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Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate
My employer's given me the opportunity to get either a base 13" Air or a base 13" Retina, to replace my worse-for-wear 5-year-old Pro. Processor speed and graphics capabilities won't matter to me - most modern chips will have enough punch for my work in Photoshop, doing web graphics, Office, music, movies, and web browsing. My only concern is being stuck with 4GB of RAM on the Air, while the Retina has 8GB in base trim. I cannot customise a build.

While I've had some hands-on time with both machines, I'd like some input from those who've owned them for a while.

Do the 13" Retina MBPs still suffer from burn-in/retention? I read about this a while ago, and it looks more like an actual concern rather than people sperging out over slight imperfections.
Does the Intel on-chip graphics solution struggle to render stuff on the Retina?
How wieldy, in terms of bulk and weight, is the Retina?
Which scaled resolution do you use on the Retina? Which is most/least comfortable or usable?
How warm does the Air get when really pushing it? (my current MBP sears my palms on warm days in a room without AC)
What have you found wanting in either machine, if you have one?

At the moment I'm leaning towards the Retina because I kinda do want something nice with an "ooh" factor. Practicality-wise, the Air wins: the usable resolution is the same as I have now, it's lighter, it's thinner, and it has slightly longer battery life.

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Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

My PIN is 4826 posted:

I'm getting psyched up to get an rMBP when they refresh, but the storage available on these really bugs me...

How do people live with a 128gb drive? Do you lug a thunderbolt drive around at all times? Confine all your music to iCloud? Am I exaggerating this issue? :ohdear:

Weighing in here. I got the 128GB rMBP in January. After using an older MBP with a 128GB SSD upgrade for about two years, it wasn't much to adapt to, but as time went on I found myself actively managing storage.

Once I'd get to about 20GB free space I'd start looking at what I can delete and what's not needed. OSX would eat up about 2 - 7GB for paging (verified by the fact that there was always a bunch more free space after a reboot). It was just annoying.

I didn't have games or any big software packages. Just Photoshop, MS Office, and a couple of smaller apps for random stuff. My iTunes library is about 20GB, and my iPhoto library is about another 20GB.

Last month I bought myself an OWC 240GB upgrade kit, and I honestly couldn't be happier. Aside from the speed boost (it's a faster drive) it's just really great not having to micromanage my storage anymore.

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

lelandjs posted:

So I bought a new base level MacBook Pro last night. I immediately upgraded it to Yosemite, and it's working and looking great (though the switch to Helvetic Neue and the transparancies make it look very close to Linux Mint's default theme, which is... interesting).

When I use a laptop on my desk, I like to use a mouse. I was using a Microsoft Sculpt Comfort mouse with my old laptop; it works pretty well with OS X, but there's a side button/gesture area that I was hoping to use with Mission Control and Spaces. Unfortunately, Microsoft doesn't support the mouse on OS X.

So I went into storage and dug out my old wired Apple Mouse--the one with the scroll ball and squeeze gesture (hey, I really want to be able to use Mission Control with a mouse!). Unfortunately, when I go into System Preferences, the changes I make don't actually seem to take effect.

Is anyone else still using their old wired Apple Mouse with Yosemite that can confirm that changing the button assignments doesn't work?

Get BetterTouchTool and it'll let you assign functions to those buttons on your Microsoft mouse.

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

lelandjs posted:

No dice, BTT doesn't see the button on the side. On the other hand, I remembered that Hot Corners are a thing and I'm using that now.

Oh :(

I only recommended it because that's what I use for my Microsoft mouse.

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

Panic Restaurant posted:

Alright, so, my fiance is in desperate need of a new laptop (her 2010 MacBook technically works, but she has to use an external keyboard and she's running out of space on her hard drive) and can't decide wtf to do. She wants a retina screen, so the Air is out. She thinks the rMB is pretty but overpriced and the single port thing is weird, so she doesn't think she wants that, either. Which leaves her with the rMBP. The predicament, of course, is that she isn't sure if she should wait for the updated version or not. The rumors seem to indicate that the machine is getting a major overhaul, but she generally doesn't like being an early adopter out of fear of the kinks not being entirely worked out. If she buys the current 13" rMBP and gets the best version of it (maxes out on RAM, gets the best processor, etc), how future-proofed will it be? How many years can she expect to get out of it? How dramatic of an improvement are the new processors in the future rMBP expected to be over the processor that's currently being used?

I should also note that she's stubborn and would never buy used and would never sell her laptop, so buying used/just buying the current rMBP and then selling it when Apple releases a new version isn't really an option, sadly. She's going to be stuck with whatever she buys for a long time.

Oh, and she mostly just uses her laptop to go online, listen to music, and edit photos.

Any help is appreciated, thanks!

For that use case the rMBP will more than suffice. I've had mine for closing on four years and it's still fine. I use many components in the Adobe Creative Cloud suite, run Microsoft Office, and do all the usual light lifting as well. I am aware of where it needs improvement, but that'll mostly be taken care of by the faster chips in the latest ones.

If she needs a computer now then that's what she should buy. No point waiting for the new one if she will only consider next year's model anyway.

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

brap posted:

Is there a faster standard than 802.11ac now? Wouldn’t your internet service have to be very very good to benefit from it?

802.11ax is the new hotness but you're right in that you'd need faster internet to really saturate it. One of the Asus routers designed to support it and has a maximum ~theoretical~ output of nearly 6Gbps.

IMO the pursuit of ultimate speed for home WiFi is futile because most appliances rarely saturate it. Most use cases only need a sustained connection speed of 10-50Mbps, which you'll get out of ac. I'd rather have a router that genuinely provided ~80Mbps speeds throughout my house, to multiple devices. (But basically wireless is some voodoo poo poo. My router in the next room is 15ft away and I can only get 20Mbps network speeds, which translates to about 12Mbps in the real world)

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

jokes posted:

I'm picturing a number of apple employees in those garish t-shirts cackling around a cauldron, stirring a mac mini, a usb-c port, and a touchbar together to form a mac mini with Just One Port.

And for $169 you can buy a breakout box that gives you three Thunderbolt 3 ports, FaceID notch, and an HDMI port, but no regular USB ports, headphone jack, or SD card reader. It’ll be introduced in a 2-minute Jony Ive design film where he waxes lyrical about the most beautiful dongle in the world.

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate
I’m in Europe but a colleague in the US has offered to play courier if I send gear to his address.

Against the wishes of the zeitgeist ITT, I’m looking to pick up a 2018 13” MBP. I narrowly missed the $100-off deal at BHPhoto last week, so hoping something pops up before the 10th of March.

Aside from BHPhoto and Adorama, which other online shops don’t charge sales tax (shipping to VA)?

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

FCKGW posted:

Which model were you looking at? Best Buy has $100-$150 off some 13” right now.

Also B&H is starting to collect sales taxes in most states due to a recent Supreme Court ruling.


Proteus Jones posted:

Yeah, the tax-dodge of ordering online is coming to an end.

I'd also recommend the refurb section on Apple's website.

I got a really good deal on 2018 13" (quad i7, 512 GB SSD, 16GB) at around $200 off retail. It also comes with the same warranty as new.

Ah crap. I'd read about that but thought it was a few months away from being enforced.
Looking at a 13" i5 16/512. Trying to keep total spend under EUR 2000, but my rubber arm could be twisted for a good enough deal.

Will look at BB and the refurb store - thanks.

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

FCKGW posted:

Which model were you looking at? Best Buy has $100-$150 off some 13” right now.

Also B&H is starting to collect sales taxes in most states due to a recent Supreme Court ruling.


Proteus Jones posted:

Yeah, the tax-dodge of ordering online is coming to an end.

I'd also recommend the refurb section on Apple's website.

I got a really good deal on 2018 13" (quad i7, 512 GB SSD, 16GB) at around $200 off retail. It also comes with the same warranty as new.

Update: Adorama did not charge me tax to deliver to our office in VA. $2374 for a 2018 13” (i7/16/512).
Bizarrely, the space gray option was more expensive than the silver (which I ended up going for).

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

Proteus Jones posted:

If that's new in box, that's not a bad price.

Yeah it’s new.
Looking forward to returning to a macOS workflow, now.

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

MarcusSA posted:

Isn’t an eGPU enclosure like $400 by it self?

Between $200 and $300 for an entry-level one. The Razer Core X ($300) is recommended.

I only know this because I’m researching the viability of using a Thunderbolt eGPU with either my work-supplied XPS13 or my MBP13, for Solidworks Visualize. Because somehow a €1000 rendering solution will be an easier pitch to management than a €4000 workstation with dual Quadros.

Visualize only works with NVIDIA GPUs though, and their driver support for macOS is awful, so lol at even trying to game with it outside of Windows.

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

Gay Retard posted:


I've been messing with a RX580 eGPU that I think I'm going to return, but I couldn't imagine dealing with the lack of Nvidia support on top of the other eGPU crap you have to deal with.

Apple really needs to release Nvidia drivers and better eGPU drivers for Boot Camp. Admittedly, they've done a good job improving general eGPU support over the past year.

The Blackmagic one?
Speaking of: It’s so frustrating that the Blackmagic eGPU range is incredibly Apple-esque in execution. Great design, functionality, and feature set, hamstrung by previous-gen hardware that you can’t upgrade, all for a premium price. But hey, it Just Works™

I’ll do a few more days of research before doing the needful. If I go the eGPU route I’ll blaze the trail for future posters.

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

Mark Larson posted:

Are a eGPU with a weak Radeon RX and a workstation with dual Quadros even comparable? Not to mention the CPU difference, plus you'd need the same peripherals either way. If you need the firepower of the Quadros it should be an easy sell in terms of time you'd save waiting for renders to complete :shrug:

I know that I'd much prefer a desktop workstation for compute-intensive stuff. An XPS 13 with a janky eGPU is in no way comparable, not to mention it'd cost more. You can build a good workstation with an 8-core CPU and a Nvidia graphics card for $1000.

Yes, you're right that a dedicated, dual-GPU workstation would be better than an eGPU.

Long story short: I'm the communications manager at our company, and occasionally I need to get some rendered images of our products. Presently, renders are only created by a colleague at another office. He is moving into a new role. I'm hands-on, so I don't mind learning the process and doing the renders myself. It is not critical for me to do this, however there would be enormous benefits to my personal productivity if I did it myself. I'll present the realistic options to the beancounters and they can decide based on cost and my motivation.

In terms of a solution: currently, Visualize only has accelerated rendering for CUDA cores, so no computer I currently have access to will render other than with a CPU. Practically, I only need to be able to render. Waiting an hour or 12 wouldn't matter, waiting multiple days would. I was just musing out loud on the eGPU, since I was toying with the idea of buying one for myself. I should've added a :v: at the end of that sentence.

Hello Spaceman fucked around with this message at 13:30 on Feb 27, 2019

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate
F keys return but there's a new full-width spacebar that is now the Touch Bar. Also it's 3D touch and doesn't actually have mechanical action.

Also, a recess in the trackpad to accommodate the camera bump from the display. It was that or a notch.

Hello Spaceman fucked around with this message at 13:35 on Nov 12, 2019

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

Empress Brosephine posted:

Am I dumb for being the refresh 13 macbook pro Intel a few months ago instead of waiting for this

unless you could didn't need a new computer and had a crystal ball with yesterday's news, then no you are not dumb for buying a computer.

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate
adobe is so loving awful, truly the general motors of software

the new face manipulation tools in photoshop seem cool until you realise it takes 10-15 seconds to do the calculations iN tHe cLoUd, while snapchat and instagram do virtually the same in realtime on a loving phone

do the adobe dev tools run in flash or???

Coffee Jones posted:

You’d have to catch the keynote but I think Adobe was promising a port then. I remember Wolfram Mathematica but that runs on everything from Alpha to 68k
https://youtu.be/kcfGsOKXO5M

If it’s the software from oss stuff like homebrew I’d expect it’s already very portable, just needs to be recompiled for the new hardware.

Java JVM is forthcoming.
https://appleinsider.com/articles/20/09/22/microsoft-contributes-to-java-port-for-apple-silicon-macs

Your typical electron apps will port over without changes as soon as there’s a chromium version out.




if they’re continuing with the SOC where the ram is going to be part of the package I’d expect them to go with denser DDR5 before the it’s available for PC
https://www.theverge.com/circuitbreaker/2020/10/7/21506883/ddr5-ram-memory-first-modules-sk-hynix

So if it’s my money, I’m holding off on a purchase.


i wonder if the 16gb ram limitation for the m1 macs is a repeat of the limitation where apple only offered macbooks with up to 16gb because the intel chipsets didn't support low power ddr ram?
in which case, what you are suggesting would fit with the design choice, since apple would be all about low-power components to bolster their battery life and efficiency goals

or it is just an architecture limitation, but hopefully a resident silicon wizard can provide some insight

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

Fame Douglas posted:

Running faster than what. If its compared to their previous Intel machines with old Intel CPUs, that not that hard to believe.

the list of systems used for comparative benchmarks is listed on the apple website

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

shrike82 posted:

what's the status of running iOS apps on macs?

afaik they will run as is on an apple silicon mac

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

Threadkiller Dog posted:

Guessing they need to put push a looot of juice into the core to get it to 3.8 (?) ghz. Could it be that even single core it might not be practical to sustain that for more than a short burst with any [reasonable] cooling solution?

the gb screenshots show the m1 at 3.2ghz
max power consumption is the same as outgoing intel chips, with tons of efficiency wizardry to get longer battery life

the mba has a tdp of 10w and with passive cooling will just throttle and reduce performance sooner if you're doing stuff like rendering 4k video for hours. the mbp and mini have active cooling so can chug away on more demanding stuff for longer, thus guarantee consistent performance.


stevewm posted:

They've made 2 attempts...

The first one was known as "Windows RT". Based on Windows 8, it was locked to applications digitally signed by MS and had zero ability to run x86 code. Only apps from the then new Microsoft Store could be run. It was a complete market failure, mostly due to the locked down nature of of it, which is very un-Windows like. I think there was also some consumer confusion thrown in, because it looked like Windows, but couldn't run most Windows apps.

The second attempt is Windows 10 compiled for ARM. It is not locked down or restricted like RT was. You can run any app, and it has the ability to execute 32-bit x86 code via an emulation layer. (but not 64-bit yet) So far it hasn't been a big success though. The only hardware available right now is the relatively expensive Surface Pro X. Developers haven't really taken to making ARM native Windows apps yet. x86 emulation is quite slow... I seen it likened to using a PC with a older Intel ATOM processor.

yep. apple's probably been teeing this up for years, probably as far back as 2009 when os x 10.6 introduced grand central dispatch and more recently with metal, both unified libraries to help manage compute power.
microsoft is just dumb to not have thought of a gradual introduction or convergence of platforms. they rushed out something to say "hey look at this thing we made", while apple's ethos is "here's how you can use this thing we made". it helps that apple also insists on owning the value chain - not just for financial reasons but also to control the end result of its products and user experience.

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

jokes posted:

I’m weirdly excited about a Mac that can run iOS apps. There are a lot of apps that just aren’t as good on desktop that are great on mobile. Having a little window on the left of your screen that’s running Instagram or something would be nice.

*cries in ipad*

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate
guys we found the real power user

wsj reviewer posted:

I finally got the new MacBook Pro’s fan to kick on, with a temperature of 98 degrees, when playing “Rise of Tomb Raider” while simultaneously exporting a 4K video in Adobe Premiere and running some Chrome tabs in the background.

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate
anybody who games enough to care about frames per second either has a dedicated gaming pc or a videogame console.
the idea of gaming on a mac is like solitaire on windows 95 office computers: a nice distraction but not really the point of its existence.

i am excited about the future of AS from a compute point of view, but dont give a flying toaster gently caress about running wow or any other emulated garbage to prove how capable my computer is.

it is likely the only reason apple included the gaming demo in the AS keynote was to showcase the combined capabilities of rosetta and AS, using an accessible metric. charts about video transcode times only get you so far, but "runs this emulated videogame faster than windows" is a great soundbite for the clickbait generation.

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

spunkshui posted:

I think this is hype that may not be fully justified I mean it’s very likely that this thing is only going to run wow at 20 to 15 FPS when you actually put it into a situation people play the actual game in.

There’s like 10 different starting areas you can pick that one is absolutely the most simple because it’s on a boat.

Why didn’t this person choose a different starting area or just load up their main account.

Even if they don’t own the game they should be allowed to play up to level 20 and leave the starting area.

I’m pretty sus.

new thread title mods

Mac Hardware - WoW. WoW. WoW.

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate
i would love it so much if the Mx nomenclature incremented in line with the number of external monitors that are supported

nerds would lose their poo poo when the M5 is shipped in the maxbook touch 12 pro macs

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

SourKraut posted:

This made me curious, since I have a 2014 15" rMBP 16/512 that I'd be willing to trade in, and it looks like Apple would offer $490. That just seems... low?

lol try €350 for my late '18 mbp13 with i7/16gb/512gb

ill stay with my dinosaur tech a while longer thx apple

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

Yeast posted:

Capture One seems to run ok, I've had Rosetta Photoshop hard crash a couple times.

The Air rendering out 600 TIFF files and there be no fan noise while expected is still delightful to actually experience.

was messing around in lightroom and c1 last night and heard my mbp13 fans over the music playing on my homepod

what was performance like relative to your previous setup?

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

Data Graham posted:

Bring back the rainbow logo

it never left



(slickwraps retro wrap)

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate
for all those people who want m1 macs but cant live without simultaneously watching all six seasons of anime star trek death porn 9, here is a possible solution

https://9to5mac.com/2020/11/24/m1-mac-external-display-workaround/

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate
i like the bong but dont reboot my mbp enough to hear it :(

on the other hand if the dell laptops i support played a chime on boot i would have ptsd

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

Data Graham posted:

Back in my day computer speeds would double every six months so nobody bothered buying computers

the only way to win is to not play at all

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

MrBond posted:

Buy AAPL stock and then get a dell xps so you can troll about how profitable apple fanboys are

You earn internet bonus points if you switch to linux and write a medium post about why you're quitting macos

i hope i never care about a computer this much

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

Nitrousoxide posted:

The ram being physically on the die DOES reduce the need somewhat. Being physically close to the places that need the stored data means that it takes less time to retrieve data onboard there, less powerful hardware is needed to successfully transmit the data to the ram for storage due to electrical losses from transmission distance. Less transmission time means slightly less of a ram buffer is needed to store pending calculation data.

Also, if designed for it, the fact that the GPU and CPU can call on the same pool of ram for the relevant data rather than having separate copies stored locally does mean that the overall system cpu + gpu ram needed would be lessened.

That said, I'm not at all confident that this reduction altogether reduces the need in a meaningful way to the end-user. I'm sure there is a real reduction but it's probably not much.

MacOS just, in general, being more aggressive in throwing older applications and data into the swap than windows is probably does a lot more than any physical proximity of the ram does to reducing the utilization.

i wonder if this memory on package architecture boosts the effectiveness of the memory compression introduced in mavericks. or if that tech was designed with this in mind (or allowed this to be a hardware optimisation)

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

Totally Huge posted:

Keep whichever one suits you best now. It doesn’t really sound like resale value is THAT critical to you, so why think a year out.

I have the same 16” MBP and ordered a 16GB/1TB M1 MBA. I plan to keep both and will mostly use the MBP as a desktop replacement because my ancient 10 year old Mac Mini does not cut it anymore. I work with VMs a fair amount and until I can easily spin up a Linux VM on the M1 I will continue using it - and likely well beyond that. It is a great laptop - although huge and loud and hot (and with horrible battery life).

The M1 will become my couch/lug around daily/travel laptop (after COVID), replacing an old 13” XPS running Linux. Linux still sucks as a desktop OS so that’ll be nice. The battery life and fan-less operation are both something I really look forward to.

dang this was supposed to be the year of Linux on the desktop but i guess they cancelled that due to the pandemic what a shame

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

redeyes posted:

USB 4.0 is gonna replace TB right?

lmao no it gets worse

https://9to5mac.com/2020/07/08/thunderbolt-4/

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

Bob Morales posted:

Background: I have the Apple USB Ethernet adapter and a A to C adapter, but I want to free that up. I also have the Apple TB Ethernet adapter and TB2-3 adapter, but I’m trying to use the hub on my USB-C adapter which of course doesn’t support TB.

I only have two TB ports on my MacBook so I want to keep the other free for external drives.

anker makes a hub with power delivery pass through and all the ports you need for like 40 bucks

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

mik posted:

That's a tiny rear end phone in their schematic.

Obviously you're not going to be charging the watch or phone while using the laptop, and I tend to shut mine when I'm not using it (mostly because of flying debris from kids).

I have two problems immediately on my wife's M1 Air, and my 16" isn't much better since the trackpad is proportionally larger.



plot twist: iphone becomes the trackpad while its charging

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

Binary Badger posted:

https://twitter.com/CBSThisMorning/status/1348995317958660097

Big announcement by Tim on CBS This Morning tomorrow.. supposedly not a new product

Gayle King said:


What could it be?

Bigger iPad Pro? New iPhone? Return of the Apple //?!

well since those are all new products and they said twice they're not announcing a new product, im going with apple car announcement

but foreal, given the current climate im leaning towards a global social initiative or shifting their manufacturing out of china idk

Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate
i really struggle to grasp what possible the benefit would be of 120hz in non-gaming applications

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Hello Spaceman
Jan 18, 2005

hop, skip, and jumpgate

look at this vr sex haver

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