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mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

minato posted:

Quad polygons are "better" because:
- More intuitive for 3D artists, both the modellers (who prefer to map a compass-direction grid over objects, vs a compass+45 degree angle grid when using triangles) and the texture artists, because quads map more intuitively to 2D quad textures than triangles do.
- More conducive to get better results for higher-order surfaces like NURBS (not applicable to the Saturn, which couldn't draw those)
- Better compression of polygon data

However I say "better" in quotes because all those advantages don't really apply anymore. These days artists don't have to care much about poly counts anymore, and most 3D packages probably use higher order surfaces anyway. Compression is no longer an issue because either computer resources are no longer scarce, and/or triangle strip technology is probably better at compressing polygon data these days than quads are.

(Triangle strips are a efficient way of representing lots of connected triangles. They work by defining 3 points of a triangle to start with, and then each additional triangle is represented by adding 1 more point to the list and using the last 3 points as the vertices)

Yeah, this sounds like a misunderstanding fueled by fanboyism.

Neither the PlayStation nor the Saturn graphics chips were "true" 3D, in that their graphics chips had no concept of a Z axis or did any 3D calculations. They were just fast 2D triangle renderers with texture mapping support, and without any per-pixel 3D calculations it meant that textures got warped the more they were viewed side-on. All the 3D calculations were done on the CPU.

People also said that quads were better at representing true curves, and "therefore the Saturn was better". It's true that if you want a perfectly smooth surface with no discontinuities between patches, then you want to make those patches out of quad higher-order surfaces like NURBS (Non-Uniform Rational B-Splines) rather than triangles. However rendering NURBS was a Big Deal back in 1995, you needed some serious hardware to do it, and the Saturn definitely didn't have that. (I recall that there were big rumors floating around prior to the launch of the PS2 that it would support NURBS in hardware, which would have been huge if it was true because even high-end PC graphics cards couldn't do that)

Quads have some downsides too. These included:
- it's possible to make a quad where the 2 internal triangles overlap, and this caused havoc with transparency because it meant some transparency calculations got performed twice.
- if you just want a triangle then you have to collapse a quad into a triangle by making 2 vertices the same, and this was a waste of processing power.

Back what when I was a 3d Modeler, quad polygons and NURBS we're just becoming popular. I did take to NURBS like a fish to water using Rhino, but I never like quad tessellation. Triangles seem to make a more pleasing surface.

Now I'm a glorified accountant and middle-manager. Life sucks.

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mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Code Jockey posted:

I am in charge of our EDI system at my job [midsize e-commerce place], and it's still widely used by a lot of modern companies, big [like Walmart big] and small. I wouldn't consider it obsolete, it still does what it needs to do pretty well, and a lot of companies hate change and have 20 year old systems that pump out EDI data, so yay for job security.

EDI is cool except when companies say "gently caress the standards do it our way" :argh:

I used to be a logistics manager some years ago. I once worked with a customer that used Foxpro as their translator, made up their own 850 format and took their invoicing off an 856. No AK from either side, no 810, no 812.

Since Gentran refused to do what they asked (no delimiters, just CRLF, no term, no X12 wrapper) I had to make my own pre and post translator using scripts and then give it to Gentran.

EDI is only fun if you do it for a living. If not, it's the most boring thing in the world. ANSI X12 4010 ISO wrapper blah blah... Click on the phone to connect to the VAN. Lose your mind using the mapper.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Code Jockey posted:

Jesus christ why

Also gently caress crlf or god help me, other nonprintable characters as delimiters, just use a god drat ~ like god intended :argh: and no ISA/GS wrapper? I just don't... :psyduck:

Yeah you win. My worst problem is vendors who send, for one example, price change requests in message segments instead of 855s with proper codes, and carriers... Well, just carriers. Oh my god freight carriers are bad at standards.

When in doubt, shove it in the message segment. Someone will totally read it...

I tried to explain the issue to the vendor referenced. They didn't understand why standards are important. They also were unable to provide a remittance for the payments they made. They just did straight 10% hold-back for everything outstanding without ever telling us what they were paying. Just a check without even a memo line.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Dick Trauma posted:

I was one of those people that tried to save a few bucks by buying one of these. To its credit it never caused me any trouble.



I had the launcher version of the external zip. It would throw the disk a good 3 feet if you didn't catch it with your hand. The eject springs were very inconsistent from drive to drive. With some devices, you had to pick the disk out with your nails.

I don't care what Iomega says, the click of death was real. I've taken a bad one apart and the failure is obvious. The drive would attempt to find the zero block. If it was missing, it would home the head (click) and try again. By doing so, the poorly attached head would detach after 20 or 30 attempts in a row and scrape the disk. Thus a hardware virus was created. There was no code to stop the re-attempt sequence so it would destroy the drive and replicate. The head was held to the arm by glue, copper, and hope.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Jedit posted:

I said "my first PC", not my first computer. My first computer had 1KB of RAM, expanded to 16KB with a module. Fun fact: if 1KB was represented by 1 pixel, graphing the trend for typical home computer memory over the last 40 years would require stacking 3884 1080p monitors on top of one another.

The first one I used back in the day was an AIM Rockwell 65 with a wooden chassis that my dad made. It had the 16k upgraded RAM, 40 character display, and only worked with Machine Language. I discovered by using it that I would never be a programmer.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AIM-65

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Jmcrofts posted:

I totally do have this on T-Mobile



It's kind of buried in their site

I've got completely unlimited data for about $90 a month including voice and unlimited texts. Grandfathered plan. It's expensive service, but I can run an ISP with my phone and I never get throttled.

That's pretty obsolete these days.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

El Estrago Bonito posted:

They were a good idea if only to just get word processors into the hands of more people but they were specced waaaaaay too low to do anything good. Also they just came at a bad time for Laptops. We crossed a line in 2012 or so where the average cost of really good refurbished consumer grade laptops plummeted hard and stuff like the AMD APU chips really pushed what you could do with low power draw onboard video options. It was a bad time to be in the cheap lappy business because within three years we had laptops that were ultra cheap and absolutely demolished that generation in specs.

2008-2011 was a really bad period for laptops. Too many were leaning on really awful core 2 duo processors (instead of the superior for the time AMD offering) and the ultra lovely Nvidia 9800M chipset, which was just an awful fit for a laptop. That whole series ran too hot in normal towers, IDK why they thought cramming a card with the average temp of a blacksmiths forge into tiny laptop bodies was a good idea but it reduced them all to ash in a short time.

The OLPC project had no idea of how service part supply chain management worked. I tried to reach out to them years ago to explain why the business model wouldn't work. There was an assumption that kids would figure out how to fix them on their own but that's not possible without a distribution system for service parts.

All I got back was lip service emails from the assistants. It is bad technology, poor model, and not sustainable.

The OLPC project refused to consider logistics and that was it's downfall as far as I can see. I think they were over-focused on the do-gooder portion of the project.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Krispy Kareem posted:

I asked a TV repair guy about that once. Ends up no one ever used it. I think some TV's have the capability, but it's no longer promoted.

Kind of like when I was a teenager and reading about this brand new technology called High Definition television. One of the perks was watching multiple shows at the same time, but in reality that isn't something anyone does.

When I worked at a re-seller for televisions, back when LCD was a new thing, we had customers that were obsessed with PIP. It never worked right, and sound was a huge problem, and some sources wouldn't do PIP. No one ever used it, but customers insisted that it worked so they could play with it for 5 seconds and get bored.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

mobby_6kl posted:

Speaking of obsolete tech, I'm typing this post right now on the update of the original PS2 MS Natural:



The only downside is with the messed up cursor keys but I got used to it after 16 years. Otherwise it keeps working fine (and feels pretty good for a rubber dome system) so I never get the motivation to shell out a Grant or two for a new keyboard.

That used to be my favorite years ago. It does have a better feel than it should. The nice thing was that you could pull the key caps really easily, disassemble the keyboard and chuck everything but the electronics in the dishwasher or just scrub them in the sink. Do that every 6 months and they last forever. Also, pop off the F1 key. You can still press it with a pen if you need to, but you don't have to deal with that incredibly irritating distraction of popping up the "Help" dialog.

Now I'm all about my Northgate Omni Key 101. It's old and tired and there's no Windows key. The "N" key needs to be replaced but I suck at soldering. It likes to double sometimes. It uses Alps switches, White I believe, but they could be Blue. I've never taken it apart. You need a key cap puller to avoid breaking them and they've been out of business for many years.

It's kind of like an IBM with buckling springs, but without the weight and a little firmer feel. You can still irritate everyone in the room with your keyboard that sounds like a Selectric. That's what's most important.

Mine looks way more worn and gross than the pretty one below. Someday I'll get a cap puller and clean it properly.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Humphreys posted:

Oh - oops yeah I forgot it was only if you have aero turned on. 6 screens of windows layered over each other and tabbing through looks great, and all windows go back to their original location.

Because it's a Friday night here, I'm drunk and now looking up fast typing and watching stuff on stenography.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZAkkTtsPKOA

I have a Stenograph from back in the day and it's pretty fun to play with. It's an amazing concept.

However, that gal needs to speed up in her explanation. To be a stenographer, you need to have your mind in the game. "This machine has keys on it..." I got it lady, how do you use it? Let's get a fire going here people.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

The_White_Crane posted:

I'm only 27 and I'm pretty sure my parents still had cars with manual windows up 'til I was at least 10. :shrug:

I had cars with crank up windows until about 2005. The last car was a cheap mid '90s Dodge Neon that didn't even have power steering or a radio. Or a functioning dash cluster now that I think of it. The guy I bought it from said it had "a good back seat". It wasn't a euphemism for anything. He just thought that was the best selling point. The back seat was actually broken but I didn't have the heart to tell him. You could just lift it right off. All the bolts had snapped.

The thing was great in the winter, with no power steering and a manual transmission, you could really feel the road. It also weighed nothing so it was quicker than you would think.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Tubesock Holocaust posted:

I suppose music machines specifically designed to play background music over and over again are an obsolete and failed technology. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1WQbJ0VFrFQ

I didn't even know 3M made music players.

That thing is awesome! For our hold music, our audio guy that supports our office, converted a pre-amp for a car into a continuous music player. It works awesome and always restarts if the power goes out. It's super cool. It's in a cardboard box on top of our PBX and is the best thing ever. Never fails. It's super ghetto, but never fails to make me smile when I see it.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Lazlo Nibble posted:

This reminds me of the setup my middle/high school had, where they used colored signal lights to time the classes rather than bells, or clocks in the classrooms. The white light was lit for something like the first two-thirds of the period, then green for the last third, then amber for one minute as a signal to wrap things up, then red while people went to their next class, then blinking red for the last minute before the next class started. The idea was to cut down on getting distracted by the clock, which it did pretty well, though in boring classes people tended to start chanting "aaam-berrr" under their breath towards the end. They gave up on it a few years after I graduated—it dated back to at least the mid-'60s so god knows how much of a pain it was to keep running, particularly if it was a custom build.

When I was a student in college and also when I was a TA at same, I hated the clock watchers. At 5 minutes to the hour, the clock-watchers would start putting their stuff away and zipping up their bags. I've got 5 loving minutes assholes! Let me finish my lecture! You paid for this education, use the time wisely. It's not high school.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Lowen SoDium posted:

Carl's Jr. (gently caress you, I'm Eating!) has announced that they working towards automated restaurants, and I believe that Wendy's said that they were going to installed self-service kiosk in many of their locations to get around a $15 minimum wage. In the next few years, teenagers and burnouts working in fast food will be obsolete. In a few year after that, most unskilled labor will be gone too. I would go as far as to guess that with in 15 years, retail stores will be almost completely automated except for the one token human to is there to override the computer and address customer complaints. In malls, it will probably even be a mall staff position or something where 1 person is the token human for 3 or 4 stores.

I used to work for a company that produced POS equipment for Wendy's. We experimented with self-service kiosks as a QSR methodology. It was complete garbage and never worked with customer flow. Humans can route traffic and take orders 10 times faster than a touch screen. Every time we tried to make it work, it failed. It slows service and causes your drop chart to become confusing as there isn't constant human feedback based on intuition. Weather, traffic patterns, construction on a particular road, local events, local news, etc.

Humans parse information faster than any computer. That's why the self checkouts suck at grocery stores. They're only faster when you've done retail yourself in the past. Otherwise, the machine fights with you if you can't tell a Poblano from an Anaheim.

In my opinion, the future should be motherfucking people handling the register. Kiosks are one step forward and two steps back.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Jerry Cotton posted:

You learn how to open a bank account by going into a bank and telling them you want to open an account.

People are idiots. I've had staff in their 20's that act like it requires skill to open a bank account and I've had to coach them to just go f'n ask for one!

That's not even the worst buffoonery I deal with. I have person from a neighboring company in my building that always plugs up the toilet on our floor and gets poo poo on the seat. He literally is unable to wipe without getting poo poo on the seat. He won't poo poo in his own suite. He comes down to our public bathroom in the hall and blasts rear end. I often see him scurrying away and I know that I'll have to call maintenance.

He's a financial adviser at an investment firm.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Spy_Guy posted:

On the Walther, yes.



I'm obsessed with old business machines too.

This is the desk calculator that I use


Mine has the shiny finish but it looks almost the same. I think mine's a little older but it's super handy and you never need new batteries. You just have to get used to doing subtraction via the reciprocal. I used to use a Burroughs portable, but my kids kept messing with it and I didn't want them to break it. I'll hall it back out in due time.

Someday, I hope to find a working Marchant at a reasonable price.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Magnus Praeda posted:

What's wrong with American wall sockets? They're polarized, grounded, and backwards-compatible with older two-prong devices. With current code updates mandating tamper-resistant shutters, they're even hard for little Timmy to electrocute himself without REALLY trying.

Plus, if you switch to using Decora for everything, it's easy to get keystone plates for up to six keystones so you can have a bunch of low-voltage stuff with the same cover plates as your outlets and switches.

US uses 110v so there is less risk, as such, they can be simpler. Most other countries use 220v? to my understanding. As such, there is significant risk to grounding out. I've zapped myself with 110 many a time but after getting myself with 220 once, I'll never do it again. It sucks to have your whole body lock up. Rewiring a cable end for a welder with the other end plugged in is not a good idea. Live and learn.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Iron Crowned posted:

I think they had Ctrl-Alt-Del blocked out or something. Remember this was in the Windows 95 days

You can't stop an NMI. The computer must respond in some way, even if it's another login screen.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

AlternateAccount posted:

Uhh Walmart DOES get special stripped down extra lovely versions of electronics sometimes to cut the costs even lower.

Enjoy your lovely low-rent laptop.

OEM's definitely do make different SKUs for Walmart. Check if the SKU has a "W" at the end. They're not made purposely bad, they're just not made purposely good.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Imagined posted:

I too find it easier to print something, hope the printer had paper and ink, walk over to the printer, put it in the fax, dial the fax #, hope it goes through ok, then wait for the person on the other end to get it, scan it back into their computer (only at a shittier quality now) and then deal with it.


Truly this is way easier than print to pdf > send to mail recipient.

"someone automated part of your workflow" yeah Microsoft Outlook about 20 years ago.

Can we just agree that sometimes email is easier and sometimes fax is easier? We'll all be OK. I like emailing PDFs that I already have, and if the contract has to be filled out by hand, I like to fax them.

I never have problems with my fax machine at home, nor at work. It's reliable technology.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

spog posted:

Why would you use microfilm in 2011?

That's taking the 'historical' part a bit too seriously

It's archival and anyone can make a reader using a microscope and projector. I can hit the film with a hammer and still read it. Try reading from a HDD that you've smashed with a hammer and bent a platter.

It's slow and awkward, but it doesn't fail. I still miss card catalogs at the library. They don't break and you can walk the stacks with your fingers. PALS was pretty good, but the new fancy systems are too much like shopping on Amazon. Too many suggestions and interstitial content. At least, that's what the library I take my kids to is like.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Phanatic posted:


The Atari that developed the Jaguar was the same one (Atari Corporation) that developed the Atari ST, which was a fairly successful machine.

The 520/1040 ST was used for audio processing and midi for decades after they were obsolete. We had one of each when I was a kid and always used them for desktop publishing in grade school/junior high. You also could get really bad-rear end games for it. You could play arcade quality games when everyone else was stuck with the original Nintendo. 8mhz 68000 Motorola ftw!

We used to go to Atari User Group sessions and trade shareware and buy software. It's so cool to hook up a synth to your computer and natively do midi sequencing and then play Gauntlet until you want to kill yourself from the "Death" sound effect.

I loved my ST. Too bad that Atari screwed the pooch.

Also, I miss Gauntlet. That was the best co-op game ever.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Lizard Combatant posted:

That would have been hz not fps.

Shouldn't 23/24 fps look all right at 120hz? That divides nicely. Or is it still 3:2 pull-down for some reason?

My in-laws have one of those TVs that do the interpolation. It makes everything look like a soap opera. Our eyes are used to what a 3:2 pull-down looks like and our brains say "That's a movie". When it's smoothed out, your brain says "That's a soap opera".

It is pretty and is awesome for sports, but 24fps and 3:2 pull-downs are what our mind wants.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Suzuran posted:

What about actual punch clocks, are those obsolete yet? At a prior employer we had one of the old mechanical clocks until 2003-ish, when he "upgraded" to a computerized punch clock that used your fingerprint to clock you in and out so people couldn't punch for their friends. The clock fed its data into a web-based status board that the boss would watch like a hawk, because if you were not there and visibly busy working on something you were literally stealing time from the company and he expected to be compensated. We had to punch out for any breaks, including smoke breaks, and if the boss found you being insufficiently busy he would punch you out with his administrative access code and you would not be paid from then until you were allowed to clock in again. One of my projects was supposed to be a program that monitored web usage via the proxy server logs and automatically punched someone out if they visited websites on the blacklist (myspace, etc) but that never happened.

Actual, mechanical, punch clocks are nice. At a company I used to work for, I had to approve my staffs hours and compare them to their door access cards. You were not allowed to hold a door, everyone had to touch their card when they entered or left. The time clock used bio-metric ID which took forever to clock in/out. So we had to metrics to fuss over.

Give me a time card and a punch clock and life would be so much easier. Dealing with buddy punching isn't hard. You just have to hang someone to let people know it's not acceptable.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Keiya posted:

Prop departments LOVE recycling random junk lying around, it's way cheaper than custom making stuff. It's especially fun when you see the same prop recycled in a different show... sometimes a different genre, even. Though that occasionally rises to the level of being an in-joke...

As for ATM chat, there are still some out there running OS/2... MOST of those were replaced with things running XP, but not all.

I used to do model making (not building) back in college. I took it as part of my bachelors degree.
At the time there were only two colleges offering 4 year degrees in model making in the US. It's essentially rapid prototyping and prop making.

It is way easier to re-purpose than to manufacture. What a lot of shops miss though, is to hide the original piece. It's not hard. It should only be other model makers that know how you made the part.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

my turn in the barrel posted:

Once a cashier accepts the bill it doesn't sit in some special area of the drawer, it gets mixed in. Chances are more than 1 hundred note comes in on a single day and if it gets missed when the drawer gets counted it ends up in the safe mixed with all the other poo poo.

Once the cashier takes the bill there isn't much proof the guy on the camera was the one that passed the fake bill.

Obviously if a rash of stores in one area all had bad bills and you are at each of them you are busted but that's why you would spread them around.

When I used to cashier, I would put all the hundreds I received under the drawer so they weren't visible to customers. I'd bank in at $125 and always keep my drawer shut. Any time my bank was high, I'd tuck it away so my drawer looked empty.

We also had to inspect every bill, straighten them, and align them when we did a drawer pull. Every time I've used a hundred dollar bill, the cashier has held it to the light so they can check for the watermark. Some of them use a test marker. My current company has a lot of customers that use $100s to pay. We usually assume that they are hiding purchases from a spouse or they're drug dealers.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Dick Trauma posted:

I have an Automatic Electric 80 that can confirm that pulse dialing is working here in Los Angeles via Frontier copper. Looks similar to this lovely beast.



Pulse dial works in Burnsville, MN. However, you can't do it with just the hook. You can't trip the hook fast enough for it to translate to numbers. It just treats it as a flash.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Konstantin posted:

Reminds me of old school plat books, which are still in use in the rural midwest. If you need to visit some random farm out in the middle of nowhere, these books are often your only option. A comprehensive listing of who owns what land, where it is, and how to get to it. Google is getting better, and rural communities are trying to get these people actual addresses, rather than rural route codes, but it's an uphill battle.

Plat books and Kings Atlas' work best. GPS is unreliable. GPS is great off road but there is a lot you have to know when driving rural roads. The fire numbers aren't that helpful, the plat is better.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

evobatman posted:

Obsolete tech? I wonder how many of todays AutoDesk jockeys would be able to make something with this kit. It's an O.E. Richter & Co drafting tool kit I picked up this weekend. The biggest kits I've seen on eBay go for a pretty penny, and this one is even bigger.



Not sure about the age, but sometime between 1920-1940.

I use an Alvin 129 JS kit to this day. I've had it since about '92. It's always been my favorite drafting kit. You do have to learn how to paint a nib with a brush but any draftsman worth his salt should learn that day one.

I learned drafting in '90 and went to school in '96 for Technical Illustration and Graphic Design.

I do accounting and operations management now. I still have my pretty Alvin kit though. I even still have the shammy.

We need a really good '90s nostalgia movie. We're due.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

SLOSifl posted:

He would likely draw two or three projections and then trace them after moving the viewport to the correct position. That was how we transitioned to the CAD software initially, by tracing some previous drawings. In plenty of cases it was still faster to draw it and then use that as a base.

You used to do the drawings by hand and then transfer them to CAD via a puck. It was way faster than using the software. Clean up your dims as you transfer. There's something about drawing by hand that helps you think about what you're doing.

When I was using Cadkey and AutoCAD back in the '90s, you did almost everything on the keyboard. It wasn't drawing, it was math. I'm sure it's more fluid now. I played with Solidworks once and that was very intuitive. I never liked AutoCAD. The best all-in-one CAD software was Rhino. That was always intuitive to use.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Unperson_47 posted:

The constant desire for brighter flashlights than needed for general use is really stupid. I should know because I fell down that rabbit hole myself a few years ago and have a drawer of them.

I've had my 4 D-cell Maglite for about 15 years now. I've gone through a dozen cheapy AAA-cell LEDs over the years, but the Maglite is the one that always works. I can leave it in my car below zero, I can drop it down a mountain, let it kick around the bed of a pickup, ignore it for a couple years, and it always turns on. I'll take that over super-bright LEDs any day.

Bright is nice, but "works" is better. Someday, I'd like an expensive "tactical" flashlight for fun. Until that day, I'll trust by beast of a Maglite.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Humerus posted:

It's genuinely not a joke, the fewer physical buttons on a phone, the better. I can't believe we're 10 years into the iPhone and just now they're getting rid of their physical home button. I've never owned a smartphone with a physical home button, my first had capacitive buttons but since then it's all software. Makes way more sense.

I like mechanical controls.

I can control every function of my car without my eyes leaving the road because it's all mechanical switches, buttons, and knobs. They never break and they provide haptic feedback because they are real things.

My wife's car has a touchscreen that I have to look at to change all the normal things that I'd do without thinking. When I drive her car, I have my 9 year old daughter come with me as the chief of the boat.

"Sonja, make our radio station 104.7 and set drivers side steering wheel heat to on."
"Aye Aye Captain."

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Enourmo posted:

Prius has had steer by wire for some time now. There is a shaft, but it's two pieces connected by a sliding collar, which is normally retracted by a solenoid; in normal operation, the steering is done by sensor and a computer module operates the steering rack. If a fault occurs or the vehicle loses power, the solenoid de-energizes and legs the collar slide down, locking the two shafts together and forming a traditional steering rack. It's unpowered and heavy, but it's enough control to pull to the side of the road.

The brakes are the same; normally entirely computer controlled through the abs module (so the actual wheel brakes take over from regenerative braking at low speeds without the driver having to do anything), but if you slam the pedal down it will eventually engage a pushrod on a master cylinder, applying the hydraulic brakes like normal.

Tldr mechanical backup systems are cool and good.

This I have no beef with. Though I prefer the feedback through mechanical and hydraulic connections, I can accept that some people like the light touch that electronic brakes and steering gives.

It's just very important to me that you can always stop and steer. Going is not necessary for safety. Just stop and steer.

Out of curiosity, how would you be able to feel that your tie-rod ends are wearing without a mechanical connection? Doesn't the numb steering hide the slop? Do you just need to keep a maintenance cycle of actively checking your suspension on a rack every 10,000? Normally you can just feel the wear and get them replaced.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Der Kyhe posted:

In a civilized country with annual road-worthy inspections they give you a shitlist that needs to be fixed within one month or you have to invest on a bus pass.

I come from MN. I can duct tape a hair dryer to a cat and call it road legal car as long as I pay for tabs.

Road worthiness? What is this word "Road worthiness"?

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Zemyla posted:

No, it only tries to kill you every couple of years https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZS9iSXKMLg

The weather looks like this afternoon in the Twin Cities. Just a normal day. It's warm so it's slushy like that. 20's is way too warm for this time of year. The people driving seem to be confused. Just drive in the track. Go slow, you'll be OK. Turn off your traction control and just drive your car. You'll get there. Even the guy filming seems to insist on driving outside the track. Just stay in the track. It's fine.

Once I realized I could turn my wife's car's traction control off, my day was brighter. The thing is un-drivable in snow with traction control on. With it off, it handles great.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Phanatic posted:

I test-drove a Model S and the regenerative braking worked just fine above 5-10 mph. Lift up off the gas and regen instantly starts slowing you down (which is kind of cool because you can modulate your speed up and down with just the gas pedal), at least at speeds up to the 70mph or so I pushed it to. Press your foot on the brake pedal and you get friction braking.

Why would the systems in hybrids only work at such slow speeds?

When you drive an electric fork truck, you normally slow and stop via "plugging" which means you put it in reverse and hit the foot-feed. This both charges the battery, and saves you on lining wear. You really only press the brakes if you have stop dead on a slope.

It would be nice if, as drivers, we weren't treated like children and the manufacturer would give us control to use those features. Plugging just takes practice. After a few hours, you do it without thinking. Much better braking control with a load and it only a few milliseconds switch to the mechanical brakes with your foot.

I don't want my car to drive it'self. I'd love it if it worked, but it doesn't. I don't want traction control, I don't want adaptive steering, I don't want pre-braking, I don't want ABS. I don't want a touch screen, I don't want to press a button instead of using a key, I don't want voice control, I don't want traction control, I don't want my lights to turn themselves on, I don't want my mirror to dim on it's own, I don't want backup cameras, I don't want proximity sensors.

It is *my* car. I am in command. I didn't practice left foot braking and threshold braking just so have some rat bastard computer tell me I'm doing it wrong. I know what my car does, and I can stop it faster that the PCM can.

/rant off

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Metal Geir Skogul posted:

I don't know what to say other than holy poo poo the gatekeeping in this post is insane, and also a lot of what you said is completely wrong re: human reaction times versus computers with assisted braking and other features.

I'm sure you want all cars to only have open diffs, three manual speeds, no seatbelts, plate glass, drum brakes, and a max speed of 52mph. Because if you can arbitrary choose which safety features you hate based on what you are used to, then so can I.

I'm going to go balls out on my response here. Open diffs work. If you'd like both wheels spinning while going into the ditch, be my guest. 3 gears is plenty. Seat belts are good, safety glass is good, disc brakes are good, 60mph is a perfectly fine speed.

Humans are very good at heuristics. Machines are not. I don't need my car chattering my brakes like an old lady fighting off a bee with a broom handle. I've got it. If I'm in a turn and my front wheels break free,, I can left foot brake my rear end around a turn in a front wheel drive car. The traction control cannot. I can see that, though it's slippery right now, I'll get grip in 10 feet. The computer cannot. I know that I need to power through the snow because there is a hidden rise, the computer does not and will not let me power through.

I have spent every winter for over 10 years pushing stuck people up the hill in front of my house because their traction control leaves them stuck. You need to paddle your way up the rise. This is not old guy ranting, this is simple fact. Press the traction control off button and put your back into pushing the car and you can get them up the hill.

ABS has never saved me. Traction control has only hindered me. This is not arrogance. It is simple fact. I am not an exceptional driver. I just know my car. Don't take that away from me. I want my car to be an extension of myself. Not some nonsense machine that won't even *let* me make bad decisions.

If I die, it's by my own hand. Not because some piece of poo poo AWD system feels like it should get tail happy when that should never happen in AWD. AWD should skid evenly sideways.

Somehow, I've managed to never be in an accident in 25 years of driving normal cars. The first time I was EVER afraid of driving on snow, is when I drove my wife's car with the traction control turned on. The car was completely unpredictable. Maybe traction control is great on dry pavement, but it is not on a snow/ice mixture.

You are better at making complicated decisions than a computer. I assure you. You are fast, well trained, and decisive. You are much more skilled than any computer at moving a machine through space, even if you are a first time driver.

If one needs a computer to drive a car, one shouldn't be driving a car. I'd rather drive a Model T than a car that thinks it knows better than me.

If the car that thinks it knows better than me is right, then I shouldn't be driving. Just put a bullet in my head and throw me in the trash.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Randaconda posted:

sir this a mcdonald's drive-thru

Now that made me laugh my rear end off. Time for me to put on my snowshoes and coyote pelt hat and ride my mammoth to work. Stupid snowshoes, life was so much better barefoot.

mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

ryonguy posted:

Speaking of obsolete technology, broadcast, well, anything. Being stuck listening to a set program list or with music picked by a stranger is utterly alien to me at this point.

I don't know. Sometimes over-the-air is repetitive, but sometimes you get a good station with a good DJ and you enjoy yourself. You get to hear tunes you haven't thought about in years, and tunes that's you'd never heard before.

At home, I listen to iTunes or YouTube, on the road, I like the radio.

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mostlygray
Nov 1, 2012

BURY ME AS I LIVED, A FREE MAN ON THE CLUTCH

Grassy Knowles posted:

Black Hole Sun and Say It Ain't So both play on my local classic rock station

When I was in college in the '90s, my friend and I once wondered what we would hear on classic rock stations once we got "old" We joked about jamming out to Beck with our kids in the back seat.

I'm pushing 40 now and I turned on a local classic rock station a few days ago while driving my kids. What do I hear? "In the time of chimpanzees I was a monkey..." I start singing along and my kids start looking at me weird.

We're all old now.

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