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Fantastic Foreskin
Jan 6, 2013

A golden helix streaked skyward from the Helvault. A thunderous explosion shattered the silver monolith and Avacyn emerged, free from her prison at last.



You don't get that Apple money without making it somewhere. That somewhere isn't mac sales, but you'll pay it anyways so mise.

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Fantastic Foreskin
Jan 6, 2013

A golden helix streaked skyward from the Helvault. A thunderous explosion shattered the silver monolith and Avacyn emerged, free from her prison at last.



njsykora posted:

$200 doesn't even get you a 2TB NVMe drive on a PC at the moment, I don't know why you'd expect it from a Mac.

It'll get you a cheap (presumably QLC) one. Crappy drives aside, you can get a good 1TB nvme drive for $120, $200 for 256gb of storage is like $180 in margin.

Mu Zeta
Oct 17, 2002

Me crush ass to dust



njsykora posted:

$200 doesn't even get you a 2TB NVMe drive on a PC at the moment, I don't know why you'd expect it from a Mac.

Apple has a $200 upcharge if you want to go from 256 to 512.

This is a high quality (non QLC, 900 tb write lifetime, 5 year warranty) 2tb nvme drive for $225.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1627133-REG/wd_wdba3v0020bnc_wrsn_blue_2tb_sn550_nvme.html

I know there is the Apple premium but I'd want at least 1tb for that much.

Ok Comboomer
Oct 20, 2007



njsykora posted:

$200 doesn't even get you a 2TB NVMe drive on a PC at the moment, I don't know why you'd expect it from a Mac.

I just bought an XPS desktop and 2TB NVMe was $300 over the 512gb base

sleepwalkers
Dec 7, 2008




appleís BTO upgrade prices have always been pretty wild and have almost never been comparable to what parts are available for at retail, fwiw.

AlternateAccount
Apr 25, 2005
FYGM

LionArcher posted:

Magic keyboards changed the travel distance very slightly/size of keys. They are not bad (unlike the butterfly keys) but they aren't nearly as good as the older model. Weirdly enough, I think the magic keyboards on the new laptops are as good as the older laptops. But for an external board, the older ones I think feel just slightly better.

Interesting. I switched to the wireless a long time ago and now I canít remember.

And I have a uhhh Ducky Shine 7 with Cherry Red Silents on it and use that at home. Like it a bunch.

FuturePastNow
May 19, 2014




sleepwalkers posted:

appleís BTO upgrade prices have always been pretty wild and have almost never been comparable to what parts are available for at retail, fwiw.

Yeah, upgrading the RAM and storage in a Mac has always cost a pretty penny direct from Apple. Of course, back in the day it was easy to upgrade those things yourself. External storage is still easy, and probably fast enough, for anything that has Thunderbolt or USB-C.

shrike82
Jun 11, 2005



Got the M1 MBA and am loving it for the most part except watching Twitch videos on Safari still kills battery life where Iím getting a 5-hour runtime from 100% charge just watching a Twitch stream from

jokes
Dec 20, 2012
jokes




I was using my M1 MBA for work last week and didn't charge it from Wednesday morning until Friday evening when it flashed a <20% battery alert. Granted, I wasn't using it constantly from 9-5 but still pretty cool poo poo hot hot hot tight tight tight

Residency Evil
Jul 28, 2003

4/5 godo BRAINS


MY WIFE closed my 4 year old MBP's screen on a tiny pebble a year or so back and the hinge/screen is finally dying. When I bought it, I configured it with 16 gigs of memory. I don't edit photos, videos, etc, and I primarily use my laptop for typical office tasks/surfing the internet. Should I:

1. Just get a MBA now.
2. Try to hold out for the new MBPs to come out.

Separate question: Do I need/want 16 gigs of ram again, especially we're 4 years down the road?

njsykora
Jan 23, 2012

Robots confuse squirrels.

You will almost certainly be just fine with an Air if youíre just doing basic office stuff.

Binary Badger
Oct 11, 2005

Trolling Link for a decade




Only reason to wait is if you absolutely need a 16 inch screen and a Mx in your portable..

Edit: and possibly more than 16 GB of RAM..

Binary Badger fucked around with this message at 17:06 on May 4, 2021

Crunchy Black
Oct 24, 2017

CASTOR: Uh, it was all fine and you don't remember?
VINDMAN: No, it was bad and I do remember.




If you have reason to upgrade, the m1 macs are pretty much the best value in computing ever, even in current form.

Martytoof
Feb 25, 2003







Ahhh! FFS! M1 only supports ONE external display? This rots, I just hopped into the office to do some training and was wondering why my flanking monitors wouldnít both work

Was going to do training lab guide on one fullscreen monitor, Teams video/presentation on the other, and the actual lab activities on my actual MBP LCD

Feels like very much a ďfirst world problemĒ to complain about it but

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Excuse me, pardon me, sheer perfection coming through


Martytoof posted:

Ahhh! FFS! M1 only supports ONE external display? This rots, I just hopped into the office to do some training and was wondering why my flanking monitors wouldnít both work

Was going to do training lab guide on one fullscreen monitor, Teams video/presentation on the other, and the actual lab activities on my actual MBP LCD

Feels like very much a ďfirst world problemĒ to complain about it but

in the meantime since you're not doing anything high speed you can maybe do a displaylink usb connection to drive another monitor

Residency Evil
Jul 28, 2003

4/5 godo BRAINS


Crunchy Black posted:

If you have reason to upgrade, the m1 macs are pretty much the best value in computing ever, even in current form.

njsykora posted:

You will almost certainly be just fine with an Air if youíre just doing basic office stuff.


Binary Badger posted:

Only reason to wait is if you absolutely need a 16 inch screen and a Mx in your portable..

Thanks guys. 14" screen as well, right? Maybe at least worth waiting to see if they get released at WWDC?

Martytoof
Feb 25, 2003







mediaphage posted:

in the meantime since you're not doing anything high speed you can maybe do a displaylink usb connection to drive another monitor

Hmm thatís not an awful idea but ultimately I think I might just need to adjust my workflow. I have two iPads handy so Iíll just move my documentation offline

Bob Socko
Feb 20, 2001



I'm debating whether or not to upgrade my 2017 27" iMac now while I can still get an Intel processor, or waiting for the refresh later this year. What's gaming like on the M1 Macs? I don't play anything too crazy, but I do play Eve (which can get graphically intensive in big fights) and I occasionally fire up Steam to play old games. I don't need maxed out settings and a frame rate of a gazillion, but I would like to play games from time to time.

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007




Grimey Drawer

Bob Socko posted:

I'm debating whether or not to upgrade my 2017 27" iMac now while I can still get an Intel processor, or waiting for the refresh later this year. What's gaming like on the M1 Macs? I don't play anything too crazy, but I do play Eve (which can get graphically intensive in big fights) and I occasionally fire up Steam to play old games. I don't need maxed out settings and a frame rate of a gazillion, but I would like to play games from time to time.

The M1 games way better unless you have a dedicated GPU and even then it might beat one from 2017.

Seriously itís real good.

Iíve been real surprised at what can run on this thing.

Bob Socko
Feb 20, 2001



MarcusSA posted:

The M1 games way better unless you have a dedicated GPU and even then it might beat one from 2017.

Seriously itís real good.

Iíve been real surprised at what can run on this thing.

Good to know, thank you!

Binary Badger
Oct 11, 2005

Trolling Link for a decade




Just in case you need some concrete proof:

https://www.techradar.com/news/apples-m1-chip-can-apparently-outperform-some-amd-and-nvidia-graphics-cards

Your Retina 5K 2017 iMac 27" has a Radeon 570 Pro GPU, which is slightly better than the RX 560 used in the benchmark tests..

So, at the very least, and depending on whether the game is Metal / OpenGL or not, your games shouldn't run any slower..

But be advised that even with the 24" M1 iMac, your maximum RAM is only going to be 16 GB... if you want to hold out for something that should take more RAM, then you should wait for WWDC..

Bob Socko
Feb 20, 2001



Binary Badger posted:

Just in case you need some concrete proof:

https://www.techradar.com/news/apples-m1-chip-can-apparently-outperform-some-amd-and-nvidia-graphics-cards

Your Retina 5K 2017 iMac 27" has a Radeon 570 Pro GPU, which is slightly better than the RX 560 used in the benchmark tests..

So, at the very least, and depending on whether the game is Metal / OpenGL or not, your games shouldn't run any slower..

But be advised that even with the 24" M1 iMac, your maximum RAM is only going to be 16 GB... if you want to hold out for something that should take more RAM, then you should wait for WWDC..

This is good info, thank you. To clarify, I'd either wait for the 27" replacement (which presumably would have more ram, maybe a M1x or M2 chip or whatever) ~or~ I'd buy a high-end 27" now. The 24" iMac is pretty, but for my use case, it's a lateral move at best.

njsykora
Jan 23, 2012

Robots confuse squirrels.

That post actually got me to install Steam on my MBA and I'm honestly kinda shocked how much of my game library was still there when I filtered by MacOS compatibility. Then Dirt 4 ran just fine, legit has me considering replacing my PC (where all I do gaming wise these days is League) with an iMac once the M1x/M2 starts to appear.

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007




Grimey Drawer

njsykora posted:

That post actually got me to install Steam on my MBA and I'm honestly kinda shocked how much of my game library was still there when I filtered by MacOS compatibility. Then Dirt 4 ran just fine, legit has me considering replacing my PC (where all I do gaming wise these days is League) with an iMac once the M1x/M2 starts to appear.

Fwiw some games will say they arenít compatible but they actually are.

Itís kinda a trial and error thing.

Thanks Ants
May 21, 2004

#essereFerrari


I'm going to hold out for multi display support, maybe we'll even get MST

Binary Badger
Oct 11, 2005

Trolling Link for a decade




If it were me, I'd just wait until WWDC, unless you believe in the 'Never Trust A First Generation Hardware Revision From Apple' trope.

I've worked with a lot of Retina 5K iMacs.. I know they can still get overheated, but I've also installed a lot of the current gen iMacs which have the 10th gen Comet Lake CPUs, and that new CPU seems to go a long way towards making them less prone to thermal slowdowns.. and if you can afford the highest end GPU, the 5700 XT with 16 GB of VRAM, that's going to make for a killer gaming Mac..

BUT, also consider this.. an Apple Silicon based high end iMac is going to be unlikely to have USB-A ports.. yes the M1 Mini does, but the M1 iMac does not. And if the low end iMac was produced without any USB-A slots I feel it's unlikely the higher end is gonna have them either. If you have a lot of USB controllers / periphs they're all gonna need a T-bolt dock..

BUT BUT on the other hand, the next iMac will likely have the vaunted M2 / M1X / Racer X / whatever Apple Silicon chip, which will have a 12/16/32-core Apple GPU, of which the current 8-core version GPU (which is an SOC and not a discrete card like the Radeon 560 it comparatively benches with) already makes the current M1 batch competitive with low-end discrete GPUs, there is the potential to have faster graphics than the best PCs period.. but we're gonna have to see about that..


Binary Badger fucked around with this message at 20:19 on May 4, 2021

Crunchy Black
Oct 24, 2017

CASTOR: Uh, it was all fine and you don't remember?
VINDMAN: No, it was bad and I do remember.




A fair and good thing to point out, BB, but I'll play devil's advocate and ask why you *wouldn't* get a TB dock, Caldigit, Totu or even smaller if you wish, if you were a serious power user trying to use a M1 iMac

hatty
Feb 28, 2011



Pork Pro

Dongle life is evolving into Dongle society

njsykora
Jan 23, 2012

Robots confuse squirrels.

I'd also say in my experimenting today I've had no issues using my wireless controller than Windows consistently refuses to ever acknowledge. Though yeah if you're trying to use an iMac as a gaming PC you're probably factoring a USB hub into the cost anyway.

Now I need to get a hub like that or at least a dongle to see how the Macbook handles sim racing stuff.

Binary Badger
Oct 11, 2005

Trolling Link for a decade




Crunchy Black posted:

A fair and good thing to point out, BB, but I'll play devil's advocate and ask why you *wouldn't* get a TB dock, Caldigit, Totu or even smaller if you wish, if you were a serious power user trying to use a M1 iMac

Mmmmm, I guess if I was a serious power user I wouldn't buy the 24-inch M1 iMac and wait for the 27/30-inch that's likely to come along?

But if it were bought for me and I couldn't do anything about it, yeah, I'd likely demand a Caldigit / Kensington TB dock.

BobHoward
Feb 13, 2012

The only thing white people deserve is a bullet to their empty skull


MarcusSA posted:

Fwiw some games will say they arenít compatible but they actually are.

Itís kinda a trial and error thing.

This affects Intel Macs too. Intel apps can be compiled as 32-bit only, 64-bit only, or a fat binary with 32- and 64-bit support rolled into one. The Steam store's database seems to have an issue where some 32/64 fat intel binaries get reported as 32-bit only, presumably because their checking system isn't smart and just checks for 32-bit support. This results in Steam claiming it's a 32-bit game which can't run on Catalina or Big Sur, even though it totally can.

I tried to report this bug in Valve's system to Valve through their bug reporter and got nothing but people who skimmed and got the superficial idea that there was a 32/64-bit problem, pasted in the standard form reply claiming I should contact the game's supplier to ask for 64-bit support, and closed the ticket.

loving steam.

Last Chance
Dec 31, 2004



WWDC is usually mostly software related, so be prepared for the possibility of no new Mac stuff until fall.

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007




Grimey Drawer

BobHoward posted:

This affects Intel Macs too. Intel apps can be compiled as 32-bit only, 64-bit only, or a fat binary with 32- and 64-bit support rolled into one. The Steam store's database seems to have an issue where some 32/64 fat intel binaries get reported as 32-bit only, presumably because their checking system isn't smart and just checks for 32-bit support. This results in Steam claiming it's a 32-bit game which can't run on Catalina or Big Sur, even though it totally can.

I tried to report this bug in Valve's system to Valve through their bug reporter and got nothing but people who skimmed and got the superficial idea that there was a 32/64-bit problem, pasted in the standard form reply claiming I should contact the game's supplier to ask for 64-bit support, and closed the ticket.

loving steam.

Yeah itís kinda frustrating. A lot of stuff works drat great on the M1 though which is refreshing!

FMguru
Sep 10, 2003

peed on;
sexually

Last Chance posted:

WWDC is usually mostly software related, so be prepared for the possibility of no new Mac stuff until fall.
They've rolled out "Pro" hardware at WWDC before. The retina MBP was announced at the 2012 WWDC, for instance.

e: Another example: that stopgap iMac Pro was announced at the 2017 WWDC.

FMguru fucked around with this message at 21:34 on May 4, 2021

njsykora
Jan 23, 2012

Robots confuse squirrels.

Yeah and since it's developer focused I assume if there's a new M chip coming they'll at least mention it at WWDC.

davidbix
Jun 14, 2016

Wow, Bix. First K.Rool, then Steve and now SEPHIROTH? Your dream game is real!


BobHoward posted:

... what? there is no $1799 stock model of the M1 Air or Pro, it's the GPU which is faster, and the RAM speed doesn't vary

I am confuse
Forgot to check back in this thread, but I was referring to Intel models with that part.

Custom speccing a 2020 Intel MBP base model's RAM and SSD up to 16 GB and 512 GB, respectively, will take you to a $1,799 retail price...but it will have a slower CPU and slower RAM than the stock $1,799 model of the 2020 Intel MBP. Which is why it's fairly common to see the former in the refurb store, I presume: People realize their mistake and exchange it for the stock $1,799 version.

japtor
Oct 28, 2005
WELL ARNT I JUST MR. LA DE FUCKEN DA. oh yea and i suck cocks too


mediaphage posted:

in the meantime since you're not doing anything high speed you can maybe do a displaylink usb connection to drive another monitor
Modern DisplayLink appears to be pretty good so not sure that caveat applies wholesale to it anymore.

Martytoof posted:

Hmm thatís not an awful idea but ultimately I think I might just need to adjust my workflow. I have two iPads handy so Iíll just move my documentation offline
...you could use one of them for Sidecar

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Excuse me, pardon me, sheer perfection coming through


japtor posted:

Modern DisplayLink appears to be pretty good so not sure that caveat applies wholesale to it anymore.

...you could use one of them for Sidecar

i mostly mean something like gaming.

imo itís been fine enough for almost everything else since usb 3.0

havenít tried 4k or higher video playback over one tho.

Crunchy Black
Oct 24, 2017

CASTOR: Uh, it was all fine and you don't remember?
VINDMAN: No, it was bad and I do remember.




One thing to bear in mind is that displaylink, for awhile, (they may have fixed this but I'm not brave enough to check) couldn't do single-window screen sharing over Zoom, it'd just display your whole monitor and/or would have a failure mode where it would only display your local display on MBPs which led to an embarrassing situation for me.

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Ok Comboomer
Oct 20, 2007



Crunchy Black posted:

One thing to bear in mind is that displaylink, for awhile, (they may have fixed this but I'm not brave enough to check) couldn't do single-window screen sharing over Zoom, it'd just display your whole monitor and/or would have a failure mode where it would only display your local display on MBPs which led to an embarrassing situation for me.

if you didnít want somebody to accidentally see those tabs in the zoom call then you probably shouldnít have had them open during a work meeting, just saying

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