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CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

AI Garage. After all, where do most of us do our best talking smack or discussing stuff? And just let the thread just..... go where it wants to.

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CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

Bulk Vanderhuge posted:

You're not alone man, you're not alone.































gently caress wha? That's not real???? drat that's some skill right there

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

azflyboy posted:

I was wondering the same thing.

Maybe the suspension is designed to have less camber when the car is loaded with fuel and a driver?

No, it wasnt.

Believe it or not, this was the at the time best believed setup to work with the technolgy and tyres they had. One of the big things they wanted was a all wheel genuine drift which sticky tyres and heaps of neg camber stop. The positive camber thence allowed the tyres to slip better and allow more throttle response to the drive when it's on a proper drift.

So basically, you couldnt really steer these things with the wheel at full race speed, it was all footwork.

Tracks also were no where near as good as we have now too.

We can laugh at how wrong they were at the time but it did work impressively well with a driver with huge balls.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

1st Edition ADandD posted:



Well hey there little guy!



What's that under your...





And people complain that no one does interesting swaps anymore.

Best part is that the owner of this car originally posted to z31performance because he was running really rich. I probably would have checked the ECU codes first, but that's one way to go.

And here I was thinking the Grand National was the best thing posted today, because the GNX is stupid good. Nope, it gets topped by this genuine automotive lunacy

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

nm posted:

At the very least, it will be a cool way to die.

So far Richard Noble seems to be able to engineer LSR cars like no one else, so the odds of firery death are pretty low I suspect. Actually all things considered, the successful run rate of LSR cars is pretty good.

On the other hand, have a look at the death rate for anyone trying to beat the water speed record. Ken Warby's record has held for what.... 35 years? Anyone who's gone close has died.

quote:

With an approximate fatality rate of 85% since 1940, the record is one of the sporting world's most hazardous competitions.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

IOwnCalculus posted:

Slightly unfair since that's the one year of the C4 saddled with the horrific Crossfire TBI setup; depending on source, the L98 TPI in 1985 dropped a solid second off of both times. Point still stands, though.

It's not just new engines producing absurd power tho - I used to gently caress with Holden V8's and the length of things I had to do to get anything close to 230Kw out of it - modified heads, lumpy cam, over bored, 780cu Rochester before it really woke up and the power I could get was very good for the day but still.

Now it's a doodle to achieve the exact same thing and get another 50+Kw without cracking the engine open. 230Kw for a Holden 308 20 years ago was pretty good. Today you can have 400Kw and you are still pretty much yeah whatever the Holden over there has another 50. 400Kw and it's still street driven quite nicely, my cousin has a 308 that can tool around and yet rips 550Kw at the wheels. That kind of power was just not doable even 10 years ago.

Hell, the Caprice I have can be boosted to 300Kw+ (From 170Kw) with off the shelf supercharger kits, it's road legal, it's not that punishing on economy and you can expect to get a few kms out of it. For us who like modding cars, we can achieve even with old motors so much more it's absurd.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

Cygni posted:

If you're going to go that crazy with aero and engine mods, whats the point of keeping the silhouette body shape of a street car? You could got a hell of a lot faster with a totally ground up aero design, and you are already so far out that any resemblance or relevance to street cars is basically a joke.

Because the silhouette is one of the very few rules they have to obey - and as a result they are lunatic cars? What's there not to love?

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

kill me now posted:

I think a lot of what people donít get about time attack to that level is, if you're going to spend that much time and money on your "racing" program why aren't you wheel to wheel racing?


Gravel is for racing, tarmac is for getting there.

/w2wsucks

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

honda whisperer posted:


Cooling and reliability I assumed but safety? I realize no amount of safety equipment is a guarantee. Is it just the high speeds they reach or do they really skimp on safety equipment? How far do they push it in the high end TT? I did see the pure tuning civic running TTS who had a 300whp 96-00 Civic hatchback that had a 6pt NHRA style roll bar and a dash bar that bolted in just to save weight.

I do like time attack and I organise / Clerk of Course events. So lets get that out of the way as to where I stand on it.

However yes what you have supposed is 100% correct. Safety is NOT what you would expect from a car that could make a huge loving hole int he fence - the cages and secondry safety is simply not up to the levels that you think it should be. My 2004 spec FIA cage is better than the latest TT cars - some of the cages TT lets you get away with make me cringe.

The cars themselves are quite flimsy and do have failures - they are pushing the envelope and I do see suspension failures or engine grenades with regularity. An very good example is there's a car coming from Autotech in Australia (BTW who are assclowns with some truly obnoxious people) that has a 06 WRC shell with half the cage cut out. That can not be a good idea for a 550Kw car and yet it's in the rulebook, they are allowed to get away with safety gear that was deemed illegal 10 years ago.

I have been working on trying to get the higher spec cars to have appropriate cages and other safety gear, but as someone else pointed out, yes this is drag racing but with a circuit and these cars are pushing the boundaries and then some of the rule book and the spirit of time attack. I think there will be an engineering failure soon and someone will get hurt and that could have been prevented.

The way I think it should work is the lower classes get some freedoms due to still being road cars - and this is where TT works well, you can drive your road car to a day, have fun, go home so full cages are not good for a DD - but the unrestricted cars having to comply with at least FIA 2011 safety rules for sedans.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

Cakefool posted:

If someone can save 50lbs of cage the rules don't stipulate they will do so.

The sad part is that you dont save that much at all (additional cross braces arent too much of a problem and a good cage can weigh only 30-40 kgs total for the most scaffold you can throw in, like WRC cages)

quote:

What excuses are they using to justify that sort of sloppy poo poo? I mean, once you've gone past the point of not being able to ever be road registered there's no excuse for not having a full cage and safety kit. I mean, buying something with an existing top-level cage and then chopping it out? WTF taken to a new level.


Apart from you dont actually save that much, if you do cage design 101 a properly designed cage makes your car a stiffer platform to make the suspension and tyres work more effectively. So they are sacrificing not much weight for potentially better handling and better safety.

Justification? I have no idea, apart sheer stupidity. But here's the REAL stupidity of it all - a WRC cage is pretty light and even acts as a deformation point. It's DESIGNED to gracefully fail. You take bits out, you lose the graceful bit. They have wasted utterly the hundreds of design hours to make that cage work at all, Lord help them if they roll over, what remains of the cage will break and become lethal. Bunch of assclowns.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

2ndclasscitizen posted:

So basically the only thing they're now getting out of having spent all that cash on an ex-WRC shell is the bragging rights of having an ex-WRC shell, not actually anything tangible from being built to WRC-spec.


Yep, that's about right.

On TT cars that aren't dumb -

The NEMO racing EVO is rumoured to have cost 900K AUD to build and get to WTAC. It shows however - it's one godawfully fast car with more left in it - A Group C LeMans car does EC in 1:19. It also has a proper full cage in it, with even a few bars not required for FIA 2012. Great bit of machinery, completely unsuited for anything other than one banzai lap but holy poo poo is it good at that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VzAE7BL4U9s

Have a look at the G meter - over 2 G lateral and nearly 2 G under brakes.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

kill me now posted:

Time attack as a total wank fest for shops that could clearly afford to be racing for real? Not so much.

It's advertising for the workshop and it works. Plus almost every single tuner involved in TT is also doing wheel to wheel for customers or themselves, so what you are saying simply isnt in general true.

quote:

And yes, a good number of dudes who do Time Attacku are too afraid of driving in traffic.

The entry lists I see show a bunch of V8Supercar, rally, club circuit etc on the list. Almost all of the non wheel to wheel guys are in road cars. And even then there's a bunch of them who on other weekends switch to a different car and go grid up.


There's a hell of a lot of BS floating around about who's involved and why - mainly because a bunch of people want to look down on it as silly or not as MANLY or some piece of utter crap.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

sadnessboner posted:

There's a Barra 6cyl swapped AMC Javelin up for sale at this month's Shannon's Auction. Unfortunately it doesn't seem to be a turbocharged one.





Even in NA form it'll be pretty resonably quick, that's gonna be a considerable weight drop from the stock car.

But...... all that work for an NA? Barra turbo would have been legendary.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

GnarlyCharlie4u posted:

yay new thread!





...yeah I'm a little late to the party.

gently caress me, now that's some car porn

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

You Am I posted:

Those things are as rare as hen's teeth, they should be restoring it

While a Series 1 is rare as now, the shell is clearly toast. There is so much work that it's not worth anyone's time and very little of the original car will be left. If it can be saved at all.

The fact it's going to go out as a race car is a drat good Viking Burial for it. RADL approves

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

rscott posted:

I think they're the most coherent youtube comments I've ever seen

And so far that I've read no one been called a fag or told to suck their balls. Amazing

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

jonathan posted:

From a performance standpoint it's a top speed monster but the weight keeps it from being great anywhere else.


The reason why it's great isnt the top speed. It's fact it actually is great everywhere else, despite it's bulk and complexity.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

jonathan posted:

I personally don't think it's great at all. It's the least exciting hypercar. Bland styling, bland performance for a 1000hp car. It doesn't draw emotion from me that the Aventador does. It's great from an engineering and manufacturing standpoint, but it's still just following in the footsteps of the Sledgehammer.

First time I've ever heard of a factory car with over 1000 hp that has levels of all round performance not seen on any other road car ever made as bland.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

As some may have guessed, I come from a family of car nuts. One of my uncles unfortuantly passed away this week and the funeral was today. I now present to you some of the cars he personally restored from rusted wrecks. The owners bought them out for the funeral convoy.

If anyone knows what they are, I'd love to know.



His second to last car.



I was in his workshop when he built the radiator grill from a Sockington worth of rust, painstakingly with solder and metal, saving everything he could (which became quite a lot)





Got a few more to go once my connection is less rubbish

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

veedubfreak posted:

What kind of money do you figure is involved in getting a car to this level of restoration? I'm trying to justify why I'm building a bug and not an early ford/chevy.

I think you start at 30K, depending on the base. Every car by the time Don got to them rated at least 7 on the Sockington scale, with close to 60-70 years of wear and tear added - you are looking at a lot of parts that if you can even get them anymore (NONE of those cars have reproduction parts where it could be avoided, they are all OEM) wont be cheap and a lot of hard work to restore the parts that can be saved. Plsu the amount of man hours required - the two best threads to appreciate the kind of work required is the 1950's Ford van thread and of course Mooecow.

Buuuuuut unlike those two, my Uncle was a professional panel beater since he was 17 so you get 30+ years of experience per hour to pay for as well

Plus you have to be highly patient - some of the projects sat for a year while parts were found. As mentioned, reproduction parts where avoided meant a lot of time just waiting for parts to pop up. One of those cars sat for 5 years at one point for that reason - think it was for doors on one of the cars I havent posted yet.

The green 1940 Coupe was his own car for some time before it was sold to fund his last project and won a slew of awards at car shows - to get to the level of that car took 10 years and probably close to 100K with man hours included. There's about five more cars to post yet

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

veedubfreak posted:

This makes me feel better. Once everything is said and done, my 58 bug will probably have 250 hours of my time sunk in it, and I'm guessing 10-15 grand. Anyone who rebuilds a car for profit is out of their mind.

Pretty much. My uncle did make a good living out of it but you are looking at clients who spend tens of thousands for results and are just not interested at reclaiming much at all because...... that's not the point. These cars are loved and driven by guys who simply do it because it's their hobby.

The Customline I think could well be single owner too.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

rear end in a top hat Bicycle posted:

I think it could depend on the car. You could restore a 1965 mustang coupe or a 1965 mustang Shelby for roughly the same money. But one is gonna be worth a lot more in the end.

Have a look at what cars go for the big dollars - they arent the restored ones, no matter how good or how original the parts list is ESPECIALLY a limited run rare one. For the Shelby to get dollars, it needs to be 100% original and in good condition. Next step down is 100% original but restored using original parts. So the restore will cost you say 30K but also be worth 20% less. Use replacement parts and the value drops again.

The 65 base model would have better parts availibilty without the Shelby tax so the costs I think might be somewhat lower too.

If you start with a true basket case to restore (Think Mooecow or the the cars my uncle worked with) then to get any decent money the work HAS to be bloody good. The '40 my uncle owned did get sold for a good sum but look at how good it was - you arent paying for the car, you are paying for the craftmanship. That's what you need to achieve.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

Okay so here the other cars from the uncle's funeral. Again, no idea what they are apart from old Fords and yes they were all restored by him.





He didnt just do showroom restos. Two rather classy hotrods also represented other work



The Mustang in the background? Yep, that too. Utterly original car I believe, didnt requre anything liek the work the older cars did.

Now.... this one took centre stage.







His car - to be honest not the best on the day (The green 40 really is stunning in person) but still, more than a bit good. I think this might also be the last one he did and might have been hurried a bit as he would have already been suffering heart issues.

That really doesn't sound right and still doesn't do it justice - drat thing is genuinely brilliant work in it's own right

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

Powershift posted:

You are right. Gasoline is as volatile as hydrogen. What was I thinking.


Hydrogen is a dumb choice for dumb people. You still need new production facilities, a new supply chain. Large amounts of storage for it within residential neighborhoods. Idiots will still smoke while refueling and Blow themselves up, and you will have to refuel twice as often.


While humans regularly use as volatile fuels without blowing themselves up every day of our lives in the most mundane of circumstances, that's always going to be a truly dumb argument against hydrogen. Battery tech is NOT going to allow an electric car for anything beyond city running at best for years unless you get fuel cells. Fuel cells work and hydrogen works.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

MikeyTsi posted:

What exactly do you propose we use to produce all this extra electricity?

IF as a civilisation we loving man up and tell a bunch of ignorant religious assholes called Greenpeace and their ilk to go gently caress themselves then start beating sense into NIMBY's, we would be building nuclear power. Oh sure, a few tons of waste, but compared to the literal billions of tons of poo poo thrown into the atmosphere like we do now?

And then, hey..... we suddenly dont have electricity problems. Crack all the water you want for hydrogen or gently caress, plug every car into the grid, there's more uranium in seawater than we could possibly concieve of using, let alone known reserves - which is far more extensive than you might realise. And not even starting on Thorium.

But noooooooooo....... the greens have made this a religious jihad and that's what it truly is, a religion. THe hypocracy of beating everyone with science over climate change (Which, believe me I more than accept is true, deniers are morons) and then blocking their ears and LA LA LA at ANY science about nuclear and it's very real benefits, while throwing up any manner of bullshit.

What a stupid species we are, the answer is availible right now and we let a bunch of retards ruin it.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

kastein posted:

SH/SC refugees ACTIVATE



It's rather clever

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

Seat Safety Switch posted:

Anyone who would put an LS in a TVR clearly hasn't heard the sound of a stock TVR V8.

Fuckin' things sound like someone took an old school Ferrari and made it inhale glass.

On the very rare times said V8 is able to fire up. TVR's really are just plain poo poo for quality and reliabilty.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

InitialDave posted:


Though occasionally such bodykits hide substance that deserves to be in this thread:



http://www.stuttgart9.co.uk/forum/o...-old-skool.html

Holy poo poo

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

ultimateforce posted:

Those who paid for it funded future hybrid vehicles to come out later. Early adopters always spur future projects.

Hook, line and sinker with the marketing BS mate. And that's all hybrids actually are.

If you gave a poo poo about real world fuel economy and cheap to run - plus actual good cars - the kind of diesels say like Ford is putting out smack the Prius stupid. And are cheaper. And are much better cars. And even good enough that a red raving lunatic like me gets grudgingly won over by the new gen Fiesta which is in truth quite a bloody good thing.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

drat, the Countach is nearly fourth years old??? Still looks futureistic and poo poo hot today

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

Cocoa Crispies posted:

It's not the noise, it's their perception of the clientele; the noise complaints are just a means to an end.

The clientele are vastly better people than the complaining dickheads

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

blk posted:

Not sure if awful or awesome; leaning towards awesome.



"This means something. This is important."

Firmly in the utter poo poo category

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

jammyozzy posted:

Let's play guess the (awesome) car!






I'm anxiously awaiting CT's analysis of that cage. Nothing's been cut out of it by the way, that's the entire cage.

Ooooooh, is that a Metro 6r4? Yes, Group B wasnt exactly the greatest at safety to say the least. They barely put cages in and it was legal (!) to run without a cage only a year or two before.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

Cakefool posted:

What better package for 600hp of violently turbocharged rally car?

Well in this case a NA 400hp V6. A very, VERY loud V6.

quote:

I love how NHRA and anyone thinks those dorky little door bars do anything

They do work and they are actually more for making sure the floor doesnt crumple under the drivers feet, rather than intrusion. Not as well as alternative designs, but that bar isnt a worthless piece of metal as you seem to think.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

Neptr posted:

I think the age of the raw, racecar-for-the-street supercar is gone. The things that engineers can do with electronically controlled drivetrains, suspension, and aerodynamics aren't allowed in racing and give the customers what they want: maximum performance without having to own a racecar that they can't show off on the street. The supercars of today are more "what-if?" racecars with leather interiors, and they sell well.

The customers who can buy those cars want an expensive doodad penis extention that they can boast about to their rich mates. "Yes it has one of them F1 diffuser thingies exactly like Schumacher does! Now where a girl to suck my dick?"

And I would have to point out there are a few racecar for the street supercars about, they tend to be hellishly quick but they dont sell because they dont have a badge. Ferrari on the other hand could sell 500 new F40 kind of monsters and have lines out the door demanding more. And frankly they should - throw out all the bullshit and go once again batshit insane with a genuine back to basics balls to the wall monster.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

SyHopeful posted:

From another forum I post on

Last night I got to drive a Dodge Neon. With a full STi swap (yes, AWD too).



What on earth possessed him to do such a completely out of left field swap???

(It's loving incredible he pulled it off but holy poo poo man.... that's really just out there)

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

Tusen Takk posted:

I assume you would have to build a tube frame to support the RWD, yeah? That by itself is not cheap


You dont know much about back yard builds, right? Yes, it can be very cheap, all it takes is some pipe and a welder and your time.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

Tusen Takk posted:

Nope, not at all . I was told by the LSJ community that it's expensive as gently caress to do RWD conversions on FWD cars since they're not engineered to support the power/torque on the rear of the frame. This made sense to my ignorant mind so I never really looked much more into it


You hang about in AI where there's half a dozen threads where the poster is doing projects that make the skills required for a backyard RWD conversion look like a stroll in the park. I could name a dozen posters who could pull off the required RWD conversion work and none of them would need to spend big money.

I think in all seriousness, you need to be watching a lot more threads to get an idea what can and cant be done to a car in a cramped garage.

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

AirRaid posted:




http://www.sheepo.es/2011/05/porsch...dk_04.html#more



Not just the accuracy of the model... the fact that so much of it is functional.

I saw it but I still dont believe it.

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CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

I think you mean dont piss in the sink....again!

Puddin posted:

They destroyed 6 mk1 Escorts in the movie. This is extremely saddening to me.

FFS Escorts are supposed to be destroyed in forests, not poo poo Hollywood movies!

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