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His notes will just lead to a cookbook
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May 13, 2022 13:51
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bobjr posted:His notes will just lead to a cookbook And all the morning dishes will be in the chapter titles "Break your fast"
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May 14, 2022 15:58
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Just blasted through The Hedge Knight. Like most people I very much enjoyed it, but it's also somewhat maddening because of how good the tight focus is.
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May 16, 2022 08:50
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the preston jacobs community fan fic thing released chapter 2 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YiPRC_8jWUo imo this holds up, still manages to be miles better than the show and probably also many parts from ADWD\AFFC.
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May 16, 2022 13:25
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algebra testes posted:Like most people I very much enjoyed it, but it's also somewhat maddening because of how good the tight focus is. No, it definitely needed like eight chapters of Dunk being locked in a room feeling anxious while staring at a Symbolism Tree.
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May 17, 2022 01:16
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Deptfordx posted:you probably just need to be patient. i don't know, but this just made me laugh.
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May 17, 2022 05:14
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I like that Bloodraven won the game of thrones. I think it's a clever twist, and opens a lot of fun room for exploration. You can go backwards to learn about bloodraven, show his motivations, and what would place him in a state of mind to risk the entire Kingdom in order to take control of it. Is he just some evil gently caress? Is he just the best player in the Game of Thrones? Does he know something we don't know about the Others? You can later go forward to have an entire series about Bran/Bloodraven fighting for control of his mind/body and managing the Kingdom. Watching Bran lose his identity ala Being John Malcovich, and struggling to regain control could be a fascinating read! And mirror the overall themes of power and control seen in GoT - I mean, we saw Bran Brain rape hodor, and then the same happens to Bran. There are the seeds of some great symbiosis stuff in there. Gods/Worshipers, Wargs/Host, Ruler/Subjects, Nobility/War, Men/White Walkers, ad nauseum. A whole lot of "Who made who" especially when writing through the time loops. It would have required some awesome editing, and dedication - which clearly are lacking, but the core idea is solid. I mean which of these shitbags did we really want to see win anyway? Could you have tolerated the saccharine sweet ending of John and Dany? Little finger or Varys might have been ok if we gave a poo poo about either one as characters. I'd have been ok with Jaime sans Cercei. Maybe even Sansa. poo poo Jaime + Sansa would have been interesting. Another hate filled marriage like Cersei and Robert. Arya is clearly a pyschopath and would need to be anchored to someone or something ( hound or John maybe ) to even consider her as a possible ruler. I expected Tyrion to end up ruler of something, but after that last book, I loving hated him so much I was skipping his chapters. I don't even know who the gently caress fAegon is - he along with any of the other characters would have just felt like Deus Ex Machina. I mean, was the loving Bravosi bank just going to call in the whole country for it's debt? An interesting angle, but not enough groundwork was laid for it, and after waiting 20 loving years, Abercrombie just wrote a bunch of books on that angle. It would have felt derivative. Look, if I can't have John + Arya being Wincest Warging Starks of Winterfell, with uber cool Direwolves in tow... then Bran of the Broken Brain is the only one that makes sense. Fight me. fEdit: I would have accepted Tyrion only if it was shown that he actually was Targaryen fEdit2: Rickon showing up in the last loving chapter, like King John at the end of RobinHood, with his goddamn uni-goat, and an army of savages just killing everyone, and also having enough food to survive the winter. fEdit3: The best ending still would have been doing all the set up, no final war, and the last book ending with John on the wall, and winter starting. Cuz it's about the game, and the game doesn't change, just the players.
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May 17, 2022 07:00
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Bran\Bloodraven winning is not a problem, I think when you read the cliff notes version of the 'main plot' as told by D&D it's not itself offensively bad, like yeah Dany being dragon hitler makes perfect sense and heck when you squint at it you can even accept Arya being instrumental to ending the threat of the white walkers. The problem is really the way those events connected to one another, it all felt completely arbitrary, there wasn't even a shade of ominousness about Bran\Bloodraven orchestrating a terrible war, we never even get a hint of what he was trying to achieve, we know nothing about the motivations of this hivemind tree spirit thing, whose side is he on? what's going to happen now? is bloodraven winning a good thing or are we meant to see it as a supernatural dictator enslaving humanity on Planetos? You can imagine someone telling a decent story with all of the key plot points, it's just not what happened.
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May 17, 2022 07:05
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Yeah, the actual plot of the last season isn't that bad. There are some dumb things in it, like the endless fakeout deaths in the ice battle episode, or the whole Bronn plot. But the overall idea of what happens to each of the major characters is certainly in the realm of the acceptable. Just the actual way they get to those plot points is absurd. Brienne hooking up with Jaime but ultimately being dumped for Cersei is certainly a reasonable finale to their plot. But the implied motivations were all over the place - people tease her about being a virgin... She's an unmarried young noblewoman, she's supposed to be a virgin! Jaime never cared about the smallfolk... Come on! Likewise, Dany as turbohitler makes sense, she's tried reforming society in other places with limited success, meanwhile fire has always worked for her. But the build up to it really didn't work, and the resolution was as clichéd as it gets. Stabbed in the heart by her lover who didn't want to do it but had to, how sad. I guess it didn't help that the Dany Jon relationship had little chemistry to begin with. I would recommend Preston Jacob's attempts to fix the story while keeping the major plot beats from the show. But honestly his plots are probably to convoluted to work in an actual TV show, what with all the time traveling and mind control. Maybe that's what grrm was planning for the books, but I don't really think so.
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May 17, 2022 07:23
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Collateral posted:I doubt people are as invested as with WoT, since that seems to have been a formative teenage event for a massive cohort, with an author that had a lot cache with his fans. Gurm has poo poo all over anybody and everybody he possibly can at this stage, his cache and that of asoiaf is in the toilet. It's a millstone to him and no established author would touch it when he finally shuffles off this veil of excuses and railroads. Yeah, GURM's reached Terry Goodkind levels of 'you might have had an okay idea once, but hoo boy did you go bad places from there'.
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May 17, 2022 07:29
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pidan posted:But honestly his plots are probably to convoluted to work in an actual TV show, They could have had a fantasy soap opera that ran for a million years.
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May 17, 2022 07:31
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TERFherder posted:They could have had a fantasy soap opera that ran for a million years. Honestly a high fantasy soap opera makes so much loving sense. People in various gaudy castles talking, magic so there can be doppelgängers and people coming back from the dead. Endless betrothal will they / won’t they scenarios. Small folk “getting above their station” and hooking up with the nobility and causing drama.
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May 17, 2022 08:05
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I felt Ike the TV show more or less began with just as wide a scope and being just as ambitious as the book, but that with every subsequent season it felt like the scope and vision of the series continually got LESS epic, and smaller and smaller. Until by the last season you have characters like Varys and Tyrion who seemed deeply clever and mysterious and full of possibilities and motivations and fate…. Being revealed as insignificant pawns of characters who apparently never knew what they were doing in the first place. Pretty much every character on the TV show suffers TREMENDOUSLY from this. One thing I will give credit to GRRM for is that his series does not have this problem at all - if anything it’s suffering from the opposite issue - while the TV show narrowed in focus down to almost nothing, GRRM has continually broadened his focus to the point where it became a serious issue in books 4 and 5. In some ways this gives me hope for TWOW? If it ever does get released, I’d like to think he’s recognized this and will pull back on the scope to where things feel a bit more like the first three books, but it does seem kind of unlikely.
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May 17, 2022 09:30
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I think gurm can't really control these things, I mean, obviously he's a person writing words on an ancient PC so he can do whatever he wants but what I mean is that the way he described his writing style he's very much the sort of writer that is carried away by the events on the page and by what he perceives as the necessities of the contiguous narrative, he said himself that when he tried to write the famous 5 year time skip he couldn't carry through with it because he felt it lacked authenticity and consistency to have the story just glance over important events that had POV characters involved in them, that it would be wrong to just have chapters full of Dany reminiscing about the events at Meereen, etc, I think we can assume from that sort of inclination that he also felt like it would be cheap for Victarion to just appear with the iron fleet in meereen and tell Dany his tale, so he felt compelled to flesh out the iron isles politics and add POV characters and then these POV characters of course have to get their own arcs which more often than not will require even more words and characters cause otherwise it's the route of the show where there are too many coincidences and too few characters and the world gets this obvious diorama feeling that the show exhibited in the last few seasons. Otoh the Preston Jacobs & Co fan fic crew seem to do a bang-up job with these things, so far! Gurm should just join their creative collective, wouldn't that be awesome??? emanresu tnuocca fucked around with this message at 10:25 on May 17, 2022 |
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May 17, 2022 09:52
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kaworu posted:I felt Ike the TV show more or less began with just as wide a scope and being just as ambitious as the book, but that with every subsequent season it felt like the scope and vision of the series continually got LESS epic, and smaller and smaller. Until by the last season you have characters like Varys and Tyrion who seemed deeply clever and mysterious and full of possibilities and motivations and fate…. Being revealed as insignificant pawns of characters who apparently never knew what they were doing in the first place. Pretty much every character on the TV show suffers TREMENDOUSLY from this. Yeah, Benioff and Weiss's brilliant way of showing the viewers that "now things are serious!" in the last couple of seasons was just to make the characters the opposite of whatever they were before. Tyrion was an underappreciated genius, both strategically and socially, with intelligent plots he never got credit for? Well, now he's an overrated dumbass, he constantly fucks up his evaluation of people, and his plans all suck. Varys is three steps ahead of everyone else because he's the literal master of secrets? Well, he'll be sloppy with this secret, and he'll be the last person to realize he's going to be executed for it. Cersei is a ruthless, conniving queen? Well, now she sits in the Red Keep, pretends she's not pining after Jaime, and moans about the poor outcomes of other peoples' conniving.
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May 17, 2022 13:37
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It feels like the show wanted to leave itself a bunch of wiggle room for the audience to interpret events on their own after the finale, but the problem is that even when the writers may have cleverly left a door open, those moments are still part of a show that had supremely stupid writing. Someone can come out with a fan theory that says this or that character was actually lying in the end, but with how many characters in the show outright state their motivations and intentions to anyone who hear, it's easier to just assume that these open ended moments are bad writing. For example, I remember there being a theory that Dany knew that Tyrion was useless by a certain point and that she was leading him on, intending to use him as a hostage or to install him in House Lannister as a puppet. And that makes a lot of sense, and it would have been neat for the show to have explored it, but so many characters just kept saying that Tyrion was great and nice and brilliant without any real good reason, causing the "Tyrion hostage" theory to just not hold any weight. Even small moments like Jaime's "I never cared about the smallfolk" line that could have been waved away as him being flippant or deflective exist in the same space where characters kept outright stating what they feel or what they were going to do, so it's honestly very fair to assume that he was being honest with that line.
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May 17, 2022 22:23
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I so badly wanted to love Sansa coming to her own, becoming Queen of The North and outsmarting the people around her but it just came at the expense of turning everyone around her in to huge idiots 
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May 18, 2022 01:54
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Happy Landfill posted:I so badly wanted to love Sansa coming to her own, becoming Queen of The North and outsmarting the people around her but it just came at the expense of turning everyone around her in to huge idiots Yeah that's the genuine peril of writing smart characters-- if the writers aren't smart then they can't fake it. That's why smart characters are usually written like House or Sherlock where they just have a sort-of omniscience that manifests as obnoxious confidence. I don't think it's a coincidence that GRRM stopped writing right around the time Sansa was going to have to truly start flying on her own and getting Littlefinger out of the way. And for all his faults GRRM ain't dumb.
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May 18, 2022 02:15
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Yeah, D&D genuinely did not know how to write smart characters and it showed when Tyrion and Varys were reduced to just making cock jokes are each other Get it?? Because Varys is a eunuch??? 
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May 18, 2022 02:30
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Happy Landfill posted:Yeah, D&D genuinely did not know how to write smart characters and it showed when Tyrion and Varys were reduced to just making cock jokes are each other The spectacle of an idiot writing supposedly one of the pre-eminent minds in a field makes Dan Brown into a kind of farce.
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May 18, 2022 02:42
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Happy Landfill posted:I so badly wanted to love Sansa coming to her own, becoming Queen of The North and outsmarting the people around her but it just came at the expense of turning everyone around her in to huge idiots She got brutally raped every night for months but don’t worry it made her strong.
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May 18, 2022 03:21
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That released Elaine chapter of Winds was kind of neat because it shows Sansa's knowledge of courtly things turning into more practical analyzation of events than when she was just a little girl admiring Knights and Ladies. The problem is that I think George wants eighty more chapters of her just wandering around, internalizing. Sansa's story is among the weirdest right now, because there is just no indication of how she is supposed to even fold back into the main plot without needing like five more books of her own.pseudanonymous posted:The spectacle of an idiot writing supposedly one of the pre-eminent minds in a field makes Dan Brown into a kind of farce. If it gives us that treasure of scene where Robert Langdon talks about female orgasms, it's worth it. One of my other favorite "people writing outside of their depth" cliche scenes is when fantasy/historical fiction writers try to have characters talk about military strategy. The author knows about Cannae and not much else, so a bunch of generals will be standing around a sand table just trying to make all of the pieces work, and the protagonist will say something like "What if we try a pincer movement!" and everyone else reacts like nobody could have possibly thought of such a brilliant move. That, or they will win by pulling some weird Little Giants-rear end trick play at some point during the battle.
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May 18, 2022 03:25
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:She got brutally raped every night for months but don’t worry it made her strong. If there was any doubt that this show was written by a couple dudes  emanresu tnuocca posted:I think gurm can't really control these things, I mean, obviously he's a person writing words on an ancient PC so he can do whatever he wants but what I mean is that the way he described his writing style he's very much the sort of writer that is carried away by the events on the page and by what he perceives as the necessities of the contiguous narrative, he said himself that when he tried to write the famous 5 year time skip he couldn't carry through with it because he felt it lacked authenticity and consistency to have the story just glance over important events that had POV characters involved in them, that it would be wrong to just have chapters full of Dany reminiscing about the events at Meereen, etc, I think we can assume from that sort of inclination that he also felt like it would be cheap for Victarion to just appear with the iron fleet in meereen and tell Dany his tale, so he felt compelled to flesh out the iron isles politics and add POV characters and then these POV characters of course have to get their own arcs which more often than not will require even more words and characters cause otherwise it's the route of the show where there are too many coincidences and too few characters and the world gets this obvious diorama feeling that the show exhibited in the last few seasons. I definitely don't blame Martin for all this and I agree, Victarion coming out of nowhere would have felt really rushed. It really sucks how the 5 year gap would have worked great for some of the characters but not all of them. I sometimes wonder if he wouldn't be having as much trouble as he's having if he would have just gone ahead and did the gap. We'll probably never really know and it's moot at this point. But yeah, if you're going to have you character sit there and reminisce about a bunch of stuff that happened before the story picked up again, you might as well have just include that as part of the story 
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May 18, 2022 04:41
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Coquito Ergo Sum posted:One of my other favorite "people writing outside of their depth" cliche scenes is when fantasy/historical fiction writers try to have characters talk about military strategy. The author knows about Cannae and not much else, so a bunch of generals will be standing around a sand table just trying to make all of the pieces work, and the protagonist will say something like "What if we try a pincer movement!" and everyone else reacts like nobody could have possibly thought of such a brilliant move. That, or they will win by pulling some weird Little Giants-rear end trick play at some point during the battle. Flank them!! FLANK THEM!!!
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May 18, 2022 04:44
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grrm hoisted by his own petard you say?
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May 18, 2022 05:31
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Coquito Ergo Sum posted:That released Elaine chapter of Winds was kind of neat because it shows Sansa's knowledge of courtly things turning into more practical analyzation of events than when she was just a little girl admiring Knights and Ladies. The problem is that I think George wants eighty more chapters of her just wandering around, internalizing. Sansa's story is among the weirdest right now, because there is just no indication of how she is supposed to even fold back into the main plot without needing like five more books of her own. to make this plotline manageable sansa really needed to be in a position to backstab littlefinger and win over the knights of the vale by revealing her true identity, like, a book ago
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May 18, 2022 05:41
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Jazerus posted:to make this plotline manageable sansa really needed to be in a position to backstab littlefinger and win over the knights of the vale by revealing her true identity, like, a book ago Isn't Jon is still dead in the books, Arya is still blind maybe? Lots of time for poo poo to happen.
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May 18, 2022 06:42
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TERFherder posted:Isn't Jon is still dead in the books, Arya is still blind maybe? Lots of time for poo poo to happen. Tyrion has yet to meet Dany.
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May 18, 2022 13:01
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TERFherder posted:Isn't Jon is still dead in the books, Arya is still blind maybe? Lots of time for poo poo to happen. Arya wasn't even blind for a full chapter. She lost her sight at the end of her last chapter in Feast and got it back in her first chapter in Dance. got cok sos ffc dwd 
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May 18, 2022 13:51
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Like I said before, I think the funniest possible outcome in the near term is Winds comes out but over the course of 1000 pages the overall plot only advances to approximately midway through season 6 of the show.
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May 18, 2022 14:17
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Yeah, it was kind of jarring to listen to Preston's Areo chapter and have something actually happen in a Dorne storyline.
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May 19, 2022 02:40
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Coquito Ergo Sum posted:
Look what are they supposed to do, read something other than the wikipedia article about the only antique battle they've ever heard of? Who has time for that??
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May 19, 2022 05:45
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Like I said before, I think the funniest possible outcome in the near term is Winds comes out but over the course of 1000 pages the overall plot only advances to approximately midway through season 6 of the show. Page 1001 is another "Meanwhile, Back at the Wall" where GRRM is like "Right now, you're saying 'wait, isn't this supposed to be the second to last book? Isn't there only one more after this? How will this all fit?' And you're right! But because of the amount of content we have to get through, each book is being split into four parts! Preorder The Winds of Winter, Part II right now, release date TBD!"
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May 19, 2022 13:07
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Gurm’s book is the new Zeno’s arrow
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May 19, 2022 13:10
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Coquito Ergo Sum posted:One of my other favorite "people writing outside of their depth" cliche scenes is when fantasy/historical fiction writers try to have characters talk about military strategy. The author knows about Cannae and not much else, so a bunch of generals will be standing around a sand table just trying to make all of the pieces work, and the protagonist will say something like "What if we try a pincer movement!" and everyone else reacts like nobody could have possibly thought of such a brilliant move. That, or they will win by pulling some weird Little Giants-rear end trick play at some point during the battle. it's also extremely apparent in every single latter-season battle that they don't have a single clue about how battles worked. just lmao @ the dothraki tactics in season 8
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May 19, 2022 15:21
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Why did Sansa keep the Knights of the Vale a secret from Jon?
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May 19, 2022 16:35
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Jazerus posted:it's also extremely apparent in every single latter-season battle that they don't have a single clue about how battles worked. just lmao @ the dothraki tactics in season 8 Or Jon vs Ramsay
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May 19, 2022 16:38
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The prevailing trait of D&D's writing is that when they try to write a character as cunning they'll write everyone else as very stupid, it kinda reminds me of HBO's Oz with O'Reilly constantly wormtonguing other inmates to kill each other for him and doing so extremely blatantly but the show plays it like it's very clever and that O'Reilly is a mastermind, that's how every plot in post-martin GoT works.
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May 19, 2022 16:59
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emanresu tnuocca posted:The prevailing trait of D&D's writing is that when they try to write a character as cunning they'll write everyone else as very stupid, it kinda reminds me of HBO's Oz with O'Reilly constantly wormtonguing other inmates to kill each other for him and doing so extremely blatantly but the show plays it like it's very clever and that O'Reilly is a mastermind, that's how every plot in post-martin GoT works. See I’m playing both sides, that way I always win.
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May 19, 2022 17:30
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Why did Sansa keep the Knights of the Vale a secret from Jon? It's hard to tell if it was even a secret or she just nipped down to the Vale for a few hours to pick up an army. I remember that being the most egregious teleportation incident until Beyond the Wall happened.
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May 19, 2022 17:54
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