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It seems like a lot of people who don't like the book haven't read it yet.
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Jul 11, 2011 16:14
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Ixian posted:Hopefully now that we have a new book the thread can evolve in to discussing it, but the vitriol train has been running for so long now it's going to be hard to stop. We just need a new bad thread so that those people can post there and the other people can post here. Sexpansion fucked around with this message at 17:59 on Jul 11, 2011 |
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Jul 11, 2011 17:52
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I have it. It's in my hands right now. This is a beautiful moment.
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Jul 12, 2011 17:03
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literallyincredible posted:Yeah the sales figures are sick. So are the reviews. The New York Times review is basically the most over the top rave I've ever seen (emphasis added): I am a huge Martin fanboy and I pretty much agree with even the most ridiculous praise, but I think it's silly not to recognize that if there weren't a TV show, the book wouldn't be getting all these rave reviews. It's the increased cultural awareness that's driving this, not the quality of the books.
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Jul 18, 2011 17:33
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OperaMouse posted:
See I don't even agree with this criticism, but no matter how good the books are, they wouldn't be turning into a cultural phenomenon without the TV show.
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Jul 18, 2011 17:49
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No one makes perfect decisions in the series because it's impossible. Decisions that seem to be good at the time come to bite characters later on. That's because they're human, and it's a tragedy. The model is Shakespeare as much as it is Mallory. No good deed goes unpunished. The more I read, the more I'm convinced that this really is 100% based on the model of the historical tragedy and that none of the main characters are getting out in one piece. If the end of the series is a Hamlet style bloodbath I would not be at all shocked. Edit: I think the repeated phrases (kennings if you are effete) are just a symptom of the rushed editing job. Sexpansion fucked around with this message at 14:23 on Jul 21, 2011 |
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Jul 21, 2011 14:20
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hampig posted:I was wondering the same thing. We know for sure now that Melisandre can maintain a glamor, but in the same book we don't get any indication that she's faking it. Maybe it needs to be tempered properly. ie. plunged into the heart of your wife
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Jul 23, 2011 14:14
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Rhymenoceros posted:I see your points. I just wanted to rant about the book and be angry and annoyed. In part because the stabbing, in part because I had high expectations (that weren't met) and lastly because now I have to wait 5 years for another book (that will not meet my expectations). I highly doubt it will be another 5 years.
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Jul 27, 2011 19:23
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Ambiguatron posted:Maybe the Drowned God is real, and is going to rise up with a bunch of drowned zombies and the Others and everybody else will have to team up to fight them off. It'a s song of ice and fire after all. There's already been talk of actual Krakens showing up and bothering ships, so I don't think it would be too much of a shock for some monsters that are connected with that area to show up and wreak havoc.
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Aug 11, 2011 13:37
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Desumaytah posted:So who does everyone think is in the running for "main (human) bad guy" in all this? I think the whole point of the series is that there isn't one. Even the Others may not end up being as bad as you think they are.
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Aug 11, 2011 13:39
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bouncyman posted:
I think this is the most likely outcome. He almost dies, has bad scars, etc.
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Aug 11, 2011 21:34
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After finally finishing it, I have to say that while I liked Dance, I think it's the weakest book of the series up to this point. To be fair, though, I like Feast a lot more than most others so that probably has a lot to do with it. I love Connington, though. I think that he's a fantastic addition and I hope he stays a POV character. Also, really liked Victarion, and I'm thinking that he's going to be even better as the series goes on. My order: 1 > 3 > 2 > 4 > 5.
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Aug 26, 2011 15:28
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menino posted:Aerys never was indicated as being unfaithful, and the only evidence from aDwD is that he "took liberties" at the wedding while Tywin was taking her up to the bedding. Meaning he groped her. Right. I think the biggest issue is that, as of yet, the timelines for that theory don't line up at all. Edit: Haha that too VVV Sexpansion fucked around with this message at 16:47 on Aug 26, 2011 |
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Aug 26, 2011 16:36
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Hedrigall posted:I really liked it I also enjoyed it quite a bit, even though it was my least favorite of the series so far.
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Aug 29, 2011 20:18
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Junkenstein posted:If Coldhands is Benjen (I was really hoping for a definitive answer to that) it may mean that Stark blood allows you to become a goodie wight. But yeah, there's no precedent for someone who's killed by a human on the southern side of the wall to get zombified. I don't think there's any reason to think that Jon is even dead at this point. It's just as likely that he's seriously injured and will be nursed back to health, which could still be considered a metaphorical "death" and resurrection. Basically we aren't really given enough info at this point to make a good guess. Edit: quote:According to prophecy originating from Asshai over five thousand years ago, Azor Ahai is to be reborn again as The Prince that was Promised to challenge the Others. The prophecy states that "when the red star bleeds and the darkness gathers, Azor Ahai shall be born again amidst smoke and salt to wake dragons out of stone." This will occur after a long summer when an evil, cold darkness descends upon the world. It is said that The Prince that was Promised, wielding Lightbringer once again, will stand against the Others and if he fails, the world fails with him. It would be awesome if Jon fails at the end of the series and all of Westeros is pulled into eternal winter. Sexpansion fucked around with this message at 16:07 on Aug 31, 2011 |
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Aug 31, 2011 16:05
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who is riding Hodor
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Sep 1, 2011 19:09
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I'm sure someone has thought about this, but I'm thinking about the "stone" dragon in the prophecy. Stone is a bastard's name. Bastards are pretty important. Is it possible that that's what it refers to? Like maybe something to do with Mya Stone or something?
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Sep 2, 2011 14:28
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So what is the thinking on Aegon = a Blackfyre and not the Aegon we think he is theory? It seems pretty plausible to me.
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Sep 6, 2011 21:47
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Ecco the Dolphin posted:^^^^ This is so stupid but I'm pretty sure he is a fan of both teams.
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Sep 8, 2011 18:01
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Fog Tripper posted:Sorry, I never bought this rubbish. If anything it reinforces my suspicion that he really doesn't have even a rough outline for the series at this point. Also, it doesn't excuse crap like expanding on inane pages of "those mountains are named after teets" and menus being described over the span of pages rather than paragraphs. If you really don't think he even had a "rough outline" then you're basically ignoring the piles of evidence already present in the books that lots of things have been planned out for a long time.
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Oct 19, 2011 16:42
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Dendra posted:The only way Feast is a decent book is if you don't compare it to the first 3 though. Nonsense, Feast is great. Dance is a horrible mess, though.
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Apr 3, 2012 14:32
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Hahahaha, so people actually think that Varys and Illyrio are secret Mermen? That has to be the most awful theory about these books I've ever heard.
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Apr 5, 2012 16:47
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Ambiguatron posted:Of course, I don't think that would matter, since I'm still assuming that R'hllor is actually evil. Do you really think the gods exist in any meaningful way in aSoIaF? I highly doubt it.
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Apr 23, 2012 14:29
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1stGear posted:One of my managers at work was telling me to read Rothfuss' stuff. Welp. Rothfuss is awful and Sanderson is milquetoast genre garbage.
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Apr 23, 2012 20:32
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I really like the books, so keep that in mind when reading this. I'm not a Gurrrrrm hater. I tried watching the TV show, but after four or five episodes in I had to stop. Besides all the cognitive dissonance from reading the books three times and then seeing similar events realized in a completely foreign way, my real problem with the HBO series is this: It's Wildcards. I'm not being facetious. It really is. It's a bunch of different writers (and producers, and actors, etc.) doing a shared-world take on a Song of Ice and Fire. Adding characters and scenes that may be reasonably induced from reading the books, but which did not previously exist and which probably shouldn't have. A bit of an over-fascination with gore and boobs. I don't know why I didn't think about this more before I watched the show, but watching the show became an enormous chore and I couldn't continue. It's Wildcards, with all the mediocrity that implies. I'll continue enjoying the books, but I doubt I'll watch another minute of the show.
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Apr 25, 2012 15:42
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Urdnot Fire posted:Margaery's being made the string-puller in the series to eliminate the need for the Queen of Thorns, I fear. Seems like the most reasonable explanation for turning her into the master manipulator.
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Apr 25, 2012 20:42
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hailthefish posted:I was inspired, so I made a chart of my own: I approve of this chart. I was thinking about the poster who said that Martin's real interest was writing the War of the Roses part of the story and not the fantasy story (sorry that was a good post but I can't remember who it was). I was thinking this might not be the case. What if Jon is the red herring? That would be pretty great if aSoIaF turns up being a near complete inversion of the heroic journey - Jon (and maybe Bran) end up leading the walkers against westeros from above the wall and Dany saves everyone. I mean obviously it's more likely that Jon and Dany will end up riding dragons and getting married and saving the realm blah blah blah, but I wouldn't put it past Martin to still have some formal invention up his sleeve.
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Apr 26, 2012 14:00
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Xiahou Dun posted:That's the worst typo I've ever seen : it's spelled 'Maggie Smith'. Even though Maggie Smith is the most obvious choice, she would still be perfect.
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Apr 26, 2012 17:25
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Thulsa Doom posted:The social commentary in Martin's novels is by no means original or even particularly well executed (you mean war as an institution cruelly grinds down the soldiers while the aristocracy glorifies it? My word!) but it's somewhat refreshing in a genre that's dominated by while male fascist power fantasies. Even if ASOIAF is basically a fascist white male power fantasy. Thank you! Martin's sense of progressive politics is very much the stodgy, old-guy Democrat kind, but it is still progressive. He's basically the John Kerry of fantasy writers (politically).
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Aug 24, 2012 14:58
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There are tons of novels written in second person. Charles Stross' Rule 34 is a recent example. Also, for the person who posted about perceptual bias: Here's a very popular, old example: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/As_I_Lay_Dying_(novel)
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Aug 27, 2012 14:42
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General Battuta posted:Definitely not tons, in proportion to the amount of novels written in other persons. It's considered a rare and pretty difficult choice to do an entire novel that way. I was surprised how well it worked in Rule 34. Fair enough. But it's not unheard of.
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Aug 27, 2012 15:58
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Martin's "system" of magic (if you can even call it that) falls very much on the Tolkien less is more side, so people who are expecting detailed explanations of why the seasons are borked or why frozen zombie people are walking around are going to be disappointed.
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Aug 29, 2012 16:57
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Thulsa Doom posted:I'm fine with the magic never being explained, but I would like to know how a continent full of human beings with primitive technology can survive with ten years in total darkness, much less a full generation. That would be impossible for modern society, even. Maybe that's why Westeros has barely advanced technologically - every long winter kills off 60% of the population and devastates crop yields, like a recurring black death. I imagine that, in a more realistic scenario, everyone who doesn't die migrates to Dorn for ten years? And there's some magic plants that grow in the dark? I don't know, I can't really think of any ways in which it would be possible for civilization to continue.
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Aug 29, 2012 19:45
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Thulsa Doom posted:It's a planet with semi-regular nuclear winters. It should be uninhabitable. I guess, then, for the world to be at all tenable, you have to assume that at the very least the stories of the long night are greatly exaggerated legends and winter never lasts longer than a few years. And you can still grow things in the South where its effects are less drastic.
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Aug 29, 2012 19:56
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emanresu tnuocca posted:Brianne and Arya also ruined poo poo for people, I resent the notion that GRRM considers women to be redeemable. She's what, a 10 year old at that point? Of course she didn't use her magic murder wishes in the most effective way, she's a child. I don't disagree with a lot of general gender criticism of the series, but the "X didn't do the smartest possible thing and therefore GRRM hates X" line of reasoning is kind of silly.
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Aug 30, 2012 21:19
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http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2012/08/31/social_mobility_in_targaryen_westeros.html
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Aug 31, 2012 19:12
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whoflungpoop posted:I liked show Stannis too. I'm sure show Victarion will be more likeable as well for the same reason, that the format spares the audience chapters worth of all their embittered Victarion is literally one of the most villainous characters in the whole series, I'm not exactly sure how they're going to make him likeable.
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Oct 9, 2012 16:22
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over their brothers.
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Fhate posted:Also, he deliberately hired a lovely assassin. He didn't necessarily need to know how the attempt would fail or because of whom, he just needed to be reasonably sure that it was very likely to fail. This seems like such a horrible idea that not even GRRM would write it for one of his characters.
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Dec 11, 2014 20:50
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I don't think Martin rips off anything from Hobbs, but they are definitely working on very similar ground and their writing shares a lot of genre tropes.
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Jan 8, 2015 16:57
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