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Subjunctive posted:I’m not sure “tenured professor at respected university, with good publication record” usually counts as being a faux intellectual, but he’s definitely a nut job.
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Apr 4, 2020 14:32
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Memento posted:Faux intellectual alt-right nutjob who says that you can change your life by tidying your room and also that women are the cause of all of your problems.
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Apr 4, 2020 14:35
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Memento posted:"good publication record" in psychology counts for exactly what these days though? Pretty standard for intellectuals?
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Apr 4, 2020 14:37
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Subjunctive posted:Pretty standard for intellectuals? Sounds good. Reproduce it.
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Apr 4, 2020 14:38
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pumpinglemma posted:It's definitely faux when he starts talking about stuff far outside his area of expertise, which he does constantly. Oh, does “intellectual” mean “expert” here? That’s not the meaning I’d understood, versus being educated and devoting energies to thinking about things, but if that’s the case I agree that he often oversteps his actual expertise.
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Apr 4, 2020 14:40
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Memento posted:Sounds good. Do you think “intellectual” means “good” or something?
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Apr 4, 2020 14:41
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you can be a tenured professor and an expert in a field and still be extremely stupid and not an intellectual
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Apr 4, 2020 14:42
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What makes someone an intellectual, then, in your mind?
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Apr 4, 2020 14:42
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Oh good the definition policeman has logged on Jordan Peterson is a loving shithead and your attempts to defend him by proxy can get in the loving ocean And basically the whole field of psychology is a loving sham Have a good evening.
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Apr 4, 2020 14:43
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Apr 4, 2020 14:45
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being intelligent and not so dumb you rant about lobsters when talking about human social hierarchies. just spending time thinking about things doesnt make you an intellectual edit: psychology isnt fake though lmao Stux fucked around with this message at 14:48 on Apr 4, 2020 |
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Apr 4, 2020 14:46
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good comeback
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Apr 4, 2020 14:47
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I edited out my response, because I decided it wasn’t productive. Apologies for not meeting your standards of posting rigour.
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Apr 4, 2020 14:52
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Subjunctive posted:Oh, does “intellectual” mean “expert” here? That’s not the meaning I’d understood, versus being educated and devoting energies to thinking about things, but if that’s the case I agree that he often oversteps his actual expertise.
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Apr 4, 2020 15:09
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pumpinglemma posted:Hey, nice selective quoting. What? The rest of your post was an example of the pattern you cited, and I said that I agreed with your assessment that the pattern was bad. What would I have to gain other than brevity from eliding it? Did I inadvertently gotcha you somehow that I can’t see? I agree that it was ridiculous for him to have a national (international?) platform for his pseudolegal analyses of pronoun implications. I Wrote A Letter to someone at a national paper about it, in fact. I don’t really know what’s going on here, but I apologize to the thread and Memento for my part in kicking it up. I didn’t think that saying I believed JP to genuinely be an intellectual, while still a “nut job”, would cause such a heated response. I actually think that he is not stupid, that he devotes his time to intellectual pursuits, and that his writings are outlandish for reasons similar to those that lead scammers to send typo-laden email with obviously implausible premises. My understanding from people who worked with him when he was still teaching and publishing is that he is both smart and manipulative, and I think the weird diagrams and evoking of crustaceans is cynical targeting of the people most susceptible to his grift. All that aside, I should have read the room better when I saw Memento’s response to me and emotional tenor of it, and walked away rather than trying to make my case. I certainly never intended to support JP in any meaningful way, even “by proxy” or whatever. I’ll go get some more coffee. Sorry. Go back the Trese brothers’ cyberpunk thing. It will have much more entertainment value than my posts.
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Apr 4, 2020 16:35
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You could've called Peterson an intellectual before he decided to go outside his wheelhouse because he's a moron there. He's not like Chomsky. Surprised someone who posts on SA had never heard of him.
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Apr 4, 2020 17:06
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Subjunctive posted:What? The rest of your post was an example of the pattern you cited, and I said that I agreed with your assessment that the pattern was bad. What would I have to gain other than brevity from eliding it? Did I inadvertently gotcha you somehow that I can’t see? I agree that it was ridiculous for him to have a national (international?) platform for his pseudolegal analyses of pronoun implications. I Wrote A Letter to someone at a national paper about it, in fact. an idiot can play make believe at being an intellecutal but theyll still be an idiot and not an intellectual. it doesnt matter if you devote your time to intellectual pursuits if all your conclusions are completely wrong, much like someone isnt a virtuso simply because they spend 40 hours a day playing piano. if theyre tone deaf and cant make it through a piece without stopping every 4 bars then theyre still bad at piano no matter how much time theyve spent on it.
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Apr 4, 2020 17:12
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Groovelord Neato posted:Surprised someone who posts on SA had never heard of him. Where would you be "supposed" to hear of him? Is he in the news or something?
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Apr 4, 2020 17:13
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Memento posted:Faux intellectual alt-right nutjob who says that you can change your life by tidying your room and also that women are the cause of all of your problems.
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Apr 4, 2020 17:15
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StrixNebulosa posted:Where would you be "supposed" to hear of him? Is he in the news or something? Peterson? Yeah he was on the news a ton before his weird diet destroyed him
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Apr 4, 2020 17:20
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CharlestheHammer posted:Peterson? Yeah he was on the news a ton before his weird diet destroyed him Ah that would be it. I stopped following the news in 2016 because it made my head explode with anger. (I have dialed that back to follow covid news because. But I still avoid other news.)
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Apr 4, 2020 17:23
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I watched the scene from The Messenger. Was expecting a couple lines with a veiled reference, but it's a full three minute story from "Jordan the Wise" and it's just regurgitation of his broke-brained, bootstraps philosophy. It would irritate the hell out of me to run into something like that in the middle of a game.
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Apr 4, 2020 17:45
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Maybe I'm giving the game too much credit but at the time I assumed that, given the context of the shopkeeper constantly telling you long boring stories, that they were making fun of Peterson.
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Apr 4, 2020 17:54
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Memento posted:And basically the whole field of psychology is a loving sham 
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Apr 4, 2020 18:19
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StrixNebulosa posted:Where would you be "supposed" to hear of him? Is he in the news or something? Inexplicable YouTube recs on LPs.
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Apr 4, 2020 21:38
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StrixNebulosa posted:Where would you be "supposed" to hear of him? Is he in the news or something? He's very popular online and posting on SA is about as online as a person can be.
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Apr 5, 2020 00:56
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In Other Waters is really fuckin good yall
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Apr 5, 2020 01:50
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I mean the reproducibility crisis, where massive swathes of the discipline are based on research that absolutely cannot be reproduced and should not be relied on.
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Apr 5, 2020 02:16
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lol
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Apr 5, 2020 02:20
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I took the Messenger thing to be a joke at Petersen's expense but the whole game was so poorly written that it's hard to know for sure.
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Apr 5, 2020 03:08
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PaletteSwappedNinja posted:I took the Messenger thing to be a joke at Petersen's expense but the whole game was so poorly written that it's hard to know for sure. I didn't know about the reference, and looking it up, the chuds sure seem to think it's a favourable reference. "OMG the game is anti-SJW??? day one buy!!" 
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Apr 5, 2020 04:47
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I mean, they have/had a 'did you assume my gender' '''joke''' in it. That should be all you really need to know about 'em.
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Apr 5, 2020 05:41
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Sometimes people have a lot of complex and even conflicting opinions so no that is not all you need to know about them imo
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Apr 5, 2020 05:56
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I looked it up and it appears they removed the transphobic, not-funny joke as soon as someone pointed out the issue to them. Not great that the joke made it in in the first place, but good response by removing it instead of doubling down about Video Gamer Free Speech or something.
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Apr 5, 2020 06:12
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I remember one of the advertised selling points of the game was the "humor", which is almost always a bad sign.
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Apr 5, 2020 08:53
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Wicked Them Beats posted:I looked it up and it appears they removed the transphobic, not-funny joke as soon as someone pointed out the issue to them. Not great that the joke made it in in the first place, but good response by removing it instead of doubling down about Video Gamer Free Speech or something. It’s sad that sometimes that’s the best you can hope for. I can feel for a team if one of the members is a bigot and puts something in without the team knowing. If they don’t fight taking it out I give them the benefit of the doubt. If they go all Ion Fury and try to fight it I pretty much write them off.
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Apr 5, 2020 13:00
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Chairchucker posted:Sometimes people have a lot of complex and even conflicting opinions so no that is not all you need to know about them imo Though most of the time that’s all you need to know. But movies have trained people to assume nuance is a thing when most of the time it really isn’t
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Apr 5, 2020 13:22
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Nuance is a thing, but so is context. If opinions run some gamut of great, good, ok, tolerable, iffy, concerning, bad, awful. Then the context in which they're expressed runs from fully intentional and pre planned and detailed, to fully intentional and pre-planned, to pre-planned but oddly worded, to intentional but in the moment, to under the influence, to under stress to under duress. Something done in a published work that has undergone revision is pretty clearly intentional so you need a lot of mitigating factors to say it doesn't represent someone. If you have an opinion that runs counter to how you wish to be seen you can just not express it, or if you want to express it, because it's complex and not really like that, then you can put in a lot of context and argument to defend it. If you willingly and consciously put an opinion out there, knowing how people will judge you on it, then you can expect people to judge you on it. Oxygenpoisoning posted:I can feel for a team if one of the members is a bigot and puts something in without the team knowing. If they don’t fight taking it out I give them the benefit of the doubt. If they go all Ion Fury and try to fight it I pretty much write them off. Yeah, the complexity and group work aspect of video games can make it harder to assign that opinion to a specific person, but their reaction to audience reaction usually gives a good clue as to where they stand.
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Apr 5, 2020 18:05
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Oxygenpoisoning posted:It’s sad that sometimes that’s the best you can hope for. I can feel for a team if one of the members is a bigot and puts something in without the team knowing. If they don’t fight taking it out I give them the benefit of the doubt. If they go all Ion Fury and try to fight it I pretty much write them off. It comes as a relief when the popular attitude on the internet is Never Renege On Anything (because that would be admitting you were wrong and then you'll be eaten by the mob.)
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Apr 5, 2020 19:28
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PaletteSwappedNinja posted:I took the Messenger thing to be a joke at Petersen's expense but the whole game was so poorly written that it's hard to know for sure. Yeah, I don’t remember the Peterson thing, but I do remember thinking the writing was poor. I certainly don’t want an RPG written like that.
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Apr 5, 2020 20:51
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