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got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Is there any practical method of preserving wines once they've been opened? My bottle of Riesling already tastes somewhat vinegary and it's only day 3 (it's been kept in the fridge after opening)

I've tried those hand vacuum pumps that work with a rubber stopper and don't think they're effective

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got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


bartolimu posted:

The best I've managed is to be familiar enough with a couple of regions/varietals/styles I like to be capable of some critical thinking about costs within that genre. For instance, I know a decent amount about German Rieslings - enough to know I tend to prefer those from the Mosel region over others (there are always exceptions), and I have some idea of years in which weather influenced the quality of the wines. Based on that bit of knowledge I can usually pick out one of the better Rieslings in my price range. Occasionally I'm still surprised, though.

Being able to do that for all of winedom is probably beyond the grasp of anyone besides Master Soms, and even they can't know everything.

So Rieslings are a thing that I've been interested in lately; I visited RN74 in SF where they had a "Summer of Riesling" thing going on and had 5 half-glasses that night. Started with a recent Riesling Kabinett and ending in a syrupy mid-90s Donnhoff and was hooked every step of the way. Can you speak more about Rieslings please

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Reading through the last 10-15 pages of the thread, it sounds like people don't like Sauternes that much, which makes me sad because I love how they taste (or maybe I'm just a big babby that likes sugar). I will readily admit that I've had lots of indifferent Sauternes that taste like sugar water but I think they can be amazingly satisfying when things come together (aromatic, viscous, enough acid to balance things). I don't consider myself a wine expert or anything; could you guys please enlighten me as to why

Also, I know even less about domestic wine but the best that I've ever had, by far, was the 2007 Pahlmeyer Proprietary Red (Christmas present from a boss). Could someone please recommend me some similar wineries/bottles to try?

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Kasumeat posted:

You can consistently get mind-blowing Bonnezeaux for $40, Juracon for $20, or Auslese for $30. Why spend $60 for half-bottle of something half as good?

Just ordered a 1990 Chateau de Fesles Bonnezeaux. Thanks for the recommendation

Also I just won an auction for a 2001 Rieussec. SQUEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


I got a bottle of Lopez de Heredia's 1994 Gran Reserva on a whim and it was amazing; can anyone recommend other riojas? I know basically nothing about Spanish wine

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


idiotsavant posted:

SF-wise Bi-Rite should have it right now and Ruby carries it most of the time. Terroir has had it but I don't know that they have any right now. Bay Grape carries it in Oakland, and so does Ordinaire. I just started working with a distributor in CA, so there should be a few more places on the list soon. If you're drinking lots of Beaujolais right now you'll probably like it. It's pretty juicy but in that lighter Bojo way, with a little bit of green in back.

I finally got round to buying a bottle of T&T 2013 (from Bi-Rite) and it was delicious. Intended to have a glass and ended up finishing the bottle haha. By the way are you talking to K&L?

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Question: I almost always double decant whenever I bring wine to restaurants - the aeration is nice and it prevents the sediment from getting all stirred up. But when we went to this one restaurant in Napa they said they couldn't let us bring in the re-corked bottle under the terms of their liquor license (!)

I didn't want to abandon the wine - it was a special occasion and I'd brought a Shafer HS - so we said gently caress it, ordered some entrees to go, and drove *back* to our AirBnb to eat and drink

Is this just a Napa thing? Has this happened to anyone ever? I've been doing this for years and it's literally the first time I'm hearing of it

Comb Your Beard posted:

  • Where to go? I realize it's a huge region. I could skip the west (Muscadet) and the far east (Sancerre) if need be.

You should go see Domaine Huet - they make just about the best Vouvray

e: added the first qn

got off on a technicality fucked around with this message at Sep 3, 2016 around 22:22

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


PT6A posted:

This is doubly true if the wine has a bit of age and the cork requires any level of finesse to remove.

I do wonder why people still use corkscrews when a butler's friend is just as fast and doesn't break corks off in the bottle

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Ola posted:

Premox isn't TCA though. And also selection bias. Where did the can of worms emoticon go?

I don't drink white Burgundy much but isn't it infamous for premox, even very nice bottles? As if compensating for that history, the 2014 Aubert chardonnay I had recently was hilariously reductive

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Overwined posted:

Or you could put them back into your wine cooler and do what all the cool kids are doing these days -- drink gallons or pet-nat while wearing flip flops and gaudy-colored Ray Bans.

I had no idea what pet nat was until your post but residual sugar + CO2 + 8% alcohol sounds amazing so I just bought some Bugey Cerdon to celebrate

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Nephzinho posted:

tl;dr Help an aging beer snob become a better wine snob.
See pet nat discussion above. It's white/rose but low alcohol, fizzy and trendy and happy

For reds there's lots of wine being made with Rhone varietals (Grenache/Syrah/Mourvedre) that might fit the bill. Both Bonny Doon (Le Cigare Volant - highly tongue in cheek) and J Lohr are larger producers that might be worth trying

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Kasumeat posted:

So now that the '15s from the Old World are starting to hit the market, what are your thoughts? Wines from the coolest regions such as Chablis and Sancerre seem good, especially at the village-level-or-equivalent where more ripeness than usual might be welcome, but almost unrecognisable: Chablis is tasting more pineapple and peach than citrus and pome fruit; Beaujolais more kirsch and Chambord than cherry and raspberry. Acids are definitely lower than usual. I worry that more prestigious sites that see more ripeness had too short of a season to develop aromatics. If I had to put my money down now, I'd say this vintage is going to prove more like 2003 than 2010 (or even 2005).

I convinced myself to buy a bunch of pre-arrival 2015 Bordeaux (mostly right bank merlot from cold, clayey soils) as an "investment" so I hope it all works out. We'll find out in several years!

I do like the idea of lower acid Beaujolais and might go out and get some

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


I am an enormous wine snob, but I also like value. I recently attended a Sine Qua Non tasting organized by the Robert Parker people and people were saying, with completely straight faces, that no one other than Manfred Krankl has figured out how to make great Grenache-based wines in California. Which, even to someone like myself, sounds like straight poppycock (but the SQN wines, 8 of them, were of course superlative). Can anyone come up with some good counter examples please (to be clear, I'm not talking GSM blends, but 80-90% plus Grenache)?

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Huge disappointment from a 2007 Maybach Materium. Despite spells in an ice bucket to keep it below 60F, there was a good deal of unpleasant alcoholic heat. I guess one needs experiences like this to learn to distrust Parker points. The only two CA cabs that have made sense thus far to me: Shafer Hillside Select and Dominus. To make me feel better I'm reminding myself of some notes from better bottles I've had recently:
  • 1995 Chave Hermitage (Northern Rhone, France): black fruit, herby, savory, made me think of sesame (?!), goes down very nicely, in drinking window
  • 2003 La Mondotte (St Emilion, Bordeaux, France): inviting nose, no raisin/roasted character - surprising given the hot year, black fruit and tar, hint of sweetness, elegant & compelling
  • 2000 Roc de Cambes (Cotes de Bourg, Bordeaux, France): black fruit, trace of coffee & savoriness, lush and concentrated, great value. RdC is owned by Francois Mitjavile, an interesting character, and I would recommend seeking out wine from Tertre Roteboeuf (his crown jewel) if you can
  • 2004 Louise Brison Vintage Brut (Champagne, France): mushroomy/leesy on open - blew off after a while, honeyed & concentrated, citrusy acid on the end, great value. K&L gets these direct from the winery's cellar
  • 1989 Pichon Lalande (Pauillac, Bordeaux, France): pencil, blackcurrant, plum, lovely balance, persistent finish, went well with a dinner that was mainly seafood (!)

Octy posted:

I love seeing Australian wines in foreign restaurants. I'm in Singapore and the prices are so jumped up, like the 2013 Tyrrell's Rufus Stone Heathcote Shiraz which was at $130 a bottle. It's a good, perhaps unappreciated wine, but one I can get for less than $20 in-store.

IIRC the import taxes on alcohol are ridiculous but if you stay on the lookout you can find decently good stuff for ok prices. My biggest score was a 1989 Bel-Air Lagrave for ~$75

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


idiotsavant posted:

Uhhhh. If you're freezing Napa Cabs because you're sensitive to alcohol levels you might be doing wine wrong.

Edit: like not to say that I love big Cali Cabernet, just that no one is forcing you to drink it...

Yes exactly; I'm finding the very alcoholic (that Maybach was 14.8% I think) cult cabs increasingly unsatisfying. Oh well, I now know better

You know more about winemaking than I do so tell me if this is right - an excess of fruit/tannin can mask high alcohol levels when a wine is young, but as the wine ages the fruit/tannin recedes and the alcohol comes to the fore. Hence it should be possible for something to taste great when first bottled, but get increasingly out of balance & unappealing as it ages

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Crimson posted:

Although my list is an anecdotal example, I have built and maintained two WS Grand Award winning wine lists in Vegas and SF, and am currently attempting to build another. I'm also intimately familiar with most of the fine dining lists in the Bay Area, and I don't know anyone who is dedicating a large portion of their lists to natural wines

What's your favorite list in SF at a place you aren't/haven't been affiliated with? Mine are Terroir and The Morris (hellooooo perfectly stored 80s Napa cabs for ~$110)

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


nervana posted:

I am visiting NYC for the weekend and want to buy a nice bottle of wine for a couple in their late 30's. They live in Chicago (as do I) and travel often, and they enjoy wine, so they've probably tried a whole bunch, but are not wine snobs. Is there anything in New York that I can buy that is decent and not readily available in Chicago? I am thinking under $100, but can go over that if needed. It doesn't have to be rare or anything, but I just want to get them something nice and show that I put some thought into it.

Rather late but doesn't the North fork of Long Island produce a bunch of interesting wine? I once had an awesome (skunky) sparkling red from there. I bet it's much easier to find that sort of thing in NYC than Chicago

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Wine in China is always weird, but I observed something you all might find entertaining. This is Apothic Red (courtesy of Gallo) on the shelf of an airport wine shop in Shanghai, listed for the equivalent ~$86. The shrink wrap? Why it's to protect the precious label while you age this for decades in your personal wine cellar. Not pictured: the 2007 Lafite on a nearby shelf, selling for many thousands of dollars

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got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Comb Your Beard posted:

1991 Carmenet Cabernet Franc (Sonoma) - Awesome. No bell pepper notes here. Quite unlike the aged left bank Red Bdx I had, this showed age in a very different way. Definite aged notes.

Nice. I had a 1984 Carmenet (bdx blend) at a restaurant a while back and remember it quite fondly. Rather 'sweeter' and juicier than the French equivalent. Did you find this on a wine list or at a retailer? I ask because I've been meaning to pick up a few if I can find it, and 1991 is certainly as good as any vintage for quite a range

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


I like my cab francs ripe and from 09 and with a cheval blanc label on

(jk I've never had cheval blanc)

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


How about Pol Roger Sir Winston Churchill? IMO cooler and tastier

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Kasumeat posted:

Agreed, but the true pinnacle of the grape is screamingly acidic off-dry rose

Can you please recommend an example of this

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear



What's up Gabriel Glas buddy

I've never had it; is it really worth the tariff to source? Do you prefer it to Clape, Allemand, etc

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


woe is me I have fallen down the Burgundy rabbit hole

it goes something like: oh people are saying Roumier's an awesome producer, let's go look up the pricing on their musigny/amoureuses/bonnes mares......

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got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Nicely done. I've not had that one but have been very happy with 09 vintage champagne anytime I've had it

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Yes anything but Mumm

If they have Laurent Perrier I like LP's NV Ultra Brut for not much more than Clicquot. Also pretty happy with Taittinger

e: have you examined the wonderful world of pet nat (anything from Bugey-Cerdon for example)

got off on a technicality fucked around with this message at Mar 8, 2018 around 16:39

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Furious Lobster posted:

‘06 Taittinger Comtes is drinking really nice now. I bought a couple of cases to age and have already gone through 1.

I am a CdC fan and don't love the 06 although everyone else seems to :/

Plus there's Krug GC 165 to be had for not much more

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Where I am the 06 CdC is ~$125 and the GC 165 is ~$155 but that's fair. FWIW I've had both the 164 and 165 and I think the 165 is much more generous for near-term drinking though the 164 is more complex and likely more rewarding further out

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


I've just bought a bottle; thanks for the tip

By the way do you know the SommPicks and the Vine & Rare people? Are they good?

e: make sure you try Mumm DVX for maximum hate

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Crimson posted:

As far as Vine & Rare, I have bought tens of thousands of dollars of wine from them, and the failure rate on their bottles is perfectly in reasonable range for the age of their offerings. They also offer full refunds on all manners of wine faults. The guys behind it are good friends of mine, really good dudes.

Nice; please tell them I've been loving the selection & the service. I could see them match/exceed Envoyer in terms of my monthly wine buying (oh my god my partner is going to kill me)

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Furious Lobster posted:

Ive been spending a lot in the fb razzle groups
Wait a minute what are these?

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Skooms posted:

I pretty consistently read this thread, and I'm based out of NYC. I also know Caleb. Just to throw a little more world touching out there. I work at one of the the restaurants in NYC that is half (two thirds?) way to establishing itself as a wine (spender) destination.

I'd love to know which restaurant, if only because I like going to that sort of place when I visit NYC; maybe tell me via PM please?

quote:

We decided on the Bollinger Special Cuvee, and it was great last night! It tasted much better after it was given time to "breath", which I think I remember Roger Moore actually saying in some Bond film.

I've found that I increasingly prefer giving whites/champagnes more air & time. Reds of all kinds I just pop & pour (& follow their development in glass)

got off on a technicality fucked around with this message at Mar 18, 2018 around 21:41

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Snowy posted:

Vague request: I'd like to give a bottle of red wine as a gift, but I don't know exactly what the recipient likes. Is there something I could get in the $40-60 range that's a surefire hit and also likely for me to be able to find easily? I'm in NYC so I have a few good wine shops but their suggestions can be hit or miss so I figured I should see what you guys think. I'm guessing something like cabernet since it's easy, but I'm open.

Ridge Geyserville would be a reliable choice; I've had it a number of times and it's a confirmed crowd pleaser. Also it can age (I've tasted ~40 year old Ridge zins in great shape) and has wine geek cred
https://www.freerangebrooklyn.com/s...lle-2012/dp/841

If you want to take a bit more of a risk and/or your recipient is a Francophile (i.e. snob like me) 2015 was a nice ripe year all over France and IMO Burgundy village wines from known producers are good buys. This is what I'd pick over a Napa cab (in my v humble opinion Napa cabs can be worse value than Burgundy, which is saying something)
https://www.chambersstwines.com/Pro...marsannay-rouge

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Trimson Grondag 3 posted:

Thanks, I'm limited to three 750ml bottles duty free so each one is precious. Other than being way cheaper its mostly about being able to get things you won't ever get in Australia like auction german riesling or a lot of priorat (I loving love priorat). Bordeaux is actually about the same price so probably a bad example.

Over the years I've flown with really nice bottles all over the place (e.g. West Coast -> Singapore with ~18h flight time) and have never had a problem even with champagne bottles. Per Kasumeat the main risk is breakage - the temperature in the baggage hold will be fine. You could be paranoid like me and go the extra mile with bubble wrap and mini cold packs, but just wrapping your bottles in clothes ought to be fine

These days I just have a wine check http://www.thewinecheck.com/

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


PT6A posted:

I need a reality check here. Wine bars (not restaurants, self-titled bars) that take reservations: complete bullshit, right?

Wouldn't agree that taking reservations is a priori bullshit but perhaps living in the Bay Areas has warped my perspective

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Jerome Louis posted:

Welp the cooler we use to store all our wine sensory bottles froze over the weekend and destroyed over $10,000 of wine, cool stuff

Fascinating; what do they put in there exactly

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Kasumeat posted:

Look on the bright side, you probably have a bunch of wine that needs to be consumed ASAP. I drank a lot of Leflaive when our fridge at work froze, it really wasn't so bad.

This sounds like a lovely problem to have. I've never bought any Leflaive because I've been scared off by reports of premox; would you say they're exaggerated? Or were you drinking wines from before it apparently started happening (IIRC 2009 or so)

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Kasumeat posted:

Depends what you're drinking. France, Italy, and Spain are the worst offenders, particularly in wines bottled before the late 2000sas many as 10-15% of these are corked, though they've pushed it down to around 5% in the past decade or so. California is the only New World wine region where it's relatively common, with incidence hovering around 2-5%.

So if you're drinking a lot of high-risk bottles, yeah, you're almost certainly just missing it. If you don't, them you're probably just lucky/smart.

I'm in the same boat as CYB; I've had ~170 in the past 2 years, of which ~80% is French, and I've only definitively found 2 that are corked. So I'm missing maybe 90% of the ones that are. Per Ola/Kasumeat I've heard that people vary in their sensitivity to TCA, and that subtle TCA can manifest itself as an absence of fruit (vs. an overt cardboardy smell). Or perhaps we're just ridiculously lucky

Kidding aside, in a way I'm glad my palate isn't super sensitive to TCA

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


By the way for the N Rhone lovers out there - I recently tried a 2015 Xavier Gerard Cote Rotie alongside some heavy hitters (Allemand Reynard, Benetiere Dolium, Gonon, Jamet, Juge, Levet) and it more than held its own against bottles costing multiples more. Highly recommended

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got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear




I imagined you'd bought your new glasses at BDIX

Were you there too?

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