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Docjowles
Apr 9, 2009



Super Rad posted:

Comments/suggestions?

I have a thing for simple recipes, so I'd personally cut out some of the specialty malts. Pick one of the Honey, CaraVienne and Aromatic and see what that gets you. But I'm not exactly an accomplished recipe designer and that's pure personal taste.

Jacobey000 posted:

Also tasted the cranberry wheat beer I've got sitting on the cranberry mush going on two weeks and the chewy cranberry harshness has relinquished into a tart and tasty fruit beer.

Not totally sure what you are saying here. If the beer is tasting how you want it, package that up ASAP. If you think it needs to sit longer...don't package it quite yet? If it's tasting great letting it sit on the fruit longer won't improve things.

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tesilential
Nov 22, 2004

You're a credit to your community!

kaishek posted:

Hm, too bad. That means I'll be throwing away 2 other liquid yeast packets too. I guess not that bad of a loss, given a waiting time of over a year like that. Better to not throw good after bad. There's no reason the ingredients would go bad, right? DME and LME?

I'd brew a simple batch with a low gravity and few hops to keep it cheap. Maybe a light porter or something. Then pitch your pack of yeast and see how it goes. I'd be willing to bet it comes out perfectly fine. In the days of old people "pitched" by using a wooden paddle with some yeast cells on it.

Of course there's no guarantee everything will be gravy, but I would certainly give it a go. If it does nothing you can pitch something else, and if it works it will probably work well. Yeast is pretty cool.

indigi
Jul 20, 2004

picture me workin McDonald's!
I'd rather pull a mac on you
sorry Ms. Jackson, but I'm packin


Pillbug

The DME you'd need to make a 1L starter costs about the same as a pack of Nottingham, which you know will have high viability and vitality. You could probably pay for it by going through your couch cushions. Why even bother with the risk unless you absolutely need a hefe/Belgian yeast?

Jacobey000 posted:

Question: How long should I leave it racked on the mush? Because of the surface area I expect there to be a much faster transfer, no? Would I be doing it harm by leaving on there for a couple more weeks?
Not at all. The best solution would be to taste it every few days. I leave my fresh fruit beers on the fruit for 2-6 weeks.

Hufflepuff or bust!
Jan 28, 2005

I should have known better.

indigi posted:

The DME you'd need to make a 1L starter costs about the same as a pack of Nottingham, which you know will have high viability and vitality. You could probably pay for it by going through your couch cushions. Why even bother with the risk unless you absolutely need a hefe/Belgian yeast?

It was actually the "American Wheat" Wyeast 1010, but I think I'll probably take the advice and replace the yeasts. I'll have to look into replacing the LME, I knew I shouldn't have waited this long! I could just take all the ingredients out of all the kits and just throw them together in various ways and see what happens...but I only have the bottles to bottle one batch at a time now. I got my wife to tentatively agree to a kegging system because believe it or not it will actually save space (fridge space for beer, and shelf space for cases of empty/full bottles).

Jo3sh
Oct 19, 2002

Like all girls I love unicorns!

So the Oatmeal Cookie brown beer recipe from Radical Brewing...

Since I'm going to be making ten gallons, I thought I might make a spice tincture to spike one of the two kegs. The suggests a teaspoon of cinnamon and a dash of vanilla for flavoring. I am thinking I will take a teaspoon of cinnamon and weigh it, then add that and a similar weight of vanilla bean and freshly grated nutmeg to a jar, cover with vodka, and let it macerate until kegging time.

Any thoughts?

Acceptableloss
May 2, 2011

Numerous, effective and tenacious: We must remember to hire them next time....oh, nevermind.

From like eight pages ago:

Hypnolobster posted:

It's pretty simple, and basically just the one that keeps floating around the internet (namely HBT).

5 gallons of jug apple juice, only preservative is ascorbic acid
Montrachet Yeast
1 lb Dextrose (or 2 if you're feeling like making it stronger)
Yeast Nutrient

Pour 3 or 4 of the jugs of apple juice into a sanitized carboy (I get all obsessive and after I've just cracked the lids on the juice to the point where it's about to break the safety seal/whatever, I spray a bunch of starsan up into the threads), dump half of another jug into the carboy, pour the dextrose into the jug, shake the gently caress out of it to dissolve, pour it into the carboy.

Usually before I add anything, I pour in my rehydrated yeast and nutrient, although you can just sprinkle it in, but it'll likely clump up.
I oxygenate for about 60 seconds, throw an airlock on it and let it ferment out and condition for at least 4 months, preferably more like 6-8, then just keg it.

It comes out super super dry and clean, with a nice big bright apple flavor. Super tasty all on it's own, even tastier drank in quantity with some fresh sparking cider added to it (or Sprite, 7up, etc if you're feeling trashy).

So I've got 5 gal of preservative free apple cider and most everything I need for this, but I don't think I have a pound of dextrose. I was thinking I might use a pound of brown sugar or a mix of brown sugar and honey or something and just boil it a little to make sure it's sanitized.

Opinions on what that might do to the flavor? I'd prefer it to finish pretty clean, and I definitely don't want any maple syrup type flavor.

Darth Goku Jr
Oct 19, 2004

yes yes i see, i understand


You shouldn't boil the honey, though you should definitely warm it up to make it runnier. Aromas boil off and honey is a hostile enough enviroment for bacteria as it is.

And Jo3sh that sounds awesome

tesilential
Nov 22, 2004

You're a credit to your community!

Jo3sh posted:

So the Oatmeal Cookie brown beer recipe from Radical Brewing...

Since I'm going to be making ten gallons, I thought I might make a spice tincture to spike one of the two kegs. The suggests a teaspoon of cinnamon and a dash of vanilla for flavoring. I am thinking I will take a teaspoon of cinnamon and weigh it, then add that and a similar weight of vanilla bean and freshly grated nutmeg to a jar, cover with vodka, and let it macerate until kegging time.

Any thoughts?

CCB makes an oatmeal raisin cookie beer which is their Maduro oatmeal brown with spices. They use cinnamon, raisins, vanilla. Don't know the quantities but it tastes sufficiently different from the original without being overwhelming.

Edit: my thoughts are that I like it. I actually prefer it to Maduro which is one of my favorite browns.

Hypnolobster
Apr 12, 2007

What this sausage party needs is a big dollop of ketchup! Too bad I didn't make any.


Acceptableloss posted:

From like eight pages ago:


So I've got 5 gal of preservative free apple cider and most everything I need for this, but I don't think I have a pound of dextrose. I was thinking I might use a pound of brown sugar or a mix of brown sugar and honey or something and just boil it a little to make sure it's sanitized.

Opinions on what that might do to the flavor? I'd prefer it to finish pretty clean, and I definitely don't want any maple syrup type flavor.

You could boil some water and then dissolve the brown sugar in it if you want. As long as it's above 180 after it's mixed in I wouldn't worry at all.

As said, honey you can just warm up in the jar in some water to get it runny. I wouldn't worry much at all about sanitizing it.
I don't use honey very often, but I'd think the best way to get it to dissolve properly would be to dump the first gallon or so of cider into the carboy, add the warmed honey/sugar/etc and swirl the hell out of it until it dissolves, then carry on adding the rest.


I doubt it would be terribly obvious in the flavor. If anything came through, I think I'd prefer the honey type flavors over brown sugar.

Jo3sh
Oct 19, 2002

Like all girls I love unicorns!

Acceptableloss posted:

<Making apfelwein / fortified cider, asking what to do about adding sugar>


Hypnolobster posted:

As said, honey you can just warm up in the jar in some water to get it runny.

Yup. Honey is pretty sanitary all on its own. I do try to use new, unopened containers, but I'm not so sure an open jar would be a problem as long as it didn't have big crumbs in it or something.

I just crack the lid and put it in a pan of hot water for a few minutes, then add it to fermenter and stir it in with a sanitized spoon to mix and dissolve.

Acceptableloss
May 2, 2011

Numerous, effective and tenacious: We must remember to hire them next time....oh, nevermind.

Yeah despite how I worded that, I wasn't planning on boiling the honey, I was just thinking about what ingredients to use flavor-wise.

I used a bunch of cane sugar in a beer long ago when I was young and dumb, and it came out tasting a bit like maple syrup, but not in a good way.

Anyway, I def don't want that kind of flavor in my apfelwein. So aside from dextrose, what would be the best thing to use?

Jo3sh
Oct 19, 2002

Like all girls I love unicorns!

One pound of cane sugar in five gallons will be just fine. I've done much higher rates (up to one pound of white table sugar per gallon) in that recipe and it's been perfectly palatable. It was very very strong, but it tasted fine.

indigi
Jul 20, 2004

picture me workin McDonald's!
I'd rather pull a mac on you
sorry Ms. Jackson, but I'm packin


Pillbug

I'd imagine even with crumbs or dust in it, if you add it immediately after knockout it'll all warm up to pasteurization temps anyway.

Plastic Jesus
Aug 26, 2006

I'm cranky most of the time.


So my first brew seems to feel it should have an FG of 1.02 (down from 1.08) so I'm going to let it have an FG of 1.02. However, I'm leaving for 10 days starting next Friday: if I bottle tonight will that give me enough time to discover any bottle bombs? I'd rather not have beer exploding in my empty apartment. If it's not enough time will it hurt anything to let the beer sit for another 2 weeks in the primary?

indigi
Jul 20, 2004

picture me workin McDonald's!
I'd rather pull a mac on you
sorry Ms. Jackson, but I'm packin


Pillbug

Why bottle tonight if that's even a possibility? High gravity beers usually benefit from more time on the yeast anyway. 1.02 from 1.08 is pretty good attenuation, but I wouldn't risk it either way til I had at least 3 days of consistent gravity measurements.

porkface
Dec 28, 2000

Oregoons Godfather

Plastic Jesus posted:

So my first brew seems to feel it should have an FG of 1.02 (down from 1.08) so I'm going to let it have an FG of 1.02. However, I'm leaving for 10 days starting next Friday: if I bottle tonight will that give me enough time to discover any bottle bombs? I'd rather not have beer exploding in my empty apartment. If it's not enough time will it hurt anything to let the beer sit for another 2 weeks in the primary?
You can end up with bombs in 10 days, but if you bottle now and reach the carb you want before leaving you can stuff them all in the fridge and that will slow things down enough to prevent bombs.

As mentioned, malty or higher gravity beers tend to benefit from a few extra weeks in primary within reason. It's kind of up to whether or not you want to enjoy them when you get back or not.

Plastic Jesus
Aug 26, 2006

I'm cranky most of the time.


Sorry, should have specified that it's been at 1.02 for at least a week.

To be honest I have no real desire to bottle tonight and am mostly just wondering if I'll be fine putting it off a couple of weeks. Provided that it's ok to wait a little longer would there've any benefit in moving it from the carboy I used as a primary to the bottling bucket?

Edit: Didn't see that reply before I submitted. Ok, cool, I'll just wait then. Total time in primary will be six weeks, which seems to be reasonable given what I've read elsewhere. Just wanted to check since the recipe called for bottling after 3-4.

Plastic Jesus fucked around with this message at Oct 29, 2011 around 22:13

indigi
Jul 20, 2004

picture me workin McDonald's!
I'd rather pull a mac on you
sorry Ms. Jackson, but I'm packin


Pillbug

Put it somewhere cold if you can. The extra two or three weeks in a chilly area will help it clear beautifully.

deebo
Jan 21, 2004



I thought I read someplace honey will stop things growing in it, but once you water it down dormant bacteria can start growing? Is this correct?

Wikipedia says

quote:

Most microorganisms do not grow in honey because of its low water activity of 0.6.[3] However, honey sometimes contains dormant endospores of the bacterium Clostridium botulinum, which can be dangerous to infants, as the endospores can transform into toxin-producing bacteria in the infant's immature intestinal tract, leading to illness and even death[4] (see Health hazards below).

Not that many infants are drinking beer, but can other bacteria etc also lie dormant in honey?

nesbit37
Dec 12, 2003
Emperor of Rome
(500 BC - 500 AD)

Yeasts and other things can certainly lay dormant in honey. The main reason bees get it down to 18% water content is so it will not ferment.

Daedalus Esquire
Mar 30, 2008


Just used a package of fuggle hops for the coffee porter I'm brewing. They smell absolutely fantastic and I kind of wish I had bought and used more for this beer. Possibly a new favorite hop.

Jo3sh
Oct 19, 2002

Like all girls I love unicorns!

There is a reason some varieties are always classic. I like the new varieties, too, but it would be a mistake to forget old friends.

Huge_Midget
Jun 6, 2002

I don't like the look of it...

Brewed 6 gallons of imperial porter yesterday evening. First time using White Labs Servomyces, heavy pre-fermentation oxygenation, and the first time I have made a starter with my new DIY stir plate. OG 1.090, White Labs WLP007 Dry English Ale yeast.

To say I have an active fermentation is a bit of an understatement. 3 hours after pitching it was partying like a rock star.

http://youtu.be/Y3uYmoVdZzA

tonedef131
Sep 3, 2003



deebo posted:

I thought I read someplace honey will stop things growing in it, but once you water it down dormant bacteria can start growing? Is this correct?
Not necessarily, the glucose oxidase in honey can create hydrogen peroxide which kills a lot of microorganisms, which is why honey is considered self preserving.

Tedronai66
Aug 24, 2006
Better to Reign in Hell...

Huge_Midget posted:

Brewed 6 gallons of imperial porter yesterday evening. First time using White Labs Servomyces, heavy pre-fermentation oxygenation, and the first time I have made a starter with my new DIY stir plate. OG 1.090, White Labs WLP007 Dry English Ale yeast.

To say I have an active fermentation is a bit of an understatement. 3 hours after pitching it was partying like a rock star.

http://youtu.be/Y3uYmoVdZzA

That is awesome. One of these days I'll stop using buckets for fermentation so I can watch the show

Docjowles
Apr 9, 2009



I continue to be amazed by how badass Wyeast 3787 Trappist High Gravity is. Pitched a week ago into a 1.080 tripel, it's still fermenting so vigorously that I have poo poo clogging the airlock. Although to be fair, it was 1.064 at pitching time and I added 2lbs of sugar a few days later. Still, I've never seen a yeast literally jump out of the carboy like this monster.

j3rkstore
Jan 28, 2009

L'esprit d'escalier

I was thinking that I'd like to try different yeasts with the same wort.

If I take a single 5 gallon batch and rack it to five 1-gallon carboys, what would be the better option for pitching into each 1-gallon; a wyeast propagator (25 billion cells) or activator (100 billion cells)?

Josh Wow
Feb 28, 2005

We need more beer up here!


Propagator if it's standard gravity, but Wyeast stopped making those recently so if you find them they're a couple months old.

j3rkstore
Jan 28, 2009

L'esprit d'escalier

So its just Activator packs from here on out?

That's a bummer because I think I'd be risking over-pitching since by myJamil's formula I'd need 43.5 billion cells for a gallon of 1.060 wort.

PoopShipDestroyer
Jan 13, 2006

I think he's ready for a chair

I like the idea, but to make things easier on the yeast front, why don't you just do 3 two gallon batches? One gallon is only going to net you maybe 8-9 bottles of beer if you're lucky anyways.

Tedronai66
Aug 24, 2006
Better to Reign in Hell...

Or step up to a 1bbl brewing setup!

j3rkstore, are you also controlling temperature precisely as well (I don't know anybody's setups around here, and I don't have any ferm chamber yet)?

j3rkstore
Jan 28, 2009

L'esprit d'escalier

Yeah I've got a chest freezer with a temperature controller on it.

If i got a six pack from each fermetor I'd be fine as its just for testing but your two gallon batch suggestion would be a nice compromise that I might look into.

TheCIASentMe
Jul 11, 2003

I'll get you! Just you wait and see!

deebo posted:

I thought I read someplace honey will stop things growing in it, but once you water it down dormant bacteria can start growing? Is this correct?

Wikipedia says


Not that many infants are drinking beer, but can other bacteria etc also lie dormant in honey?

Yes other stuff can lie dormant in honey, however honey is generally pretty safe to add in unpasteurized. But if you really want and you have the equipment for it, you can pasteurize it yourself at 140F for 45 minutes. 140F is below the boiling point of water but is still going to kill 99.999% of whatever is in your honey.

Honestly when I make cider I bring everything (cider, spices, honey, brown sugar) up to 140F in a big pot and let it stay at that temperature for close to an hour. Kills off anything that might have been in my cider or other ingredients but won't set the pectin in the cider.

It isn't necessary but it's peace of mind that any infants getting drunk off my cider won't die from bacterial infection before they die from alcohol poisoning.

Acceptableloss posted:

From like eight pages ago:


So I've got 5 gal of preservative free apple cider and most everything I need for this, but I don't think I have a pound of dextrose. I was thinking I might use a pound of brown sugar or a mix of brown sugar and honey or something and just boil it a little to make sure it's sanitized.

Opinions on what that might do to the flavor? I'd prefer it to finish pretty clean, and I definitely don't want any maple syrup type flavor.

How your cider finishes is more a question of how long you age it than anything else. You could spice it, make it sparkling, hell make it a cyser and the question remains of how long you age it. Not clear enough yet? Let it age more. Seriously cider is more a wine than a beer. You CAN drink it on week 2 but it tastes much better on week 52.

As to flavor, I tend to use mostly honey and only a little brown sugar. But really the answer is make several batches and see which one you prefer. Again though, this takes time because a crappy cider can turn godlike in a year.

TheCIASentMe fucked around with this message at Oct 31, 2011 around 22:02

Darth Goku Jr
Oct 19, 2004

yes yes i see, i understand


Today I learned that if I'm going to toast some oats, that they're going to affect the math needed for a proper saccharification temp more than I guessed. Or alternatively, cool the drat oats a bit more.

Is it reaching 168 where you officially screwed the pooch? I think i hit 163 max for at least where my probe was. How screwed up could it be? Eh whatever rdwhahb

Darth Goku Jr fucked around with this message at Oct 31, 2011 around 22:59

Super Rad
Feb 15, 2003
Sir Loin of Beef

Leaf hop users: I bought a mix of pellet and leaf hops for my last brew since I wanted to get a good whiff of saaz aroma and always heard that leaf hops retain aroma better. Anyhow we open the bittering pellets and take a deep smell from the bag - smells lovely but it goes in the boil for bittering! I'm rather excited for the leaf hops by this point - we open that bag up - and not so much aroma. We even tried crushing them up some to release extra aromas, but all in all they seemed very dull compared the the pellet hops.

Is this usual? We still have 1 oz for dry hopping, if there are any tests I can conduct.

zedprime
Jun 9, 2007


Is there something I'm missing about camden tablets that make them ok for wine, but not for meads or ciders or anything else? There's probably a reason they aren't used for the latter but it seems like it could be a simple way to make sure yeast outcompete anything you'd ever worry about without pasteurization like its use in winemaking.

TheCIASentMe
Jul 11, 2003

I'll get you! Just you wait and see!

zedprime posted:

Is there something I'm missing about camden tablets that make them ok for wine, but not for meads or ciders or anything else? There's probably a reason they aren't used for the latter but it seems like it could be a simple way to make sure yeast outcompete anything you'd ever worry about without pasteurization like its use in winemaking.

Lots of people use campden tablets for beers and non-wines.

It's not that they can't be used for cider or mead. It's just that in the case of mead the honey is already sterile-enough. It's not completely sterile but the trace amounts aren't going to affect anything and by the time it can the alcohol will inhibit growth.

As for cider, that's usually because the main ingredient comes in pre-pasteurized bottles. You can get fresh, unpasteurized cider of course, which again requires more care unless your one of the people who makes and drinks their cider within a couple of weeks.

TheCIASentMe fucked around with this message at Nov 1, 2011 around 04:11

Tedronai66
Aug 24, 2006
Better to Reign in Hell...

TheCIASentMe posted:

How your cider finishes is more a question of how long you age it than anything else. You could spice it, make it sparkling, hell make it a cyser and the question remains of how long you age it. Not clear enough yet? Let it age more. Seriously cider is more a wine than a beer. You CAN drink it on week 2 but it tastes much better on week 52.

As to flavor, I tend to use mostly honey and only a little brown sugar. But really the answer is make several batches and see which one you prefer. Again though, this takes time because a crappy cider can turn godlike in a year.

This is definitely true. I bottled my first cider after 4 weeks, and i still have a few bottles not in my fridge. The ones I had a couple weeks after bottling were so-so, but now 8 weeks after, they're awesome (and at ~9% alcohol, dangerously easy to get drunk off of).

I think at some point, I'll do a batch the same way (4 gal pastuerized apple juice from costco, 2lb honey, 2lb dark or light brown sugar, cheapo muttons ale yeast), and let it just sit for 3 months.

quantegy
May 18, 2002


silver97232 posted:

You know I've found this to be more a homebrewer thing than a universal beer thing. If you're brewing a normal gravity ale around 1.050 with an english or american strain it should be package ready in 10 days. It will have reached terminal gravity in 3-4 days, then raise the temperature up about 5 degrees for 3 days to condition, lower to 32 for 2 days so it drops bright and you're done.

My normal fermentation schedule is 68* for 3 days 72* for 3 days then chilled to 32 for 1 or 2 days.

That being said, having a metered amount of oxygen injected, proper pitching rates, and accurate temperature control are imperative. If you don't have those things down then it's going to take longer or be less predictable.

This is going back a little far but can someone explain the 3 days at 72* part? What does raising the temperature do?

I brewed my first batch last week, it was a MoreBeer American ale (all grain) and I have a mini fridge with a controller so I kept it at a steady 68*. I need to get a thief or something tomorrow so I can get a sample to test but I'm pretty sure primary fermentation is done. Can I test the gravity two days in a row to check or should I wait longer in between?

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tesilential
Nov 22, 2004

You're a credit to your community!

quantegy posted:

This is going back a little far but can someone explain the 3 days at 72* part? What does raising the temperature do?

I brewed my first batch last week, it was a MoreBeer American ale (all grain) and I have a mini fridge with a controller so I kept it at a steady 68*. I need to get a thief or something tomorrow so I can get a sample to test but I'm pretty sure primary fermentation is done. Can I test the gravity two days in a row to check or should I wait longer in between?

In the post you quoted, silver97232 says to raise the temperature about 5 degrees after primary to condition.

Basically the yeast work faster at higher temps and clean up the byproducts or off flavors of primary quicker. Since primary is over after 3 days or so, you don't run the risk of fusel alcohols and esters from higher temps. The higher temps also helps make sure your beer finishes attenuating and doesn't stall out. Some yeast require a temp raise to avoid stalling.

I let my beers rest at room temperature (74-78*) for a couple weeks to allow them to fully attenuate and condition before kegging. I also have to remove the kegs and let them sit at room temp while I ferment new batches, with no negative effects.

As a matter of fact the last gallon of Munich Helles I have tastes way better than it did 2 months ago. It was brewed in late May. That beer was on tap for 2 months and then at 78* for a few months. It finally lost the diacetyl off flavor it had.

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