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Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


I cannot find Rittenhouse Bonded anywhere. It's an excellent rye, under $25, and 100 proof. And impossible to find. I mixed my first proper Manhattan (i.e. with rye) with it a month or so ago and it was revelatory, but that was with my last couple ounces.

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Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Skeleton Ape posted:

Not always. Bourbon laws state that bourbon must be aged in a brand-new barrel, and after that the barrel can't be used anymore to make bourbon. Many scotch distilleries buy these barrels up in bulk because they can be had relatively cheaply. Scotch whisky is often aged in all sorts of other things though, such as port, sherry, and Madeira casks.

The economics of Scotch barrel aging is fascinating. For a long time used sherry/port/Madeira casks were just the thing, because said wines were imported from Spain/Portugal, and then there were just these barrels laying around. Since they used to be way more popular than they currently are, old Iberian wine casks just made sense. With changing tastes and the advent of legally-defined and widely-produced bourbon, the fruity/nutty flavors of the wine barrel-aged Scotch gave way to the vanilla and honey notes of old bourbon casks, since less wine was being imported, and bourbon barrels became dirt cheap. It's so cool.

Old bourbon barrels are also used in a lot of aged Caribbean rums for the same reason.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


The Third Man posted:

I thought I liked Scotch. I thought I liked Islay Scotch a lot. Then I bought a bottle of Laphroaig Quarter Cask.

Everything changed.

Wait, what happened? I loving love Laphroaig 10, I figured the Quarter Cask would be awesome.

edit: Like, I seriously love Laphroaig 10. My friends think I'm crazy, but I think I'm going to pick up a bottle for the winter, because it is like exactly what I want to drink when it's cold out.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Nostrum posted:

It is awesome. Laphroaig Quarter Cask is by far my favorite scotch. It's everything the 10 year is but MORE and drat is it smokey.

The Third Man posted:

What happened was I found a new favorite Scotch. I didn't think I would find anything I liked more than Ardbeg, but goddamn if that quarter cask didn't jump to the top of my list. I think that bottle lasted maybe 2 weeks, and I was holding back on that, too.


Oh thank god. poo poo, now I need to choose between this and a single village Oaxacan mezcal for my next fancy bottle of liquid smoke lightly flavored with spirit.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


I picked up a bottle of Wild Turkey Kentucky Spirit today. Just had a little taste with my buddy, will give some better notes later tonight after I have a bigger glass of it. First thoughts though: overwhelming caramel and honey in the nose. The bouquet is incredibly sweet. Thick, heavy body with lots of oaky char flavors, and a surprising amount of spice for a bourbon. Rye levels of spice. Finish lasted forever. Very warm on the stomach.

Basically whenever it's rainy out and I have nothing to do, this is what I'm going to reach for. Very nice bourbon.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Killer robot posted:

Any particular recommendations for rye whiskey? I've had Jim Beam, Wild Turkey, and Old Overholt, but the larger liquor stores around here are getting a wider variety these days and I'm not sure what to try out. Especially since so much tends to be in the premium price range.

If you can find Rittenhouse Bonded that's a fine whiskey and very affordable. I wish I could find it.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Does anybody actually use whiskey stones? Pretty sure those are just a gimmick.

If you have a snifter such that might be used for cognac that would be better than a plain old rocks glass, but in a pinch a rocks glass will work just fine. To be honest, if you're a first-time drinker you probably won't be able to pick up on all the extra smells from a special glass, so relax and enjoy your whiskey. I've heard good things about Bulleit.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


It might be fun sorta, but don't expect to make anything that actually tastes good.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Vampyr posted:

WT American Honey...fowl.

Heh.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


I mean, if all you've got is a couple ounces at the bottom of the bottle you might as well drink it off.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Mikey Purp posted:

I had this a long while ago and really wasn't too impressed with it. I find it to be overpriced. Maybe I'll give it another shot though.

This is something I've heard from a number of people/reviewers about these new boutique American whiskeys. The thing is, distilling and aging and blending is an old man's game most of the master distillers etc. at the big houses are loving ancient, since it takes a lot of waiting around and a lot of experience to nail something as finicky as barrel aging. It's partly why boutique gins have been so much more successful than boutique whiskeys.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Powers is a great blend for cheap. It makes what may be the tastiest whiskey sours I've ever had. I've got a friend who's all over John L. Sullivan, which I thought was good, but not revelatory. If you want something off the hook you should spring for some Redbreast. Pure pot stilled awesome.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


The crazy thing about Scotch barreling is how a fundamental character of the whisky has changed due to seemingly unrelated economics. A couple hundred years ago the vast majority of Scotch was aged in old port, sherry, or Madeira barrels, since those Iberian fortified wines were insanely popular in Britain and were being imported en masse. Rather than pay to ship back empty barrels, people would sell them dirt cheap to the distilleries. That gave the Scotch a particular character.

Fast forward two hundred years and the market for Iberian fortified wines just ain't what it used to be, but now we've got the American bourbon industry churning out piles and piles of barely-used barrels all the time. Suddenly flavors from the barrel have a lot more oaky vanilla and less of the round fruitiness of the wines. Pretty cool stuff.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


spankmeister posted:

Yes, and it's even gotten tot the point where due to the shortage in sherry casks, some heavily sherried whisky expressions (like old-style Macallan) are importing barrels of sherry, then dumping out the contents and filling it with distillate.

I didn't know this and it's pretty hilarious.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


I love introducing people to Laphroaig 10 and having them describe the flavors/bouquet:

"rusty shipyard"
"wet lumber"
"old leather purse"
"campfire"
"It's delicious but I don't know why."

God I love that Scotch.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Aglet56 posted:

One of my friends described Laphroaig 10 as "a forest fire in my mouth."

Oh yeah also one friend said "It's like a Charizard cumshot," which is pretty cool.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


I dunno, I found Buffalo Trace to have a malty graininess that was actually less sweet than a number of bourbons I'd had. I didn't care for it as much as Wild Turkey 101.

If you felt Wild Turkey was bland, stay away from Maker's. You might like rye whiskeys a little better, they've got a spicier character than bourbons. If you can find Rittenhouse Bonded it's fantastic and affordable. I've heard very good things about Sazerac, but it's sort of hard to find. Apparently Bulleit makes a rye that's gotten some notice.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Boner Slam posted:

Sazerac goes more for around 50, Rittenhouse nothing under 150 :<

Yeah the Bonded has been drat hard to find. And the 23 year old bottle of Fancy Sipping Whiskey really doesn't make up for its lack.

Some things to remember about bourbon when comparing it to Scotch is that it's a very young whiskey. Most of the bourbons in your price range are aged for 4 years, and none for more than 6. It's not going to be as smooth as most Scotch, and will have fewer, more bright and forward flavors. For a good workman-like bourbon you should get a fair amount of vanilla, honey, spice, and oak. Wild Turkey 101 hits the bright honey flavors very well in my opinion. It will be sweet, but hopefully not cloying. It'll be warm, but hopefully not burn. It can take ice, but not too much, and it's not always necessary. A bourbon Old Fashioned is excellent, especially with turbinado/demerara syrup. Most of the whiskeys you've listed are not, strictly speaking, sippin' whiskey, so bear that in mind.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


I've heard the Old Potrero whiskeys described as "bookish," in that they are very interesting and curious, but not the sort of thing you reach for when you just want a tasty drink. Also they're really expensive.

Anchor's Junipero and Genevieve gins, on the other hand, are spectacular.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


wormil posted:

Most bourbons on that list are aged 6-10 years. Makers is 6-8 years. WT101 is a blend of 6, 8 & 10 year. Bulleit is 6+. Don't remember BT off the top of my head but I believe it is 6-8. Beam Black is 8. The Four Roses would depend on which expression but they are all over 4. Don't know the age of Blanton's but I'm sure it contains whiskey over 6. Whiskeys mature at different rates in different climates. Hell, they mature at different rates within the same warehouse, which is one reason the barrels are harvested at different times and tasting is so important. So "very young" is misleading and inaccurate.

http://whiskeyreviewer.com/2011/11/bourbon-vs-scotch/


And this is not true either.


With the exception of 7 Crown and and Red Stag, they are all sipping whiskeys.

I stand corrected on the issue of time spent in barrels, my bad. I do think that the fact that bourbons all use new, fresh-charred barrels makes them a bit more, perhaps, spicy and a little more fiery than most of the Scotch I've had. Don't think I'm hating on bourbon; I love American whiskey. It just might be something that might throw someone who grew up on Scotch.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Was it an all-wheat whiskey, or was it a wheated bourbon? The most well-known wheated bourbon is Maker's Mark, which I (and many in this thread) find a bit flabby and bland. It just lacks the bright spice of bourbons with rye in the mashbill. I imagine an all-wheat whiskey would just take that to the extreme.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Redbreast is off the hook. I can corroborate this.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Kraven Moorhed posted:

Problem is, I'm at a dead end as far as rye goes, I think. Virginia's state regulated stores don't have the best selection, and rye isn't all that popular in my local area. Having tried Johnny Walker Red and Black and not particularly enjoying either, what would be a good entry point into Scotch? I remember enjoying Glenlivet 12 when I had it, but that's pretty much my only positive experience with the drink so far.

Johnnie Walker is an Islay blend, so you might not be that into peat smoke. Chivas Regal is another blend you might like a bit more, since it mellows the smoke some. Famous Grouse is even milder, since it's not pure malt, and is pretty inexpensive. I mostly use it for mixing, but it's a decent dram.

In terms of other Speyside single malts (like the Glenlivet), you could try Glenfiddich. People talk a bit of smack about their 12 year, but I think it's a perfectly enjoyable Scotch. The 15 year is supposed to be a fair amount better.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Bourbon is a corn-based whiskey, and is noted for big honey and vanilla notes, medium heat on the palate, and slight oakyness. Rye is a rye-based whiskey (heh), which is spicy and nutty, while sharing a few characteristics with bourbon, since they're both aged in fresh-charred white oak barrels. Canadian whiskey is an abomination of neutral grain spirits and despair.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


I haven't had it, I hear it's good but nothing to write home about. Rittenhouse Bonded is my favorite workhorse rye, but it's pretty much impossible to find right now. I'm having excellent results from Bulleit Rye right now, and Old Overholt is serviceable but somewhat drab, sort of the Famous Grouse of rye whiskey.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Does Irish whiskey even really reach that price point? I have to assume you mean $25/fifth.

I've been quite a fan of Powers for a fairly inexpensive Irish whiskey. Redbreast, as mentioned earlier, is amazing, but runs more like $40/fifth where I'm at.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Hahah okay right on. Well Redbreast is still really good.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


You might as well. This seems to be the only liquorchat thread that can survive. Gin and rum threads have come and gone, and when I started a general spirits thread it only lasted a few pages.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


GoGoGadgetChris posted:

Is that even possible? I've kept homemade grenadine palatable for 6 months just by putting a shot of vodka in it. What do they put in that poo poo?

Exposure to oxygen and light can cause various flavor compounds to change and degrade. It's really mostly an issue with delicate brown spirits a London Dry gin or white rum could last forever on the shelf, pretty much. Scotch and Irish whiskey, and to a lesser extent American whiskeys, can experience a substantial loss of flavor over time.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Kentucky Spirit is definitely a fiery bourbon though. I'm a big fan of Wild Turkey of their 101 bottling, and the Kentucky spirit, which is I believe 90 proof, is very tasty but very warm. It's a single barrel bottling though, so experiences will vary.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


I saw it in BevMo, of all places, right alongside Laird's bonded also. My mind was utterly blown, I hope they've figured their supply angle out and it's not just a temporary glut.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


You know I just never could get into Buffalo Trace. I dunno what it was about it, but both bottles I've had just ended up being a drag. Then when I got back to Wild Turkey 101 is was like remembering how much I like bourbon again.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Halloween Jack posted:

What would you guys say is the best "rail" bourbon for making lots of sours and juleps at a party? Last time I did this, my guests found Old Forester more than tolerable.

I use Wild Turkey 101 for all my bourbon mixing. Depending on your guests Maker's Mark could be more popular at around the same price point. I've remarked a number of times that I find Maker's sort of flabby and boring, but the mellowness of a wheated bourbon can really shine in a julep. For sours though I wouldn't use it, since it would get lost in all the citrus.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


GoGoGadgetChris posted:

I can see the merit in having a cheaper bottle for spirit + Coke, but what's the consensus on cocktails? Is it worth it to use a quality bottle in a Sazerac or a Buck (assuming other quality ingredients), or is it best to let the good stuff be enjoyed on its own?

I wouldn't mix with a bourbon that cost more than $40-$50, typically. Usually, of course, we're talking more like $25 bottles for mixing. However, if you wanted to make a truly excellent Sazerac, and used some very nice Sazerac to do so it would be a case of no harm no foul.

I'd never use nice stuff in a sour, but a Manhattan? Sure, as long as I'm also using Dolin or Vya or Carpano Antica for the vermouth.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Halloween Jack posted:

What's so bad about Wild Turkey 80, anyway? I've never had it; does the dilution create a very different flavour profile?

All things equal, higher proof is usually better. It's certainly better when using it for mixing, since it gets less dilute, and since lower proof just means more water was added prior to bottling there's more flavor in higher proof whiskey.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


DoctaFun posted:

Call me crazy but I actually liked it a lot more than Buffalo Trace, for some reason the BT just didn't do it for me.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Oh man I've heard nothing but good about George T. Stagg. Is it amazing? I hear it's amazing. I would *love* a bottle, but it's drat hard to find and I couldn't afford it right now anyway.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


There are so many incredibly expensive craft ryes that I just can't believe are worth the price tag.

Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


Vya and Dolin are both high-end vermouths, I wouldn't call them middle shelf. Carpano Antica is sort of halfway between a vermouth and an amaro, really, even though it's been fashionable to use it as a sweet vermouth in the last couple years, particularly in Manhattans. In terms of inexpensive vermouth, I'd recommend Cinzano Rosso before Noilly-Prat sweet, since NP is really more about their dry vermouth.

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Kenning
Jan 10, 2009

I really want to post goatse. I wish I had 10bux


You used a single malt for mixing? That just seems wrong, even though the Glenlivet 12 is like $25 at CostCo right now.

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