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Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

This article seems to address some of the "should I get it on Xbox or PS3" and "how does Xbox party chat work" concerns:
http://kotaku.com/5844514/hows-dark...ing-on-xbox-360

Schwartzcough fucked around with this message at Sep 28, 2011 around 03:31

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Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Happy Blue Cow posted:

Just to make sure... since Dark Souls got rid of the whole Body Form & Soul Form mechanic, where a Body-form player can only summon Soul-form players... In this game, you can summon ANYONE using the White Soapstone? Their Humanity amount doesn't matter?

Pretty sure it's basically the same. You need to restore your humanity at a bonfire to be in "human" form, rather than desiccated zombie form, to summon blue phantoms or be invaded by black phantoms.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Macksy posted:

Are there any walkthrough videos that really explain how the combat in this game works? I like the difficulty of games like ninja gaiden and bayonetta and have been wanting something new, but i can't tell if I will like this(I understand it isn't fast paced and linear like those.)

The screenshots and text aren't really helping me and I haven't played the games it has been compared to.

Edit - I get the exploration and how the world works parts, but the combat mechanics are still fuzzy to me.

Some people early in the thread described it pretty well. You can lock on to enemies like in Zelda games (or not; there are times and places for both). Then you have a relatively basic selection of Block, Parry, dodge, regular attack, and strong attack (with some slight variations. Pressing forward+regular attack will perform a push or some other attack variant. Attacking after a roll or during a sprint will perform another attack, etc.). Some attacks may stun or interrupt some enemies; others won't. Fighting is all about watching attack patterns and waiting for safe openings to attack, and blocking or dodging while you wait for those openings. Probably most important is watching your stamina gauge- you almost always want to leave enough to block an attack or roll away, because enemies (all of them) can kill you extremely quickly and your healing is limited.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Samurai Sanders posted:

Some level of heavy armor (I don't understand what yet) causes your animations to not be interrupted by enemy attacks, so that is a big boon for heavy armor. However, I'm still going with light myself, especially since, like in Demon's, the black leather armor gives you all kinds of status effect resistances.

edit: also the general idea that if you are getting hit over and over again to the point where heavy armor is making a big difference, it probably means that you are doing something fundamentally wrong and need to improve.

I have heard that rolling in Dark Souls isn't as effective as it was in Demon's- not as many invincibility frames, and you need to be practically naked to get the fastest roll. Is that your experience so far?

I get the impression they improved heavy armor, and nerfed the roll a bit to balance things out.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

der juicen posted:

Thanks yall. I've pretty much trained myself since my accident happened, once I figured ?I could play games. I've nearly beaten Deus Ex on second hardest difficulty, beaten asscred, dragon age 2, currently playing Madden and NHL, which use the left stick to move. Well, all those games do. I've gotten use to hitting LB fast enough in those games that need it.

I think I may have a chance with a range character or a rolling tank. I don't like shields anyways.

I'd say go light armor for as quick a roll as possible. Being able to avoid attacks will probably be more useful than taking things on the chin in heavy armor. Heavy armor tends to make you really slow, so dodging becomes difficult. It's not so bad with a shield, but you usually have to hold the block button down, not just tap it every once in a while.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

evilalien posted:

Yes, you get a unique weapon that requires a ton of strength to use. Because it requires such high stats, it's advised to just get it at the beginning of your NG+ where you can just decimate him easily.

Is it confirmed that you redo the tutorial area in a NG+? You didn't in Demon's Souls- it just kicked you right to the Nexus.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Samurai Sanders posted:

Well, its not a big deal since you can travel back to the tutorial area any time you want, I assume in new game plus as well. New enemies are there though.

The issue isn't getting back to the tutorial area, the issue is that the tutorial boss only drops a special item if you kill him the FIRST time you see him in the tutorial. People were suggesting getting it on NG+, but if it skips you over the tutorial like it does in Demon's Souls, your only chance to get it would be during your first run.

And you could redo the tutorial on NG+ in Demon's Souls? Did you have to turn the game off before the credits were done or something?

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Gazmachine posted:

Does anyone have footage of the dev invasions?

I don't know if these invasions were ever even verified. I saw one screenshot of an uber-character-monster status screen, and lots of articles talking about "reports of From devs invading," but it all sounded like secondhand rumors.

It'd be awesome if true, though.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

So I had assumed that all classes were given an equal amount of base stat points distributed differently, and that a class that started at Soul Level 3 would simply have 2 more stat points than a class that starts at Soul Level 1. But according to the stats on the Wiki, this isn't the case. The Sorcerer is Soul Level 3, but has the lowest combined stats at 82. Meanwhile, the Wanderer is also Soul Level 3 and has 86 points, while the Pyromancer is Soul Level 1, and has 84 stat points. The Deprived class actually seems to get a lot of points per level, with 88 points at level 6. (I think the Wanderer has the best points per level ratio, though).

I suppose in the end starting equipment is probably more important (and different value armors and weapons may account for the stat differences). I just thought it was interesting. This concludes the

Schwartzcough fucked around with this message at Oct 1, 2011 around 06:27

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

ErIog posted:

I also got invaded for the first time in the defilement-like area. The invader was terribad. He was naked save for a meat cleaver, and I was able to sidestep + backstab my way to an easy victory. The rewards for killing invaders in this game are substantial. It makes me want to stay in human form more often to try to take more of them out.

Did you catch the invader's name? The people on the IGN stream encountered a naked "invader" with a meat cleaver in the swamp which they easily dispatched- turns out it was actually an NPC invader.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Dolphin Fetus posted:

I really hope they don't "fix" DeS' character creator but merely add more options. I made the ugliest character possible with tiny eyes, a sphincter for a mouth and a huge mosquito nose. I wish mmos had DeS' character creation options.

I don't think you need to worry about not being able to make monstrosities.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Sheep-Goats posted:

Can we add the following as a spoiler to the OP (or second post or whatever), it's about which gifts to choose and I got the info and modified them from some wiki:


What starting gift should I pick?

Minor spoiler:Take the pendant or the master key.

Detailed spoiler:

In my view there are basically three options and one joke option. All of the other gifts are consumables that can be purchased later in the game.
  • The pendant. An NPC you'll meet later on will want it and you can only get it as a gift at the start of the game. This is the "enhance the plot options" choice.
  • The master key. As you play you'll find reusable keys as you go that unlock gates that mostly open up new areas. The master key replaces some of these and is also reusable so it allows you to sequence break a bit. There's also a door in the tutorial level which the master key opens that gives you a strong starting weapon -- it's the effective Crescent Falchion of Dark Souls. Note that the Thief starts with a free master key, so if you want to choose "all of the above" take a thief and pick the pendant.
  • No gift at all. This was one of the options suggested by the game's director. Why? We don't know yet. Maybe there's a reward for not taking a gift. It is though.
  • Joke option: the black firebomb. People use this to facilitate killing the tutorial boss which drops a unique weapon which requires a ton of strength to use.

Any idea what benefit giving this person the Pendant gets you? Fancy equipment or spells, or just some extra lines of dialogue?

Also, any idea what the Witch's Ring is for? That was another of the "no known uses" gifts.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Bland posted:

I have no idea if this is helpful or not as I haven't played the game but here's a guide to removing curse http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJq3Dz46Tso

Apologies if it's of no help

That says a patch was released (at least for the JP version) that makes an easier to access merchant sell the cure as well. So maybe they realized being able to get cursed before you can reliably reach a cure was an oversight.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Dan Didio posted:

Yo, peeps, I'm going to be playing a Deprived on my first runthrough; with every stat an eleven, how many starting spell slots/miracle slots is that?

All spells/miracles/pyromancy spells share the same slots, which are governed by Attunement. You get 1 slot at 10, and a second slot at 12. So you'll be one point away from 2 slots.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Nelson Mandingo posted:

You need 30 dex to get the upgraded roll, though. Perhaps he had an item that boosted his stats?

That table says it's just a placeholder, and they don't know the values. I've heard that 20 dexterity will get you the handspring rather than a roll. However, I do think your Endurance/Equip Burden still matters for your rolling and movement speed.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Capsaicin posted:

I can't get past the first two skeletons on the outside of Firelink Shrine.

You aren't supposed to go that way right away. Look for other paths with weaker enemies.

Also: My order has been "Shipping Soon" for almost 24 hours now. Define "soon."

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Ok, I'm now over 200 pages behind on this thread, so gently caress trying to catch up.

I just got the Antiquated dress items; they all say how they're not meant for combat and don't provide any protection, but holy poo poo the skirt is amazing! Unfortunately, now I'm going to look retarded running around in a skirt all the time...

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Oh god damnit. Since I actually had humanity for about the first time ever, I summoned Solaire and a white phantom to take on Gaping Dragon. Solaire got killed immediately, but me and the white phantom were doing fine; except he got grabbed and I had to chug about four flasks to keep him alive. The dragon was down to a sliver of health, and I go running at his butt after one of his charges and then fall over dead from full health. I guess I got too close to him while he was running, even though I was running at him from behind and none of him hit me.

Sorry white phantom buddy; no souls or humanity for you today.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Orange Crush Rush posted:

I just got summoned for the Carpa Demon, and I'm level 32. Huh.

Yeah, I got summoned for the Gargoyles when I was level 30. That boss battle did not last long.

By the way, I've killed a billion of the undead knights at the Parish trying to get them to drop a Balder Side Sword, and even with the Covetous Gold Serpents Ring and 6 humanity, they just won't drop it. Do they drop it at all, or do I have to get it from the ones at Sens Fortress or something?

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Dizz posted:

I finally caved and bought the game. I never played Demon Souls so this will be completely blind for me. Is there anything I need to take note of before playing other than being disgustingly careful?

Don't take the Tiny Beings Ring as your gift; Master Key is probably your best bet. The attack buttons are on the shoulders of the controller, so be very careful (especially with the PS3) when setting controllers down around peaceful NPCs- you do NOT want to piss off most of them, as they usually provide very useful services.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

NESguerilla posted:

Oh jesus that does not sound fun at all. Does the effect stay or does it die with you?

The Gravelord "invasion" continues until you find the gravelord sign and invade and kill the Gravelord, or until the Gravelord signs out.

I got the Gravelord "disaster" warning before when in Sens fortress, but I'd already cleared the area out and was waiting to get summoned, so I never ran into any black phantom enemies. One of the times I got summoned in Sen's Fortress, the first sound I heard was the summoner getting murdered- I did see some black phantoms before being sent back to my world.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

NoneSuch posted:

I'm surprised Gravelord stuff works at all as I've never encountered it and any attempts at doing it myself didn't achieve anything noticeable.

I know when your "invasion" is successful, you're supposed to get half of your victim's souls, with the other half remaining in their bloodstain. When I got the gravelord warning, I soon after fell off a cliff and died- all my souls were still in my bloodstain, so I guess you actually need to get killed by the phantoms.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Dizz posted:

I have yet to find a bow. I'm not sure if i'm skipping content or it's a drop from a monster or what, but I don't have one or arrows at all.

At the bonfire before the Taurus demon, go outside and down the stairs to your right. To your left will be a bridge with two spear soldiers at the end. Kill them and bust through the crates over there to find a stairway that leads to the first merchant. He sells arrows (go for the cheap 3-soul ones) and a short bow. Very handy to have around- the bows suck for actually killing things, but they're good for drawing one enemy at a time from a group.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Elysiume posted:

Apparently you can walk on top of the waterwheels, like gigantic, deadly treadmills.

Yeah, I got dropped on one of those once and ran on it for about two minutes trying to find a safe way off before giving up and falling to my death. Then I was afraid my souls would be stuck there, but the game took mercy and put them on solid ground.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

I'm so happy to discover that Ornstein's armor actually looks pretty decent with the Ancient Skirt. I was so tired of looking like the most unfashionable hobo in Gold-Trimmed Robe, Dusk Crown, and Ancient Skirt (that, and I've encountered several other players in the same exact outfit I was wearing, which rankled me).

Now if only I could find reasonable guilty players to invade instead of twinked-out uber PvPers hanging out with their white phantom buddies waiting to kill poor little SL35 me.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

I've gotten the Gravelord "invasion" message when I was in hollow form, so I don't think that matters.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Ugh, I need to turn in my Dark Souls card. Yesterday I lost about 150,000 souls and 10 humanity. I made about 15 Blue stone invasions and got killed in all of them. Today I managed to gently caress up the Snuggly glitch after only getting about 9 Dragon Scales.

All I want is to check the covenant goodies off my list, but I can't seem to get any more Souvenirs of Reprisal or Dragon Scales!

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

sighnoceros posted:

Brett on his stream just invaded with the fog ring on and the other guy was definitely targeting him. People are saying they made it half the normal lock on range or something, but I don't know if that specifically has been confirmed.

It would make sense to have a shorter lock-on range, like with nighttime Anor Londo (or is that just me? It seems like the lock-on range was really short when I was dueling people there. Dueling them poorly and dying. Since they're usually around level 100 and I'm level 38.)

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Jetpack Postman posted:

More patch stuff:

Our WikiDot friends have been keeping track of some of the data mined patch changes.

So far we have this:


More to come, but so far it's looking pretty good. The changes to the Hollow Shield, Iron Flesh and the rest are a bit of a bummer, but higher scaling for weapons (ESPECIALLY uniques) and more are very welcome.

They nerfed the Elite Knight set? I thought it was only marginally better than the plain Knight set for higher weight.

I wonder how people will get through the Four Kings at low levels now that Iron Flesh, the Crystal Shield, and Pyromancy have all been nerfed.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Sheep-Goats posted:

Quoting this for posterity.

I killed Sif, then got summoned for him three times within about 15 minutes by putting my sign right in front of the boss door at level 30.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

sentrygun posted:

They'll, uh, punch them and dodge their attacks like normal? I only used Combustion as a supplement to my Zweihander for heavy hits that fired off faster, but not only is Combustion not too terribly much weaker from what I've seen, but thanks to the scaling fixes people can probably find a faster firing weapon that still does good enough damage.

Seriously, I don't understand why everyone acts like the Four Kings are impossible without Iron Flesh or the Crystal Shield.

Well, I said "low level," as in the level 1 runs people have been doing- where you can't swing weapons like Zweihanders. Low level characters are extremely limited in what equipment they can use and how much damage they can take, so killing the kings extremely quickly before they can respawn will be challenging with limited damage output and no good way to tank damage at the same time.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Wow, some of the other modifications seem kinda cool. I don't know what's been posted earlier, but this link (http://forums.demonssouls.info/view...hp?f=62&t=11488) says there are adjustments to the level-up menu (so hopefully you can tell how much the next level is), the Master Key can be purchased, arrows are available from more vendors, another vendor stocks Transient Curses, paying for your sins is now Level x 500 instead of Level x 2000, the Faith requirement to join the Light Covenant is dropped from 50 to 25, item discovery scales with level, multiplayer matching has been "adjusted", etc.

I'm iffy on some of the nerfs, but I like a lot of the other changes.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Vargs posted:

Sif is one of the easiest bosses in the game if you have a decent shield. Every single one of his attacks is easily blockable. All you need to do is hold your shield up and run straight forward until you get underneath him, where he can't hit you at all. Then just mash the attack button until he jumps away. Maybe back off and put your shield down for a few seconds if you run low on stamina. If you're having issues, come back later with shield that has better stability (and 100 physical resist, of course). You'll be fine with that even if you're rocking base endurance. You really don't need phantoms to help you out.

Even with a decent shield Sif's double-slash will usually cut through your stamina and a good chunk of health. But yeah, other than that one attack he doesn't have much going for him. A few Combustions will chew through his health in no time.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

HondaCivet posted:

Is it possible that the game is set up to just run slightly differently for different people? In the IRC channel we were talking about the big knight with a mace and tower shield that guards the route to Ricard on the roof of Sen's. After having killed him and revisiting the bonfire many times, he never came back. Tonight, after running around through Anor, I run back through Sen's only to find that he's back? Some other people in the chat had never had him respawn, and some people had him respawn every time they visited the bonfire.

Maybe the game is just screwing with us.

Huh. He respawns every single time for me. I farmed him for most of a steel armor set and some large titanite shards.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Rough Lobster posted:

Pharis has jumped off a drat cliff every time I tried to fight her.

Really? She's a pretty good distance from most cliffs; it seems like you'd have to try to have her die that way. Personally, I just walked up to her with a shield, wait for her to bang off it, then set her on fire with Combustion. She always just pulls out a sword and goes melee when I get close.


OK, questions on SOLAIRE!

1. What exact steps do you need to take to save him- the wikis are directly conflicting and generally unclear. For example:
wikidot sez:
Note about saving Solaire: you need to speak to him at the bonfire after the Centipede boss to activate his progression. Do not open the shortcut before speaking to him or else you ruin his progression and he will be killed by the chaos bug.

Meanwhile, wikispaces sez:
Basically, if you want him to live. Get Chaos Covenant rank to +2, use the shortcut to kill all 9 chaos bugs (Without entering Izalith), and don't talk to him after the centipede demon fight.

So do I need to talk to him after the Centipede Demon or do I need to AVOID talking to him? Do I need to fight the Centipede demon at all?


2. Is there even any real benefit to letting him live besides summoning him at the end? I never summon people for bosses, so if I like collecting stuff, should I just kill him for his stuff?

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Elysiume posted:

1. Lost who said it, but In order to keep Solaire alive and reach his next encounter near the Chaos covenant bonfire, you need to NOT traverse into Lost Izalith. You instead take the shortcut from Demon Ruins, and kill all nine of the huge slugs that do little more than block the path.

Only once all nine of them are killed should you cross into Lost Izalith. If you leave one alive, or skip this shortcut altogether, Solaire is killed by them and shows up as a phantom prior to the door to Bed of Chaos boss fight.

If you kill all nine slugs, you can meet with him one more time near Chaos covenant bonfire, and talking to him will unlock his summon sign for the final boss.


2. Are you a completely terrible person? This will affect my suggestion for what to do.

1. Yeah, both wikis have that info, but one says that, in addition to all that, you MUST talk to him after the Centipede boss, and the other says you must NOT talk to him. I haven't gotten that far, but I got the impression the Centipede demon is before you enter lost Izalith, so you can go as far as killing it before the important choice of progressing or backtracking to the shortcut. One wiki suggests you NEED to kill it or he'll die even if you take the shortcut.

2. Mmmmaybe. Ok, yes.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

Elysiume posted:

t

Hey, it's not like I WANT to. I hear there's a bug that keeps Solaire from appearing in NG+, so if I want his equipment I need to do it on the first run. How can I be grossly incandescent without sun-themed armor and matching shield?

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

I think the archer in Darkwood Garden is not THE Pharis, she just has his hat and bow.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

EvilCornbread posted:

So if I don't have a good Divine weapon (my divine mace hits skeletons for like 60), is it even worth doing Nito? I'd really rather not go back to the blacksmith and then work all the way back down to Nito again, but I can't kill the skeletons before he shows up, and then like an rear end in a top hat he ends up killing them before I can land the killing blow.

Also, like 3 big skeletons down there too? What the hell is that?

I read somewhere that you just need to have a divine weapon EQUIPPED, and don't need to actually kill them with it (like have it equipped in your second right-hand slot, and kill them with the weapon in the first slot). I haven't actually tested this, though.

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Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!

invalid posted:

Second, I heard from the internet (so it has to be true) that if you join the Blade of the Darkmoons and keep the ring off and just use the blue orb it matches you up someone your level in the area you used it. Is that true or do you get some PvP nut waiting on you in Dark Anor regardless of how you do it?


So that said, I really need 9 more reprisals or whatever, so I was thinking about making a glass cannon type guy just for that trophy because my main is a faith tank that never can seem to get even close to winning a fight. If I did make the second character would it match me with guys my level?

So if so, what's the best type of cheese just to get this done ASAP.

I THINK all the guys I invaded with the blue stone were reasonably within my level, but I won't swear to it. I was mid to upper 30s when I was trying it in various areas (Parish, Depths, Blighttown, Demon Ruins, Sens, Anor Londo) and I don't think I ever ended up with some crazy NG+ people (mostly because I pretty much never ever had successful invasions in lower-level areas). Blue Stone invasions will not send you to dark Anor Londo (unless you use it while in Anor Londo; then you might get that, I guess).

You can farm the Harpy women in the painted world for Souveneirs of Reprisal, but I personally never had any drop after killing probably 30+ of them with the Gold Serpents Ring on, so they seem pretty rare. I probably ended up getting most of mine from the rare successful Blue Stone invasion, or from Dark Anor Londo invasions where I was joined by another Blue Phantom that was clearly higher-leveled than me. You can also get one from Snuggly the Crow if you happen to have a Pendant.

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