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Fatkraken
Jun 23, 2005

Fun-time is over.

thuvia posted:

As evidenced above, people are going to patronize you and say that you'll change your mind when you get older (because obviously you can't know your own mind until you hit some magical age) or that all you need to do is start hanging around other people's children. People can be really lovely when they don't think you're living the life they approve of. I've come to realize that a lot of it is out of jealousy. You'll be able to do things with your life that they cannot because you don't have kids and they do. Misery loves company and all that.

I don't think it's patronising to say you might or might not change, especially coming from someone who felt the same then changed their mind. It's not a question of knowing your own mind, it's a question of knowing the mind of the person you will become ten, twenty or thirty years in the future. None of us know that. We probably have a good idea of it, but if we knew for certain there would be no divorce or unhappy relationships ever. There are studies of voluntarily sterilized women, and the younger they got the procedure the more likely they were to come back and ask for a reversal or express regret later in life. To be fair though, unless you express strong interest in actually getting permanent surgery, it's none of anyone's drat business and they should keep their mouths shut and their opinions to themselves unless specifically asked.

Saying you WILL change or SHOULD change is definitely patronizing, and saying you should stay with someone who feels differently just in case you change isn't fair on either of you.

OP, not wanting kids of your own is totally fine and normal and you shouldn't have to defend it. But a deep seated seemingly pathological HATRED of children could point to some deeper issues, especially if it's been with you since childhood (you suggested your mum get an abortion when you found out she was pregnant, that strikes me as kinda crazy even though you can't be blamed for how you acted as a kid). It would probably be worth exploring in therapy, not with a view to changing your mind on wanting your OWN kids (as I said that's a perfectly reasonable opinion) but to understanding yourself and hopefully making it easier to interact with friends who have kids, as people around you are likely to start doing.

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Fatkraken
Jun 23, 2005

Fun-time is over.

HelloIAmYourHeart posted:

Hey OP I hope you're on birth control! May I suggest an IUD? They're as effective than surgical sterilization, and your boyfriend won't be able to sabotage when he decides you need a kid anyway, because he won't even listen to your thoughts now.

Many women who have never been pregnant can't use an IUD, it can be extremely painful, and they can cause heavier bleeding and menstrual cramps. Also I know that at least the older models aren't perfect (ask me why I have TWO brothers...) and if you do get pregnant with one it can cause complications. Certainly look into them, but don't be surprised if it doesn't work out, and always combine with an appropriate barrier method.

Fatkraken
Jun 23, 2005

Fun-time is over.

Mradyfist posted:

You apparently didn't read, she said condoms and the rhythm method.

Condoms have a fairly high rate of failure (2% with perfect use, 15% typical), as does the rhythm method (5-9% with perfect use, 25% with typical use). Combining them helps but the failure rate is still relatively high compared to hormonal contraception, IUDs and surgical sterilization, especially if these are also combined with condoms. Rhythm method also means there are windows up up to 2 weeks where the couple aren't allowed to have sex, which could cause problems in a relationship.

Fatkraken
Jun 23, 2005

Fun-time is over.

malefactor posted:

So just condoms then.

The rhythm method is about as good as the pullout method / hope to not get pregnant method.

edit: Unless you are leaving a massive 2 week window of no sex every month.

If it's used religiously (which does involve extended periods of celibacy, or at least buttsex/oral only), failure rate is around 5-9%. Pull out is actually BETTER when used perfectly, at 4%. However for both, "typical" use has almost the exact same failure rate of about 25%. I presume that for both, typical use involves at least occasionally just loving and letting God sort it out (ie, failing to abide by fertile days or miscalculating for rhythm, failing to pull out before coming for pull out)

Fatkraken
Jun 23, 2005

Fun-time is over.

Harry posted:

The post was pretty weird, but it's really absurd to argue that your opinions of things won't change from when you're 23 to basically any later age.

Exactly, if no one ever changed, there would be no divorce. Saying that at 23 you can accurately predict how you will feel in 25 years, when you have been an adult for 1/5 of that, is a little silly. Sure you MIGHT be right, but the posters in this thread saying "I hated kids and didn't want them, now I'm pregnant and couldn't be happier" are proof that you might not be.

Again, it's pretty rude to say this IRL unless someone is making an irreversible decision that you think they may regret, but this is a thread where advice was solicited, so drawing on personal experience of the exact same situation is fair game.

Fatkraken
Jun 23, 2005

Fun-time is over.

opie posted:

Really I don't even see why anyone cares if an 18 or 23 year old might change their mind. If they do, so what? Too bad, guess they'll have to adopt. Probably not the worst thing ever. And it affects my life in absolutely no way. Maybe they won't be so bitter about kids and we'll see less whining about how nasty and vomit-inducing they are.

Because doctors don't want to gently caress up peoples lives? "Too bad, I guess they'll have to adopt" can in fact translate into years of misery and failed attempts to reverse surgical procedures. Not everyone wants to adopt (lets not get into the whole "people who want their own kids are inhuman monsters!" that you sometimes see on SA), not everyone CAN adopt. Sterilizing someone is an active procedure that a doctor DOES, and knowing that the thing you are doing may result in unhappiness isn't something a doctor will necessarily want to do.

13-24% of tubal ligation patients later express regret or seek reversal. That's a BIG "failure" rate of the procedure if success is judged as "does this make the woman's life better?". And it is structured by age: up to 40% for under 25s, 6% for over 30s. Some of this is due to medical side effects, but a portion relates to the later desire to have children. And I know that many ligations are carried out under different circumstances than the ones discussed here (often women with children who feel they have enough), but regret is still pertinent to discussion. It's understandable that a doctor does not want to perform a procedure that has a good chance of being later regretted.

Fatkraken
Jun 23, 2005

Fun-time is over.

EmeraldFlashlight posted:

I hereby declare every 18-23 year old's feelings and opinions about EVERYTHING to be invalid.

E/N does this all the time, and is usually right.

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Fatkraken
Jun 23, 2005

Fun-time is over.

Fluffy Bunnies posted:

It pretty much depends on your own personal chemistry. BC fucks me over no matter what I'm on, though.

Dog person here, never having kids because my genetics are poo poo and I'd currently make an awful parent. Who knows. I might adopt some day but I'm not having any of my own. I've been reading the thread as it goes along and if you want sterilized, you should be able to be sterilized. Would've saved me years of not being able to go places or do things during my cycle. I mean, SA fixed it (if you're a girl and you haven't looked at the cup thread in A/T, you really should. It's here: http://forums.somethingawful.com/sh...hreadid=3365134 ) but I'd still rather have those years back. I begged for sterilization thinking it was the only way to make it better. I'm 25 in a couple of months and I wouldn't have cried about not being able to have kids for the past 7 years at any point because I've always known my genetics were awful and poo poo, I don't wanna do that to some kid.

I don't think surgical sterilization helps with periods if that's what you're suggesting. They don't remove the ovaries so the hormonal cycle still goes on as normal, menstruation is not usually affected (in rare cases it can get WORSE). Ovary removal is a really bad idea in most cases outside of stuff like cancer since a lack of Estrogen is so strongly related to osteoperosis as well as a bunch of other serious issues. I guess you could have a hysterectomy without ovary removal, but that itself has a lot of risks

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