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Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.


User0015 posted:

Wasn't there an interview at one point where they said they had people in on the combat design that were participants in TrueStyle videos? Anyone remember that?

They said something along those lines. I hesitate to believe them.

Speaking of that, look at this Truestyle video. Obviously this person knows the thing inside and out and can do all sorts of crazy poo poo. This is her DmC attempt.

And for shits and giggles, as well as demonstrating just how hosed and unbalanced the ranking system is, look at this guy go from a D to SSS in three hits.

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Zellyn
Sep 27, 2000

The way he truly is.


weird bleep posted:

This kind of thing really bugs me with modern game development. This has absolutely no impact on gameplay, why do they bother wasting their time and money on it.

This sort of complaint has no real bearing on the game, though. Having your art team receive advice from external experts (contractors, effectively) means nothing to the designers who decide how the game will play, the devs who put the code in, or the QA who make sure that it's not a buggy mess.

If your argument is that that money could have been spent better elsewhere, maybe, but it's highly unlikely that that extra cash would have magically inserted a lock-on function. Ultimately, I don't see it as a negative because that's what an art team should be doing, going out into the world to expand their style and toolset to create quality visuals.

randombattle
Oct 16, 2008

This hand of mine shines and roars! It's bright cry tells me to grasp victory!



Pesky Splinter posted:

They said something along those lines. I hesitate to believe them.

Speaking of that, look at this Truestyle video. Obviously this person knows the thing inside and out and can do all sorts of crazy poo poo. This is her DmC attempt.

And for shits and giggles, as well as demonstrating just how hosed and unbalanced the ranking system is, look at this guy go from a D to SSS in three hits.

I keep hearing people mention this but I don't ever remember them saying anything like that. Especially when the combat system is just Heavenly Swords combat system with some dmc moves in it.

FedEx Mercury
Jan 7, 2004

Me bad posting? That's unpossible!


Lipstick Apathy

Pesky Splinter posted:

They said something along those lines. I hesitate to believe them.

Speaking of that, look at this Truestyle video. Obviously this person knows the thing inside and out and can do all sorts of crazy poo poo. This is her DmC attempt.

And for shits and giggles, as well as demonstrating just how hosed and unbalanced the ranking system is, look at this guy go from a D to SSS in three hits.

Posting brea isn't fair. Makes everybody else look like such a chimp scrub

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.


randombattle posted:

I keep hearing people mention this but I don't ever remember them saying anything like that.

Ninja Theory inviting hardcore Devil May Cry fans to playtest DMC

"Ninja Theory has sent out invites to massive Devil May Cry fans to try out DMC in the hope they can provide feedback for the upcoming series reboot. One invite that was sent out was posted on GAF soon after. The developer will cover all travel costs for those who wish to take part."

source:http://www.vg247.com/2011/11/09/nin...o-playtest-dmc/

Ninja Theory Letter posted:

Hi,

Im part of the team currently developing the new Devil May Cry title at Ninja Theory and I wanted to get in touch to see if youd like to come in and play the game. Essentially Im inviting in a very select few really top end DMC players to come and play through a section of the game and talk to some of our team about your experience.

Well pay for travel to and from the studio and will also provide lunch.

Let me know if this sounds of interest and I can give you some more details.

Cheers

XXXXXX

And there's some talk in this Neogaf thread about the Truestyle playtesters.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=451332

Christ, that was over a year ago where has the time gone? And they obviously decided to ignore whatever the playtesters said if it was the TSer ones.

"Ah gently caress it - slap on Heavenly Sword's left overs and we'll go from there."

notZaar posted:

Posting brea isn't fair. Makes everybody else look like such a chimp scrub

Tell me about it but it was the quickest one I could find of a TSer who was playing the demo.

[e]: And for anyone interested in the what the general opinion seems to be of the demo outside of the extremes of either slurping its cock or wanting to crucify it - the general low-down seems to be; it looks nice, plays okayish, no lock-on is an issue, and it's too easy.

Pesky Splinter fucked around with this message at Nov 29, 2012 around 00:21

AggsOfSpades
Sep 5, 2011


Even though I just barely scrapes by on the hardest difficulties, the demo was a bit of a cakewalk. I understand that it isn't really fair considering the level was a tutorial and everyone has already seen how to SSS the Succubus. The writing is still poor, but if this wasn't DmC I wouldn't have any disdain for it.

It's weak and forgettable and the lack of lock-on was the prime thing I found annoying.

SSNeoman
Jul 19, 2011




Well I guess I'll ask. How's the much-vaunted platforming? I always found DMC's platforming to be awkward as hell; you jump up way too quickly and have no horizontal momentum. This is good for battles but it makes certain platformy puzzle rooms a real chore (and reason number 1098 I loving love the Pandora )

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.


SSNeoman posted:

Well I guess I'll ask. How's the much-vaunted platforming? I always found DMC's platforming to be awkward as hell; you jump up way too quickly and have no horizontal momentum. This is good for battles but it makes certain platformy puzzle rooms a real chore (and reason number 1098 I loving love the Pandora )

Jumping is okay; air hike doesn't really do much. Sky Star is now the angel stance thing, and is fairly easy to pull off. If Dante is now at certain point of a ledge, he can grab it and pull himself up (you have to hit it at the right angle though).

NT learnt their lesson from Enslaved, so you can actually fall off platforms now (excepting the one behind Dante in the Slurm Queen fight, I believe - though I haven't actually tried jumping off it, I'll admit). Platforming itself is as simple as it looks - is it glowing red? Use demon pull. Is it glowing blue? Use Angel pull.

You mostly have to have the target in the camera sights for him to target it (though I have managed it when the camera was facing the other way), and you have to be at the right elevation or angle. You also can't sequence break, I don't think, unless you manage to exploit launching an enemy and landing on a platform you're not meant to.

So yeah, platforming is easy enough to do.

Oh yeah, and here's the official picture of Aquila.

FedEx Mercury
Jan 7, 2004

Me bad posting? That's unpossible!


Lipstick Apathy

I wonder if they will explain in the game how Dante got his magical hookshot device. I remember in the original trailer they actually showed Rebellion splitting into segments and turning into a whip/hookshot, but I guess they dumped that idea.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.


notZaar posted:

I wonder if they will explain in the game how Dante got his magical hookshot device. I remember in the original trailer they actually showed Rebellion splitting into segments and turning into a whip/hookshot, but I guess they dumped that idea.

Not quite dumped the idea. Apparently he collects two roses (one of which is a blue rose) that turn it into the whip/hookshot thing.

For reference the angel whip is called - "Ophion". They haven't shown what the demon version is called.

So basically, even though it was the first level shown, the Underwatch level is probably about mission 4/5, as the first is the pier, and assuming that the others are Dante collecting the scythe, axe, and two whip functions.

Pesky Splinter fucked around with this message at Nov 29, 2012 around 10:34

FedEx Mercury
Jan 7, 2004

Me bad posting? That's unpossible!


Lipstick Apathy

Or more likely they just enabled them for the demo, because Under Watch really plays like the first real mission after the prologue.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.


notZaar posted:

Or more likely they just enabled them for the demo, because Under Watch really plays like the first real mission after the prologue.

You need both abilities though to get through it though. It's not inconceivable, of course that getting all of Dante's stuff takes place in the prologue. Though if the achievements are anything to go by (as well as what they've shown in the streams), you don't get a demon weapon til after that level, and get the two whip items and the angel dash and scythe before it.

Just my speculation at the end of the day vv
Hell, I might as well post how I think the whole thing is going to go:

Pier level, Dante kills the monkey boss, talks to Kat, hallucinates/goes to limbo to get the whip and scythe abilities from whatever reminds him of Eva, does the Underwatch level, beats the Tyrant boss, meets up with Vergil.

He hallucinates/goes to limbo to get the axe and demon dodge from the picture of Sparda, told to retrieve Phineas' eye, and gets Eryx doing so (maybe the subway level?), Phineas tells them about Mundus' weakness or 'vault' or whatever, Kat gets kidnapped, prompting Dante to go and find Not-Glenn Beck to get the whereabouts of Lilith.

He then goes to the nightclub to trade her for Kat, instead of fighting Lilith he fights Mundus' Spawn (maybe), beats her and trades her over. Then he and Vergil go into the vault and find Sparda (possibly?), they then fight Mundus and beat him. And then, in a "shocking twist", either Vergil reveals that he's been working against Dante since the start because he wants power/gets possessed by Mundus/doesn't like Dante's new duds/whatever they then fight and Dante wins, leading to Vergil falling into Limbo with no way out. leading into Vergil's Downfall.

That's my thoughts anyway. Be interesting to see how in/correct they turn out to be.

Pesky Splinter fucked around with this message at Nov 29, 2012 around 11:20

toasterwarrior
Nov 11, 2011


Pesky Splinter posted:

He then goes to the nightclub to trade her for Kat, instead of fighting Lilith he fights Mundus' Spawn (maybe), beats her and trades her over. Then he and Vergil go into the vault and find Sparda (possibly?), they then fight Mundus and beat him. And then, in a "shocking twist", either Vergil reveals that he's been working against Dante since the start because he wants power/gets possessed by Mundus/doesn't like Dante's new duds/whatever they then fight and Dante wins, leading to Vergil falling into Limbo with no way out. leading into Vergil's Downfall.

That's my thoughts anyway. Be interesting to see how in/correct they turn out to be.

Well, going from the bitter rivalry thing the twins have going on in DMC3, I'm guessing that the trade goes bad/was supposed to because Vergil set up Kat for the fall and Kat dies, but Dante only finds out after Mundus goes down and that leads to the final battle. I mean, they don't have to follow the story beats from the previous series, but Vergil does have a manipulative streak going on, and it works with why Dante is out for blood against Vergil due to a previous incident in DMC3.

Also, I bet Vergil will get Force Edge in his DLC story.

toasterwarrior fucked around with this message at Nov 29, 2012 around 12:24

Uncle Wemus
Mar 4, 2004


Was it Tameem who blow cigarette smoke into a dudes face and said "I dont give a poo poo" when asked about fan outcry to DmC? Or was that a different game dev or just a fabrication. Im trying to chronicle the PR madness.

Speedball
Apr 15, 2008



This game might not be a worthy successor to the original but taken on its own merits I might very well enjoy it. The whole "entire city coming to life to crush you" thing was actually really tense and interesting,

I also am in love with this game's art style. Nobody can say Ninja Theory doesn't know how to make things visually striking.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.


A Capcom Unity Q&A with some NT guy:

quote:

Friday, November 30th (tomorrow), we will be joined by Ninja Theory's Dom Matthews for an exclusive Q&A session. Since Dom is in the UK, we'll be holding this session bright and early for those on the West coast, at 7AM PST.That's 10AM EST or 3PM GMT.

This will allow you to view thread updates in real time, creating a more communal, event-like feel. Just show up at the time above and post your questions.

Now we've got a few ground rules that should go without saying, but I'm gonna say 'em anyway.

-He won't be able to answer every question. It's all at his discretion as a representative for NT. That said, this is a rare opportunity, so if you've got a burning question, it's definitely worth showing up and asking.

-Do NOT spam the same question over and over again. I know it can be frustrating if your q doesn't get answered the first time around, but just be aware that excessive spamming of the same thing will get you a warning and possibly a suspension from the site (at the discretion of mods including yours truly).

-This is a civil adult discussion. Failure to treat our guest or anyone else in this thread with basic human decency will result in brutal reprisals. So be nice, even if you're asking a tough question (which, feel free to do).

Also, keep in mind that this whole "live view" Q&A thing is an experiment we're conducting for the first time. If it doesn't go so smoothly, well, lesson learned =\ If it does, we'll definitely do more of these spanning more titles.

So yeah! Let's enjoy this opportunity.

http://www.capcom-unity.com/devil_m...ws-1130-7am-pst

ImpAtom
May 24, 2007




Ugh. Man, I appreciate what they're trying to do but I feel so bad for them. That's gonna end in disaster.

Mr. Fun
Sep 22, 2006

ABSOLUTE KINOGRAPHY


Threatening me with "brutal reprisals" is neither very civil, nor adult.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.


Uncle Wemus posted:

Was it Tameem who blow cigarette smoke into a dudes face and said "I dont give a poo poo" when asked about fan outcry to DmC? Or was that a different game dev or just a fabrication. Im trying to chronicle the PR madness.

Supposedly. I don't know what interview it was though. He's definitely said similar poo poo.
He's also a bit of a surly rear end in a top hat:

quote:

Twitter guy: https://youtube.com/watch?v=nj2NwBpHeTQ could NT atleast balance it so that the enemy doesnt get interupted then they try to attack you? my tip

TA: We also don't have a fix for face-palming your face until it bleeds...

And his reply to someone talking about the fact that the best way to beat the Slurm Queen was to parry all the time was:

quote:

"Pretty good parrying skills there... What's to fix? You can play the game in whatever style you want."

Parry. Smash with axe. Get SS rank. Yeah, that's not in need of a little fix.

He didn't really help himself with this either:

quote:

"The essence of Devil May Cry is all about 'cool,'" says creative director Tameem Antoniades. "It's about Dante being cool and making you feel cool when you're playing it, and so the combat and the style system and everything is integral to that. But, you know, what was cool 12 years ago -- I think that was when the first game came out -- isn't cool anymore.

"If Dante, dressed as he was, walked into any bar outside of Tokyo, he'd get laughed out.


Yeah, he's not explicitly saying Dante isn't cool and was never cool, just that he's no longer cool. Could have phrased that in a better way rather than just have it alienate a large number of people who play the games.

Then again, this whole thing has been a loving PR nightmare, right from the very first trailer with the 2010 Dante design. And with NT's rather shoddy previous titles (combatwise). And then the comparisons to Bayonetta (which is a death knell really, when we knew they couldn't possibly manage that), the 30fps thing, the whole "wait and see it's awesome, really, while showing really lacklustre footage, the focus on the story aspect more than the gameplay...and it goes on and on and on. Right up to SSSensational 2.0 and all the painfully average, but heavily unbalanced combat in the demo.

ImpAtom posted:

Ugh. Man, I appreciate what they're trying to do but I feel so bad for them. That's gonna end in disaster.

It's asking for trouble really. I know they can't turn around and say "Well, we think this game is an average pile of poo poo, with bugs and glitches that we can't sort out because we've just gone gold - sorry it turned out to be a mediocre mess because our bosses and NT hosed up - go play MGR instead", but still, most of that last stream was them either proving how broken the game is (both meanings of the word), and shooting themselves in the foot with comments about Megaman.

isk
Oct 3, 2007

You don't want me owing you

The wording is unprofessional garbage - the terms should be clear and upfront, like saying each user gets a warning first and then a ban for a repeat violation. Whatever it would be. That said, the possibility of a figurative public execution is extremely useful in a forum like that. It's easy for dumbasses to overtake the tone and content of the conversation, so moderation keeps it in line. It doesn't apply to a lot of folks who'd come, so that's why you gotta watch the phrasing (which didn't happen here).

Par for the course, seems like hearts are in the right place but the execution leaves a lot to be desired.

Rigged Death Trap
Feb 13, 2012

BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP



quote:

"The essence of Devil May Cry is all about 'cool,'" says creative director Tameem Antoniades. "It's about Dante being cool and making you feel cool when you're playing it, and so the combat and the style system and everything is integral to that. But, you know, what was cool 12 years ago -- I think that was when the first game came out -- isn't cool anymore.

"If Dante, dressed as he was, walked into any bar outside of Tokyo, he'd get laughed out.

If this Dante went into any bar he'd get asked for ID then summarily barred from entry after his first couple gently caress yous.

Magil of Shadow
Dec 28, 2009

Proposal: Form a friendly relationship immediately.

"You have GOT to be kidding me"



Rigged Death Trap posted:

If this Dante went into any bar he'd get asked for ID then summarily barred from entry after his first couple gently caress yous.

Or he'd get the poo poo beaten out of him for mouthing off to the wrong group of people.


Or laughed at for how he looks.

JT Smiley
Mar 3, 2006
Thats whats up!

What a stupid line of thinking. "If Super Mario went to a local nightclub all the ladies would take turns mocking his overalls".

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.


It was most likely in response to people loving hating the design of Dante, and they obviously felt they had to come up with a reason why they changed the design. The answer? poo poo over the character that people became attached to by saying it was no longer relevant/cool/old-hat/etc.

Incase you forgot.

JT Smiley
Mar 3, 2006
Thats whats up!

Yeah I totally wouldn't be creeped out if that guy pulled up a stool next to me a bar.

Uncle Wemus
Mar 4, 2004


Hank Hill would mock him for holding his cagarette wrong! I cant find the clip on my phone

PoshAlligator
Jan 9, 2012

When SEO just isn't enough.


If this Dante walked into a bar he'd be stabbed in the chest and then angstily finger it in the bathroom.

SSNeoman
Jul 19, 2011




Pesky Splinter posted:

Incase you forgot.



To their credit, they did fix his head so he looks less...douchey.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.


^^^
True, but they did make it more...backpfeifengesicht


The best thing about that first design, was after pretty much everyone bitched about it, Capcom and NT then released the finalised design with the excuse that the re-redesign was just a natural part of development, pretending that it was planned all along. Despite the majority of the complaints levelled against it - the smoking, looking like a drug-addled crack-whore rent boy and the accusations that he looked liked Tameem - they obviously, magically, adressed these issues in their pre-planned(!) re-redesign.

There are also conflicting accounts of the how they expected fans to react to it. At first they said they were amazed at the amount of pure frothing bile directed at the reboot, only to say later that they were expecting it - though not as much, to then later say that they knew people weren't going to like it and they weren't surpised.

If nothing else, the development behind the game is great fun to read.

[e]: The smoking didn't bother me either - the whole ensemble was pretty god awful to look at though. Especially them then trying to pass it off as the Dante from the other games. This was when they were still alternating between calling it a prequel, AU and a reboot. Remember how long that mess took to clear up?
VVV

Pesky Splinter fucked around with this message at Nov 30, 2012 around 00:55

ImpAtom
May 24, 2007



Honestly, the smoking didn't seem like a problem to me. They could even have done something fun with it. Give Dante a weapon that primes enemies with explosive gel or something and let him "trigger" it with a tossed cigarette ala Lucifer.

Monkey Fracas
Sep 11, 2010

...but then you get to the end and a gorilla starts throwing barrels at you!


Grimey Drawer

ImpAtom posted:

Honestly, the smoking didn't seem like a problem to me. They could even have done something fun with it. Give Dante a weapon that primes enemies with explosive gel or something and let him "trigger" it with a tossed cigarette ala Lucifer.

Dammit now you're just making me depressed. Now that I've gotten my hands on the demo and played through it, I can say with certainty that I'm just better off ignoring the game until it's like 5 dollars on Steam or whatever. Or I pick it out of a bargain bin at a store that ensures that Capcom will not see a dime from my purchase.

wildzero
Apr 23, 2008

"My name is Dante."
"Fuck you say?"



PoshAlligator posted:

If this Dante walked into a bar he'd be stabbed in the chest and then angstily finger it in the bathroom.

I can't remember, was that actual "official art"? Complete with the "ur a faget" graffiti?

I saw it the other day somewhere else, couldn't stop laughing at how hard it was trying to be edgy.

PoshAlligator
Jan 9, 2012

When SEO just isn't enough.


wildzero posted:

I can't remember, was that actual "official art"? Complete with the "ur a faget" graffiti?

I saw it the other day somewhere else, couldn't stop laughing at how hard it was trying to be edgy.

Yes it's official.

It's meant to be him discovering his powers after a bar fight or something. It's based on that one painting of Jesus but the really bad tryhard edgy version.

wildzero
Apr 23, 2008

"My name is Dante."
"Fuck you say?"



I guess incidental discovery of powers can be a cool motif, except when the execution is poo poo.

Schubalts
Nov 25, 2007

People say bigger is better.

But for the first time in my life,
I think I've gone too far.


It's him getting stabbed in the chest, then pulling open the wound in the bathroom to see his heart beating. It could have been executed better.

Rigged Death Trap
Feb 13, 2012

BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP



PoshAlligator posted:

Yes it's official.

It's meant to be him discovering his powers after a bar fight or something. It's based on that one painting of Jesus but the really bad tryhard edgy version.

Yeah but that involved Thomas gingerly fingering the wound of Christ. Not Jesus himself.


ImpAtom posted:

Honestly, the smoking didn't seem like a problem to me. They could even have done something fun with it. Give Dante a weapon that primes enemies with explosive gel or something and let him "trigger" it with a tossed cigarette ala Lucifer.

It's obnoxious because it's played and illustrated as 'HE SMOKES. DEAL WITH IT'. Instead of just a casual thing.

SSNeoman
Jul 19, 2011




Schubalts posted:

It's him getting stabbed in the chest, then pulling open the wound in the bathroom to see his heart beating. It could have been executed better.

The execution is terrible because it's not a sword and he doesn't do this when he gets stabbed:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_1kETIVweo

wildzero
Apr 23, 2008

"My name is Dante."
"Fuck you say?"



^^ That's still one of the best cutscenes in the series. Kicking Alastor up into the air and catching it will never stop being stylish.

He's not smoking because he enjoys it. He's smoking because it's edgy-as-hell, gently caress you dad.

Isra the Great
Apr 5, 2009

A pleasure to meet you, my good bro.


Pesky Splinter posted:

^^^
True, but they did make it more...backpfeifengesicht




Wow, that Aphex Twin guy really does have to get his face into everything.

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Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.


The Q&A has started:

http://www.capcom-unity.com/devil_m...-pst?liveView=1

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