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Krinkle posted:I couldn't remember if that was a preview chapter or not. I think I remember him at his ancestral castle like "well at least this is done, wonder where those dragons and dornish are." Ya the last JonCon chapter has him reveal he he has greyscale, pine for Rhaegar a bit and plan an attack on Storms end. My most recent read through of DoD lead me to believe that people really overblow the Quentyn subplot, he has like 5 PoV chapters and most of them are at the start and pretty interesting. He has the first look at Volantis, the Battle of Astapor and a look at the wind blown/Astapori army. The last two chapters with the dragon plot are pretty dumb, but overall I actually kinda like his chapters, there is some good world building in them.
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Sep 17, 2015 23:05
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emanresu tnuocca posted:Mance wrote the latter. The key line in the letter I feel is "I have his magic sword" which is just oddly placed and doesn't seem very Ramsey like. Mance saw the sword when he was being Rattleshirt but not many other people have seen the sword. Mance not being involved at all in the escape attempt leads me to believe he was up to something else and that he wrote the letter. Also wasn't Mance the hooded dude that was killing people at Winterfell? That's what I assumed on my re-read anyway.
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Sep 22, 2015 17:54
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I think the best clue that Mance wrote the pink letter is he would really have no motivation to stay at Winterfell and try to rescue fArya, he should know outright that she's a fake. He saw the real one at the beginning of GoT and he immediately recognized Jon when he saw him a second time, so I don't see why he'd give two shits about Jeyne unless he has some ulterior motive. On the other hand maybe Grum just forgot that Mance would know what Arya looks like and I'll admit that's entirely possible.
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Sep 22, 2015 19:02
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I'm of the opinion that the book is never coming out
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Oct 4, 2015 20:35
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Krinkle posted:Something that confused me and is now sticking out in my memory, when Tyrion hears Aegon sailed west instead of going to Danerys, why did he think "haha whaat? Did he take the bait?" It implies that he also thinks "what a dumbass haha I owned him with my clever joke". I took at it as a pretty simple "gently caress my plan worked but way too late to help me" Is Tyrion even heading to meet Dany at the end of Dance? Last we see him he's in the Yunkai'i army making a bunch of promises to Westerosi that he has to be in Westeros to fulfill. I think he might just go with the Second Sons and join Aegon
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Oct 11, 2015 22:18
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Grendels Dad posted:Could his attempts to get Jaime out of the Kingsguard and back to the Rock also be viewed in this light? Reading the last few posts made me think that maybe it doubled as an attempt to get Jaime away from Cersei as well as getting an heir that isn't also a dwarf. Pretty confident that this was the case. I believe after Jamie refuses to ditch the Kingsguard that Tywin tells him that he's gonna send Cersei back to Casterly Rock
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Dec 1, 2015 19:05
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jsoh posted:also jaime was named to the kingsguard by aerys he didnt ask for it Jaime asked for it so he could be close to Kings Landing and Cersei. Aerys agreed to spite Tywin and take away his heir. Tywin got pissed and sent Cersei from the capital and resigned as Kings Hand
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Dec 2, 2015 00:52
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mind the walrus posted:Nah that's a bridge too far to try and make Jamie sympathetic even by GRRM's standards. Jamie is written as a pretty sympathetic character basically the entire time after he pushes Bran out the window.
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Dec 2, 2015 18:56
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I don't think Jaime is gonna come out of the next book* alive  *the book is never coming out
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Dec 8, 2015 02:01
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The book is never coming out
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Jan 4, 2016 11:11
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Do people still actually think the next book is ever coming out?
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Sep 23, 2016 02:13
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Are Fire and Blood and the World of Ice and Fire worth reading/buying? I haven't read much ASoIaF since Dance with Dragons came out and I'm thinking about giving the series a re-read It's weird posting in this thread again and seeing people still talking about the exact same poo poo from a decade ago I'm assuming Winds of Winter is still never coming out?
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Feb 14, 2019 09:38
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I've always thought the glass candles would end up being just Dues Ex Machina to communicate across far distances. The Maesters aren't the only ones that use them, Qaithe uses one to talk to Dany in Meeren
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Mar 5, 2019 03:21
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Woodpile posted:She did it because the American Tolkien couldn't find a better way to get a war started. The whole 'Joffrey sent the assassin to kill Bran' really makes no loving sense when you think about it. Joffrey doing it to try and impress Robert and to give Bran mercy or whatever the reasoning was is just super out of character for him. On the other hand Catelyn just plain accepting Littlefinger's word about the dagger and arresting Tyrion without proof is incredibly dumb, it actually fits her character so it works for me
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Mar 5, 2019 23:41
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Jaime telling Loras "I'll shove my sword somewhere even Renly never found" is not exactly subtle
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Mar 6, 2019 10:20
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esperterra posted:It always did strike me as odd that none of Ned's sons were the wards of other lords tbh. Robert's children not being sent away I can buy b/c Cersei would probably refuse to send them away, but you'd think Ned would have sent a few away. Ned is really loving bad at politics, it makes sense that he'd prefer to have his children close to home rather than try to use them to further relations with other great houses. I like how in the series there is a lot of things left unsaid and just implied, like how Jon Arryn and Hoster Tully we're clearly planning some form of alliance for years before start of the Rebellion
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Mar 6, 2019 19:27
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The only thing Selmy adds to Dany's plot in the book was telling her that the greenseer that Arya talks to in the riverlands once predicted that the Prince that was Promised would be a descendent of the Mad King.
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Mar 8, 2019 22:33
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TK-42-1 posted:considering how much of a dumbass my 13yo niece is it makes Sansa a bit more relatable. Nothing gross has really happened to Sansa in the book at least. Blame D&D for that Ramsay poo poo
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Mar 10, 2019 01:02
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Zenithe posted:It would be so much better if they followed the book, and Tormund just beat Mance to death. Isn't Mance alive in the books and murdering people in winterfell?
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Mar 12, 2019 13:19
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Katt posted:I wouldn't say "allowed to join the watch" is right word. Ned wanted Jon to stay at Winterfell with Robb, it was Catelyn that refused and said she wouldn't have it. Jon wanted to join Benjen in the Night's Watch so it all ended up working out
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Mar 12, 2019 22:50
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esperterra posted:I'd imagine Ramsay will be dead by the time Sansa ever finds her way North again, if she ever does. The Stannis plot I can see ending in a similar way, but us getting to the conclusion far differently. Like the burning of Shireen, for instance, I can't buy him being the one to make that call-- especially considering Shireen is at the wall and he's at Winterfell-- rather I could see crazy Selyse being the one to make it happen, or Melisandre just doing it on her own. My guess would be that Selyse/Melisandre would burn Shireen in an attempt to bring back the 'Prince that was Promised' thinking it's Stannis but surprise surprise Jon wakes up instead if the book was ever coming out, which it is not
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Mar 14, 2019 21:16
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TommyGun85 posted:In the show, the faceless men literally wear masks? Even though the first time we meet Jaqen he changes his face seemlessly? Yeah, this is how it works in the books too
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Mar 18, 2019 12:08
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Sephyr posted:Very much so. Asha is a bit like Davos in that they are there to point out how dumb everything is while being powerless to stop it, but Davos' contraint about beingunable to change things is a lot better. He's lowborn scum and his king is both an underdog and utterly inflexible, while also being in the thrall of the only religion with actuak power in the show. Sorry that you didn't like the plot of the first two books I guess? You know these are works of fiction right? Weird to talk about 'forcing the status quo' or whatever when the only thing driving the plot is whatever the author chooses to write. Just seems odd to complain about military realism in a fiction series with dragons and ice zombies is all
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Mar 31, 2019 11:43
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Evil Fluffy posted:Looking at that gif just reminds me of an old interview about filming the LOTR movies and how there was not only a master swordsman to teach the cast how to actually swing a sword (at least in a way to look flashy for movies) but that Viggo Mortensen got really in to it and kept practicing on his own and insisting on wearing his sword around the set. LOTR had plenty of bad fights but at least the fight between Aragon and Lurtz(?) at the end of the first movie looked like the actors were at least trying. https://twitter.com/seanastin/status/1053351488972455936?s=21
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Apr 3, 2019 07:58
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It seems weird to complain about depictions of sexual assault in the book series where you have children being smashed on walls The horrors of war/war making monsters of everyone is a pretty consistent theme throughout the novels. The Dany scene was pretty hosed up but I think it's the only rape in the series that is portrayed as not explicitly horrific.
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Apr 9, 2019 15:17
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TXT BOOTY7 2 47474 posted:
I just got to the Ghost of High Heart chapters while re-reading the books so hearing that song was weird and seemed kind of out of place. Was the ghost of high heart even in the show?
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Apr 22, 2019 04:32
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Solice Kirsk posted:I like how the Faceless Men, an assassin cult built on stealth and subterfuge, have somehow turned Arya into an Adem from Patrick Rothfuss' Kingkiller Chronicle. some people think that in the books there is a hinted at subplot by the faceless men to try and hatch a dragon egg As far as crazy fan theories goes, it does actually seem pretty supported by the text
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Apr 24, 2019 04:27
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Katt posted:I have to credit ASOIAF for the phonetic character names. This Hizdahr Zo Loraq erasure is unacceptable
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May 1, 2019 21:07
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Zenithe posted:They were a pre-planned Dornish psy-op. PJs show videos are good but his book theories are insane and I feel like he's just doing a shtick. He skips over obvious explanations to laser focus on random sentences that he thinks GRRM wrote as little hints, not realizing that there is no way Gurm put as much effort into these insane theories as PJ does
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May 12, 2019 16:44
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scary ghost dog posted:did u not read the books or somethijng He was talking abut the show did u not read the post or something
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May 15, 2019 03:40
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Mameluke posted:It is so drat telling that those two scenes (and the beetles line) are literally the only original contributions to the series anyone ever lauds Why do people say the Tywin/Arya scenes were good? I thought they were utter trash and completely ruined Tywins character. This insane badass dude who never smiles that is obsessed with his families honour and place in society is going to chuckle and he fine with some random peasant girl sassing him and basically calls him dumb to his face? Come the gently caress on. The Harrenhal scenes in the books were much better. I particularly liked Elmer Frey talking to Arya about how he was betrothed to her but neither of them realize he's talking about her
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May 18, 2019 04:31
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The part about this dumpster fire that actually makes me the most mad was probably the scene with Brienne writing in the White Book. In the books the empty part of his page represents the change he could make in his life and his ability for be whatever wants to be. Brienne wrote "ransomed at Riverrun for two stark daughters" in the show scene and Jaime wrote "ransomed at Riverrun for a promise unfulfilled" in the book, I remember cause the line stuck with me poignant and as being particularly representative of Jaime's arc in the books. He's not evil and he's tired of acting like he is, so he finally acknowledges his warts and starts to come to gripes with his past. Except in the show nope he's actually bad all along and then rocks fall on him.. gave good D to Brienne tho
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May 20, 2019 03:24
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Dangerllama posted:The worst part of the episode is when Brienne closes the book after writing in it and I’m like “nooo that’s gonna smear!” How is Tyrion not mentioned in a book about the wars after Robert's death, his kidnapping literally kicks off the war of the five kings does DND not even remember season 1
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May 20, 2019 03:30
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PupsOfWar posted:sansa being Queen in the North is good I'm sure the other 6 kingdoms and all the bannered lords will be cool with the North being the only independent nation forever
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May 20, 2019 03:55
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Katt posted:Does the show or the books ever clear up where Hugh's got his money from or why the Lannisters had him killed? It was probably Littlefinger himself, because someone apparently mentions knighting Hugh to honour Jon Arryn's memory and that seems out of character for the Lannisters Also keep in mind that two people would have been required to kill him, Gregor obviously, but also whoever helped him get into his armour. He didn't have a squire so whoever did his armour for the tourney likely left his gorget unclasped on purpose. Not too many knights are mentioned to fight at the Tourney but one we do know that was present was Lothar Brune who is mentioned because he fights a northman. Brune is one of Littlefinger's men and from the Vale so he probably knew Hugh and was the one who helped him with the armour, especially if it was paid for by Lysa Arryn or Littlefinger. At the same time after typing all this, I'm doing a re-read and I'm about halfway through Dance, and I think that Game of Thrones is easily the worst book. The story is good and enjoyable but its inconsistent and a lot of what happens is plain illogical and fantastical, and I think a lot of trouble stems from GRRM writing it thinking that he was going to have a tight quick trilogy and the editor not knowing the general endgame. A lot of Ned and Catlyn's conveniently idiotic choices stir the plot a little too well and don't really make too much sense when looked back at logically with things we've learned from the next 4 books. But I mean the book came out like 25 years ago, when GRRM was writing it even he probably didn't really know what we were going to learn in the next 4 books. I think the most egregious example is early on when Bran has a dream that heavily implies Jamie was going to end up being the end villain in the story, which GRRM has said was his original intention but that he'll likely change because he likes Jaime's character now. imo Game is the book that has the least hidden mysteries and subplots, just because I don't think GRRM really thought he was writing that kind of series when he actually wrote the book. SirKibbles posted:I doubt it. It really comes off as outside of Arthur Dayne, Rhaegar gives zero fucks about anything else before he reads some prophecy and then does a personality 180 He's like 10 when he reads the prophecy and has the personality flip though
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May 28, 2019 22:00
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pseudanonymous posted:How would Littlefinger do that, he was at his basically meaningless holding on the fingers wasn't he? And Brandon didn't have any respect for him, he beat him in a duel and only left him alive because Catelyn asked him to. Why would he listen to him? It seems more likely Varys had something to do with it, though I can't really fathom his reasoning. There's a whole YouTube series on this but he was likely at the inn at the crossroads during this period and not the Fingers yet. He had just been banished from Riverrun for fighting Brandon and knocking up Lysa and he was heading to the Fingers, but it was a bad winter that year after the year of the False spring and there was lots of snow, so he likely was somewhere in that area waiting to cross the mountains of the moon. Him lying to Brandon to get Brandon killed actually makes sense as he knew Brandon was hotheaded and he hated him for being betrothed to Cat Ginette Reno posted:Why would Benjen know? Ned didn't even tell his wife. Benjen probably knew that Lyanna was the Knight of the Laughing Tree because he's the one that tells howland Reed that he could find armour and a horse. Also apparently GRRM was asked directly about Benjen taking the black at a illogical time and he had some real evasive answer about how it would come up in the future so who knows A Typical Goon fucked around with this message at 09:49 on May 30, 2019 |
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May 30, 2019 09:37
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TK-42-1 posted:The Westerlings are Lannister bannermen. The theory is that Tywin had them use their daughter to gently caress Robb to ruin the Frey alliance and break up his coalition. I think there was something about her mom making her abort the baby after robb died but I haven’t read in a while. Jeyne definitely wasn't in on the Robb murder in the books, in Feast she is still wearing mourning colours after the siege of Riverrun even though it's well past the expected time to still be in mourning and she stares daggers at her family when they talk to Jaime
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May 30, 2019 20:02
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So I was reading the appendixs last night cause I'm a nerd like that and I have what I think is an original theory about the books that are never coming out. The appendix seem to hint at a possible Reach Civil War] We are constantly told through the books that the Reach is the most powerful region and the most powerful houses are the Tyrells, the Florents of Brightwater Keep, the Hightowers in Oldtown and the Tarlys. During Clash of Kings the Florents declare for Stannis because he's married to a Florent, but then Stannis eventually kills the Lord of the family (alester) for a +10 wind magic bonus. The next time the Florents really come up is in King's landing when they have their lands stripped due to the rebelling and their castle granted to Garlan Tyrell, the second Tyrell son. I dont think it comes up again except for Garlan leaving to try to take back Brightwater Keep, but the appendix have a bunch of characters that arent even mentioned in the series that could come into play with this plotline. Apparently Alester had a son and a bunch of daughters that are married into very strong Reach houses. The appendix says his son Alekyne fled to Oldtown, where his sister Rhea is Lady Hightower. If it was just this I wouldnt have thought much of it but it turns his other sister is Melissa Tarly and married to Randyll Tarly. It seems a bit too coincidental that this character never mentioned yet that has a claim on the second best seat in the Reach just happens to be a brother in law to the Lords of the third and fourth best seats. Would the rest of the Reach lords be cool with the Tyrells controlling both Highgarden and Brightwater? A Typical Goon fucked around with this message at 20:51 on May 30, 2019 |
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May 30, 2019 20:49
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chaosapiant posted:Is there another Ice and Fire thread I can go to and banter about these old books? Because I like doing that. I didn't even know this thread was about the show since that's not the title of the thread. Yeah this thread has actually been talking about the books quite a bit recently, seems weird to close it now
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May 30, 2019 22:56
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esperterra posted:There would certainly be a new OP, but I like the idea of this thread having existed as long as Dance has been out, so why not wait til Winds has(n't) come out to make a new one. What is dead may never die
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May 31, 2019 00:31
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