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Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
I'm wondering about the supposed change since 1.0 that breaks monster spawn towers. Forgive me if it's common knowledge here. I see some unsourced rumors on the Wiki about mobs freezing if they're 32 blocks away, but not much else. If true, that would indeed totally render most of any mob tower useless -- besides a narrow 8 block strip away from the player where mobs can both spawn and move.

Has anyone in here observed any actual evidence of mobs staying in place when far away?

If so, how does it work? The Wiki fails to mention how the distance measure is taken. If it's just a plain "is x > 32 or y > 32", that would dictate mob towers shaped like 8-blocks-thin lines. On the other hand, if it's taken on x and y dimensions only (like a lot of things, since many calculations are done chunk by chunk) then that would dictate a mob tower shaped like a thin cylindric shell. Or if it's taken on all three dimensions, that would dictate towers shaped like pieces of thin spherical shells or domes, and those would be tough to build right without software tools if one wants to exactly hit the 8 block range.

If it's true, does anyone know which of those three things it is? I want to build this mob tower that I've started but I can't until I know what shape to make it in the current game version.

Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 09:09 on Apr 9, 2012

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Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop

proudft posted:

What's been breaking farms since 1.0 is the monsters won't merrily walk off the edges of cliffs anymore. You can either wash them off with some kind of timed water thing like that .gif, or line all the interior ledges of your monster-spawning box with signs. Monsters will still walk off an edge where there is a sign (at the moment - in my research I gathered there was one patch where this wasn't true, so who knows what the future holds). Basically they'll walk onto the 'top' of a sign but then fall from there.

I built one just last week, basically an inverted pyramid thing with ledges inside and signs along all the edges. I can verify that the vertical distance does work as well, the spot I sit is pretty much under the center of the device, but 25 down from the bottommost spawning ledge. Spiders are causing clogs in the thing so it's not perfect but it's good enough for me.

Cliffs wouldn't be my problem, since instead of recessed canals I have raised half-blocks surrounding my water. My output is pretty low or zero depending on where I stand, and that would make sense if monsters don't spawn or just freeze if they're not in a certain narrow 8-block spherical shell; my dark rooms are pretty big but an 8-block strip in any of them would be way too small to produce much.

Well, I guess I'll change the innards of my tower to use intermittent water flow to push monsters around, since monster movement no longer works that far away. Thanks to the guy above who posted the gif! Making a spherical-shell shaped tower would be cool looking too but would take a lot more effort per unit of spawnable area.

----

On a related note, it seems pretty obvious that this "mob movement freeze" change, if real, is just a botched bug fix in response to the fact that monsters used to wander outside of the loaded chunks, where despawning behavior broke. The whole point of fixing that bug would have been that it interfered with spawn towers, but it looks like the coders completely missed the point, were disconnected with how their game is actually used, and ended up *removing* functionality from the game by fixing the bug in this way. That sucks.

Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 23:34 on Apr 9, 2012

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
Okay, I'm trying to make one of these for my spawn tower like the guy said:



I'm working on the clock circuit that turns the water on and off. Everyone knows how to make a redstone clock that pulses on and off at any speed; you just add more or less repeaters. Problem is, that always gives you a 50% on-off duty cycle, whereas I want there to be a short time of water and then a long time of not-water each cycle. I am having an unbelievably hard time coming up with a circuit that lets me play around with duty-cycles - I even tried ANDing two different clocks together but it always seems to result in chatoic 1-tick ON pulses, never a variable-length one. What's the trick to making circuits with different on-off duty cycles?

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
I get a little impatient when I cross jungles. I found a way to never have to cross the same one twice. Also makes finding my way back easy via the trail of scorched earth.

(I exploit a water bucket to quickly climb straight up and down trees, and then again to "swim" from one treetop to others that are a bit too far for jumping... I place a single lava block at the top of each one, wait a second, and pick it back up... fire will do the rest, and the lava spreading makes up for the fact that fire got nerfed. Right now though I managed to totally wall myself in with the lava so I have to wait it out.)

Only registered members can see post attachments!

Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 21:25 on Aug 16, 2012

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
That infinite lava bucket you get in Creative mode can rapidly do a lot of damage :stare:









Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 00:53 on Feb 26, 2013

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
How often do dungeons spawn inside of desert temples?







Oddly, the placement looks to be exactly the same as in this guy's video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zc5USlg7XOA&t=127s) but he used the seed 1465871743, whereas mine used 825886923. Could it be that we have the same map with just different spawns? I found mine pretty far from spawn at (x306, z55).

Also, beneath the surface it's surrounded by a giant cave:





Much closer to my spawn on the same map is a desert temple inside a *jungle*, also against a river.

Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 20:07 on Sep 2, 2012

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
I made a monster trap that I think is pretty good.

It pushes monsters around with water, so you can be very far away and it won't matter that they aren't walking. Think of it as a giant "flushing" mechanism for mobs.

I gotta thank the folks in this thread who gave me the idea for using periodic waterflow and posted an example GIF, and those who gave me pointers on making a clock circuit with a variable duty cycle to let the water in.

GIF's ahoy; they might take a while.



Monsters getting crushed:



The same crushers and their half-tick clock circuit:



Here they fall into the crusher area:



The mob spawning / flushing area:



Lots of identical floors:



A single piston on the roof floods all of the floors below:



The water flow on/off circuit on the roof:




The collection site is far enough away that monsters spawn throughout the whole tower even when you're standing still. This has been a hard thing to do since Beta 1.3.



Standing at the collection site for an hour gives you about a stack of TNT, and plenty of other goodies. For faster output, it could be expanded upward tenfold with more identical floors.

Of course, staring at one point in space for too long could be problematic. Especially near a place where Endermen are periodically getting wet. I came back to this sight after one session:

Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 05:11 on Sep 12, 2012

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
Huh, I didn't know having dial-up was something that people were brave enough to admit these days. Maybe it's some retro throw-back thing.

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop

DrunkYardGnome posted:

Sorry if this has been brought up before, I've only read the last few pages of the thread, but I think this clone actually looks fairly interesting:

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=93066848

Just looking at some of the pictures, it looks like it has a lot more customization than Minecraft does right now. Not sure how big a fan I am of the hi-res textures, but it looks fairly nice.

Ah, Marching Cubes algorithm, it's about time. Glad to see it looks as gorgeous as I said it would. Here is another early example of someone using a voxel editor and rendering the data points like that.

It would be so easy to use Minecraft's own map data structure to render surfaces like this, without needing to re-invent the game from the ground up. Just group like blocks together in 2x2x2 cubes and draw each of those possible groupings as different slopes. The game would instantly look less lovely, which is the biggest turn-off to new players - not that looks are what the sandbox concept is about, but still. See how much better the knockoff looks?

drat the shaping tools in that look like a joke though. Really, you have to select what angle of block you want to put down at each place? It can't just figure it out by interpolation? As bad as this is, the editing tools that other sandbox games give you aren't that great either for quickly creating things. I can make one that will eliminate that problem and then some. Give me within the next year or two. There's one I've already been working on but it's going to be a LOT different technically from all of these.

Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 08:21 on Sep 30, 2012

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
Anyone else getting sudden game closures at random times, with segfault error-log files getting made? Happens to me like twice an hour since (1.4.4).

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop

Jamesman posted:

How massive are you talking here? I don't really want to make one too much bigger than the one I already have, which gives me 112 pieces of paper with each full harvest, and that's just 4 emeralds.

Selling meat was/is the most profitable for me with a Looting sword, followed closely by everything farmer-related (wool, wheat, fish, chicken). Too bad Looting doesn't work on chicken meat.

I ought to point out that wool can also come from spider silk - and spider silk can come from mob towers. Rather than manually farming you can just walk up to one spot every now and then to get your wool.

In spite of mob towers getting nerfed a long time ago by mobs standing still when far away, water-flow based mob towers like the one I show in this post are still quite effective and will deliver the goods wherever you want them. If those images don't animate for you in the post, they will in this photo album: http://s95.beta.photobucket.com/user/louisvilleLT4/media/Minecraft/Monster%20House/outside.gif.html?sort=3&o=6 although you'll still need to refer to the post for explanation.

Once you've got a treasure chest full of spider silk, the right villager can turn that into a lot of emeralds. Not to mention all the TNT and arrows you can get from such a tower.

Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 22:13 on Dec 1, 2012

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
I dunno, someone once said on here that the best thing if you feel like you've run out of things to do in Minecraft is to figure out all the resources the game has to offer, and devise some machine or means to automatically mass-acquire them. To me, that's the ultimate challenge, "beating Minecraft". Taking the dire situation of survival mode and turning it into the godlike surplus of creative mode through normal gameplay.

Mob towers don't have to be a tower either, any big ole dark cave will do if you can just steer the mobs towards a trap. What's more natural than conquering and exploiting the dark places where monsters naturally spawn? Mob spawners seem like more of a cheap trick compared to that.

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
I can't believe how hard this information is to find. What happens when you try to enchant a damaged item? Do you get a damaged item back (of the same health), plus enchantments? The Wiki and every post ever about enchantments that I can Google all leave that aspect out.

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
Thanks both of you, that makes a big difference in what I bring to this village priest guy.

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
Aww cool :) Do the new hoppers / droppers know how to send diamonds one way and ingots another yet? Is your setup there automatic?

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
I think one of you guys knows this, how does mob clipping work and what are ways around it? I'm trying to build an infinite chicken farm with hoppers that automatically feeds eggs back into itself, but I'm having issues with running out of space for the exponentially growing chickens.

Also, has anyone else here tried making an infinite chicken farm with hoppers that automatically feeds eggs back into itself?

Currently my chickens are dancing above water and not stacking together, which eventually blocks my egg dispenser. I tried arrangements that didn't have them on water, and that could compress them down to one block's space, but then I had issues with eggs splashing out too far to wind up in the hopper.

Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 22:02 on Jun 21, 2013

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop

Jamesman posted:

I do not understand comparators at all, and would like someone to explain them to me like I am a 5-year-old, please.

What I want to do with them is set up a chicken farm. A small room where chickens poop their eggs into a hopper, which feeds the eggs into a dispenser, which shoots the eggs back into the room to create more chickens, all automatically. I'd also have a lever to turn the flow off, possibly to redirect the egg flow into a chest. Then when I have too many chickens, I just chuck a damage potion at them all or take a sword to them, and get all the experience and raw chicken I can handle.

Is this possible?

Hey there, I've been meaning to post this for a while. I made an extremely compact one of these chicken farms on the Goonimati server (fits into a 5x5x2 rectangle and is fairly cheap). Here's a super quick video showing how it works:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3znYNgfRDg

30-second construction tutorial included.

By keeping the amount of chickens above a few hundred, it replenishes chickens at the same rate that you can spend the XP. Remember that you get more XP from manually killing mobs than from using damage potions; I found it most effective to chuck a poison potion into the cage (VERY cheap to make) and then start punching to rapidly thin them out. You can even do without poison pretty effectively if you just hammer on the punch button faster than they can move out of the way, but of course you level up a little faster using the poison.

The chunk doesn't start getting slow until around 700 - 2000 chickens; with a well hidden one of these under someone's house and a way for them to escape, the resident wouldn't find out why chickens keep showing up faster and faster until the exponential nature makes it too late to kill them all.


Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 21:27 on Nov 3, 2013

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop

Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:

Wolves are not and have never been random spawns in the same way hostile mobs are. So yeah, you have to be actively exploring and spot one while exploring.

And then once you find a couple you can basically have thousands, yay rotten meat being so drat common

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop

Jamesman posted:

and then letting the game refill the area with new ones

Friendly mobs haven't been random spawns for many versions. They load with chunk creation, only once. The only way to make more is to find new chunks.

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
Vines make cobble look better

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop

CJacobs posted:

I've yet to see a single facecam video where the facecam benefitted at all

Lowtax says you're wrong https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9II_cq01hY

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop

Arkitektbmw posted:

Best face cam ever. What's sad is he stilled played better than any youtuber ever.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQQCDxfv1SY

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop

xzzy posted:

That's generally how I start new worlds every time a new update comes out.

THIS TIME IT'LL BE DIFFERENT!

But after a couple evenings when I'm laying down absurdly long minecart tracks to get to my current dig site I realize I've ended up in the same hole and stop playing.

Fuego Fish posted:

It's why I keep experimenting with modding, but since I'm completely indifferent to technology-based stuff, and I hate combat with a passion, my choices are limited.

As I read someone else post a while back, once you think you've run out of things to do, make a list of every scarce resource and start devising machines to automatically harvest them. Throw everything at it: Improve mob spawning areas, have water flow channels and pistons, redstone signals and hoppers to keep the resources flowing into something, whatever you need to increase your throughput. Experiment with pistons + water + lava + giant mushrooms and trees for generating large cobble structures of the shape you need automatically.

Regardless of how good you are at this, it will definitely drive your survival and exploration forward as you scavenge for things. As you explore, customize or at least "touch" every cave passage you go through with at least a statue. This helps everything to blend in less, keeping you from getting lost (and never finding dropped items on death), and helping give your creativity a target.

Or, if you're not wanting to commit to a particular map, just do like that one guy on youtube and see how far north you can go manually and what you find in the process each time you set up camp.

Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 03:30 on Mar 7, 2014

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
I'm really looking forward to 1.8 and seeing them address more of the client hacks. I gave up Minecraft for a while, not long after my base on "the" big anarchy server 2b2t.org got found by an x-rayer. But I might go back to it if the update seriously does cut down on the effectiveness of x-ray clients (and hopefully other aim-bot style hacks in the future), making actual resource gathering skills important again for competing.

Being a dominating force on that server would, I think, be a pretty major test as a player; this is the server with dozens of Withers and aggressive players guarding the spawn, and a 2000 blocks radius of blown up stone



(and scarce wood and food) that you have to escape just to start surviving. By the time you get out you're so good at sprint-jumping it's like you're playing a whole new game.

Farther out, it's insane to explore. I traveled about 15k blocks in one direction and saw things that I just can't describe. Castles, no, cities way too huge to fit on one screenshot or for any one person to raid, completely quiet and abandoned, some hidden underground with barely a trace of human intervention on the surface but once you notice something and go down, you find rooms that have like a 200 block radius. I haven't built anything like that, so far I've just bred thousands of mooshrooms from a pair I found and set them loose near spawn.

Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 03:59 on Mar 7, 2014

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
Also, a tip for everyone since I only recently figured it out; you never have to drown. As long as you have a bucket in your hands (which should always be the case anyway in case you're on fire or need to climb up something tall). You can simply remove the water block you're swimming in for a split-second fresh gulp of air, dump the water, and repeat as many times as you like.

Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 03:30 on Mar 7, 2014

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop

xzzy posted:

The issue for me is that the fun part is the survival. Any new seed once you find iron and get your farm started the survival problem is pretty much over. Up until then it's a great experience because stuff can easily rip your face off and you don't know what goodies are nearby.

I don't necessarily want to be constantly farming resources just to stay alive but I'd like a much longer progression.

If you're surviving with just iron, you're not moving through caves nearly quick enough. Lava-level caves and abandoned mineshafts are the fastest way to reveal new diamonds, and if you're trucking it through them with that intention, you will have enemies dropping on you from above (even if you're lighting up and customizing the level you're on). Depending on how many hard lessons have trained you before, they will surprise you quite often and absolutely destroy you if you're in iron armor, and with each surprise you'll learn a new rule to follow from that point forward. Between creepers dropping on your head, poison spiders, witch potions, zombie massing, and arrow knockback, the mobs are more than challenging enough, trust me. Move around more and expand your territory and you'll agree.

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop

Ezreail posted:

What in the world is going on in this picture

Ground zero (spawn). Open creative, release a bunch of withers and let them go to town for a while and things will start looking like that pretty quick.

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
Goatse

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop

Serifina posted:

I don't think this'd be able to move liquids. I hope not. That would be wrong. Or weird. Just have a gigantic trail of cobblestone across all of existence.

Dispensers can't be pushed by pistons or put on Minecarts either, right? So no liquid movement there either. No automatic moving cobble tower pour-ers. It's a shame really. The most obvious way to make this game more interesting is to give the player more "butterfly effect" type actions that cause huge chain reactions and eventually affect tons of blocks. Or likewise to give mobs the ability to re-shape any untouched terrain to suit their needs and movements.


Last I checked at least, the 2b2t server map has had many dozens of withers under spawn that have been active since 2010, tearing it up. Even the obsidian bridges people build aren't safe during their spans across the blown out mountains at spawn. Most of the withers just hover around bedrock level shooting at squids though.

Try it yourself, open up creative and make a row of ~50 withers. It's a blast to watch how quick the terrain changes. It's just about the only way to do what I was wishing for at the top of this post.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yo2VZgQhlSU (An incorrectly compressed vid I took back when I tried this)

xzzy posted:

There's about a billion minecraft clone tutorials out there for Unity, the running around in a world of blocks part of programming takes maybe two hours of effort.

I made that bet to my last roommate, he didn't believe me. 45 minutes later I had a blocks world in C++ with OpenGL calls. It really is simple and I can see how it only took Notch a couple weeks. The not-simple part, and the reason why I abandoned voxels for game-making 10 years ago, is I didn't think you could make blocks interesting, and moved my focus to worlds with continuous space. But somehow he found a way to do it, by making so many different block types and focusing on precision terrain manipulation. Kudos to him for that, and the gapingly-empty market niche that it filled earned him $100 million for 2 weeks of work.

Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 02:57 on May 3, 2014

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop

Vib Rib posted:

I don't really agree with that. Personally I'd say giving more reasons to explore and fine-tuning combat would go a lot further, but I guess that's just proof that everyone enjoys Minecraft differently.

It's definitely true that some aspects of gameplay, like those, really dominate your experience in the game as is. No kidding, I wouldn't mind big improvements there either considering nearly all of my time in-game has been spent clearing mobs from one cave to the next as fast as I can explore.

(The top item on my real wish-list for gameplay is actually closer to your list; improved client validation, to make it harder for script kiddies and cheaters to remove the sense of competition from PvP servers. I actually stopped playing the game because of the futility that problem locks the game into.)

I was talking about a broader game or engine overhaul though, where those things would seem like small details. From an engine standpoint (keeping in mind that the engine was all that made Minecraft stand out to begin with), the best way to make the blocks world concept itself more interesting (aside from totally getting rid of it) would be to gradually make additions that cause the world to behave more like an ecosystem. The simplicity of voxels would be made up for by the fascinating uncertainty of what useful shapes that mobs or automatic / random building tools might shape the terrain into.

I would LOVE the aforementioned ability to design flying or burrowing machines out of those new pistons, to set them into motion and watch them take off, and to explore the aftermath as it interacts with other ones.

That's assuming we're still talking about blocks in our overhaul, which we will be because there's a serious cost of entry in making this game work for any other data structure (i.e. not something a casual coder like Notch could make, more like you'd need an applied mathematician and re-meshing expert to do it).

Although the gameplay may be what keeps people like us playing, the average Joe who decides to download the game doesn't know about the gameplay. Rather, the neat generated world and the tools for changing it seem to be the main draws of the average newcomer to Minecraft. So much of what we do, so much of the terrible "gameplay" that we put up with, is just us chasing that dragon of our first experiences in the game and the stupefying sense of awe that the generated world and mechanics brought to us.

Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 02:59 on May 3, 2014

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
Where exactly is the gaping hole in documentation? What exactly exists in the game that cannot be immediately discovered from the changelogs, the bug tracker, and failing those the wiki? Like, name one thing? At this point the MC Wiki is essentially a part of the game so don't try to not include that; you'd have to try pretty drat hard to not know to consult it, given that the same channels that people find out about the game through (internet comments and videos) also clearly point you to the wiki for every detail. For a game that has such radical potential for more breakthroughs in how we do virtual reality, you guys sure throw fits over problems that have small repercussions.

Sylink posted:

:lol: that isn't realistic. Diamonds aren't formed from coal at all.

I sort of like the diamond distribution. The unpredictability really pushes you to explore tons of lava caves. It's the rest of the underground right now that especially needs to be less boring.

Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 08:11 on May 8, 2014

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
Did you guys seriously just fight about this for another page? Who in here is personally held back by not knowing how to do things in game? How does it inconvenience you on a day to day basis? How does it inconvenience your friends on a day to day basis? If the answer is "it doesn't", WHY do you think it's worth it to rant and complain about it when it doesn't hurt anybody you have ever known or even heard of?

And WHY do you think it compares in importance to all the time you spend mindlessly enjoying the gameplay and exploration, or to the devs using this engine to invent yet more never-before-done ways to do virtual reality and shape to it and to socialize in it? I'm just trying to understand why you want the focus to be on this of all things, when there's so many more far-reaching things out there waiting to be done.

Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 20:39 on May 8, 2014

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
Great, well, I think the sound of water running being looped and not generated through some water physics algorithm is loving stupid. Let's all focus on that detail of the game for three pages, like it'd be the end of the goddamn world if the devs don't all drop what they're doing and zero-in 100% on that facet of the situation right now and not work on anything else until it seems all proper and professional to everyone.

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop

Fwoderwick posted:

Way to carry on the argument.

The short answer to all those is probably 'No one'. The slightly longer answer is probably 'No one, but it's possible to see design flaws and have empathy for new users, while enjoying said thing. Oh and in an indefinite development cycle, improving the existing game is not a binary choice with adding new features.'

Sure, but complaining and getting indignant about "design flaws" like everyone has been in this conversation, when those things clearly are not holding anyone back in practice, is a really douchey thing to do and reeks of just wanting to condescend and feel smarter than others.

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop

DarkJC posted:

Don't use the word design when talking about game design :qq:

I'm not sure how your reply goes with anything that I said. Reading comprehension fail.

No one in here has managed to come up with any examples of how this personally holds them back, in some way that stands out among the thousands of other design problems with the game that do. And it's because you all already know how to craft things and have no need for a tutorial. Except for one guy on this page. Who sounds like a baby because they know perfectly well where to find all the information via the wiki. And expect in-game messages for every extremely pedantic detail like "flipping this picture frame is now detectable by redstone!" and "only leaping from a surface at least on the same y-level as this crop will trample it now!"

And to counter that anecdote with a different one: I'm not annoyed at all by having to alt-tab to refer to instructions or videos; the separation is nice. I'd be a lot more annoyed if it was clunkily trying to share space in the same window as the game, where best-case, they would just be re-inventing the concept of tabs and windows for no reason. So it's not even necessarily a flaw, like the conversation has assumed thus far. Who cares.

But even with that assumption it's REALLY not a flaw worth bringing tons of attention to, when it probably does not affect you as a player at all, on behalf of some imaginary player. You're not interested in improving the game at all when it's like that; at that point you're just mad at the developers for some perceived sin and for not having your skills. Douchey.

Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 23:47 on May 8, 2014

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop

Schweinhund posted:

...followed by you arguing about it for 12 paragraphs.

With you. Not with the devs. Not with the intention of making it a front and center issue to the whole global MC community. Which you all are. But do keep trying to sound clever, that seems to be far more important to these criticisms than any real contributions to the Minecraft concept. You all just want to sound so smart by punishing those awful devs for their mistakes you wouldn't make.

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
Or just make them all half slabs (which they appear to maybe be)

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
Traps using existing spawners are waaaay more practical than ones that use normal spawning. Hollow a dungeon out a couple more blocks in all directions, send a diagonal water flow across it (elevate the source's corner as necessary), and collect all the mobs far enough away that they won't interfere with spawning but closeby enough that you can go kill them without turning off the spawner. If built right (large enough empty space around the spawner and completely dark) thousands will accumulate as you AFK, at which point you must be careful not to surpass the point where the map crashes. To keep them from backing up along the water stream as they accumulate, have the stream end in a drop (preferably 23 deep as you mentioned if your spawner is high up enough, otherwise 1 deep can do), where all the monsters will all stack into the same tiny space.

If you don't want to find and move to a spawner, there are other ways to accumulate a ton of mobs without building something huge. I came up with an ingenious chicken-replicator that fits into a 5x2x5 slit in your base and automatically produces an exponential growth rate of the population (which you will have to be careful to cull before the map crashes). It uses a couple hoppers, a dispenser, a tiny redstone ciruit, a lava block and a water block to automatically collect and hatch all eggs from the entire current population. In practice I stacked two side by side with a shared 2x1 pen. Poisoning and punching most of them (or even just punching is fairly fast) can potentially get you to level 30 in one shot. Here is a poorly edited (not exaggerating here) video tutorial: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3znYNgfRDg.

If you do want to use the large room method (in my opinion the most interesting), there are a lot of basic game logic rules to be aware of. You'll have to be familiar with the details and numbers on the Wiki. Monsters out past a certain (25 block??) range do not walk around at all and I don't think the new AI has changed that. That severely limits the size and shape you can use when bringing the monsters all to one point, unless you have a water-flow system that covers all your spawnable ground. I've made such a setup; big towers of repeated downhill-sloped floors that all periodically flush monsters out with water to a collection point far away so that the whole tower is able to spawn monsters while I sit at the end. This was a long time ago, and comparators / hoppers make the timing circuit for controlling the water flow much easier now to make.

Like the above guy I'm also a fan of charging madly through dark caves / outdoors and just fighting the monsters all at once, getting good enough at combat to do so rather than being as timid as most players are. You cover a lot more ground and see a lot more surface area at diamond-level than any other mining technique. But building machines to automate things is an important aspect of the game too.

Happy Thread fucked around with this message at 00:52 on Aug 16, 2014

Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop

Ra Ra Rasputin posted:

Nothing can make you mine as fast on survival as a eff5 pickaxe and a haste 2 beacon.

senae posted:

And if you need to dig in a straight line down that's a really helpful effect.

Unfortunately, that's not usually as common as you might expect.

1. Place one in the End.
2. Harvest the huge obsidian towers with haste 2.
3. Trade them in for some gold.
4. Spend your limitless gold on new beacons wherever you go.

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Happy Thread
Jul 10, 2005

by Fluffdaddy
Plaster Town Cop
Awesome job! Would make a nice base of operations. The buildings around it are well engineered too.

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