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McTimmy
Feb 29, 2008


Vagabong posted:

Are civil wars broken in Three Kingdoms? I've only ever seen them happen in game when they're mentioned in that event after Dong's death, but nothing seems to actually occur on the map.

I don't even know what happens to Li Jue and Gou Si for the event since I still see them in the faction half the time.

Actually getting a civil war to fire is tricky but it can happen, I've done it a few times, and even had it happen to me once. But usually the characters in positions to cause Civil Wars won't have the satisfaction low enough to trigger it without some effort.

Though Han Sui always seems to start in Civil War with Han Xin in the 200 start.

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MiddleOne
Feb 17, 2011



Have literally never seen or encountered and un-scripted civil war in 400 hours of play.

AAAAA! Real Muenster
Jul 12, 2008

My QB is also named Bort



McTimmy posted:

I don't even know what happens to Li Jue and Gou Si for the event since I still see them in the faction half the time.
I'm pretty sure nothing actually happens.

ACValiant
Sep 7, 2005

Huh...? Oh, this? Nah, don't worry. Just in the middle of some messy business.


MiddleOne posted:

Have literally never seen or encountered and un-scripted civil war in 400 hours of play.

Same. I'm rarely in a position where my generals are that unhappy with me. On the other hand, happiness in generals is a pretty un-fun mechanic anyway so I'm glad I'm not worrying about it all that much. I wouldn't mind if they changed it up so that it mattered but give me better ways of dealing with it rather than giving them a court position.

Edgar Allen Ho
Apr 3, 2017


Quoth James Cameron,

"Nevermore"



You could simply play as the good guy faction and have all your officers be brothers by default, but I guess benevolence doesn't come easy to everyone.

alex314
Nov 22, 2007


The only time I had general satisfaction crisis was with Southern Barbarian factions big decision.

I'm trying to play as Dong Zhuo on earliest start, and I'm doing pretty bad job at it. All provinces are spread out far, enemies come from 3 directions, and there's no way I could both secure my base, go after YT, and hit the missions. I imagine all it takes is to defend and then hit the event chain for that sweet auto-annexation.

Chortles
Dec 29, 2008


ACValiant posted:

I wouldn't mind if they changed it up so that it mattered but give me better ways of dealing with it rather than giving them a court position.
RoTK-style 'ancillaries grant satisfaction' but across the board, and/or make them desire specific ancillaries instead of higher office?

RoyalScion
May 16, 2009


From what I remember the civil war gives them a large penalty to satisfaction among other penalties, in addition to the other penalties if the enemy escapes.

That said Dong Zhuo and Li Jue have been in a lot of trouble lately, one time Gong Du captured Chang'an and the emperor mechanic disappeared on like turn 20 .

In most cases I don't think satisfaction is a big deal, either you give them a title or an admin position and that will probably carry you to the prime minister court along with ancillaries, since as far as I know the AI can't use turncoats against you. Some factions have decent early heir options too that will solve your satisfaction problem as well, like Lady Mi or Bian.

I guess there are the -30 satisfaction faction council missions now but the AI isn't really targeted enough to use them properly.

You don't really need to keep all your officers happy anyways, just the good ones.

RoyalScion fucked around with this message at 20:00 on Apr 26, 2021

AAAAA! Real Muenster
Jul 12, 2008

My QB is also named Bort



I've found that you can juggle giving someone a misc title for a couple years until you have other factors jumping their satisfaction up, then taking away the misc title doesnt drop them neagtive enough to matter. I think its usually when I get/grab an emperor seat and suddenly have three more people contributing their Authority to making people happy and providing any traits or skills that give +faction wide satisfaction. And tech, of course.

RoyalScion posted:

You don't really need to keep all your officers happy anyways, just the good ones.
Eh, the -10% corruption from High Satisfaction is pretty great.

super-redguy
Jan 24, 2019


I once did kickstart a civil war back near release for Cao Cao. I got Cao Pi to start his own thing and watched as the son gobbled up his father's lands while I took little pieces away from them.

Then Cao Pi died and Cao Cao was the heir.

Flipswitch
Mar 30, 2010





I kinda hope Liu Bei gets some mechanic rework in the future, Unity is such a boring mechanic.

Communist Thoughts
Jan 7, 2008

0.000% of Communism has been built.
Evil, child-murdering billionaires still rule the world with a shit eating grin.

All he has managed to do is make himself *sad*.

Instead of building communism, he now builds a precise model of this grotesque, duplicitous world.





I think despite the campaign mechanics in general being good, the diff factions are really poorly distinguished between eachother in terms of gameplay.

It's weird cause warhammer has dozens of factions that all play noticeably different but 3k has 4 factions and I don't think any of them play particularly thematically on the map.

MiddleOne
Feb 17, 2011



Flipswitch posted:

I kinda hope Liu Bei gets some mechanic rework in the future, Unity is such a boring mechanic.

Peasants for free? I mean you are right of course, it's pretty dull.


Communist Thoughts posted:

I think despite the campaign mechanics in general being good, the diff factions are really poorly distinguished between eachother in terms of gameplay.

It's weird cause warhammer has dozens of factions that all play noticeably different but 3k has 4 factions and I don't think any of them play particularly thematically on the map.

Kinda wish they wouldn't have spent so much effort on the Nanman only to have them locked away in a corner for most games.

alex314
Nov 22, 2007


You know what's bullshit? Getting hit by Cao Cao's minus food scheme on your first couple of turns.

Funky See Funky Do
Aug 20, 2013
STILL TRYING HARD

Communist Thoughts posted:

I think despite the campaign mechanics in general being good, the diff factions are really poorly distinguished between eachother in terms of gameplay.

It's weird cause warhammer has dozens of factions that all play noticeably different but 3k has 4 factions and I don't think any of them play particularly thematically on the map.

This is generally a problem with any historical TW title. There's not a lot of periods in history where groups that were right next to each other were all that different in terms of warfare. Let's say they did a 100 Years TW. Historically speaking both sides fielded exactly the same kind of troops. The story that gets told is Agincourt was a triumph of English archery vs Frech mounted knights so any TW game is going to exaggerate that and give England really good ranged units and France really good heavy cav but that's about as different as they're going to get.

I don't think there's a solution to this. Any two armies that face each other in any given period are going to be very similar in their composition.

AAAAA! Real Muenster
Jul 12, 2008

My QB is also named Bort



alex314 posted:

You know what's bullshit? Getting hit by Cao Cao's minus food scheme on your first couple of turns.
Its not necessarily that - there is also a Faction Council option to do that, too. As Sun Jian I had Liu Biao hit me with it twice in a 15 turn span in the first 20 turns of a game and it was crippling.


Communist Thoughts posted:

I think despite the campaign mechanics in general being good, the diff factions are really poorly distinguished between eachother in terms of gameplay.

It's weird cause warhammer has dozens of factions that all play noticeably different but 3k has 4 factions and I don't think any of them play particularly thematically on the map.
When you say "diff factions" do you mean Nanman/Yellow Turbans/Han? Or do you mean like... any Han leader compared to his Han neighbors?

AAAAA! Real Muenster fucked around with this message at 13:54 on Apr 27, 2021

reignonyourparade
Nov 15, 2012


Funky See Funky Do posted:

This is generally a problem with any historical TW title. There's not a lot of periods in history where groups that were right next to each other were all that different in terms of warfare. Let's say they did a 100 Years TW. Historically speaking both sides fielded exactly the same kind of troops. The story that gets told is Agincourt was a triumph of English archery vs Frech mounted knights so any TW game is going to exaggerate that and give England really good ranged units and France really good heavy cav but that's about as different as they're going to get.

I don't think there's a solution to this. Any two armies that face each other in any given period are going to be very similar in their composition.

The solution is to have never played total warhammer and thus have the status quo feel perfectly fine.

Meyers-Briggs Testicle
Aug 13, 2012



complaining about troop diversity is weird because that's the genre. it's a historical battle simulator. i dont play tw3k and complain about no dating-sim elements or lack of crafting mechanics, its not that kind of game. you sign up for historical total war, you get guys with spears.

HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?




Meyers-Briggs Testicle posted:

complaining about troop diversity is weird because that's the genre. it's a historical battle simulator. i dont play tw3k and complain about no dating-sim elements or lack of crafting mechanics, its not that kind of game. you sign up for historical total war, you get guys with spears.

i dunno rome total war had incendiary battle pigs

Flipswitch
Mar 30, 2010





Army cosmetics when you hit the three kingdoms era would be good to help diversify it. Even if the stats are the same. Bit like how the three kingdoms TV series diversified the troops.

Also Wei Shu and Wu did use varied tactics and troop compositions so more uniques would help tell them apart.

Randallteal
May 7, 2006

Good night, sweet prince, And flights of angels sing thee to thy rest

HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:

i dunno rome total war had incendiary battle pigs

"When the enemy fights nude, bring hot hogs" - Herodotus

yikes!
Jul 5, 2006




Soiled Meat

Meyers-Briggs Testicle posted:

complaining about troop diversity is weird because that's the genre. it's a historical battle simulator. i dont play tw3k and complain about no dating-sim elements or lack of crafting mechanics, its not that kind of game. you sign up for historical total war, you get guys with spears.

nah

HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?




If I were designing 3K, I'd give the very important officers uniques as well as reforms at each rank. Lu Bu's retinue would be totally different to Zhang Fei's. The uniformity of the ranks and distinctness of each faction would rise at each level. The major kingdoms would recruit from a totally different pool than the Han commons.

I still love the game, and all that represents a lot more work, but goddamn, I'd love it.

Xander77
Apr 6, 2009

Fuck it then. For another pit sandwich and some 'tater salad, I'll post a few more.




Funky See Funky Do posted:

This is generally a problem with any historical TW title.
I mean... there's Rome.

Ravenfood
Nov 4, 2011


Meyers-Briggs Testicle posted:

complaining about troop diversity is weird because that's the genre. it's a historical battle simulator. i dont play tw3k and complain about no dating-sim elements or lack of crafting mechanics, its not that kind of game. you sign up for historical total war, you get guys with spears.

If anything there are way too many guys with swords and nowhere near enough guys with spears.

Ravenfood fucked around with this message at 11:14 on Apr 28, 2021

Third World Reagan
May 19, 2008

Imagine four 'mechs waiting in a queue. Time works the same way.

I am here to complain about the lack of dating sims.

Koei Techmo guide me.

https://twitter.com/ChefLuBu_ATL/status/1386702325805461508/photo/1

Reiterpallasch
Nov 3, 2010



Fun Shoe

still seems more fun than the recent shibusawa-branded strategy games, frankly

Third World Reagan
May 19, 2008

Imagine four 'mechs waiting in a queue. Time works the same way.

I am also here to complain about how someone wields a spear why are they doing it that way

Flipswitch
Mar 30, 2010





HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:

If I were designing 3K, I'd give the very important officers uniques as well as reforms at each rank. Lu Bu's retinue would be totally different to Zhang Fei's. The uniformity of the ranks and distinctness of each faction would rise at each level. The major kingdoms would recruit from a totally different pool than the Han commons.

I still love the game, and all that represents a lot more work, but goddamn, I'd love it.
TROM does this, it's a nice touch. White Horse Fellows are GSZ only for example, and only Liu Bei's close officers get Oath Fellows. I think only Big Ears himself gets Buqu of the Left.

Muscle Tracer
Feb 23, 2007

Medals only weigh
one down.


Yeah, there's plenty to distinguish the different Total Warhammer races beyond just the units available. Different types of campaign objectives, unique currencies, different available army stances, different interactions with overworld terrain types, extremely well-defined color schemes, different tech trees. There's plenty of room to make spearmanii factions distinct through other means, at least for the campaign.

HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?




Flipswitch posted:

TROM does this, it's a nice touch. White Horse Fellows are GSZ only for example, and only Liu Bei's close officers get Oath Fellows. I think only Big Ears himself gets Buqu of the Left.

Exactly, thatís why I like TROM so much, though itís still somewhat limited in scope.

Eimi
Nov 23, 2013





Though speaking of dudes with spears, it was a shame in Troy that there actually were not enough dudes with spears where top tier units more often had anything but a spear. Look Troy is the one time I actually want 90% various types of spearmanii with different spears, that's the appeal of the setting and what's cool drat it!

Thom12255
Feb 23, 2013
WHERE THE FUCK IS MY MONEY


Rome Remastered reviews coming out seem to not indicate any bugs or problems introduced to the game, just the same game with some nicer graphics on top of it. I'm not sure if it's really fair to knock off score for a remaster for being a dated game when of course it's dated when it's a 20 year old game that is just being updated to run on the latest systems with some better textures and uncompressed audio slapped on it.

Thom12255 fucked around with this message at 16:32 on Apr 28, 2021

Third World Reagan
May 19, 2008

Imagine four 'mechs waiting in a queue. Time works the same way.

I mean except that whole having someone pay you to take all their provinces bug.

Thom12255
Feb 23, 2013
WHERE THE FUCK IS MY MONEY


Third World Reagan posted:

I mean except that whole having someone pay you to take all their provinces bug.

That wasn't normal practice in the ancient Mediterranean?

Third World Reagan
May 19, 2008

Imagine four 'mechs waiting in a queue. Time works the same way.

Egypt screaming, take all of my money and my property. In return I demand you forgive me for past sins that never happened.

Edgar Allen Ho
Apr 3, 2017


Quoth James Cameron,

"Nevermore"



Thom12255 posted:

That wasn't normal practice in the ancient Mediterranean?

I'm the king of Pergamon and I say it's in fact the correct course of action

alex314
Nov 22, 2007


I had one faction give me a province in R2 just because the ambasador I've sent was so good. It was a faction leader's wife, so it might have been some "Caesar, queen of Bithynia" thing

fuf
Sep 12, 2004

haha

How do I install this "enhanced graphics pack" thing?

e: oh nm the download button showed up at the same time as release

fuf fucked around with this message at 14:02 on Apr 29, 2021

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HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?




Thom12255 posted:

Rome Remastered reviews coming out seem to not indicate any bugs or problems introduced to the game, just the same game with some nicer graphics on top of it. I'm not sure if it's really fair to knock off score for a remaster for being a dated game when of course it's dated when it's a 20 year old game that is just being updated to run on the latest systems with some better textures and uncompressed audio slapped on it.

And they even ignore a lot of the advantages the old engine had, such as battle maps being derived from the campaign location and units feeling like units and not HP blobs. It's a very different flavour, and not a worse one. Rome, Three Kingdoms and Warhammer are all distinct enough to be mutually enjoyable.

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