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dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




That, and:
1) IEC 7180 (credit card/ID card) is a really common format in materials and processes amenable to economies of scale - in fact, your SIM card, even if it was a nano-SIM, was probably delivered as a semi-punched part of one;
2) SIM cards were originally intended to be exchanged a lot more than they ended up being (for most cases; granted, people who do a lot of travelling still probably switch cards a fair bit);
3) SIM cards were probably intended to be used in a lot more places than just cell phones - such as public terminals - which would have made even mini-SIMs a pain in the rear end.

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dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




The courts give more credence to fax than e-mail (not that either deserves any), so we're stuck.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




In a wire, channel competition takes place in, for practical purposes, one spatial dimension. (2 or 3 is possible in commercial buildouts, but unless you're in the IT bitch threads (2 drink minimum) this doesn't apply to you.) In air - as in wireless - channel competition takes place in all three dimensions.

Of course data density is wireless's Achilles' heel.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Tubesock Holocaust posted:

Before there was a card swipe machine at every register, there was this:



I haven't seen one of these in years.

1) Did anyone other than Bartizan actually make those? That's the only brand I ever really noticed.

2) They're going to be not just obsolete but useless soon, now that they're heading toward financial account cards with the information screened or sublimated under the protective layer, rather than embossed.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Also there's nothing intrinsically valuable about a terminal client not having any autonomous capabilities unless your terminal service actually requires it (for security or consistency reasons or something).

Ask Google why Chromebooks even function offline.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Billy Gnosis posted:

A lot of people complaining about the wrong types of pages coming up (LIEberal media), and they end up changing back to please the customer?

They can't go to Bing because they don't want their square searches mixed with their porn searches.

They can't go to DuckDuckGo because some pundit told them it was unamerican.

They can't go to Yahoo because lol Yahoo.

The hell are they gonna go?

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Probably 'we have more money than God and more power than most countries let's give it a shot'

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Geoj posted:

Unless your home is set up like a fortress any lock, no matter how resilient or tamper proof is only going to keep honest people honest anyways.

Even if they don't have well-honed lockpicking skills a common thief could just throw a brick through a window and gain entry that way.

Tamper-resistant locks guard against lovely insurance companies.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




flosofl posted:

What I'm hoping becomes obsolete is multiple devices. I want a single device that take advantage of multiple form-factors. A core device that can be carried as a phone and docks to shells that adds additional display horsepower and peripheral interfaces for a tablet or a laptop. Motorola tried it (unsuccessfully) with the Atrix. I know it's a probably multiple generations off and will require some revolutionary breakthroughs in processor design, but damnit that's what I want.

What makes you think you'll be able to develop software on this device, despite existing market trends? If you don't care if you can, then where do you think new software and new/better uses for your universal computing device will come from (And I don't mean "the app store")?

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Sentient Data posted:

Aren't beepers on a different cell network that's more robust or something like that? Maybe not after cell lines switched from analog to digital, but I remember that being a thing and the primary reason doctors had beepers even after cells dropped from insanely expensive to just sorta expensive

Pagers were also popular back when restricting cell phones from places that didn't already require a full-blown security clearance or materially valid NDA was a feasible thing to do.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Samizdata posted:

Still better than my GTX 760, or the 9500 GT I had before it.

You wouldn't buy it anymore with Pascal cards outperforming and undercutting it, though.

EDIT: You could probably argue this extends to halo computer components in general, really.

dont be mean to me has a new favorite as of 08:03 on Jun 11, 2016

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




mobby_6kl posted:

GTX 760: still not as obsolete as my 650 Ti! What's rather mind blowing is that, despite being orders of magnitude slower than anything in the 10xx range, it still runs everything very acceptably at 1080p.

Yeah. I mean, there's things like bus-powered GTX 950s out there, and unless you're used to ALL THE GRAPHICS cards you'd probably be fine with one. Most people's gaming is on phones these days, and when they aren't they still have their experiences shaped by 360s and PS3s. Maybe sick graphics generally belong in this thread, I dunno.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




twistedmentat posted:

I'm running fallout 4 on ultra with zero problems with a 970, friends with lower rated cards are having no issues with Overwatch or Warhammer Total War. Doom they've had issues with but that's because Doom has some weird graphical stuff going on.

Sound Cards. Does anyone who isn't a professional musician actually have separate sound cards on computers these days? I saw they do still sell them, but doesn't an integrated card do everything you need, and with USB headphones, isn't sound just software?

USB headphones scream gimmick, but you're close - most useful sound cards are external these days because there isn't much room left between the signal capabilities of onboard sound and the signal floor available inside the computer with its sixty-someodd pieces of EMI-generating circuitry.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Elliotw2 posted:

For pure headphones USB hasn't taken off yet, but for voip headsets USB has jumped to being the reigning king. You actually have to go out of your way to find a headset that still has two 3.5mm plugs.

VoIP isn't exactly a general-purpose application and it at least sort of makes sense I guess since most computers don't have 4-pin 3.5mm jacks, but subjecting something like headphones to artificial usage restrictions via a USB connector rather than the standard 1/4" or 3.5mm connectors is an atrocity, so take that "yet" back.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Elliotw2 posted:

Considering that Apple and Google are removing/discouraging 3.5mm jacks in their higher end models, that "yet" might be sooner than you think.

Are you glad for it?

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Elliotw2 posted:

I don't really care either way because I'm the small amount of people who doesn't really use headphones with their phones.

Well I do, because balkanizing audio connectors the same way we have data connectors and rendering decades of audio hardware obsolete seems pretty drat wasteful, especially if it's to shave half a millimeter off the thickness of a phone that probably needs to bulk back up a bit for the sake of its battery and its grip.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




ColHannibal posted:

Just upgrade

Do this.

quote:

follow the guides to disable to automatic updates and it's just like Windows 7.

Really? We're doing this now? If you're that freaked out about broken patches like it's the days of XP or something then it's time to stop using Windows altogether.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Tunicate posted:

yes because having microsoft silently install a new OS and take closing the window as consent doesn't set a bad precedent about how they'll use the ability to force updates onto your computer

It's their OS. It's been their OS for thirty years. You just can't deny it anymore. And as a bonus that stuff is in 7 and 8.1 now and they can just re-add the relevant patches to get them out of your hidden updates list pretty much whenever they think to do so.

No, people do not remember to patch manually every month, because normal people do not work that way, and not patching is how we get Windows XP again.

If this is a problem for you, why are you still using Windows.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




The Gasmask posted:

I have 10 on my laptop (which I'd made sure to disable the auto update to, went to take a poo poo, and when I got back it was already mostly installed, kinda soured me off the bat), but the experience so far hasn't been terrible*.

I'd like to update on my desktop but to elaborate on the star above, there are a ton of older audio production programs/plugins/hardware that I use on a near daily basis which aren't stable in the slightest with 10 and will never be updated. The 10 surprise install already sort of boned me since I keep my laptop as a portable DAW when I need and now I can't use my 24-input setup on the go, only a tiny 2-input one, but luckily that's not something I do often so it hasn't changed much.

One thing I'm pretty unhappy about (which is probably not Microsoft's fault) is being unable to go back to pre 362 nVidia drivers on the laptop. post 362 ones are broken with CUDA stuff/Iray rendering, and for whatever reason the old drivers don't detect the card... Admittedly I haven't checked in the past couple of weeks so maybe they've solved it finally, but it's disheartening to see all these software vendors put out reports saying "DON'T USE NEW NVIDIA DRIVERS!!! Oh, and the 1070 and 1080 also have that issue!". Don't know how that happened...

E: looks like late July for the IRay and 1070/1080 fix... Which is crazy, considering IRay is an nVidia renderer, and it doesn't work with their flagship products (i.e. it only renders with cpu instead of gpu so you get no speed benefits)

Sounds like you have an uncanny ability for picking software developed by people who'd rather be rentiers than software developers.

This isn't intended as passing judgment; that sounds like a living hell.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Shugojin posted:

Principal Investigator, probably. The way a lot of science research works now is that there's one older professor who manages to get a bunch of grant money (admittedly a very very important job) and sort of head up the research while postdocs and grad students do a lot of the more researchy looking work.

And one of them paid dollars for a Toshiba product?

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Buttcoin purse posted:

drat, which version of Windows is this broken?

Depends on what third-party jank he's got; I haven't had a problem like that since before Windows 2000.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




cheerfullydrab posted:

This thread and other parts of the internet convinced me that Windows 10 is best avoided. My ancient laptop kicked the bucket a few months ago, and I've just been using phone and tablet since.

Yesterday, I ordered this bargain basement laptop. No Windows 10! There are few choices out there to avoid the thing.

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Refurbish...sional/47085644

The same computer cost $1200 five years ago.

So what's your plan for when Windows 7 is no longer supported by Microsoft and your computer gets dragged into a botnet?

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




cheerfullydrab posted:

Is that really going to happen?

Happened with XP, and we didn't think XP's security model would become impossible to secure until it did, and if anything users have gotten more obtuse and obstinate since its heyday, not less.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




treiz01 posted:

Almost any laptop can be greatly improved this way, IMO. Now that I run SSD's in my gaming computer and laptop I'd never go back to mechanical primary drives. Still great for mass storage though!

Mechanical hard drives aren't great for anything (they can be described as rust-coated glass platters which primarily exist to fail and, as a useful side effect, store data for a time), they're just least bad for storing terabytes of stuff in a fairly accessible format. They're also slightly less bad for long-term storage than SSDs since SSD data can decay if left unpowered for a year or three, but you should be using archival optical or archival tape or a 'somebody else's problem' server (a/k/a The Butt Cloud, and ideally archival and online) for that.

Fortunately economies of scale are driving down the cost of SSD components, so eventually platter drives should be unjustifiable by any metric, and I look forward to them being enshrined in this thread.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Exit Strategy posted:

I'd go so far as to argue that most of the computing commoners don't need "real" computers at all - tablets, heir to the iMac throne of "I want something that looks nice on my table and sometimes lets me watch movies or order airline tickets" are a far safer alternative for the vast majority of humanity.

This leads me to wonder where you expect interesting new software to come from. App stores and pleasure or curiosity projects don't really mix, and even universities lean more toward software-as-marketing than is likely to push informatics forward at a useful pace.

Also, as much as I recognize that a lot of people really aren't in a position to wrap their mind around it (more accurately, they're probably cut out for it, because humans are profoundly versatile, but real-world time/money/focus demands are a hell of a drug) I'm on principle image-macro-upset with you for proposing taking general-purpose computing out of the general public's hands.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Grumbletron 4000 posted:

I wasn't busting your balls. Just offering the insight of someone who isn't necessarily ignorant of current tech but just doesn't care. I tend to just add a new, lovely device to my arsenal of obsolete crap to bridge the gap. I used to try and keep up with the newest and best but I found other ways to burn my disposable income.

I was the tech support guy for my family once. It was hell. Now I just tell people to buy either an iPad, a cheapo Android tablet or a midrange laptop depending on what they ask me. Anyone that needs more already knows what they want for the most part.

Well yeah, you can do The Job (and learn The Job) with a 200-dollar store-brand TV and a Raspberry Pi or three, or hell, someone will figure out how to get people to develop software in a web app soon, if not already. Anything beyond is specialist tools or desire-driven.

And you can't with thousand-dollar tablets.

Computers are now fast enough that they'll usually be cast aside because some lesser material not part of the processing chain failed, or it was on full-tilt for 20 years and the circuits physically tore themselves apart, or not having some actually useful thing baked in (Vulkan looks like the next big one, now for non-neckbeards too thanks to WebGL, but it could be a decade or more off; that's how rare actually useful changes are), or some artificial feature-exclusion thing (which seems super wasteful to me) rather than being a candidate for the thread.

Ironically, narrow-purpose computers actually sort of help here because whatever's on your desk has a much larger thermal envelope than something that has to be cooled exclusively by contact with air or desks or hands (which is what they're designing around now) and thus will be able to do more for several years yet.

Your handling of this mess in your personal and social life makes sense, although I'd drop Android as a consideration; app writers designing for phone-first aside, the security and endurance situations on Android are epic nightmares and until Google starts playing hardball with the OEMs that can poo poo all over Android and take none of the heat for it it won't get better. Maybe Chromebooks; Google went hardball-first on those and it actually sort of works.

Exit Strategy posted:

I'm former IT. My statement doesn't come from ignorance of the "computing needs" of the general population, nor out of some sort of misguided "lol plebs" poo poo, but out of a genuine feeling of gently caress-fixing-everyone's-poo poo. I'm so loving tired of every single computer problem anyone I know being pointed at me that I've started recommending people buy a tablet or perhaps a Fisher Price My First Computer if they can't handle their own poo poo.

Your handling of this mess is ... understandable, but war against the world is over the line. That feeling isn't going to go away on its own; talk to someone.

dont be mean to me has a new favorite as of 09:06 on Jul 4, 2016

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Instant Sunrise posted:

Weren't most of the machines that ended up in botnets running Windows XP FCKGW edition, which was blacklisted from security updates?

I mean, you're not wrong about it, but I'd hope Microsoft learnt their lesson after how bad it turned out to be to have a blacklist for security updates.

Sort of (note that it's not a mistake they'd made since), but the security model fell apart all on its own even without that. The sad part is that MS still have to support industrial and cash register systems and things until 2019 because there are still companies today that refuse to support anything newer than XP and there are still people trying to fake being that to stay on XP at home.

Still, what Microsoft learned is that idiots and assholes would rather put one over on Microsoft than have a machine that's not basically a hellmouth.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




AlternateAccount posted:

Uhh Walmart DOES get special stripped down extra lovely versions of electronics sometimes to cut the costs even lower.

Enjoy your lovely low-rent laptop.

A LOT of shops do that so they have something to shove out the door on Black Friday or for other radical market segmentation reasons or to confound price comparisons or any of a hundred other client-hostile reasons.

Always check the entire model number, and if they won't let you, you walk. Hell, check the serial number if they'll let you.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




blugu64 posted:

Walmart puts less pickles in my pickle jar

Also possibly true; most pickle jars are listed by total agricultural mass, and when you buy one the brine may take up more and the pickled cucumbers inside correspondingly fewer in number and smaller in mass and volume compared to the same product from the same supplier at another store even within the same chain (and upscale shops may also pay for or otherwise secure preferential choice among which batches they receive from the manufacturer with regard to quality).

dont be mean to me has a new favorite as of 21:33 on Jul 5, 2016

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Instant Sunrise posted:

Also packaged food companies will vary the quantity of food inside the bags based on food prices at the time to keep the sticker price the same.

So while a bag of potato chips will cost you $.99, the amount of potato chips in the bag will vary with food prices.

Yeah, doesn't the USDA or whoever regulates food where someone's reading this allow some pretty huge variance from the sticker (up to 10% in cases)?

This also makes the nutrition statistics label kind of lol.

v v v Timing!

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Grumbletron 4000 posted:

I'd love to see a car manufacturer emerge that could produce a safe, cheap, reliable car that's built to last and easy to fix. Performance and luxury be damned. Its got to be possible.

The mechanical stuff probably does last longer than it used to (and the examples you cite are confirmation bias, since the busted cars have probably been recycled into other steel constructs now, maybe even other cars, therefore you don't see tons of busted cars around). But yes, proprietary connections rendering perfectly functional hardware (and nowhere near just cars the gently caress a fridge or an air conditioner need a Tizen interface built into it for) practically useless, in an age that looks dangerously close to peak everything, is a straight-up call-the-ICJ atrocity.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




And luddites are worried about needing the number of the beast to buy food and things. Nope, the system being broken will send us back to a cash society.

Also banknotes are serialized so it's pretty much just their laziness and you not wanting to be That Guy Who Pays In Pennies that keeps every transaction from being thoroughly tracked as is.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Pham Nuwen posted:

So in this hypothetical scenario where tills are replaced with scanners that read every single bill's serial number, how do they associate the money being fed in with any particular person? Do you also have to hand over your driver's license when you pay with cash?

Bank accounts are still a thing. Wait long enough and Big Data will do it for you, unless everyone keeps their money under the mattress.

Note this is all hypothetical, and an effort to point out how silly total transaction awareness is. Bill scanners aren't going to be that literally everywhere. Probably. They have iPhone vending machines now, so the economy still has plenty of room for weird.

dont be mean to me has a new favorite as of 21:08 on Jul 8, 2016

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Humphreys posted:

Well some apparently obsolete tech has at least let my PC hobble along.

My attempts to get Windows 10 installed ended with an install that doesn't support ANY form of USB. No keyboard, no mouse and no USB devices (yet still will charge devices connected to it).

So here I was with a fresh upgrade at the login screen and no loving way to type my password. Luckily I still had a PS/2 keyboard lying around and a motherboard with support for it. It worked! However on of the keys on the board is dead and it happened to be part of my password. A quick and dirty PS/2 emulation circuit with an arduino and I can at least login and change password to not use that key.

Now I have networking up too and even with official drivers and trying windows update to solve the problem - my computer is still crippled

Who's responsible for manufacturing your laptop or motherboard?

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




This is a link to "Internet of poo poo" on Twitter because your link isn't cynical enough. because of the name (surprisingly little actual feces though).

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Manuel Calavera posted:

Old folk who don't have smart phones, probably. My mom has an iphone now, but my parents still tend to print off mapquest () directions.

Familiarity is a hell of a drug.

On the other hand, having a hard copy is useful because if your computer navigator cuts out it's better than ending up in The Woods or something.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Lurking Haro posted:

Turns out the Juicero is way overengineered for just being an electric press or even a consumer product.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Cp-BGQfpHQ

Well, when your design market is "the International Space Station", and you want to wring some blood out of that stone (which your machine won't recognize because DRM ) then of course your marketing people will do something stupid.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




Mondian posted:

So purely aesthetic reasons? I'm guessing they're used for art or something? I worked with engineers and architects for 15 years and never saw anything pen plotted or anything that came out of a large format printer that couldn't be easily read regardless of size or scale. Very confused right now.

Printers can't produce true diagonal lines for the same reason general-purpose grid displays can't. (A plotter relates to a printer the same way an oscilloscope or Vectrex tube relates to a regular monitor.)

Nobody wanted to take chances with blueprints, and this was a bigger deal when things like dot-matrix printers and fax-quality inkjet and laser printers were still the thing.

Now, of course, printers can deposit ink/toner/wax/whatever in fine enough detail that only being able to approximate diagonals isn't much of an issue, and many schematics live in vector-graphics files their whole lives and are never committed to hardcopy anyway. Also CNC cutters still work a lot like plotters, as you might expect.

dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




DesperateDan posted:

Normal car gps units are pretty obsolete now it seems, my old unit is getting crash prone and laggy and i cant update the maps without paying a shitload so I looked for a replacement and the prices were insanely high compared with the function offered for essentially free on google maps.

Guess I will use my phone, but i liked having something that i could plug in, stick to the windscreen and have a map with no fuss or distractions.

Google Maps on your phone, in navigation mode, in a suction-cup or vent-clip phone holder?

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dont be mean to me
May 2, 2007

I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars




ladron posted:

wait until y'all find out about south korea and active x.

Hey.

HEY.

The South Korean National Tax Service is abandoning ActiveX. South Korea is finally free of one of its top five greatest enemies.

... At the end of this year. (E: Wrong year at first, whoops)

If you have an irrational regret of life itself, rest assured, that's rational.

dont be mean to me has a new favorite as of 05:40 on Feb 8, 2018

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