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mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Excuse me, pardon me, sheer perfection coming through


hell yes

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StarkingBarfish
Jun 25, 2006

Novus Ordo Seclorum


ogopogo posted:

Kale and sausage with Calabrian chili aioli



Pepperoni with jalapeños!



Quoting these so they can be admired on a second page. You always get such perfect crusts and those are ace ingredient combinations.

ogopogo
Jul 16, 2006
Remember: no matter where you go, there you are.

StarkingBarfish posted:

Quoting these so they can be admired on a second page. You always get such perfect crusts and those are ace ingredient combinations.

Cheers dude! We've been working hard to dial in our consistency and bake, really loving the results so far.
We ran two specials this last weekend, one from the vaults and a new one from our chef.

The Last Action Gyro
Garlic oil, mozz, feta, red onion, and gyro meat, topped with fresh tzatziki, red onion, dill, and parsley



The Pea Shooter
Garlic oil and mozz, topped with cold fresh burrata, peas, pea pesto, pea shoots, mint, and lemon zest

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Excuse me, pardon me, sheer perfection coming through


ogopogo posted:

Cheers dude! We've been working hard to dial in our consistency and bake, really loving the results so far.
We ran two specials this last weekend, one from the vaults and a new one from our chef.

The Last Action Gyro
Garlic oil, mozz, feta, red onion, and gyro meat, topped with fresh tzatziki, red onion, dill, and parsley



The Pea Shooter
Garlic oil and mozz, topped with cold fresh burrata, peas, pea pesto, pea shoots, mint, and lemon zest



would, both

do you guys toss?

ogopogo
Jul 16, 2006
Remember: no matter where you go, there you are.

mediaphage posted:

would, both

do you guys toss?

Depends on if you buy me a cocktail or not!

Ahh but for real, we generally don't toss our doughs open, it's more a traditional Neapolitan style bench open, with some final hand stretching in the air before laying down the opened skin for topping. With the sourdough especially we are already at the maximum thinness and strength for the dough, so tossing just leads to rips and tears.

CancerCakes
Jan 10, 2006


My pizzas always come out very "rustic" in shape, but I haven't found a good video on shaping on YouTube that is actually informative or tolerable. Surface seems to make I big difference as well, I am normally using a floured quartz worktop but I did see someone use baking paper?!

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Excuse me, pardon me, sheer perfection coming through


ogopogo posted:

Depends on if you buy me a cocktail or not!

Ahh but for real, we generally don't toss our doughs open, it's more a traditional Neapolitan style bench open, with some final hand stretching in the air before laying down the opened skin for topping. With the sourdough especially we are already at the maximum thinness and strength for the dough, so tossing just leads to rips and tears.



that's cool, i've gotten reasonably good at shaping for someone that only makes home levels of pizza, lol, but haven't really tried tossing before, so i wondered.

Rocko Bonaparte
Mar 12, 2002

Every day is Friday!


It's a lot easier to get something more circular if you're hand stretching it than if you use a roller. You can get there with a roller with a lot of practice but you're going to either:

1. Have to master rolling in a lot of different directions in positions.
2. Master rolling in one direction and turning the dough each time to stay uniform.

I've just found stretch it by hand makes it easier to turn the dough and apply a uniform effect. I still use a roller at points to touch up on stuff. This makes me a horrible human being but I don't really care.

beerinator
Feb 21, 2003


Rocko Bonaparte posted:

I've just found stretch it by hand makes it easier to turn the dough and apply a uniform effect. I still use a roller at points to touch up on stuff. This makes me a horrible human being but I don't really care.

This is what I do as well.

Leng
May 13, 2006

One song / Glory
One song before I go / Glory
One song to leave behind


No other road
No other way
No day but today


Finally moved into an apartment with a real oven and decided to make pizza for the first time in like two years:



Chorizo, mushroom and capsicum using the Peter Reinhardt neo-neopolitan dough recipe.

My pizza stone cracked down the middle while it was preheating but it still kind of worked:



Time to get a baking steel!

bolind
Jun 19, 2005




Pillbug

ogopogo posted:

Cheers dude! We've been working hard to dial in our consistency and bake, really loving the results so far.
We ran two specials this last weekend, one from the vaults and a new one from our chef.

The Last Action Gyro
Garlic oil, mozz, feta, red onion, and gyro meat, topped with fresh tzatziki, red onion, dill, and parsley



The Pea Shooter
Garlic oil and mozz, topped with cold fresh burrata, peas, pea pesto, pea shoots, mint, and lemon zest



Love the naming.

Tip: when having friends over (remember that, in The Before Times) for pizza, do the hard work but let each friend design and, most importantly, name a pizza.

Leng posted:

Time to get a baking steel!

Amen, will likely outlast you.

CancerCakes
Jan 10, 2006


My friend has some steel and a laser cutter, but I don't really understand what the advantage of the steel is over my current stone, and can it be normal steel or does it need to be specific alloys?

I use my stone for breads more than pizzas if that makes a difference.

SHIT POST MALONE
Feb 4, 2005

I was born down. You know this.


I think normal steel is fine but the thickness is the critical part.

How thick is his steel?

PokeJoe
Aug 24, 2004

hail cgatan




Steel won't crack in your oven and transfers heat a little differently than a stone. Normal steel is fine, just clean all the bullshit off it if it's been sitting in a shop/garage. You'll need to season it so the food will be touching that seasoned surface.

ogopogo
Jul 16, 2006
Remember: no matter where you go, there you are.

CancerCakes posted:

My friend has some steel and a laser cutter, but I don't really understand what the advantage of the steel is over my current stone, and can it be normal steel or does it need to be specific alloys?

I use my stone for breads more than pizzas if that makes a difference.

Will your friend let us borrow his laser cutter for uh...experiments in pizza science? How fast can one of those bad boys cut a pizza into the shape of my logo, I wonder.

Gwaihir
Dec 8, 2009



Hair Elf

CancerCakes posted:

My friend has some steel and a laser cutter, but I don't really understand what the advantage of the steel is over my current stone, and can it be normal steel or does it need to be specific alloys?

I use my stone for breads more than pizzas if that makes a difference.

Steel essentially both stores way more heat, and moves that heat from itself in to a lump of dough you put on top of it much much faster than a stone does. You might be able to touch a hot stone for a half second without getting burned, but touching a 500 degree steel will almost certainly leave you blistered.

I would suggest a 3/8" thick piece, as anything over that will rapidly grow far too unwieldly to deal with and not offer a lot of benefit if you aren't doing many pies back to back to back.

I've used mine for breads, too- It is killer at imitating a tandoor for naan, or making pita breads puff up wonderfully:





In general the rule of thumb for the steel is just, anything you cook on it, with parchment or no, will end up a good bit more crisp on the bottom than it would otherwise using just a sheet pan.

BraveUlysses
Aug 7, 2002



baking steel absolutely owns and I like mine more than a lot of my other kitchen tools. absolutely worth every penny.

Jhet
Jun 3, 2013


BraveUlysses posted:

baking steel absolutely owns and I like mine more than a lot of my other kitchen tools. absolutely worth every penny.

If you have a gas cooktop it's fantastic for doing pancakes and home made tortillas too.

PokeJoe
Aug 24, 2004

hail cgatan




You can make 4 grilled cheeses on it at the same time

Gwaihir
Dec 8, 2009



Hair Elf

If you have never smashburged on a steel, it is the most perfect possible surface for it

Casu Marzu
Oct 20, 2008

SHUT
THE
FUCK
UP!
BIIITCH!




Gwaihir posted:

If you have never smashburged on a steel, it is the most perfect possible surface for it



CancerCakes
Jan 10, 2006


Awesome, I've been thinking about getting a griddle plate and it seems like this will fulfill that function as well. I will discuss it with him and report back if I go ahead!

SHIT POST MALONE
Feb 4, 2005

I was born down. You know this.


I use my steel for pizza, pancakes, cheesesteaks, and quesadillas. It is a true utility tool.

Rocko Bonaparte
Mar 12, 2002

Every day is Friday!


I'm looking for experiences in cold fermenting dough. I used to do that a decade ago without really thinking about it; it was just a lazy pizza prep thing I could do. I think it's been a missing step in my process and I'm trying to catch up on it.

Gwaihir posted:

If you have never smashburged on a steel, it is the most perfect possible surface for it

I got a rectangular one for the grill and a round one for my outdoor burner. I do an even mix of smashburgers and hash browns on it.

A problem I've found is that it like to warp once heated up and I've cooked on it a bit. I think it has to do with the temperature differences. However, it really makes a mess. I'd like to have the sides bent to try to get some reinforcement but haven't figured out where I could go to get a lip like that. I'd also need to order a new steel for it. It might also just be cheaper to get the purpose-built ones.

PokeJoe
Aug 24, 2004

hail cgatan




I cold ferment 100% of my dough. I mix up a batch of dough in my stand mixer, weight it out into portions, and toss them in the fridge immediately without letting it rise. I put a healthy amount of olive oil in the containers to keep it from drying out as it rises. It tastes best after about 2 or 3 days but I use it for up to a week or so. Towards the end the structure breaks down and it becomes more difficult to stretch, but it still works and tastes pretty good.

Rocko Bonaparte posted:

A problem I've found is that it like to warp once heated up and I've cooked on it a bit. I think it has to do with the temperature differences. However, it really makes a mess. I'd like to have the sides bent to try to get some reinforcement but haven't figured out where I could go to get a lip like that. I'd also need to order a new steel for it. It might also just be cheaper to get the purpose-built ones.

Just get a carbon steel pan instead of looking for a lipped steel imo. the flat steel is good to put on a grill or even a firepit where grease dripping isn't as big a deal

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Excuse me, pardon me, sheer perfection coming through


PokeJoe posted:

I cold ferment 100% of my dough. I mix up a batch of dough in my stand mixer, weight it out into portions, and toss them in the fridge immediately without letting it rise. I put a healthy amount of olive oil in the containers to keep it from drying out as it rises. It tastes best after about 2 or 3 days but I use it for up to a week or so. Towards the end the structure breaks down and it becomes more difficult to stretch, but it still works and tastes pretty good.


Just get a carbon steel pan instead of looking for a lipped steel imo. the flat steel is good to put on a grill or even a firepit where grease dripping isn't as big a deal

pretty much this and generally use less yeast

i don’t get how oil in a sealed container does anything about keeping a dough from “drying out”, though

PokeJoe
Aug 24, 2004

hail cgatan




Because sometimes they rise enough that the pressure inside pops the lid off

Flash Gordon Ramsay
Sep 28, 2004



Grimey Drawer

I put my pizza steel on my outdoor propane burner for smash burgs. Keeps the fat and smoke outside, make the burgs perfectly.

fake edit: fat will drip off the sides so put something down or make peace with it.

Jhet
Jun 3, 2013


Flash Gordon Ramsay posted:

I put my pizza steel on my outdoor propane burner for smash burgs. Keeps the fat and smoke outside, make the burgs perfectly.

fake edit: fat will drip off the sides so put something down or make peace with it.

I have one with a groove “to catch” the oil, but it’s not big enough when you’re making burgers. So you’ll be making a mess regardless, as there’s no where else for the grease to go. It’s a nice thick heavy rectangle though, and worth the mess into the grill.

Rocko Bonaparte
Mar 12, 2002

Every day is Friday!


PokeJoe posted:

I cold ferment 100% of my dough. I mix up a batch of dough in my stand mixer, weight it out into portions, and toss them in the fridge immediately without letting it rise. I put a healthy amount of olive oil in the containers to keep it from drying out as it rises. It tastes best after about 2 or 3 days but I use it for up to a week or so. Towards the end the structure breaks down and it becomes more difficult to stretch, but it still works and tastes pretty good.
Ahh so you're cold fermenting as portions. That's something I've never done and is possibly a little late for this batch. I've seen it before so I think I'll have to try it too.

I know when I'm working with colder dough in general that it is really stubborn to stretch out. So when I cut off a portion and try to get the original round shape, I've also made it too tough to work for bit and I have to rest it.

quote:

Just get a carbon steel pan instead of looking for a lipped steel imo. the flat steel is good to put on a grill or even a firepit where grease dripping isn't as big a deal

I guess I should have emphasized that I was using that on a grill in the first place. Ordering a steel cut for that was convenient since I could have it fit perfectly on one half of the grilling surface.

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Excuse me, pardon me, sheer perfection coming through


PokeJoe posted:

Because sometimes they rise enough that the pressure inside pops the lid off

put them in a larger container then? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

BraveUlysses
Aug 7, 2002



when i do kenji's ny pizza recipe, i split the dough into 4 globs and put into quart reditainers, they dont expand enough to pop the lid.

Rocko Bonaparte
Mar 12, 2002

Every day is Friday!


I had a bad surprise trying to integrate some olive oil into cold fermented dough. In the past when I've had to do add fat after kneading, I've just done a little more kneading in the mixer with the fat. Heck, I have seen some enriched bread recipes where they prefer it added after-the-fact. They believe the fat impedes activating the gluten and want the dough kneaded separately first.

This dough was cold so it didn't take in the oil. When it came time for me to break off dough (since I was working off a lump like I usually do as posted before), I couldn't tuck in the bits I tore off. Normally I pull the dough into itself to make a ball where all those little imperfections get tucked inside of it. The oil kept the dough from sticking to itself so this never happened.

The dough tasted good and all, but I couldn't, say, grab more dough to make a larger ball because I couldn't get the pieces to stick to each other. I couldn't really hand pull because the dough ball was so uneven that it would split open at points before the rest of it was fully stretched. It would stick to the peel when getting put into the oven and also while turning it; the imperfections on the underside of the pizza would physically catch on the peel while turning.

I had been using oil based on Kenji's recipe--which doesn't cold ferment--because I have liked how it handled in the past when I mixed it in. However, I read some stuff advising against adding the oil for the cold ferment. I'm inclined to just go back to a lean dough but wondered if anybody here uses some fat and also cold ferments the dough too.

Also, my wife didn't get much of the flavor of the dough. Since I'm making my own sauce now, I can reduce the salt there. This gives me an opportunity to finally increase it in the dough. Awhile back, I tried 3% and it was no good with everything else we were doing. Does it really help with the bread's flavor?

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Excuse me, pardon me, sheer perfection coming through


Rocko Bonaparte posted:

I had a bad surprise trying to integrate some olive oil into cold fermented dough. In the past when I've had to do add fat after kneading, I've just done a little more kneading in the mixer with the fat. Heck, I have seen some enriched bread recipes where they prefer it added after-the-fact. They believe the fat impedes activating the gluten and want the dough kneaded separately first.

This dough was cold so it didn't take in the oil. When it came time for me to break off dough (since I was working off a lump like I usually do as posted before), I couldn't tuck in the bits I tore off. Normally I pull the dough into itself to make a ball where all those little imperfections get tucked inside of it. The oil kept the dough from sticking to itself so this never happened.

The dough tasted good and all, but I couldn't, say, grab more dough to make a larger ball because I couldn't get the pieces to stick to each other. I couldn't really hand pull because the dough ball was so uneven that it would split open at points before the rest of it was fully stretched. It would stick to the peel when getting put into the oven and also while turning it; the imperfections on the underside of the pizza would physically catch on the peel while turning.

I had been using oil based on Kenji's recipe--which doesn't cold ferment--because I have liked how it handled in the past when I mixed it in. However, I read some stuff advising against adding the oil for the cold ferment. I'm inclined to just go back to a lean dough but wondered if anybody here uses some fat and also cold ferments the dough too.

Also, my wife didn't get much of the flavor of the dough. Since I'm making my own sauce now, I can reduce the salt there. This gives me an opportunity to finally increase it in the dough. Awhile back, I tried 3% and it was no good with everything else we were doing. Does it really help with the bread's flavor?

interesting, i've never added oil into a long ferment dough like that but i imagine (as you've probably figured out) that it would be best to do it with a room temp or warm dough and fold it in over the course of an hour.

in what way did you find the saltier pizza no good? 3% is sort of my go-to for most bread stuff but it is on the higher end of some preferences.

Rocko Bonaparte
Mar 12, 2002

Every day is Friday!


mediaphage posted:

in what way did you find the saltier pizza no good? 3% is sort of my go-to for most bread stuff but it is on the higher end of some preferences.
At the time, we were using supermarket pizza sauces, which tend top pack some salt. Spread that on a 3% salt dough and you can feel yourself turning into a mummy.

StarkingBarfish
Jun 25, 2006

Novus Ordo Seclorum


Rocko Bonaparte posted:

At the time, we were using supermarket pizza sauces, which tend top pack some salt. Spread that on a 3% salt dough and you can feel yourself turning into a mummy.

I find this too- it's personal preference but after eating a pie with 3% salt I find myself getting up to drink water in the middle of the night. For my recipe about 2.5% is enough to not mess much with the fermentation and still give the dough a good flavour. Any less and it begins to get a bit bland.

Nettle Soup
Jan 30, 2010

Oh, and Jones was there too.


Gwaihir posted:

Steel essentially both stores way more heat, and moves that heat from itself in to a lump of dough you put on top of it much much faster than a stone does. You might be able to touch a hot stone for a half second without getting burned, but touching a 500 degree steel will almost certainly leave you blistered.

I would suggest a 3/8" thick piece, as anything over that will rapidly grow far too unwieldly to deal with and not offer a lot of benefit if you aren't doing many pies back to back to back.

I've used mine for breads, too- It is killer at imitating a tandoor for naan, or making pita breads puff up wonderfully:





In general the rule of thumb for the steel is just, anything you cook on it, with parchment or no, will end up a good bit more crisp on the bottom than it would otherwise using just a sheet pan.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhxEqB_PsxY

Recently got into making pitta bread, this was one of the first attempts. I just make the dough in the stand mixer and then keep it in the fridge til I need it, super easy. The same dough works if we want pizza, too.

bonus easter bread

Cozmosis
Feb 16, 2003

2006... YEAR OF THE BURNITZ, BITCHES

So I got a steel (quarter inch thick) - it works fine but not sure it’s doing much beyond the stones that I have already. Our oven only goes to 500 and has a top broiler. Pizza quality is good but the steel doesn’t seem to be improving much.

Steel not thick enough? Or oven just not hot enough for it to make an impact?

BraveUlysses
Aug 7, 2002



IMO it makes a huge difference if you do multiple pizzas in a row

But it also needs to thoroughly heat soak before using

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SHIT POST MALONE
Feb 4, 2005

I was born down. You know this.


Yeah i need to preheat for like 75-90 mins if I'm using my steel. Especially if I'm using it as a top-down heat deflector.

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