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Heavy Metal
Sep 1, 2014

America's $1 Funnyman

Chinston Wurchill posted:

I've been digging Power Fantasy too. Intriguing concept and great art!

As far as other recent indie stuff I've been enjoying:

Gilt Frame is a murder mystery by Matt Kindt and his mother which is fun so far.

The Moon is Following us is a Daniel Warren Johnson book with shared art duties. It's fantasy with a twist.

The Tin Can Society is by Peter Warren (a screenwriter though I'm not sure what he's done) with Rick Remender. Imagine if Tony Stark grew up with a group of close friends and got murdered, and his friends are trying to solve the crime...except one of them probably did it.

Also Ultramega is back!

That's all cool to hear, Ultramega has been on my to-read list too. Gotta love comics.

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Lucifunk
Nov 11, 2005

Chinston Wurchill posted:

I've been digging Power Fantasy too. Intriguing concept and great art!

As far as other recent indie stuff I've been enjoying:

Gilt Frame is a murder mystery by Matt Kindt and his mother which is fun so far.

The Moon is Following us is a Daniel Warren Johnson book with shared art duties. It's fantasy with a twist.

The Tin Can Society is by Peter Warren (a screenwriter though I'm not sure what he's done) with Rick Remender. Imagine if Tony Stark grew up with a group of close friends and got murdered, and his friends are trying to solve the crime...except one of them probably did it.

Also Ultramega is back!

Those all sound cool. I'll have to check them out.

Endless Mike
Aug 13, 2003



Power Fantasy #3 is extremely Gillen, which I do not mean in a bad way at all.

Chinston Wurchill
Jun 27, 2010

It's not that kind of test.
Jonathan Hickman and friends are Kickstarting their Substack!

I'll consider the digital editions since I kind of got lost amongst the many many tiers.

And hey, I guess this is what Nick Spencer has been up to.

Endless Mike
Aug 13, 2003



Yeah, I seriously cannot wrap my head around what I actually want there

El Gallinero Gros
Mar 17, 2010
I very much enjoyed the first library edition of Black Hammer, without getting spoiler-y does it remain good throughout?

Zachack
Jun 1, 2000




El Gallinero Gros posted:

I very much enjoyed the first library edition of Black Hammer, without getting spoiler-y does it remain good throughout?

Core story yes, although maybe it's still going?
World of Black Hammer is decent, some are good, one or two are kinda meh.

Caros
May 14, 2008

I killed hundreds of thousands of people and all I got was this lousy president

Endless Mike posted:

Power Fantasy #3 is extremely Gillen, which I do not mean in a bad way at all.

Up to #5 now and the series continues to be excellent. They give you just enough to provoke questions but not enough to answer them without going out to get them next month.

Very solid lure you in storytelling.

Waffles Inc.
Jan 20, 2005

Gotta nth how absolutely wonderful Power Fantasy is—I traditionally haven’t been much of an indies reader but over the last year I’ve expanded my taste a little bit and I am SO glad I have

Power Fanasty and Eight Billion Genies are like two of my favorite things I’ve read this year

Sephyr
Aug 28, 2012
No kidding. Power Fantasy manages to grab you both with the unfolding narrative of each character's unique power and worldview, and the slowly revealed divergence points with regular history, usually teased in advance and left to mature in the reader's expectations. The great art clinches it.

Caros
May 14, 2008

I killed hundreds of thousands of people and all I got was this lousy president

Sephyr posted:

No kidding. Power Fantasy manages to grab you both with the unfolding narrative of each character's unique power and worldview, and the slowly revealed divergence points with regular history, usually teased in advance and left to mature in the reader's expectations. The great art clinches it.

The timeline they put in the back of issue 3 is a stroke of genius Imho. Gives you a solid glance at what to expect with broad strokes while not telling you nearly enough to spoil.

Also helps with their marketing because 'here is cool poo poo you can expect' is fantastic.

Sephyr
Aug 28, 2012
As someone who listens to Bad Religion, well...religiously, Jacky Magus being a fuckhead sellout was a twist of the knife I'm still recovering from.

Nazi punks gently caress off, indeed.

Goa Tse-tung
Feb 11, 2008

;3

Yams Fan

Sephyr posted:

As someone who listens to Bad Religion, well...religiously, Jacky Magus being a fuckhead sellout was a twist of the knife I'm still recovering from.

Nazi punks gently caress off, indeed.

Jacky is tragic, absolutely. He probably feels he had no other choice to create the Pyramid, and everything that follows was unavoidable. So the latest thing isn't really what you say, it's just the thing he has to do, so Etienne can't read his mind (and become a Magus himself).

I assume he doesn't want power over the USA, just the military. He said he needs money and people in the Pyramid, maybe because it functions like a battery/amplifier/conduit. Stronger Pyramid = stronger wards against Etienne. Btw I hope we never get to know just what Jacky found that is so dangerous.

Caros
May 14, 2008

I killed hundreds of thousands of people and all I got was this lousy president

Goa Tse-tung posted:

Jacky is tragic, absolutely. He probably feels he had no other choice to create the Pyramid, and everything that follows was unavoidable. So the latest thing isn't really what you say, it's just the thing he has to do, so Etienne can't read his mind (and become a Magus himself).

I assume he doesn't want power over the USA, just the military. He said he needs money and people in the Pyramid, maybe because it functions like a battery/amplifier/conduit. Stronger Pyramid = stronger wards against Etienne. Btw I hope we never get to know just what Jacky found that is so dangerous.

We've seen a lot of the fruits of his labor with things like the mech suit that ambushed Etienne in Japan. The vibe I get is that poo poo is expensive and after whatever happened to the first pyramid, there just isn't the recruitment that there used to be.

I doubt it is entirely Etienne he is worried about. While they are clearly at odds he still seems to hold the belief that no one should have the level of power that the supers do, and is more or less universally opposed. I don't think it is a coincidence he gave them a weapon that he thought could take out heavy.

gimme the GOD DAMN candy
Jul 1, 2007
yeah, you know who else thought that? the man. jacky has become the man.

he's making etienne look better by comparison and etienne is terrible!

Caros
May 14, 2008

I killed hundreds of thousands of people and all I got was this lousy president

gimme the GOD drat candy posted:

yeah, you know who else thought that? the man. jacky has become the man.

he's making etienne look better by comparison and etienne is terrible!

Ehhh, is he? Jacky, not Etienne, obviously he is a monster. Jacky seems like a good person trying to avoid horrible poo poo.

And failing, mind you.

Etienne is the platonic ideal of 'You can do the most horrific poo poo but so long as you say it in a nice voice, are you really a bad person?'"

Literally just this.

Sephyr
Aug 28, 2012
All of them can claim to be wanting to avoid horrible things, and making compromises.

Etienne is being hunted by a government that has been shown to be willing to nuke tens of thousands of civilians to hit one Superpower. He seems to have a lot of lines he won't cross, but since the premise is 'people with the power of a major nation', he also gives himself some moral leeway with collateral damage, just like any state does pursuing their policies/wars.

Heavy is keeping a core of atomics that might well be attacked or exploited in a safe pseudo-nation, and feels that instant and extreme reaction is the only way to not be overwhelemd, since otherwise the governments will just keep trying and they only need to be lucky once.

Magus is juicing up those same governments with ultra-powerful weaponry, regardless of the effect it might have, while being the head of a self-admitted cult and now going on to basically weave said cult into a national superpower. There's -zero- evidence so far that Etienne really is growing super-powerful, which is his justification. It may be entirely paranoia. He hasn't mind-controleld a continent under the radar or subverted another Atomic. If anything, he asked for permission of the others before making his move on #1, to prevent the murder of an entire US state.

So basically what I'm saying is Lux did nothing wrong.

Safety Biscuits
Oct 21, 2010

Recently read two old comics anthologies, Real Stuff (written by Dennis R. Eichhorn) and The New American Splendor Anthology (written by Harvey Pekar). They sound similar on paper - they're both collections of stories about the author's life, both by American men, both oldish )from the 80s and 90s), both illustrated by several artists - but they're pretty different when you read them.

Real Stuff has more diverse art, sometimes in colour, by (just the names I recognise) Julie Doucet, Joe Sacco, Seth, Chester Brown, and Terry Moore. It's a lot of anecdotes from Eichhorn's entire life, usually with sex. Or violence. Or drugs. Or drink. Or drunk violence and sex. Good thing it's called Real Stuff and not Nice Stuff. Mostly it's things you'd be interested to hear at a bar: a crazy old guy getting his dick stuck in a Coke bottle, or a visit to a radioactivity testing lab, or helping a dominatrix humiliate a client, or accidentally buying condoms for a science project... there's a hook, right? And that's basically what this is: one interesting story after another. There's a strong streak of counterculture, parody, and deliberate bad taste/pushing cultural boundaries, although this could be due to the editor's preferences; maybe the original comics included more pedestrian fare. There's some absolutely sickening stuff in it, too, including :nms:Eichhorn being complicit in child neglect and abuse.:nms:

I'd heard of American Splendor but not read it, and the cover is atrocious: it's a solid red background fronted by a portrait of Pekar with terrible proportions; his head is about twice the size it should be. The art is entirely b/w and more samey than Eichhorn's collaborators; the artists include Rebecca Huntington (who does some pencilled, very realistic art, but not in a stupid "just drawing a photo" way), Alan Moore (for one page), and some guy called Robert Crumb. And the stories are generally completely pointless: Pekar sees an injured squirrel and goes back to try and take it to a vet but can't find the squirrel. Or he invites his friend over and basically nothing happens and they have a pretty miserable time. Or he loses his glasses and argues with his wife and finds them again. And yet the amount of detail gives a sense that these pointless things are worthwhile anyway, a sense that Pekar is honouring and respecting these pointless trivia - maybe the title isn't totally ironic. You get to know Pekar (awkward, sincere, obsessive, self-absorbed, critical, fragile; easy to respect, hard to like) more than Eichhorn, although not many of the other people in the comics. But then, just reconsidering these incidents in order to write them must mean that Pekar overcame, to some degree, his self-absorption. There are some cool layouts where the action zips back and forth across the page and the art becomes the panel boundaries ("Weekend", art by Gary Dumm, in which Pekar and a friend go to buy some books and then Pekar gets stopped for speeding). American Splendor is better at length; the one- or two-page comics don't usually have time to add up to much. There's a few introductions to artists near the end - one is for Eichhorn, and seems full of overblown praise - and one contains, right on the last page, what might be Pekar's guiding principle:

quote:

Q. How can a democracy function in a nation full of people who believe that their lives and their neighbors' lives are insignificant?
A. In such a situation, democracy functions imperfectly, at best.

You can tell which of the two I prefer. Real Stuff often comes off as pretty juvenile (to me), but then maybe I'm just a midwit who prefers trivial nostrums about democracy. Or maybe it's because Real Stuff works because of its stories, and American Splendor because of its style. They're both good, though.

Dangerous Person
Apr 4, 2011

Not dead yet
Watch the American Splendor movie when you get a chance

Chinston Wurchill
Jun 27, 2010

It's not that kind of test.
I've had my ups and downs with Rick Remender but his new book with Paul Azaceta, The Seasons, is off to a fantastic start. The first issue was great at introducing the world and some key characters, it used narrative gimmick to excellent effect, and there wasn't any of the fairly-common Remender edginess to it at all. Highly recommended!

Heavy Metal
Sep 1, 2014

America's $1 Funnyman

Savage Dragon is going strong folks, 275 issues! And Larsen has been stepping up the pace lately, the road to 300+ issues oh lord yes.

I'm also still poking at Mega Man and Street Fighter comics of yore, and also I gotta read Criminal before I see that TV show. I want the book to be the first impression etc. Lot to read!

Cassa
Jan 29, 2009
Ultramega remains real real good.

frameset
Apr 13, 2008

Anyone else feel like Department of Truth is spinning its wheels a bit with the latest issue?

Action Jacktion
Jun 3, 2003

frameset posted:

Anyone else feel like Department of Truth is spinning its wheels a bit with the latest issue?

It did feel like they were trying not to have anything happen. It wouldn't be so bad if they hadn't just finished with two consecutive multi-issue flashback stories set in the early 1960s.

Madkal
Feb 11, 2008

It became a weapon
Fallen Rib

frameset posted:

Anyone else feel like Department of Truth is spinning its wheels a bit with the latest issue?

I felt this after the third trade (sorry was following trades not single issues). I liked the premise of it but found the pacing so slow and ponderous that I lost interest.

Caros
May 14, 2008

I killed hundreds of thousands of people and all I got was this lousy president
Power fantasy continues to be the best comic on the market right now by giving the readers exactly what they want.

It's basically the only thing I actively keep track of the release date as opposed to picking it up whenever I happen to see it.

Sephyr
Aug 28, 2012
It's really something to not just be pleasantly surprised, but to be consistently pleasantly surprised by an ongoing work.

Power Fantasy is so loving good it's almost triggering my doomer "what if it turns bad?" generation-x instinct.

Caros
May 14, 2008

I killed hundreds of thousands of people and all I got was this lousy president

Sephyr posted:

It's really something to not just be pleasantly surprised, but to be consistently pleasantly surprised by an ongoing work.

Power Fantasy is so loving good it's almost triggering my doomer "what if it turns bad?" generation-x instinct.

Right? Though my biggest worry is that it will get poo poo canned because it doesn't have enough brand recognition, which would be criminal.

Fortunately it looks like it has decent enough sales and they got confirmation out for at least the first major story Arc.

My biggest complaint about Power Fantasy is the issues end. The art is spectacular, the writing is incredible but I blitz through them too quickly.

The good news is that it more than holds up on re-reads. As the series is still so short I make it a habit to just do a start to finish on the series every time a new issue drops.

Endless Mike
Aug 13, 2003



It's hard to find sales figures since ICv2 seems to be the only source and isn't particularly reliable, but Power Fantasy is in the upper third of Image titles in terms of sales, though it's still pretty far down the monthly list - probably somewhere in the 10k copies range. This would be approaching cancellation at Marvel or DC, but given Image's business model, this is probably fine as long as Gillen thinks he can keep it running (he's been open that he will always pay his artists before himself since they can only work on one thing at a time). There's definitely a level where they'll cancel a book for low sales, but it's lower than that. Gillen's said he's committed to 16 issues, but has plans for 30-something if it's successful.

https://bsky.app/profile/kierongillen.bsky.social/post/3l7b5m5wmgi2m

Jedit
Dec 10, 2011

Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

Endless Mike posted:

It's hard to find sales figures since ICv2 seems to be the only source and isn't particularly reliable, but Power Fantasy is in the upper third of Image titles in terms of sales, though it's still pretty far down the monthly list - probably somewhere in the 10k copies range. This would be approaching cancellation at Marvel or DC, but given Image's business model, this is probably fine as long as Gillen thinks he can keep it running (he's been open that he will always pay his artists before himself since they can only work on one thing at a time). There's definitely a level where they'll cancel a book for low sales, but it's lower than that. Gillen's said he's committed to 16 issues, but has plans for 30-something if it's successful.

https://bsky.app/profile/kierongillen.bsky.social/post/3l7b5m5wmgi2m

Worth noting also that Image usually release a volume 1 collection only a month or two after the last issue is published and at a discount price so people can buy in easily if they arrive late. They also recognise that a lot of their readers trade wait, so they factor in for TPB sales alongside floppies.

Sentinel Red
Nov 13, 2007
Style > Content.
Kieron’s blogged before that a creator owned title doing around 10k was usually more lucrative than his Marvel work selling way more so he’s probably doing okay.

Heavy Metal
Sep 1, 2014

America's $1 Funnyman

That's about how many copies Invincible was selling during its run too.

Dawgstar
Jul 15, 2017

Sentinel Red posted:

Kieron’s blogged before that a creator owned title doing around 10k was usually more lucrative than his Marvel work selling way more so he’s probably doing okay.

Recently he talked about that going back to the Big Two would strictly be because he had a certain story to tell about one of their characters.

Air Skwirl
May 13, 2007

Neither snow nor rain nor heat nor gloom of night stays these couriers from the swift completion of their appointed shitposting.
Also, I have some great opinions.
I mean, Once and Future was originally a mini that went to 25 issues (and I expect ended just because Gillen didn't have anything else for the story). Wicked + Divine went for 42 issues. Seems like Image has a lot of faith in Gillen, and I'm guessing that faith is based on his comics selling very well for years at a time

Jiro
Jan 12, 2004

What's people's opinions on Minor Threats and its world building? I've really been enjoying how fleshed out it feels and the different types of stories. I'm curious as to how much influence Patton has on it, I know he's mellowed out the last decade or so publicly, but there's a big strain of cynicism and weird that I can't help but notice after being such a big fan of his comedy for so long.

Air Skwirl
May 13, 2007

Neither snow nor rain nor heat nor gloom of night stays these couriers from the swift completion of their appointed shitposting.
Also, I have some great opinions.

Jiro posted:

What's people's opinions on Minor Threats and its world building? I've really been enjoying how fleshed out it feels and the different types of stories. I'm curious as to how much influence Patton has on it, I know he's mellowed out the last decade or so publicly, but there's a big strain of cynicism and weird that I can't help but notice after being such a big fan of his comedy for so long.

Probably more known today for their influence on the genre than their actual catalog of songs, but an absolutely seminal hardcore band.

Cassa
Jan 29, 2009
I'm really digging Minor Threats, but I'm a sucker for indie superhero worlds that actually have that long legacy and still play with the capes and tights side of things instead of being too afraid of engaging with what they're riffing on.

Big Bad Voodoo Lou
Jan 1, 2006
I just reread Minor Threats volume 1 and chased it with volume 2, which I enjoyed, just not as much as volume 1. I love the feeling of a "lived-in" world with a lot of mythology and backstory, kind of like Astro City that way. I'm also a sucker for stories about supervillains either doing shady poo poo but not "take over the world" or "go around hurting and killing innocent people" shady poo poo, or supervillains seeking redemption, trying to do better and be better. I loved Ostrander's Suicide Squad, most versions of Thunderbolts, Villains United/Secret Six, Superior Foes of Spider-Man, and Flash's Rogues.

The first volume of Minor Threats just hit every button for me, because it was a reworking of a Batman graphic novel Patton Oswalt pitched to DC years ago called "J," inspired by the 1931 Fritz Lang film noir "M." In the movie, a bunch of low-level, pathetic criminals teamed up to hunt down a violent pedophile after the police started cracking down on the entire underworld to find him.

Patton's "J" was about the Joker (J) going so far with a heinous, unforgivable crime that Batman was out of control and the Justice League was taking a brutal, authoritarian approach to the criminal element in Gotham City as a result. So a bunch of literal C-list supervillains -- Cluemaster, Copperhead, Crime Doctor, Crazy Quilt, maybe one or two others -- teamed up to find and kill the Joker to get Batman and the Justice League off their cases. I thought that was a brilliant pitch, but even if people were unfamiliar with "M," I think it would have resonated and been a fun endeavor.

You can see how that story evolved into Minor Threats, with Brain Tease as Cluemaster (even though Cluemaster was originally the main protagonist, which became Playtime), Scalpel as Crime Doctor, and Snakestalker as Copperhead, plus Stickman as the Joker and Insomniac and Kid Dusk as Batman and Robin.

Big Bad Voodoo Lou fucked around with this message at 14:00 on Apr 30, 2025

Marshal Radisic
Oct 9, 2012


What I've noticed in both Minor Threats and its spinoffs is that Oswalt is very interested in taking the shifts and evolutions cape comics have undergone over the decades and literalizing them as events within the comic's setting. The first installment of the original series is very much about the evolution of supervillains from goofy jewel thieves with a gimmick in the Silver Age to the callous mass murderers of the Bronze Age, which is rendered within the story as a reaction by both the heroes and villains to the escalating violence of Stickman, the comic's Joker analogue. To drive the point home, the instigating incident of the book is very deliberately based on the murder of Jason Todd. (Oswalt took this idea for another spin in the story he wrote for that DC horror anthology, with a cursed artifact that's been bouncing between Gotham's rogues for decades and driving them into insane murderers. It doesn't really have the space to spread its wings, but I liked that he made Catwoman the artifact's latest victim, as she is a character who's been insulated from edgy retoolings by the need for her to remain a potential love interest for Bruce.)

He does something similar with his spinoff The Alternates, where a bunch of C- and D-listers were plucked out of their universe by a wizard, spent a decade each having their own very off-genre adventures in different universes, only to be unceremoniously dumped back in their original home and left to deal with the culture shock. In essence, it's a story about all the former Vertigo headliners having to deal with reintegrating into mainline DC continuity. As for his second spinoff The Brood, it's a straightforward take on King Lear with Lex Luthor and his kids rather than any sort of metatextual cape comic riff.

Marshal Radisic fucked around with this message at 17:52 on May 2, 2025

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Jiro
Jan 12, 2004

I had no idea about the initial premise of "Minor Threats" being a DC story but that does make a lot of sense. That's so cool, same with "The Brood" basically being "King Lear".

Whoever said it feels like a weirder ironic "Astro City" hit the nail on the head. The most recent anthology books " Welcome to Twilight" has some choice Allred art in the first issue. It really is kinda shaping up to be an Astro City that isn't afraid to be weird.

Now I gotta go track down that Fritz Lang movie.

Also all the talk on "The Power Fantasy", I'm all caught up and holy loving poo poo what a gut punch of a series. I'm incredibly curious as to how everything is just going to absolutely poo poo the bed.

Jiro fucked around with this message at 04:59 on Apr 30, 2025

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