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Tremblay
Oct 8, 2002
More dog whistles than a Petco

Fog Tripper posted:

I travel back and forth to visit my home town every couple years. Usually on the spur of the moment. Filing a form each time would suck, and serve no purpose. There should be nfa reciprocity just like ccw.

The issue isn't really reciprocity for possession. It's the ATF wanting to know where that poo poo is at. You can just file a form 20 once a year every year if you want. I agree it's stupid but so is NFA.

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DarkHorse
Dec 13, 2006

Vroom Vroom, BEEP BEEP!

Nap Ghost

Is there any interest in updating the OP now that 41p has been approved and all? I'm sure I can find the relevant info from atf.gov and miscellaneous other sites, but I like the comfort from knowing it's been given at least a once-over here (This attitude probably also explains a lot of my poor decisions)

Specifically I still want to set up a trust even though I know I have to fingerprint everyone in it now, but when I buy a new toy do I have to send in everyone's information each time? Is the fearmongering about "the trust has to be the one that purchases the NFA item" accurate? What other things should I consider regarding suppressors and SBRs regarding trusts in a post-41F world?

Stuff like this makes me think it's just one trustee's info, but then is setting up the trust in this way something that can still be done by some schmuck with Quicken?

TapTheForwardAssist
Apr 9, 2007

Pretty Little Lyres

Three quick and related questions:

-- when a police department can buy full-auto guns, of recent manufacture that normal people can't buy, is the broad term for that Post Sample?

-- in terms of Post Sample (or whatever the broader term is), if one happened to owe a police department a favor, and wanted to get them a totally fun and impractical .22LR full-auto firearm just for them to have fun with at range days, what's a reasonably-affordable .22 to get them? Can the department just buy a 10/22 and buy a cheap Post Sample drop-in action and go to town for like $100 instead of the $10k the rest of us pay?

-- I'm dimly aware there are several firearms made that vaguely resemble the Suomi sub-gun; is there any .22 version available a Post-Sample full-auto, or that could be easily converted to such by an SOT for a police department?

Craptacular
Jul 11, 2004



TapTheForwardAssist posted:

-- when a police department can buy full-auto guns, of recent manufacture that normal people can't buy, is the broad term for that Post Sample?
Yes.

TapTheForwardAssist posted:

-- in terms of Post Sample (or whatever the broader term is), if one happened to owe a police department a favor, and wanted to get them a totally fun and impractical .22LR full-auto firearm just for them to have fun with at range days, what's a reasonably-affordable .22 to get them?
Probably a 10/22 trigger pack.

TapTheForwardAssist posted:

Can the department just buy a 10/22 and buy a cheap Post Sample drop-in action and go to town for like $100 instead of the $10k the rest of us pay?
Yes. Probably budget a bit more than $100 though.

TapTheForwardAssist posted:

-- I'm dimly aware there are several firearms made that vaguely resemble the Suomi sub-gun; is there any .22 version available a Post-Sample full-auto, or that could be easily converted to such by an SOT for a police department?
I've never seen such a firearm, but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Midjack
Dec 24, 2007






I thought when a police department got a machine gun it was just a non-transferable machine gun an not even an FFL could buy it from them. The FFL can get a post sample for T&E if a department asks for a demo in writing.

Craptacular
Jul 11, 2004



Midjack posted:

I thought when a police department got a machine gun it was just a non-transferable machine gun an not even an FFL could buy it from them. The FFL can get a post sample for T&E if a department asks for a demo in writing.

If a police department buys a registered machine gun from an SOT, then the gun may later be transferred out to an SOT, as long as the SOT has a demo letter for the gun (e.g. the same limitation as if the gun was being transferred from one SOT to another).

If a police department confiscates an unregistered machine gun, they can register it on a form 10, and that gun can never be transferred to any entity other than another government agency.

Semi-related, read this post on Subguns.com about how some illegal Vietnam-era bringback AKs were remanufactured into transferables. This was before 1986, so new machine guns could still be transferred to the general public. Since they were illegally imported they had the same status as a form 10 gun now, but cutting the receivers made them into scrap metal (legally speaking) which an enterprising SOT could then remake and register.

Midjack
Dec 24, 2007





Thanks for that explanation!

stgdz
Nov 3, 2006

158 grains of smiley powered justice

S&w apparently purchased gemtech

Doctor Grape Ape
Aug 26, 2005

Dammit Doc, I just bought this for you 3 months ago. Try and keep it around for a bit longer this time.


stgdz posted:

S&w apparently purchased gemtech

That's... interesting. I guess with Ruger making cans that got under S&W's skin. Or Dr. Dater is looking to retire.

e: I kind of wish I had purchased one of their pill bottles and Auroras, as I'm sure those are never going to get another production run now.

Sten Freak
Sep 10, 2008

Despite all of these shortcomings, the Sten still has a long track record of shooting people right in the face.


College Slice

There is a PPSh clone in 22 that were either made or converted to FA. I think the one I've seen come up was the PPS-50. Suomi-ish. Post sample could be tricky. Putting up a WTB ad on subguns could help, or just asking on the general NFA board.

wheres my beer
Apr 29, 2004


Tryin' to catch me ridin' dirty


Fun Shoe

TapTheForwardAssist posted:


-- in terms of Post Sample (or whatever the broader term is), if one happened to owe a police department a favor, and wanted to get them a totally fun and impractical .22LR full-auto firearm just for them to have fun with at range days, what's a reasonably-affordable .22 to get them? Can the department just buy a 10/22 and buy a cheap Post Sample drop-in action and go to town for like $100 instead of the $10k the rest of us pay?

-- I'm dimly aware there are several firearms made that vaguely resemble the Suomi sub-gun; is there any .22 version available a Post-Sample full-auto, or that could be easily converted to such by an SOT for a police department?

American 180s are fun on a bun.

Does anyone know if CMMG 22lr ar uppers are reliable in full auto?

Craptacular
Jul 11, 2004



Doctor Grape Ape posted:

That's... interesting. I guess with Ruger making cans that got under S&W's skin. Or Dr. Dater is looking to retire.

He already sold it a couple years ago to an investor. IIRC he was/is still working there as a consultant.

Miso Beno posted:

American 180s are fun on a bun.

Does anyone know if CMMG 22lr ar uppers are reliable in full auto?

Yes but even a post-sample 180 will be well out of the specified price range.

For the CMMG upper, make sure the BCG includes the autosear trip. It's a separate part that usually isn't included.

Craptacular fucked around with this message at 15:09 on Jul 2, 2017

TapTheForwardAssist
Apr 9, 2007

Pretty Little Lyres

Maybe best bet is to have a 10/22 mocked up to resemble a Suomi, give an SOT the money for an FA Post-Sample trigger pack, then tell the cops to contact the SOT to arrange delivery?

https://m.imgur.com/r/1022/Z46Y6cu

What's the preferred SOT for FA PS 10/22s?

TapTheForwardAssist fucked around with this message at 16:05 on Jul 2, 2017

Craptacular
Jul 11, 2004



TapTheForwardAssist posted:

What's the preferred SOT for FA PS 10/22s?

I don't know if there is one. I did a little googling and Norrell doesn't appear to make posties. But with stuff like this book readily available, any halfway competent 07/02 should be able to make one.

TapTheForwardAssist
Apr 9, 2007

Pretty Little Lyres

Related to my SOT gift question, and building on the "what .22 bolt action for my mother" thread, mom is on deathwatch right now at a hospital in Michigan, but as soon as she passes we are having a *grand* old hooley with rifles and airguns, then tons of beer, then switch to Nerf guns, then board games until dawn. She wants no funeral, no grave, no monument, so instead we're donating funds from family for public artworks and cultural projects for the town that she's to die in, and for me since the tiny town is hugely Finnish I want to donate a "Suomi" 10/22 to the local PD for their support in this tough time.

Anyhoo, a bunch of relatives are coming up at the end of July to come party further. I'll re-iterate a previous offer: if anyone has a .22 suppressor that's FA rated and would fit on standard threads (mainly a CZ bolt gun, and on my Lage .22 upper for my MAC), if you're willing to add me to your trust for just like two weeks and ship it to Michigan so we can all go blow poo poo up, I'll happily pay you a deposit for the full value of can/stamp/shipping, sign whatever contract you want, etc. and return it promptly when done and buy you some awesome holster or grips or case or whatever as thanks. There's just no time to order a can from scratch, and we want to make this party extra awesome, including shooting her .22 (and I'll probably thread the muzzle on her old Remington Nylon 77 since it's going as an heirloom to a visiting niece). PM me if down, and I think I'm known enough here that someone will be comfy with this, and I've done my research (but please feel free to double-check me) and this appears to be totally kosher both federally and in MI.

Somebody Awful
Nov 27, 2011

BORN TO DIE
HAIG IS A FUCK
Kill Em All 1917
I am trench man
410,757,864,530 SHELLS FIRED




Sten Freak posted:

There is a PPSh clone in 22 that were either made or converted to FA. I think the one I've seen come up was the PPS-50.

The only connection the Pietta Puma, AKA PPS-50, has to the PPSh is being dishonestly marketed as a 'descendant' by shitheels like Mitchell's Mausers.

Doctor Grape Ape
Aug 26, 2005

Dammit Doc, I just bought this for you 3 months ago. Try and keep it around for a bit longer this time.


Craptacular posted:

He already sold it a couple years ago to an investor. IIRC he was/is still working there as a consultant.

Ah, didn't know that.

I did have another thought, perhaps S&W wants to compete against SilencerCo's Maxim. IIRC the Maxim was designed on an S&W M&P 9 (I know the final product bears no resemblance in looks or function) so they might be a little bit miffed about that. Given the trends in the market I'm not surprised S&W is going down the suppressor road, I'm mostly surprised they did it by purchasing Gemtech, it's both unexpected and pretty smart. They easily could have scooped up any one of the many new suppressor start ups but they went after the king of the mountain.

Tremblay
Oct 8, 2002
More dog whistles than a Petco

Doctor Grape Ape posted:

Ah, didn't know that.

I did have another thought, perhaps S&W wants to compete against SilencerCo's Maxim. IIRC the Maxim was designed on an S&W M&P 9 (I know the final product bears no resemblance in looks or function) so they might be a little bit miffed about that. Given the trends in the market I'm not surprised S&W is going down the suppressor road, I'm mostly surprised they did it by purchasing Gemtech, it's both unexpected and pretty smart. They easily could have scooped up any one of the many new suppressor start ups but they went after the king of the mountain.

Echoing he's still around. The HD Military I posted a page or two ago was made by him.

I just hope they fix what's broken, and leave what works well enough alone...

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

TapTheForwardAssist posted:

Related to my SOT gift question, and building on the "what .22 bolt action for my mother" thread, mom is on deathwatch right now at a hospital in Michigan, but as soon as she passes we are having a *grand* old hooley with rifles and airguns, then tons of beer, then switch to Nerf guns, then board games until dawn. She wants no funeral, no grave, no monument, so instead we're donating funds from family for public artworks and cultural projects for the town that she's to die in, and for me since the tiny town is hugely Finnish I want to donate a "Suomi" 10/22 to the local PD for their support in this tough time.

Anyhoo, a bunch of relatives are coming up at the end of July to come party further. I'll re-iterate a previous offer: if anyone has a .22 suppressor that's FA rated and would fit on standard threads (mainly a CZ bolt gun, and on my Lage .22 upper for my MAC), if you're willing to add me to your trust for just like two weeks and ship it to Michigan so we can all go blow poo poo up, I'll happily pay you a deposit for the full value of can/stamp/shipping, sign whatever contract you want, etc. and return it promptly when done and buy you some awesome holster or grips or case or whatever as thanks. There's just no time to order a can from scratch, and we want to make this party extra awesome, including shooting her .22 (and I'll probably thread the muzzle on her old Remington Nylon 77 since it's going as an heirloom to a visiting niece). PM me if down, and I think I'm known enough here that someone will be comfy with this, and I've done my research (but please feel free to double-check me) and this appears to be totally kosher both federally and in MI.

Where in Michigan?

TapTheForwardAssist
Apr 9, 2007

Pretty Little Lyres

infrared35 posted:

Where in Michigan?

Far Upper. But I may have a local NFA dealer who owes me a favor and will let me borrow some product samples for a week.

Steeltalon
Feb 14, 2012

Perps were uncooperative.




Hmm Never seen anything like this before. High-speed low drag sci-fi suppressor.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdOEAzCJ7Ww

Sten Freak
Sep 10, 2008

Despite all of these shortcomings, the Sten still has a long track record of shooting people right in the face.


College Slice

Wait times:





E:
blue are form 4 trusts, red are form 4 individual

Tremblay
Oct 8, 2002
More dog whistles than a Petco

Sten Freak posted:

Wait times:





E:
blue are form 4 trusts, red are form 4 individual

Not surprising, people are taking family vacations and such. I've been waiting 3 weeks for a check to be cashed by NFA branch.

Steeltalon
Feb 14, 2012

Perps were uncooperative.




I thought wait times would be going down by now with suppressor sales being at an all time low. The 41p rush backlog still going?

SpartanIvy
May 18, 2007


Hair Elf

Didn't someone here build a maglite suppressor? I've got an old 5 D-cell maglite that I'm thinking would be a ridiculously bitchin looking suppressor.

SpartanIvy fucked around with this message at 17:12 on Jul 10, 2017

Doctor Grape Ape
Aug 26, 2005

Dammit Doc, I just bought this for you 3 months ago. Try and keep it around for a bit longer this time.


Steeltalon posted:

I thought wait times would be going down by now with suppressor sales being at an all time low. The 41p rush backlog still going?

They are still finishing that backlog/mailing them out. I'm still waiting on one.

Roundboy
Oct 21, 2008


12 month wait times are 245 days, 3 month average is 302. Paper F4 trust.

Also lol at ny with 3 nfa transfers. Ca with 16

dbltp
Apr 29, 2009


So my trust form 4 for my first suppressor came back on 7/11 stamp attached after exactly 365 days and i went out shooting with it the other day and it was loving awesome. I was shooting it on a g19, CZ P-01 and my sub2K and while the P-01 worked flawlessly with the booster the glock would barely cycle with some Freedom Munitions 147gr remans, was a little better with the Lawman 147gr and some HSTs.

To the point where the pistol did not return to battery until I released the trigger.

This seemed to get better over the course of about 200rnds through the booster. 1st ~25 rnds through G19 with terrible reliability, next 150 through P--01 with perfect reliability and last 30ish through G19 where they all cycled but just barely.

Do the boosters sometimes take a little time to loose up or should I take it apart and lubricate it or is the suppressor just too heavy for the G19?

Also gently caress shooting without suppressors from now on, this was the most fun shooting I have had in a long time.

Fog Tripper
Mar 3, 2008

by Smythe


365 days?
it has to get better from here on out, right?

dbltp
Apr 29, 2009


Well considering I sent it on the last day before 41P went into effect I would hope that we have peaked... really really hoping...

various cheeses
Jan 24, 2013



I'm debating ordering a maxim 9 to go with my MDR preorder just to see which one will actually be in my hands first.

Sten Freak
Sep 10, 2008

Despite all of these shortcomings, the Sten still has a long track record of shooting people right in the face.


College Slice

Yeah that last graph I posted clearly shows to me an upward trend, not a plateau and most certainly not a decline in wait times so unless something dramatic happens we are still in the great 41P wait.

MrBusiness
Jan 19, 2016


Sten Freak posted:

Yeah that last graph I posted clearly shows to me an upward trend, not a plateau and most certainly not a decline in wait times so unless something dramatic happens we are still in the great 41P wait.

Maybe all the examiners are on vacation after busting their asses processing all the 41P paperwork?

Doctor Grape Ape
Aug 26, 2005

Dammit Doc, I just bought this for you 3 months ago. Try and keep it around for a bit longer this time.


Got my Rugged Surge today, just 4 days shy of a year from the check cashed date. Putting it on an AR upper makes it feel like 10x more badass, can't wait to try it out.

Also, Lego needs to get into making suppressors: https://www.rainierarms.com/q-silencer-erector

e: with all 10 baffles that thing weighs 2.6 ounces

Doctor Grape Ape fucked around with this message at 02:00 on Jul 19, 2017

ZebraBlade
Mar 26, 2010

Something is rotten in the state of Denmark

My Tirant 9m still hasn't shipped from the seller to my class 3 guy right at 2 months today.

tangy yet delightful
Sep 13, 2005





Does anyone have any thoughts and/or opinions regarding the Hearing Protection Act (wa-po article) actually passing both houses and being signed into law by Trump?

Please keep answers specifically related to the bill and not a political derail.

Bummey
May 26, 2004

you are a filth wizard, friend only to the grumpig and the rattata


lol not gonna happen

Craptacular
Jul 11, 2004



tangy yet delightful posted:

Does anyone have any thoughts and/or opinions regarding the Hearing Protection Act (wa-po article) actually passing both houses and being signed into law by Trump?

I think if anything gets passed it'll be the SHARE Act. It's basically the HPA plus a few other pro-gun things added to a larger hunting/outdoor bill. I'd love to see the SHUSH Act that's in the Senate pass, but it makes silencers totally unregulated (the same as a flash suppressor) and that's probably going too far for some senators and congressmen, who'd vote for the SHARE or HPA.

I'm not holding my breath though.

wheres my beer
Apr 29, 2004


Tryin' to catch me ridin' dirty


Fun Shoe



This arrangement is way dreamier than I ever thought it would be.

wheres my beer fucked around with this message at 06:03 on Jul 20, 2017

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Fog Tripper
Mar 3, 2008

by Smythe


tangy yet delightful posted:

Does anyone have any thoughts and/or opinions regarding the Hearing Protection Act (wa-po article) actually passing both houses and being signed into law by Trump?

Please keep answers specifically related to the bill and not a political derail.

Yes, I have thoughts on it. Also opinions.

Miso Beno posted:



This arrangement is way dreamier than I ever thought it would be.

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