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Tim Pawlenty
Jun 3, 2006


Doing the Langdon trigger job on my M9A3 was a significant improvement, so I would say it's worth it. Dream to shoot.

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Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011


Part of the Langdon sauce is the much lighter springs. I think it's worth trying just the springs first before shelling out for the full TJIAB.

Sidesaddle Cavalry
Mar 15, 2013


counter-anecdote: I found that hammer springs weren't as big of a deal for my accuracy compared to the Optimized Performance Trigger Bar and the new Match Hammer (https://www.langdontactical.com/beretta-92-match-hammer/) to modify pull & reset distances.

Final Blog Entry
Jun 23, 2006

"Love us with money or we'll hate you with hammers!"

I have 9 (I think) 92/96 variants, all have D spring or lighter and a smattering of other various upgrade parts across them from over the years. I really should have kept a spreadsheet or something because in many cases I'm not sure what was put in which guns, especially with the hammer springs which aren't really (easily) identifiable.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

Dead Reckoning posted:

Also, I think the Wilson hammer matches the aesthetics of the original gun better.

For preserving the lines of the gun, get you a factory bobbed hammer. :getin:

The Royal Nonesuch
Nov 1, 2005



Ordered an A400 Xplor Action today from my LGS. Three month lead time due to ~everything~ but I can't wait to get my hands on it. :dogcited:

Generic pic for excitement purposes:

Styles Bitchley
Nov 13, 2004

FOR THE WIN FOR THE WIN FOR THE WIN

Received my M9, not yet fired. First receiving inspection comments:

-barrel is marked STAINLESS, i thought these were carbon steel and chrome lined. guess not
-overall fit/finish/feel of the gun is a bit more....plasticky? than i thought. i realize the trigger, mag release, safety are plastic but also...
-the slide finish looks like some kind of baked on enamel look like a CZ or something. i'm quite sure it's a top coating as there is a staked cross pin on top and the coating is flaked at the staking. not a problem itself just i didn't know of this coating before.
-the snowman sights aren't that bad. i think i like this more than vanilla 3 dot sights actually
-slide serrations are really shallow. Perhaps my only real complaint as coupled with the shape/size of slide make grasping and racking it a bit difficult with hammer down. there is very little to grab onto, and what you have to grab is not very good. Actually i have to wonder if this is a defect as there is a noticeable difference in the left and right serrations. The left side has basically no depth and in the middle almost washed out to be flat. I can put my fingernail in the shallow left side and run it across without it catching, no matter how hard i press. not good
-yeah DA trigger is heavy, but not atrocious. i will definitely change the hammer spring to a D model or lower. Not that bad really, then again I own a Makarov so maybe desensitized
-single action trigger just ok, heavy wall which i don't mind but wish the break was a bit cleaner
-magazine release is terrible. it's plastic, small, very firm, and mushy. mags will hang up if you press and hold. i don't like large mag releases but this is both small and bad. maybe worst non-heel release on any pistol i have. i will probably replace it
-the grips screws, or some of them, protrude above the grips. there is a star washer underneath so just a function of that and easy to fix if i wanted. while i hate slotted screws, these use a piss ant little hex bit for some reason and would be more prone to stripping.
-safety/decocker is not big deal issue for me. with medium+ hands i can reach it no problem. with safety engaged you get a dead trigger, so you would likely know it if pulling the trigger unlike some safeties you just yank the trigger harder until you realize it's on. i like having controls away from my thumbs, this would not bother me if not for the slide serration issue. especially on a Type G conversion
-the vertical grip grooves are pretty deep and feel great

Some observations, most minor but looking forward to first shots with this classic.

Problematic Soup
Feb 18, 2007

My soup has malfunctioned?





The slide serrations sound like a manufacturing problem. I have found that 92s are a lot easier to manipulate slides that CZs for me, and I donít recall having problems using the serrations.

As far as the other stuff, I do like 92s, but I also do loads of parts swapping to get things set up how I like. That includes VZ thin grips, taking out all the plastic stuff, and switching to aftermarket trigger giblets (except for the factory steel trigger itself or the spurless hammers on my 92Ds). I would probably go with another gun if I had to use something set up like a stock M9.

Styles Bitchley
Nov 13, 2004

FOR THE WIN FOR THE WIN FOR THE WIN

So upon further review I noticed what I would consider pronounced tool marks in the chamber of this M9. I looked in the chamber of 5 other pistols I have and they don't have discernable tool marks. However, the gun is still unfired though I doubt this would smooth itself out. Not good.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

:catstare:

I've never seen any pistol chamber look like that. Not even unbranded aftermarket barrels.

Tim Pawlenty
Jun 3, 2006


That is criminally bad, I would absolutely try and get them to replace the barrel.

Quickshanks
Oct 3, 2011

So damned good.

Maybe that barrel is just rifled in the super rare 1:1/100th inch twist rate.

Styles Bitchley
Nov 13, 2004

FOR THE WIN FOR THE WIN FOR THE WIN

FYI Beretta customer support says their backlog to even look at a return is two months and any parts might be six months.


:waycool:

Tyro
Nov 10, 2009


Styles Bitchley posted:

FYI Beretta customer support says their backlog to even look at a return is two months and any parts might be six months.


:waycool:

:staredog:

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

Styles Bitchley posted:

FYI Beretta customer support says their backlog to even look at a return is two months and any parts might be six months.


:waycool:

Just tell them to either replace the gun or cut you a check so you can buy a barrel off eBay or something.

Final Blog Entry
Jun 23, 2006

"Love us with money or we'll hate you with hammers!"

Here's one you don't see everyday, a 96G Compact

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/910245343

Sidesaddle Cavalry
Mar 15, 2013


Final Blog Entry posted:

Here's one you don't see everyday, a 96G Compact

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/910245343

hot gat
hot gat!!!

Sidesaddle Cavalry
Mar 15, 2013


https://www.gunbroker.com/item/909216046

You got me browsing so now hereís another heads-up about a Cougar in 357 SIG

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

Final Blog Entry posted:

Here's one you don't see everyday, a 96G Compact

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/910245343


Sidesaddle Cavalry posted:

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/909216046

You got me browsing so now hereís another heads-up about a Cougar in 357 SIG

Efffffff

Good thing I don't have any fun money right now.

:smith:

Seamonster
Apr 30, 2007

IMMER SIEGREICH


Are the .40/.357sig guns durable? As in, do they go kablammo like early Glocks?

AFAIK the only pistol designed for .40 and then scaled down to 9mm is the USP.

Tim Pawlenty
Jun 3, 2006


Seamonster posted:

Are the .40/.357sig guns durable? As in, do they go kablammo like early Glocks?

AFAIK the only pistol designed for .40 and then scaled down to 9mm is the USP.

The Steyr handguns floating out there are as well. I still have an L40A1 despite not buying .40 for over half a decade at this point.
From what I know about .40 Berettas just scrolling through forums while researching other things Beretta they are 'fine' aside from shooting the wrong caliber.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011


Seamonster posted:

Are the .40/.357sig guns durable? As in, do they go kablammo like early Glocks?

AFAIK the only pistol designed for .40 and then scaled down to 9mm is the USP.
40 apparently beats up alloy frame 92 Berettas more than 9, but it's only something to worry about if it's a primary gun you're going to be shooting 6,000 rounds of duty loads through. Later generations with Brigadier slides or the beefed up frame around the locking block interface are fine. I've never heard anything one way or the other about the Cougars. The Storm series are apparently designed around 40, and as a result are soft shooting without reported issues.

Sidesaddle Cavalry
Mar 15, 2013


Seamonster posted:

Are the .40/.357sig guns durable? As in, do they go kablammo like early Glocks?

AFAIK the only pistol designed for .40 and then scaled down to 9mm is the USP.

There's actually a ton of different pistols of various makes that were originally designed for .40, most of them from the early 2000s and onwards. The Px4 Storm was one of them!

At the time, law enforcement in North America was still following a lot of the concerns brought up by the Miami FBI report, and elsewhere in Europe the not-9mm calibers gained popularity as 9mm parabellum was restricted by law as a "military" round.

You can actually tell if a pistol was originally designed for .40 if you compare the width of their 9mm-version magazine with the width of a mag from a natively 9mm gun. The originally .40 gun will have a thicker 9mm magazine!

This is of course because when you downsize the caliber, it makes more sense to get the optimal 9mm stacking pattern by thickening the inside of the magazine with grooves, instead of trying to reduce the thickness of the mag (and increase the thickness of the gun frame's mag well).

Here's a few more pistols originally in .40 s&w aside from the PX4, USP, and the Steyr 40s:
- S&W M&P
- S&W 4006 if you want to go way back oops!
- SIG P229
- Beretta 8040 Cougar (if you were wondering about whether or not that 8357 from that listing would last)
- I think the Walther P99 and early PPQs maybe?

Sidesaddle Cavalry fucked around with this message at 14:46 on Sep 8, 2021

rifles
Oct 8, 2007
is this thing working



I broke an m9 last week :(

Final Blog Entry
Jun 23, 2006

"Love us with money or we'll hate you with hammers!"

The 92/96 series frame change from straight to slanted dust covers was to strengthen the area for the 40s&w in the 96's. An early 96 with straight dust cover wouldn't be ideal for a high round count gun but the later ones seem to be fine.

rifles posted:



I broke an m9 last week :(

Yikes. Is that a gen 3 locking block?

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

Sidesaddle Cavalry posted:

- S&W 4006 if you want to go way back

The 4006 is a .40 handgun (and arguably the first .40 handgun to come to market) , but it's a 9mm frame with .40 wedged in, just like the Beretta 96. That's why it only holds 11 rounds in the mag despite being a full-size handgun. 4006 series mags are the same width and length as the 5906 series. You're right that the P229 was designed around .40 (and thus the .40 mags are wider than those from a 9mm P229 or P228).

Another exception to the mag width rule of thumb is Glocks - 9mm Glocks were around way before .40 was a thing and .40 was crammed into the same mag dimensions. Glock mags just happened to start out a little wider which is why a G22 holds nearly as many rounds as a G17.

To me, original mag capacity is a better rule of thumb. Comparing the 4006 and the Beretta 96 to their 9mm predecessors, they hold 11 rounds vs. the original 15 which is more than a 25% drop in capacity.

The USP .40 holds 13 vs the 9mm version which is 15, and that's about a 12% drop in capacity. The P229 holds 12 rounds in .40 vs. the 9mm version's 13, for less than 8% drop in capacity. And a G22 holds less than 12% fewer rounds than a G17 (same as the M&P series and the PX4s).

The rule of thumb really only works with double stack mags though, and on guns going "up" to .40. If you look at, say, a 1911 in .40 vs. 9mm, you're only losing one round when you go to .40 (about 11%) but the gun was designed for an even bigger cartridge to begin with.

Styles Bitchley
Nov 13, 2004

FOR THE WIN FOR THE WIN FOR THE WIN

rifles posted:



I broke an m9 last week :(

yikes. post deets

looks like a Gen2 block?

rifles
Oct 8, 2007
is this thing working

Styles Bitchley posted:

yikes. post deets

looks like a Gen2 block?

I didn't keep it so I'm not sure. It's a headquarters gun and they're getting clapped out by us practicing/competing alongside yearly quals. Last two rounds on a combat EIC pistol match and I squeeze and get a dead trigger - stuck case and a doublefeed. Cleared the malfunction, went to rack the slide to chamber a round and the horn went off. Took me about 30 seconds of messing with it and smacking the frame while holding the slide to get it to unlock and open to show clear. Armorer took a few minutes + a hammer to get it apart and had a block to replace it with... "good as new."

I guess the contracted lifespan of an M9 is only 5000 rounds of m882. I put 800 of that through that gun in two days. We're just waiting to get M17s, though we have heard that a lot of units have traded locking block failures for their rear sights/plates flying off under recoil. Beats the gun actually breaking I guess.

Action-Bastard
Jan 1, 2008



Is the APX a newbie friendly enough firearm for a first time shooter? Relative is determined to buy a handgun for home defense (no carry) and they're gravitating towards the APX for its price and ergonomics and I talked a big game about Beretta to them prior.

Final Blog Entry
Jun 23, 2006

"Love us with money or we'll hate you with hammers!"

https://youtu.be/LbeKxBqgUU8

https://www.beretta.com/en-us/m9a4-full-size/

New optic ready M9A4. Seems that Beretta's red dot solution won't sit as low as Langdon's but doesn't require a redesigned firing pin or anything like that

poopgiggle
Feb 7, 2006

it isn't easy being a cross dominate shooter.




MSRP is the same as the street price of a 92X + cost of LTT's milling service. IDK what they'll street for though. I wouldn't be able to speak to height over bore without actually trying it.

It would be cool if they offered the mounting solution for the 92X Performance, which they did for a limited Italian-market-only variant because it's Beretta and of course they did.

Tim Pawlenty
Jun 3, 2006


Action-Bastard posted:

Is the APX a newbie friendly enough firearm for a first time shooter? Relative is determined to buy a handgun for home defense (no carry) and they're gravitating towards the APX for its price and ergonomics and I talked a big game about Beretta to them prior.

Absolutely. The price usually is nice and low as well, criminally underrated gun.


poopgiggle posted:

MSRP is the same as the street price of a 92X + cost of LTT's milling service. IDK what they'll street for though. I wouldn't be able to speak to height over bore without actually trying it.

It would be cool if they offered the mounting solution for the 92X Performance, which they did for a limited Italian-market-only variant because it's Beretta and of course they did.

Jesus I want that 92X performance so bad. I definitely like how the LTT looks more however and everything else (barrel so I don't have the M9A3 threaded tip out there all the time, TJIB) I've bought from them was top notch.

Final Blog Entry
Jun 23, 2006

"Love us with money or we'll hate you with hammers!"

I really need to get off my rear end and buy a 92x Performance. I really can't believe that a new frame safety, steel frame 92 was released and I still haven't bought one some two years later.

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BadgerMan45
Dec 30, 2009


Y'all should go for it if you've always lusted after a steel-frame/frame safety 92 like I have, they're pretty sweet...

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