoshi and Billy as-is, but the rest all seem "meh". A Big Dark Yak posted:How would Billy's OPG work when switching the target of the Airlock away from someone who's already in the Brig, as it's entirely possible to pass the Airlock check against a brigged character which would, thanks to the lowered difficulty, fail against a free character. Would the skill check automatically count as "passed" against whoever the new target is, or would it need to hit the normal target number to airlock the other character? It's pretty straightforward. The check passes, then you change the target. Whether or not it would have succeeded if they were the original target would be irrelevant. Crackbone fucked around with this message at 19:18 on Aug 3, 2011 |
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Aug 3, 2011 19:14
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Cocks Cable posted:What do you mean by "meh"? You hate the characters on the show? Not thematic enough? None of the abilities have a certain zing? Yeah, sorry for lack of description, I just didn't want to put up a wall o text. My thoughts about the characters overall is that there are a lot of "sickbay" related drawbacks, and several of the other abilities seem clunky. Kendra: I like the static (maybe too powerful?), but I hate the "if you are the admiral" part of her drawback. It's sort of thematic but really un-intuitive. Deferring to the boss doesn't make a lot of sense when you are the boss. Don't know how to fix it without making it more convoluted though. Romo: Static seems underpowered. Drawback seems forced. Racetrack: I get the point of the static, but it's really unwieldy verbage and only sort of makes sense thematically. I can raptor courier Adama from the Armory to Communications? Not digging the sickbay drawback. Hotdog: Static's not bad but not great either, and again the sickbay drawback thing. I'm inclined to let him have a 1 PIL draw - not only does it represent his "rookie" status (hence less PIL), but 2 PIL is a drawback in and of itself. Unless you're busted like Apollo or at least as good as Starbuck, that hand full of PIL cards really makes Pilots unattractive. Seelix: I get the viper theme, I just don't like it very much mechanically. Drawing PIL as a static is pretty "meh". I'd at least make it ENG or PIL. I think her drawback essentially means she's never going to be piloting a viper - especially in Exodus games where there's a swath of MK VII's to repair. Her OPG isn't bad but it almost forces her to blow it early if she wants to pilot. Cottle: His static feels clunky and I just don't see it as that thematic. Why should a doctor be immune to getting sick or hurt? If you wanted to keep it I'd change it to: If you are moved to sickbay, you may immediately move to a different location on Galactica instead. That has essentially the same effect, but avoids weirdness with nullifying how Sickbay works. It also makes it pretty powerful, don't know if it's too much. Sorry for all the criticisms without a lot of solutions.
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Aug 3, 2011 19:58
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I think the problem is sickbay just isn't a deep mechanic to design around. Thematically he's a healer. So you could represent that with giving cards to other players? Movement: Draw 2 Skill card from any set and give them to another player. or something similar but different: Movement: Choose a player to discard 3 skill cards. Then draw 3 skill cards from any set and give them to that player. Obviously the numbers can be tweaked, but this works as a human, and as a cylon. It's a variant of Ander's, but it's target-able and since it's movement it's more likely to be used. He can also use it on himself. I kind of like the 2nd option, especially because if a player has less than 3 cards it becomes a net gain for the person receiving. For OPG, what about the anti-Cally? Medical Miracle: When a character is executed, that execution is ignored and the player moves to sickbay. Crackbone fucked around with this message at 14:11 on Aug 4, 2011 |
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Aug 4, 2011 13:44
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ChewyLSB posted:I'm not a big fan of "preventative" OPG's like Cottle (like Gaeta's) because if you're a human it just means that they won't choose to Execute you (or brig you in Gaeta's case). I guess it allows the humans to choose an "executed" choice when they wouldn't have to normally. Cottle's OPG would be for ANY execution. It's not like Gaeta's at all.
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Aug 4, 2011 20:01
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Vulpe's Billy OPG is solid, but I doubt it needs to exclude him from gaining the Presidency. Just put him low on the succession chart. Alternate Cottle OPG: Cylon Blood Infusion/Stim Overload/whatever Action: Choose a human player. They may take any combination of 4(3?) moves and/or actions. Seelix - Static: Avionics Expert: Anytime you use a repair action, you may scout the Crisis or Destination deck. Drawback: The Circle: You must play at least two cards into any Brig/Airlock check. Thematically it's supposed to represent her Cylon/sympathizer hatred.
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Aug 5, 2011 17:38
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Cocks Cable posted:For Kendra, I'd say just change her drawback to: You cannot hold the Admiral Title. Whenever you must make a choice on a Crisis Card, the Admiral chooses for you. Billy looks fine. For Hotdog, I like the first draw fire, but I don't think the "ships of your choice" clause should be there. So basically he moves to a new space and takes all cyclon ships with him. Still don't like his drawback but don't know a better solution. Tying it to the fleet jumping is hard to make balanced. Seelix, the static is pretty drat cool. OPG is meh, but they don't all have to be fantastic. I still like my proposed drawback for her (must play two cards for any brig/airlock check). Cottle: See two posts up for another OPG. Not a fan of his drawback, but mainly because it doesn't seem to fit chain-smoking. Odd proposals for drawbacks: - Only draws 4 skill cards, maybe strenghten his other abilities. - Starts off in Sickbay (and suffers its effects unless XO'ed out).
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Aug 5, 2011 19:06
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Cocks Cable posted:I don't think there is much design space to be had here. Bumping it down to 3 actions still makes it strictly better than Cavil and we should not be reproducing such brokeness. Bumping it further down to 2 Actions makes it no better than XO. quote:This is a good idea, but is it really penalizing much? I assume you mean Admiral Quarters and not Brig checks? You're right that it may not be penalizing enough. But I think it's a lot like Gaeta and Cally, where their drawback is pretty much a non-issue up until it bites them in the rear end. Not every character needs a really strong drawback. quote:Not being able to hold the Admiral title really goes against theme though. Kendra was XO of Pegasus. Yeah, I just hate that clause to cover when she's the admiral. quote:Chain smoking is more metaphorical than literal. Some abilities (mostly from the base game) are like that. Plus its too cute. I didn't mean to imply that it would be his only drawback though. But I agree there's nothing particularly wrong with the current proposed drawback. Crackbone fucked around with this message at 21:17 on Aug 5, 2011 |
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Aug 5, 2011 21:14
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Cocks Cable posted:Here we go. Getting close! Kendra- Drawback 1 or 4. Drawback 2 is way harsh. Drawback 3 is really mechanically clunky and doesn't seem like it would happen much. I think drawback 4 has potential but it seems really mild. I'd remove the once per turn portion. Seelix OPG is probably fine as is, but I'd prefer damaging more vipers vs. destroying 2. I prefer drawback 2. There's usually not THAT many brig/airlockings a game, so I don't think it has to care about cards in hand. Hell, you could move it down to 2 cards - that can still cause havoc on an attempt, and she doesn't look powerful enough to need a really punitive drawback. For Cottle, I don't know. There's problems with all 4 of them. What about stealing Billy's original OPG? Instead of preventing the execution, he can choose a different target? That would make it useful for cylon and human, and fix Chewy's issue with it. Definitely not as thematic though.
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Aug 6, 2011 18:17
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I'm blanking on execution rules, and don't want to read the rulebook right now - what would be the functional differences between Cottle's "Life and Death" and a real execution? They'd keep their loyalty and skill cards? Would their OPG get reset? I'm having a hard time imagining what circumstances you'd want to use that ability. Plus Cottle is going to have a bitch of a time using it, since there's not that much control of when characters go to sickbay.
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Aug 7, 2011 19:28
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Good as New is a winner, I think. It does make him very skill-card centric, but that's not a bad thing.
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Aug 7, 2011 21:42
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Pander posted:Oh I think I misread it. That does make it better I suppose, but no real use for an unrevealed cylon. I suppose you could change it to "Target player in Sickbay draws up to their hand limit or discards all cards"?
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Aug 8, 2011 13:08
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Now that we've finished up with characters, I'm still working on more cylon reveals and some extra personal goals. Is there any balance reason you couldn't do more - resource reveals? By that I mean there's the -1 morale, why not -1 pop, or even -2 food? Or is the -1 morale so weak it should be buffed? New personal goals: Vendetta: Reveal 4 or more treachery cards from your hand. -1 Morale Cutting corners: 3 or more locations on Galactica are damaged. -1 Food Up Close and Personal 1 or more centurions on the boarding track. -1 Pop Sacrificial Lambs 3 or more Civillian ships are destroyed. -1 Fuel
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Aug 9, 2011 16:08
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Cocks Cable posted:-1 morale often considered the weakest reveal card, but I don't see why not. Rather than -1 pop, you'd probably be better off drawing and destroying a civilian ship. -2 food is probably too strong for a reveal card and -1 food would be definitely too weak. -1 fuel is strong enough, but I'd be wary of dinging fuel (the most important resource) in the base game with limited options to regain it. With Exodus and TAC-6, it might be okay. I agree fuel isn't really a good reveal option. I was thinking maybe making the reveal -1 pop or morale, Cylon's choice. I was thinking of a "draw a ship and destroy it" reveal, but that's pretty swingy since there's so many results. For Vendetta I keep waffling on 4 or 5 cards. I lean towards 4 just because it's easier for a player to achieve, but could still look suspicious. I'm not a fan of some of the current PG cards because they're so drat hard for a character to accomplish, like holding both titles. As for the Up Close and Personal and Sacrificial Lambs, I do agree they might be on the weak side. Civy deaths is too problematic to balance, as most of the time it'd be better just to take the hit on the card.
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Aug 9, 2011 20:23
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Railing Kill posted:You could change Up Close and Personal to require that specific player to ace a centurion. I think I was approaching this in the wrong way. The idea behind personal goals is really to give Cylon players cover to make bad or sub-optimal plays. So for Sacrificial Lambs, "Six (seven?) or more civillian ships on the board". It can happen naturally but also encourages the person with the goal to advocate for letting civs build up. Your idea for "Up Close and Personal" is pretty good too.
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Aug 10, 2011 15:26
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Railing Kill posted:I like this better. It's harder to justify the previous version because the cost outweighed the benefit. "Guys, we should let those civvies die." "Why? We'll lose 2-3 pop, maybe as much as 4." "But if we don't lose that pop, we'll lose... 1 fuel." In some endgame situations this might make sense, but usually it would be hard to justify. With the new way, you're just putting them civvies in potential danger, but nothing is lost yet. You're misreading the card. You reveal the goal, then discard 20 strength. It doesn't require a "normal" discard to activate. Even still I think 20+ is really high. And I agree the distance 6/extra loyalty card mechanic sucks. In the set I'm making I'm taking it off the cards entirely, along with granting an additional action. The original cards are really harsh, and I don't see the need to do so. Crackbone fucked around with this message at 16:04 on Aug 10, 2011 |
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Aug 10, 2011 16:00
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If anything was done to the Crisis deck it should probably be adding consequences onto older cards. Exodus introduced the mechanic and then put it on so few cards that it's a non-issue in most games.
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Aug 11, 2011 19:08
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I've got about 8 spaces left in my Artscow deck for the BSG loyalty deck. Anybody have ideas for weird or unique reveals/personal goals/final fives?
Crackbone fucked around with this message at 19:07 on Aug 12, 2011 |
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Aug 12, 2011 19:00
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Cocks Cable posted:How many total cards do you have already? I thought Artscow decks were 52? They are, but including 14 human cards takes up a chunk. Pretty much have to redo the entire deck for matching backs. http://www.artscow.com/gallery/playing-cards/bsg-loyalty-fg5vse3qc6dv The text is un-readable in that link but you can hit the "make changes" button and that'll take to you the designer where you can zoom in.
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Aug 12, 2011 19:09
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Cocks Cable posted:I like spitballing ideas. I like both the Crisis Ones, and I was thinking of similar ideas. You think giving a player a second Super Crisis is too powerful though? Activate Cylon Ships is pretty solid as well. The loyalty cards one is interesting, but I'm just wondering about the logistics of that. You'd have to specify to take 3 more cards from the "not a cylon" deck after you'd dealt out the cards, I guess.
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Aug 12, 2011 19:38
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ConorT posted:Sabotage Nuke- Action: Reveal this card. If there are any nuke tokens remaining, discard one. Already got that one in the deck.
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Aug 12, 2011 19:45
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Cocks Cable posted:Play Crisis Card -- Action: Reveal this card. If you are not in the Brig, you may draw two Crisis Cards and play one immediately ignoring any Jump Prep. The more I think about this one the more problems it poses. Who would decide "current player chooses" options? What if they held a Title and the card requires that title to make a choice? If the crisis would require the revealing cylon to discard cards, do they? What if it takes them below their 3 card minimum?
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Aug 12, 2011 22:23
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Sent off my custom deck for printing. Finished version here, if anybody cares about it: http://www.artscow.com/gallery/playing-cards/bsg-loyalty-fg5vse3qc6dv
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Aug 13, 2011 20:07
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General Battuta posted:I can't find the make changes button to expand them, someone explain how I'm a moron. I think you have to have an account to do that. Just figured that out this morning.
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Aug 14, 2011 20:17
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Some Numbers posted:Yeah, you could have been generous to the player who was helping you and not dicked him over at the last second. Oh come on, that's hilarious.
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Aug 16, 2011 22:50
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Some Numbers posted:I mean, I disagree, but okay. I just don't get raging over that. It's still sounds like it was a good game, and that gave it a memorable ending. It's not like there was money on the game, was there? Maybe it's just because I've played with real assholes - I had a game with a friend of a friend who was human but was playing like a Cylon "because he felt like it".
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Aug 16, 2011 23:09
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General Battuta posted:Any speculation on what kind of mechanics will be in that expansion? Or when it'll announce? Not much, really. They've pretty well altered/expanded most of the core game already. I could see them doing a new endgame based on the series finale. Adding some more Crisis cards that actually use the consequence mechanic would be nice.
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Aug 17, 2011 12:50
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WhiteHowler posted:Yeah, the 5% of games where you only get one Cylon are really lovely. We've had it happen twice now, and the Cylon player never really had a chance in either game. I don't think we're going to use the Exodus extra-card loyalty setup again. I think it's the only logical solution. Having a game with the last cylon never coming out of the loyalty deck sucks rear end. Might as well just do it for any execution, there's not that many in the Crisis deck and nobody should use the Ionian Nebula poo poo anyway.
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Aug 17, 2011 14:50
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Railing Kill posted:We've only used the Ionian Nebula once, and I'm not sure we gave it a fair shake. I haven't heard anything good about it here or elsewhere, though, so we keep passing over it. I guess my question is: has anyone had a good experience using the Allies/Ionian Nebula? There's just so many downsides: - Random executions - Player elimination at crossroads (not a huge deal but still) - Crossroads cards that can gently caress other players even if they've managed their trauma well - Tons more bookkeeping in an already info-heavy game - Generally makes the game more random IMO I just don't see enough benefits from it to even bother trying to rework.
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Aug 17, 2011 16:48
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I don't see Political Prowess as a problem, or at least not anymore than any of the Exodus cards. Sure it's a powerful effect, but then again so is being able to Iron Will a loving Super Crisis. I don't think any of them really need alteration, even Piloting. There's value in a 6-strength card in and of itself, and not every effect needs to be equal.
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Aug 22, 2011 17:20
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Cocks Cable posted:The only real options are: You don't think Base + Exodus would work? Obviously just the same stuff from Exodus we use now.
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Aug 25, 2011 19:34
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I finally got around to making a .pdf of my variant loyalty deck so people didn't need an artscow account to see the cards. http://www.mediafire.com/?zab0e3nb0attinc
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Aug 29, 2011 18:54
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I may make up some more, but it's harder to find relevant quotes from characters than you'd think. Plus I was pretty well tired of this fucker after doing up 41 separate cards. If anybody has other good human quotes for "not a cylon" cards, let me know.
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Aug 29, 2011 19:57
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I don't get it though - is it desirable to tweak the %chance somebody draws cylon pre-sleeper? Seems like it would just make more sense to fix the deck size to 2x players (+baltar/boomer) and be done with it.
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Sep 7, 2011 20:24
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